New New Prospects Thread

[AtlantaHotWings 1,135]

Kip you are putting a lot of good news about Kasper into the thread lately.  I appreciate the info as I am barely keeping up on the Wings let alone the Griffins. 

 I seem to remember after the prospect camp a few people were pretty down on him. He seems to be trending in a major positive way especially the last couple of weeks. 

 Is it due to him figuring out the NA game at the AHL level?

Slow start was due to the knee and the NA ice?

Shift in coach technique?

All of the above or ?

[kipwinger 8,771]

Just now, AtlantaHotWings said:

Kip you are putting a lot of good news about Kasper into the thread lately.  I appreciate the info as I am barely keeping up on the Wings let alone the Griffins. 

 I seem to remember after the prospect camp a few people were pretty down on him. He seems to be trending in a major positive way especially the last couple of weeks. 

 Is it due to him figuring out the NA game at the AHL level?

Slow start was due to the knee and the NA ice?

Shift in coach technique?

All of the above or ?

I would say all of the above.

I think the knee injury genuinely affected his play. He had the same injury as Rasmussen had, and with both players it seemed to take them a while to get back up to speed and play as strongly as they had the year before. That's likely because they didn't have an offseason to train and get stronger and all that.

But I also think that Kasper is realizing that playing an abrasive/gritty/direct style is his ticket to success in NA. At the beginning of the season (and back as far as the prospects tournament) he was trying to be very cute with his offense (e.g. trying the Michigan, toe-drags, between the legs, etc.). I think he heard the criticisms of his offensive upside and wanted to show that he was a slick, skilled, player too. But ultimately that's not what is going to make him successful in NA. He's going to be successful playing like Larkin, not playing like Elias Pettersson.

Finally, I think coaching played a really big part in his output as well. Dan Watson is a new coach at the AHL level and when he took over the team he seemed to be relying on his veteran AHL players to do the heavy lifting. Trouble was, some of those guys weren't shouldering that responsibility well (Hirose, L'Esperance, Gettinger) and some were in and out of the lineup (Czarnik and Berggren). This pretty much explains why GR sucked to begin the season. Once Watson got more comfortable with the team he started plugging some of the younger guys into those bigger roles. Kasper, for instance, went from a 4C to a 2C and also started getting powerplay time with the top unit. The corresponding increases in prime ice-time and the quality of his linemates led to increased offensive output. But had he not already had the physical tools, as well as the defensive responsibility, to succeed in that role it wouldn't have worked. Watson tried Lombardi as the 2C for a time and it really didn't work because he's not reliable defensively nor is he physically strong enough to handle those types of minutes (yet).

The last thing I'd mention is fan expectations. The only two 19 year olds I can remember making the Red Wings (in the current era) were Larkin and Raymond. Before that it had been forever since we'd had anyone do that. Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Kronwall, Tatar, Nyquist, Franzen - you name it. Most of our top end talent didn't even sniff the NHL at 19. But because we had two guys do it in relatively short order I think some folks began to consider that the standard, as opposed to the exception. Kasper is a very young player, playing a very difficult position, in a very difficult league. Every indication was that he'd be able to handle the assignment, and even excel. But it was always going to take longer than a year. And I'm thankful for that because I've seen too many promising players get ruined because their teams thought it was a good idea to put an 18-19 year old in the NHL and their development basically stalled as soon as it happened (Buffalo is famous for this).

[kipwinger 8,771]

Griffins won a fun one tonight 3-2 in the shootout. Kasper looked excellent, had an assist, but most notably was on the ice first for Grand Rapids in the 3on3 overtime. But the story of this one was Sebastian Cossa who stood tall in the shootout and blanked all three Rockford shooters before GR put the nail in it. Absolutely a stud performance by a guy that keeps looking better and better. He looked great and made saves on Rockford's three top offensive guys. None of them missed, Cossa stopped em.

Edited February 3, 2024 by kipwinger

[stephen-gregory-yzerman 142]

4 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

Griffins won a fun one tonight 3-2 in the shootout. Kasper looked excellent and most notably was on the ice first for Grand Rapids in the 3on3 overtime. But the story of this one was Sebastian Cossa who stood tall in the shootout and blanked all three Rockford shooters before GR put the nail in it. Absolutely a stud performance by a guy that keeps looking better and better. He looked great and made saves on Rockford's three top offensive guys. None of them missed, Cossa stopped em.

1C between Berggren and Hirose tonight.

[kipwinger 8,771]

Just now, stephen-gregory-yzerman said:

1C between Berggren and Hirose tonight.

That's their 2nd line. Their first line is centered by Czarnik and usually has L'Esperance (their top goal scorer) and Mazur.

