Wings to focus on Datsyuk

[motorcitykid 42]

It's an expression.

Yeh but your implication was almost like "oh well, so what".

My point is simply this: if we're going to throw 6 million at a guy, how exactly is the name Pavel Datsyuk at the TOP of Holland's list?

Because we drafted him? What. A. Joke.

A franchise guy like Hank .. well ok, that's an easy sell.

Edited March 16, 2007 by motorcitykid

[dicksmack 33]

I do not think we can afford to sign Datsyuk for more than $5.5M and still keep the team competitive.

Exactly. Sign him now. The Wings finally have got some skilled size to compliment Datsyuk's talent. He will light it up and be gone and I will not be happy.

[Heroes of Hockeytown 694]

Yeh but your implication was almost like "oh well, so what".

Then you are misinterpreting. It was more of a synonym for "spending" than anything else.

[motorcitykid 42]

Then you are misinterpreting. It was more of a synonym for "spending" than anything else.

Gotcha.

I'd like Holland to earn his paycheck instead of doing the easy thing and begging to overpay guys already here.

[discohadestwo 0]

No thanks.

Playoffs:

05-06: 3 PTS 0 GOALS

03-04: 6 PTS 0 GOALS

02-03: 0 PTS 0 GOALS

01-02: 6 PTS 3 GOALS

Bottom line: he does not produce when the games matter, yet he wants to be paid like a player who does. What exactly has you confused?

Again 3 career playoff goals in 42 games.

It ain't like reality much matters to Holland, but spending 5.5-6 million on a perrenial no-show is in most books, inexcusable.

You'll see. He'll be all right this year & this thread won't matter.

Everyone of you will want to resign him.

[HoweHatTrick 0]

I think overall it's pretty ridiculous that it could come down to $1M or $1.5M on this deal. What happened to the guys that were willing to take pay cuts, so we could acquire other top notch players (like Yzerman did to get Shanny)? Think about, whether you're making $5M, $7M, or $1M...you can still get cheese on your Whopper.

[WingNutt 12]

This sounds like great news, Holland get him signed.

[eva unit zero 271]

I think overall it's pretty ridiculous that it could come down to $1M or $1.5M on this deal. What happened to the guys that were willing to take pay cuts, so we could acquire other top notch players (like Yzerman did to get Shanny)? Think about, whether you're making $5M, $7M, or $1M...you can still get cheese on your Whopper.

If you're making that much money, I would hope you never have to set foot in a fast food joint. I know if I made that much, I would NEVER eat at McDonalds or BK. EVER.

[HoweHatTrick 0]

If you're making that much money, I would hope you never have to set foot in a fast food joint. I know if I made that much, I would NEVER eat at McDonalds or BK. EVER.

I was simply pointing out that when you're making that much money, an extra $500K doesn't really matter.

[toby91_ca 620]

I think overall it's pretty ridiculous that it could come down to $1M or $1.5M on this deal. What happened to the guys that were willing to take pay cuts, so we could acquire other top notch players (like Yzerman did to get Shanny)? Think about, whether you're making $5M, $7M, or $1M...you can still get cheese on your Whopper.

I don't remember anyone taking paycuts to bring in other guys. Some guys deferred salary, which is completely different and that would not help under the salary cap system anyway.

Also, it's easy for you to say "why don't they just take a pay cut, $5 or $6 million is enough anyway" when you are not in that position. Personally, I would like to get paid what my market value is, not a cut below that. When I was younger, I had a salary in mind that I thought I would be comfortable with for the rest of my life and since I surpassed that amount, there is no way you could convince me to take a paycut down to that amount. You really do not understand until you are in that position.

The NHLPA also wouldn't like someone accepting below what their market value is, within reason of course. There is always the "minor" home town discount (Lidstrom, etc.).

[sibiriak 84]

So what you're reasoning is that Pavel would give up 5-7% of his perceived worth in case he gets hurt this spring.

I suppose it's few who actually know Pavel's thought process on the issue, but let it be on the record that I doubt that this is it.

You've twice failed to respond to my points on management's offering this ultimatum. Do you disagree?

The 5-7% number is a guess. How much of an insurance premium would you pay to secure an income stream of $6mil. a year for 3-5 years? Could be 1-2%. But as long as he can be signed for less than the market value, even if by $10000, it would be a good idea.

I am not sure I understand your "perform or be traded" point. The management signs him in good faith, and can then trade him (or anyone else w/o a no-trade clause) if a right deal comes along. The player doesn't have to be consulted beforehand, or even warned about a possible trade. So no ultimatum is necessary.

Edited March 16, 2007 by sibiriak

[bringback91 2]

No thanks.

