Could Kenny go the Z route for Hossa?

[Andy Pred 48 337]

Was doing some number crunching and maybe Kenny has a cunning plan to keep Hossa here

along the same lines as Z. The only draw back would be the amount offered to Marian. Lets not forget he left a big deal on the table from the Oil to sign for us last year.

I'm thinking along the lines of a Z type deal. With the unwritten law of no one earns more than the Capt, Kenny offers Hossa a 10yr $50m deal. The first 5 years @ $7.4m and then

$5m, $3m, $3m, $1m and $1m. At 30yr Hossa is hitting his prime so the next 5yr should be some of his best. The last 2 yrs of his deal at $1m each doesn't sound much but he will be 39 and seen his best. The cap hit of $5m would help Kenny, and dare I say with some minor tweaks to the roster also help to re-sign Mule.

Just a thought.

[CMatt89 63]

well, since we have Datsyuk and Zetterberg as our two star centers...we resign Franzen..and than we have holmstrom as our 4th forward..we could take the money that we are giving to Hossa..and use to it sign two lesser players..possibly role players...or just B level players to fill our other 2 spots. We dont need 5 or 6 stars as our top six forwards...we have 3-4, i think we'll be fine without Hossa. Yes, he's great..and i mean, great...but, would it be wiser to sign 2 playes who can fill the shoes of one superstar?

Edited February 1, 2009 by CMatt89

[Namingway 146]

It's a nice thought but I don't think Hossa will be willing to stay for even cheaper than Z. I mean... Hank was drafted by the Wings organization and he's part of the Red Wings family in a way. He even said it before that he would like to play in detroit for the rest of his career. Hossa's case is a bit different. He decided to sign with us because we were his number 1 choice for a team that could possibly win the cup this season. He stated that he likes being a Red Wing and the style of hockey they play... but I don't think that he'd be willing to sign even a 5 year contract at that amount when he could be making more elsewhere. He may or may not stay, I think it depends on how well our playoff run will be this year. If we have an early round exit, I think the chances of having him re-sign would be that much slimmer.

Edited February 1, 2009 by Namingway

[joshy207 156]

You can't use up all your cap space 8-10 years down the road with all these old guys' cap hits. What happens if they don't retire but are quickly fading? Do you want to lose your next-generation Datsyuk or Lidstrom because Hossa, Zetterberg, and Franzen are eating up $15M or more in cap space but producing less than 100 points between the three of them? I wouldn't.

Front-loading a really long-term contract is a good idea for one player, but not for two or three.

[Anomalously 0]

You can't use up all your cap space 8-10 years down the road with all these old guys' cap hits. What happens if they don't retire but are quickly fading? Do you want to lose your next-generation Datsyuk or Lidstrom because Hossa, Zetterberg, and Franzen are eating up $15M or more in cap space but producing less than 100 points between the three of them? I wouldn't.

Front-loading a really long-term contract is a good idea for one player, but not for two or three.

I think the hope might be that revenues increase, the cap increases. At a 3.3% increase per year for 10 years, as is the industry standard, the NHL's revenues are $3.35 billion in 2019. Players get 57% when league revenues are more than $2.7 billion. The cap could realistically be in the ballpark of $65,000,000 per team. Henrik and Marian would be (at $6m per) ~18%. Right now, Datsyuk and Zetterberg (new contract) combine for ~23%. If they're anything like Sundin, Sakic, etc., it could end up being a very good situation.

On the other hand, and I want to stress this, I know these are all hypotheticals, and the economy sucks, and there's no way league revenues will increase 3.3% in 2009/10 over 2008/09. I know that there's a chance they would age gracefully like Sundin or Sakic. I'm just looking at reasons why this could be attractive.

[FLWINGSFAN4013 5]

its either Franzen or Hossa.....then sign hudler and leino

[joshy207 156]

Good points. It could work out in their favor. They may still be productive at 37, 38. (Or, if not, they may have already retired by then.) But I agree with you, the league is going to be hard-pressed to have increased revenues for the next year, maybe two. I've already heard projections that the cap will decrease next year since the value of the Canadian dollar has fallen again. Teams need to take into consideration the fact that the cap may not rise every year.