[stephen-gregory-yzerman 142]

3 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

That's their 2nd line. Their first line is centered by Czarnik and usually has L'Esperance (their top goal scorer) and Mazur.

You can call it 1a and 1b if you want but Berggren and Hirose are the teams top 2 wingers so Id argue Kasper was centering the 1a line while the vet Czarnik was centering the 1b line. Im not sure where to see TOI for AHL games but if I were to bet Id say the Kasper line played more/ tougher minutes.

[kipwinger 8,771]

11 minutes ago, stephen-gregory-yzerman said:

You can call it 1a and 1b if you want but Berggren and Hirose are the teams top 2 wingers so Id argue Kasper was centering the 1a line while the vet Czarnik was centering the 1b line. Im not sure where to see TOI for AHL games but if I were to bet Id say the Kasper line played more/ tougher minutes.

You're probably right about the bolded. They were the best line tonight (and many nights). I'm just basing my comment on the lineup the Griffins post online. 

Edited February 3, 2024 by kipwinger

[stephen-gregory-yzerman 142]

1 minute ago, kipwinger said:

You're probably right about the bolded. They were the best line tonight (and many nights). I'm just basing my comment on the lineup the Griffins post online. 

Regardless I agree with your assessment on Kasper hes been real impressive. Fast, tenacious, heavy on pucks, plays both ends of the ice. Hes gonna be a good one.

[Scott R Lucidi 675]

15 hours ago, stephen-gregory-yzerman said:

Regardless I agree with your assessment on Kasper hes been real impressive. Fast, tenacious, heavy on pucks, plays both ends of the ice. Hes gonna be a good one.

Kasper, Danielson, Edvinsson, ASP, Cossa

 

talk about a shot in the arm for Detroit

[kipwinger 8,771]

1 hour ago, Scott R Lucidi said:

Kasper, Danielson, Edvinsson, ASP, Cossa

 

talk about a shot in the arm for Detroit

Our best prospects are all centers, defensemen, and goalies. I genuinely can’t think of a better farm system in the NHL at the moment. 
 

Scott Wheeler if the Athletic is doing his annual prospect pool rankings. He will no doubt penalize Detroit for not have ten smallish, stickhandling, wingers in the system and we will no doubt be all the better for it. Every year he mocks some loser like Cole Perfetti or Matt Savoie to Detroit and then says we had a bad draft because we didn’t take the losers he liked. 

Edited February 3, 2024 by kipwinger

[Scott R Lucidi 675]

7 hours ago, kipwinger said:

Our best prospects are all centers, defensemen, and goalies. I genuinely can’t think of a better farm system in the NHL at the moment. 
 

Scott Wheeler if the Athletic is doing his annual prospect pool rankings. He will no doubt penalize Detroit for not have ten smallish, stickhandling, wingers in the system and we will no doubt be all the better for it. Every year he mocks some loser like Cole Perfetti or Matt Savoie to Detroit and then says we had a bad draft because we didn’t take the losers he liked. 

your post about Seider and Raymond spoiling us was your best post so far.  100%.  We gotta wait for these teenagers to hit man status.  Seider and Raymond hit it faster, but that's just an unrealistic thing to expect in almost any prospect drafted outside the top 2 or 3.  We got LUCKY with Seider and Raymond.  I have a strong feeling ASP and Danielsson are going to be Red Wings quick as well.  

[stephen-gregory-yzerman 142]

9 hours ago, Scott R Lucidi said:

your post about Seider and Raymond spoiling us was your best post so far.  100%.  We gotta wait for these teenagers to hit man status.  Seider and Raymond hit it faster, but that's just an unrealistic thing to expect in almost any prospect drafted outside the top 2 or 3.  We got LUCKY with Seider and Raymond.  I have a strong feeling ASP and Danielsson are going to be Red Wings quick as well.  

Seider and Raymond still aren't fully developed 'man status' yet either. As good as theyve been both still have a lot of room for growth too.

As good as this teams been this season thyre gonna look a lot different in 2-3 seasons with Berggren, Kasper, Danielson, Edvinsson, Sandin Pellikka, Cossa all making it among others.

[stephen-gregory-yzerman 142]

Nate Danielson - drafted 9th overall

19 years old - 6'2", 185lbs. - RH-C

35GP - 15G - 37PTS

Emmitt Finnie - drafted 201st overall

18 years old - 6'1", 185lbs. - LH-C

41GP - 8G - 36PTS

Is Danielson a bust or is Finnie the steal of the draft?

Not to be taken serious (big Danielson fan) but an interesting tidbit nonetheless.

[Troy McClure 347]

54 minutes ago, stephen-gregory-yzerman said:

Nate Danielson - drafted 9th overall

19 years old - 6'2", 185lbs. - RH-C

35GP - 15G - 37PTS

Emmitt Finnie - drafted 201st overall

18 years old - 6'1", 185lbs. - LH-C

41GP - 8G - 36PTS

Is Danielson a bust or is Finnie the steal of the draft?