Playoffs:

05-06: 3 PTS 0 GOALS

03-04: 6 PTS 0 GOALS

02-03: 0 PTS 0 GOALS

01-02: 6 PTS 3 GOALS

Bottom line: he does not produce when the games matter, yet he wants to be paid like a player who does. What exactly has you confused?

Again 3 career playoff goals in 42 games.

It ain't like reality much matters to Holland, but spending 5.5-6 million on a perrenial no-show is in most books, inexcusable.

I think your leaving out some important numbers when it comes to getting a contract done. First of all ....

NHL Totals:GP:352 G:102 A:215 Pts:317+/-:77PIM: 97 like it or not regular season counts for alot, and those are some pretty damn good numbers. Secondly: look at the number of games played in said year. After 02 (the cup win, see no reason to complain about him that year,) not much of a chance to get alot done.Games played is a stat often overlooked when you take out the 21 from 02. Besides the stiff goaltending faced, which is so easily overlooked by fans, but not Wings brass.

Career Playoff Stats

Season GP G A P +/- PIM

2001-2002 21 3 3 6 1 2

2002-2003 4 0 0 0 -3 0

2003-2004 12 0 6 6 1 2

2005-2006 5 0 3 3 0 0

In comparison everyone on heres golden boy Z, 11 pts. in 22 games. exclude last year you get 5 pts. in 16 games. Yet after one year he's considered the answer and a perenial playoff performer? I mean I like Z he's the man, but the bias is dumb. It's clear some just don't want Dats around, that's better to be said, then to act like playoff goals are the only reason. Anyway, sign the guy up, and I'll let his play continue to do the talking.

Edited March 16, 2007 by bringback91

[13dats 1]

I think your leaving out some important numbers when it comes to getting a contract done. First of all ....

NHL Totals:GP:352 G:102 A:215 Pts:317+/-:77PIM: 97 like it or not regular season counts for alot, and those are some pretty damn good numbers. Secondly: look at the number of games played in said year. After 02 (the cup win, see no reason to complain about him that year,) not much of a chance to get alot done.Games played is a stat often overlooked when you take out the 21 from 02. Besides the stiff goaltending faced, which is so easily overlooked by fans, but not Wings brass.

Career Playoff Stats

Season GP G A P +/- PIM

2001-2002 21 3 3 6 1 2

2002-2003 4 0 0 0 -3 0

2003-2004 12 0 6 6 1 2

2005-2006 5 0 3 3 0 0

In comparison everyone on heres golden boy Z, 11 pts. in 22 games. exclude last year you get 5 pts. in 16 games. Yet after one year he's considered the answer and a perenial playoff performer? I mean I like Z he's the man, but the bias is dumb. It's clear some just don't want Dats around, that's better to be said, then to act like playoff goals are the only reason. Anyway, sign the guy up, and I'll let his play continue to do the talking.

Agree 100%

[sharomyga 6]

I think your leaving out some important numbers when it comes to getting a contract done. First of all ....

NHL Totals:GP:352 G:102 A:215 Pts:317+/-:77PIM: 97 like it or not regular season counts for alot, and those are some pretty damn good numbers. Secondly: look at the number of games played in said year. After 02 (the cup win, see no reason to complain about him that year,) not much of a chance to get alot done.Games played is a stat often overlooked when you take out the 21 from 02. Besides the stiff goaltending faced, which is so easily overlooked by fans, but not Wings brass.

Career Playoff Stats

Season GP G A P +/- PIM

2001-2002 21 3 3 6 1 2

2002-2003 4 0 0 0 -3 0

2003-2004 12 0 6 6 1 2

2005-2006 5 0 3 3 0 0

In comparison everyone on heres golden boy Z, 11 pts. in 22 games. exclude last year you get 5 pts. in 16 games. Yet after one year he's considered the answer and a perenial playoff performer? I mean I like Z he's the man, but the bias is dumb. It's clear some just don't want Dats around, that's better to be said, then to act like playoff goals are the only reason. Anyway, sign the guy up, and I'll let his play continue to do the talking.

Agreed!

[Kp-Wings 3]

The way I look at it, how can you ever expect Datsyuk to perform in the playoffs? It's not a question of ability, it's a question of the way he plays. This fancy stuff he does in the regular will not work in the playoffs. He's not going to be able to fishline the puck in the neutral zone and dance around the entire team. Teams step up the physical play a notch in the playoffs, and will knock guys like Datsyuk around like a paper bag. Granted we could Bert out there to give him some space, but I don't think Babcock is going to break up the Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Holmstrom line any time soon.

I'd like to see him do well. But until that time, Holland should NOT re-sign him.

And I'd like to state something else: Stop being worried that Datsyuk will abandon us for Washington just to play for Ovechkin. Just because Eklund or whoever the hell said it doesn't mean it's true.