Also, at that age, you have to worry about injury. The risk becomes that much greater. Before Sakic minced his hand in his snowblower, he had missed a bunch of games with another injury. Conditioning becomes a factor--Sundin has struggled mightily in his much-hyped return this year. HNIC last night was talking about how much heat he has taken from the media and fans for not showing up in top shape and for taking a vacation over the All-Star break rather than working out in Vancouver. Plus there's the lost scoring touch that Michael Nylander is suffering through at age 36. He went from a consistent point-per-game producer after the lockout to .5 P/GM this year. Ken and Mickey were talking about that yesterday, how much he has struggled this season.

The rewards are great in the short-term and could be good in the long term, but the long-term risks are big and cannot be overlooked.

[hokike 1]

Was doing some number crunching and maybe Kenny has a cunning plan to keep Hossa here

along the same lines as Z. The only draw back would be the amount offered to Marian. Lets not forget he left a big deal on the table from the Oil to sign for us last year.

I'm thinking along the lines of a Z type deal. With the unwritten law of no one earns more than the Capt, Kenny offers Hossa a 10yr $50m deal. The first 5 years @ $7.4m and then

$5m, $3m, $3m, $1m and $1m. At 30yr Hossa is hitting his prime so the next 5yr should be some of his best. The last 2 yrs of his deal at $1m each doesn't sound much but he will be 39 and seen his best. The cap hit of $5m would help Kenny, and dare I say with some minor tweaks to the roster also help to re-sign Mule.

Just a thought.

you forgot one important aspect: Holland has promised to Lidström that nobody earns per year more than capt'n as long as Lidström is under contract.

And yeah, Z-type contract in longterm is too risky for too many players, Holland does not want make "tampa bay mistakes"

Conclusion: signing hossa is pipe dream. But as I have noticed, most of LGW seems to hope to some silly "kenny's magick"

Edited February 1, 2009 by hokike

[Zata fan 40 6]

Like everyone else I would love for Hossa to stay....but I don't want us to get bogged down with too many high end contracts like Tampa Bay did and then have nothing worth a damn to play with the top guys...and be screwed against the cap all the time....I think it to be wiser to focus on Franzen and Hudler and just appreciate this year for what it is...

[Yzersyukstromberg 0]

As much as I can't deny that Hossa is a great player, I think the Red Wings would really handcuff themselves if they were to lock Hossa up long-term, in a contract similar to Z's. I think they'd be much better off trying to find a way to lock up Franzen to a long-term deal, with a cap number somewhere around $3.5 mil/year (if that's even possible!), which would then leave them much more space to keep guys like Samuelsson and Hudler around. I think it would be a much better situation keeping 2-3 guys rather than blowing the wad on Hossa, and being forced to drop a couple of solid role players like Sammy and Huds, both of whom have been solid contributors to our team for a few years now.

[TheOwl 77]

Can someone point out why it would be a better idea to keep Hossa over Franzen? Franzen will probably be around 2 million cheaper, he's just as good defensively, he's scored 22 goals to Hossa's 24, he fits in better on the powerplay. Hossa is too much like Zetterberg, while Franzen, a big strong forward uses his body to make plays. We can't have a whole team of skinny fancy Europeans, we need some brute force goal scoring.

And the main reason I would take Franzen over Hossa is, it's a lot harder to shut Franzen down then Hossa. It's a lot easier to stop people like Zetterberg and Hossa making fancy plays and passes, then stopping the Mule. Keep the MULE! Not to mention the fact Franzen just started getting good at the end of last season.

It'll be a huge mistake if Detroit just ignores the goaltending situition and re-signs Z, Hossa to 6 million dollar contracts. The supporting cast is just as important, and re-signing the cheaper guy will leave a lot more cap room to even out the lines with decent players.

Edited February 2, 2009 by TheOwl

[Winged_Wheeler 3]

Holland will sign Hossa long term. Remember what Holland said at the Zetteberg press conference, "We'll only be able to sign one more guy until July 1st". That doesn't take Franzen out of the picture at all.