Not to be taken serious (big Danielson fan) but an interesting tidbit nonetheless.

Well Finnie plays for Kamloops, and they are by far the worst team in the WHL right now. Is he simply the shiniest piece of poop on a poop team? Or is he actually really good and his teammates suck? IDK, I've never watched him play. I think it will be hard to say until he moves to a different team.

But I do remember him be described as a super hard-working sleeper pick. Seems like he is indeed putting in the work.

[The 91 of Ryans 3,019]

Kasper with a great goal tonight, Fancy hands and all but he did it in a very high traffic area.

Also love the Bergrren-Kasper-Mazur line. 

Bring em all up next year

[The 91 of Ryans 3,019]

Kasper 2nd star tonight in a 4-3 SO win. Bergrren with a sick SO goal.

Edited February 10, 2024 by The 91 of Ryans

[kipwinger 8,771]

I'll be disappointed if we end up trading Berggren. I really like that he's starting to play with a little swagger. According to Mazur's interview on the Winged Wheel Podcast Berggren talks more trash than any other Griffin on the ice. I'm here for it.

Great game by Marco tonight. Unbelievable that the kid was playing professional hockey in the SHL when he had JUST turned 16. He's still 19 years old and he's been playing professional hockey for 4 years.

[The 91 of Ryans 3,019]

2 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

I'll be disappointed if we end up trading Berggren. I really like that he's starting to play with a little swagger. According to Mazur's interview on the Winged Wheel Podcast Berggren talks more trash than any other Griffin on the ice. I'm here for it.

Great game by Marco tonight. Unbelievable that the kid was playing professional hockey in the SHL when he had JUST turned 16. He's still 19 years old and he's been playing professional hockey for 4 years.

Depends on the return. But me too, generally speaking.

I do like that this team's at the stage of the rebuild where they have guys like Bergrren to throw into decent deals and it won't kill them to make the trade

I was also serious about those three playing on a bottom 6 line together next year in Detroit. It would cost 2.8M.

Put all that extra money toward a top 6 winger/Kane/a top 4 D/ a goalie

Edited February 10, 2024 by The 91 of Ryans

[kipwinger 8,771]

12 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Depends on the return. But me too, generally speaking.

I do like that this team's at the stage of the rebuild where they have guys like Bergrren to throw into decent deals and it won't kill them to make the trade

I mean, I obviously agree that for the right return anyone is available. That said, I think Berggren scores 50+ next year on an entry level deal and that's a lot of offense for very little money. I also think he's really developed his two way game. He's never going to be a stud defensive foward, but I think he's roughly as good as Sprong or Debrincat in terms of his defensive effort.

[The 91 of Ryans 3,019]

Just now, kipwinger said:

I mean, I obviously agree that for the right return anyone is available. That said, I think Berggren scores 50+ next year on an entry level deal and that's a lot of offense for very little money. I also think he's really developed his two way game. He's never going to be a stud defensive foward, but I think he's roughly as good as Sprong or Debrincat in terms of his defensive effort.

agreed

check my edit

[Axl Foley 334]

26 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

I'll be disappointed if we end up trading Berggren. I really like that he's starting to play with a little swagger. According to Mazur's interview on the Winged Wheel Podcast Berggren talks more trash than any other Griffin on the ice. I'm here for it.

Great game by Marco tonight. Unbelievable that the kid was playing professional hockey in the SHL when he had JUST turned 16. He's still 19 years old and he's been playing professional hockey for 4 years.

I am puzzled by the rumors. Kid seems like what a rebuilding team would want.

[kipwinger 8,771]

6 minutes ago, Axl Foley said:

I am puzzled by the rumors. Kid seems like what a rebuilding team would want.

I seriously wonder if they just don't like his attitude or something.  I remember when we signed Kane, Yzerman said something like "a left handed, skilled, playmaking, winger" is something our organization really needed or something like that. I remember thinking it was odd since that's pretty much exactly why Berggren is.

Edited February 10, 2024 by kipwinger

[kipwinger 8,771]

Kasper's goal. Between the legs in tight. Nice skill by the kid.

https://x.com/HockeytownWpod/status/1756137098388611140?s=20

Edited February 10, 2024 by kipwinger

[Axl Foley 334]

Berggren gives me Nyquist vibes. 40-50 point winger.  Not a game changer, but a young, secondary scorer. Perron. Fabbri, and Kane aren't exactly spring chickens.

[kipwinger 8,771]

I'd be thrilled if he was as good as Nyquist. Gus is a hell of a player. He scores 40-50 points, but he does it without giving up a ton the other way.