Edited March 16, 2007 by Kp-Wings

[rwfan007 18]

Because Pav's a Red Wing.

and ryan smith was a oiler and ray bourque was a bruin... anything is possible in the business of sports

[drwscc 212]

Take this for what it's worth (it IS Eklund after all) but it does sound feasible.

A source told me yesterday afternoon that word among some of Datsyuk's friends are that his dream is to play with Ovechkin and that he may take a bit less money to make it happen. The source also added, "The price that Datsyuk is giving the Wings right now is extremely high. This could be to bide time and see if the Caps are willing to get into this come July"

It should also be noted that Ted Leonsis, the extremely progressive owner of the Washington Capitals, recently went on record saying that the team is preparing to make a very big splash this off-season. Datsyuk is a splash.

Again, it is Eklund, but interesting food for thought anyway.

[Kp-Wings 3]

Take this for what it's worth (it IS Eklund after all) but it does sound feasible.

A source told me yesterday afternoon that word among some of Datsyuk's friends are that his dream is to play with Ovechkin and that he may take a bit less money to make it happen. The source also added, "The price that Datsyuk is giving the Wings right now is extremely high. This could be to bide time and see if the Caps are willing to get into this come July"

It should also be noted that Ted Leonsis, the extremely progressive owner of the Washington Capitals, recently went on record saying that the team is preparing to make a very big splash this off-season. Datsyuk is a splash.

Again, it is Eklund, but interesting food for thought anyway.

Again, I highly doubt it's true. This rumor is coming from a man who did not get a single trade right at the trade deadline. He's the one who said the Wings would get Bill Guerin. He said that Shane Doan was going to the Islanders. He even said Columbus goalie Pascal Leclaire, while on IR, whould be traded to Minnesota. That, and a whole bunch of other crap that ended up being wrong. He's lost all credability since then.

I just go on his website now for comical purposes!

Edited March 16, 2007 by Kp-Wings

[Matt 1,049]

He's just repeating what has been tossed around on this board and others for MONTHS now.

[Wings_Dynasty 267]

I think your leaving out some important numbers when it comes to getting a contract done. First of all ....

NHL Totals:GP:352 G:102 A:215 Pts:317+/-:77PIM: 97 like it or not regular season counts for alot, and those are some pretty damn good numbers. Secondly: look at the number of games played in said year. After 02 (the cup win, see no reason to complain about him that year,) not much of a chance to get alot done.Games played is a stat often overlooked when you take out the 21 from 02. Besides the stiff goaltending faced, which is so easily overlooked by fans, but not Wings brass.

Career Playoff Stats

Season GP G A P +/- PIM

2001-2002 21 3 3 6 1 2

2002-2003 4 0 0 0 -3 0

2003-2004 12 0 6 6 1 2

2005-2006 5 0 3 3 0 0

In comparison everyone on heres golden boy Z, 11 pts. in 22 games. exclude last year you get 5 pts. in 16 games. Yet after one year he's considered the answer and a perenial playoff performer? I mean I like Z he's the man, but the bias is dumb. It's clear some just don't want Dats around, that's better to be said, then to act like playoff goals are the only reason. Anyway, sign the guy up, and I'll let his play continue to do the talking.

I agree also. I also hate it when Z is referred to as a "franchise player" and Pavel is not. The tandem is a franchise tandem. Alone, they are just 2 above average players. Together they are worth more than any one player.

Playoffs only matter if you make it that far. Without skill guys in the regular season piling up "meaningless goals and points" you end up watching a TEAM win the Cup in June, not a team with one "franchise" guy and a bunch of 1 million per year players like most people on this board want. Lidstrom, Zetterberg, and 18 other guys.

[sibiriak 84]

Take this for what it's worth (it IS Eklund after all) but it does sound feasible.

A source told me yesterday afternoon that word among some of Datsyuk's friends are that his dream is to play with Ovechkin and that he may take a bit less money to make it happen. The source also added, "The price that Datsyuk is giving the Wings right now is extremely high. This could be to bide time and see if the Caps are willing to get into this come July"

It should also be noted that Ted Leonsis, the extremely progressive owner of the Washington Capitals, recently went on record saying that the team is preparing to make a very big splash this off-season. Datsyuk is a splash.

Again, it is Eklund, but interesting food for thought anyway.

From what i've seen when Datsyuk and Ovechkin played together on the Russian national team, their playing styles don't mesh very well. I don't know about their human-to-human relationship, but I have hard time believing that a shy retiring 28 year old family man would be more than good aquaintances with a rock-star personality type single 21 year old. They certainly are unlikely to hang out together.

In short, Eklund is full of it, as usual.

IMO, Ovechkin needs someone like Marc Savard (he's not available, but someone who plays a similar style).

Someone who likes to get the puck and get rid of it fast, not carry it all the way up ice.

Ovechkin and Datsyk on the same line would probably require two pucks in play.

Edited March 16, 2007 by sibiriak

[motorcitykid 42]

In comparison everyone on heres golden boy Z, 11 pts. in 22 games. exclude last year you get 5 pts. in 16 games. Yet after one year he's considered the answer and a perenial playoff performer? I mean I like Z he's the man, but the bias is dumb. It's clear some just don't want Dats around, that's better to be said, then to act like playoff goals are the only reason. Anyway, sign the guy up, and I'll let his play continue to do the talking.

Hey I bleed red AND WHITE and I love seeing Hank & Pavel's name up near the top of the league stats page.

But for around 6 million, or close to it, i'd rather spend it on a player, a power-forward type,

who can compliment Hank the same way everyone in here feels Bertuzzi would do given the chance.

Now if we're talking maybe 4 million ... i'll type out the contract myself. That's what Pavel is worth.

Anyways, Ken Holland and conversations about "premier" or "power-forwards" don't really go together anyway.

[gbdet 0]

No thanks.

Playoffs:

05-06: 3 PTS 0 GOALS

03-04: 6 PTS 0 GOALS

02-03: 0 PTS 0 GOALS

01-02: 6 PTS 3 GOALS

Bottom line: he does not produce when the games matter, yet he wants to be paid like a player who does. What exactly has you confused?

Again 3 career playoff goals in 42 games.

It ain't like reality much matters to Holland, but spending 5.5-6 million on a perrenial no-show is in most books, inexcusable.

BLAME DATSYUK... here we go again... Doesn't count that he played through an injury and had to get his leg drained of blood??? Nope he sucks in the playoffs... 3 points in 5 games in the playoffs last year while he was injured.

Yzerman only scored 9 goals in his last 51 playoff games...

Shanahan--- only scored 3 goals in his last 22 playoff games... and he's a goal scorer.

"What exactly has you confused?"

Why your pulling out goal scoring stats... Since when has Pavel been a goal scorer??? Thats what confuses me, sure he scores some but his job is to set up goals primarily.

"It ain't like reality much matters to Holland, but spending 5.5-6 million on a perrenial no-show is in most books, inexcusable."

I get it... you don't like Datsyuk... So now lets rag on the GM who wants to sign one of our top players... Its not like he hasn't given us an AMAZING team the last 15 YEARS IN A ROW. Nevermind that he signed one of the top 10 (Zetts) players in the game right now to an EXTREMELY cheap price long term, oh and maybe has kept our team on top of league even though he had to cut his payroll in half...

[Wings_Dynasty 267]

BLAME DATSYUK... here we go again... Doesn't count that he played through an injury and had to get his leg drained of blood??? Nope he sucks in the playoffs... 3 points in 5 games in the playoffs last year while he was injured.

Yzerman only scored 9 goals in his last 51 playoff games...

Shanahan--- only scored 3 goals in his last 22 playoff games... and he's a goal scorer.

"What exactly has you confused?"

Why your pulling out goal scoring stats... Since when has Pavel been a goal scorer??? Thats what confuses me, sure he scores some but his job is to set up goals primarily.

"It ain't like reality much matters to Holland, but spending 5.5-6 million on a perrenial no-show is in most books, inexcusable."

I get it... you don't like Datsyuk... So now lets rag on the GM who wants to sign one of our top players... Its not like he hasn't given us an AMAZING team the last 15 YEARS IN A ROW. Nevermind that he signed one of the top 10 (Zetts) players in the game right now to an EXTREMELY cheap price long term, oh and maybe has kept our team on top of league even though he had to cut his payroll in half...

Very nice. Didn't realize the Stevie and Shanny stats were bad as well. But then again, they didn't come from the same country as Fedorov, so there is no reason to hate them , right?

[Heroes of Hockeytown 694]

I am not sure I understand your "perform or be traded" point. The management signs him in good faith, and can then trade him (or anyone else w/o a no-trade clause) if a right deal comes along. The player doesn't have to be consulted beforehand, or even warned about a possible trade. So no ultimatum is necessary.

The point is that it is an ultimatum; either they would plan on dealing him if he turned in a potentially bad playoff performance or they wouldn't. What precedent is there for management doing that? They would never sign and deal a guy like that right away.

Yzerman only scored 9 goals in his last 51 playoff games...

Way to cherry pick. You're essentially talking about the years Steve was an old man, injured, or both. It's awfully easy to gloss over his Conn Smythe worthy 2002 run, as well.

Shanahan--- only scored 3 goals in his last 22 playoff games... and he's a goal scorer.

And he was regularly lambasted for it. There was a reason people wanted him gone after last season's playoff no-show, and that's because it was becoming a habit for him.