[talex 1]

I would not mind seeing Hoss signed long term like Z. You would then have Pav, Z and Hossa around during thier prime for at least 1/2 the contract, would even consider offering Franzen something simular. Hossa seems the type to me to be performing well late into his career baring injuries, not so sure about the mule on that one however. The most logical out look is that the cap would be higher in 5 years, hopefully at least enough to cover a long term deal. All that said, if neither signed we would have a great team with definite playoff chances every year, not to mention the D men you could pick up with the savings. I think we will be fine no matter what.

[Z and D for the C 712]

Can someone point out why it would be a better idea to keep Hossa over Franzen? Franzen will probably be around 2 million cheaper, he's just as good defensively, he's scored 22 goals to Hossa's 24, he fits in better on the powerplay. Hossa is too much like Zetterberg, while Franzen, a big strong forward uses his body to make plays. We can't have a whole team of skinny fancy Europeans, we need some brute force goal scoring.

And the main reason I would take Franzen over Hossa is, it's a lot harder to shut Franzen down then Hossa. It's a lot easier to stop people like Zetterberg and Hossa making fancy plays and passes, then stopping the Mule. Keep the MULE! Not to mention the fact Franzen just started getting good at the end of last season.

Hossa is a big body too....wow. And what do you mean it's a lot harder to shut down franzen than Hossa? That's ridiculous. Franzen will never be the player Hossa is when Franzen is playing his best and Hossa is playing his worst. This is fact. Whether or not Hossa will be a better signing for the money is another story. But Hossa is leagues above Franzen, you can't ever argue against that.

[Ms_Hockey 0]

Hossa is a big body too....wow. And what do you mean it's a lot harder to shut down franzen than Hossa? That's ridiculous. Franzen will never be the player Hossa is when Franzen is playing his best and Hossa is playing his worst. This is fact. Whether or not Hossa will be a better signing for the money is another story. But Hossa is leagues above Franzen, you can't ever argue against that.

Actually, TheOwl has a point. You're looking at what he said from an all-around view. Hossa scores more goals than Franzen. Hossa is, admittedly, worth more than Franzen. But the only thing that Hossa takes advantage of his size with is staying on the puck. In the physical aspect - Franzen wins, hands down. There's a certain physical intensity and presence on the ice with Franzen that you don't get with Hossa. He's our go-to guy when Homer is out with an injury - and for good reason.

Hossa is a great player. Franzen just happens to be more physical than he is.. and with our team - one that plays a far better finesse game than physical game - losing a large physical player is not always the smartest move, no matter who it's for.

[TheOwl 77]

Franzen will never be the player Hossa is when Franzen is playing his best and Hossa is playing his worst.

Except the stats don't say that at all. Franzen, 22 goals in 43 games. Hossa 24 goals in 49 games. More or less equal. Franzen has a better plus-minus. Franzen has more game-winning goals. Hossa is the better play-maker, but not as good as Datsyuk.

I'm not saying Hossa isn't great, but for this team, Franzen is a better fit. Big bodies are important. Look at Homer, Franzen takes his position perfectly on the 2nd unit. All I'm saying is, if Hossa is a 7.45 million dollar player, Franzen is at least a 4-5 million dollar player. And signing either one would be difficult for Holland at anywhere close to that if they don't get rid of people. Is Hossa better defensively? I don't think so. The stats don't think so. And that -4 the other night didn't help.

If you really look at the cap hard, Hossa taking a discount at 6 million is nearly impossible, again unless Flipulla is traded. If it's the choice between Hossa at 6, Franzen at 4, it should be Franzen all the way. The guy scored more goals per game then any other forward last years play-offs. He's severely under-rated, while I think Hossa is slightly over-rated. He's no 90 point a season guy.

[Hockeytown_Ryan 122]

everyone has great points here. I think what needs to be looked at is what kinda of players your getting for the contract. We know Hossa is a goal scorer and a playmaker of sorts. Franzen is a big body that is nice to have up front,and has been known to score as well heh heh.

I guess it will all depend on how Holland wants to build his team.If he wants guys who shoot the lights out and scores goals,or guys who PUSH thier way to the net and score. It all remains to be seen

[Casey 145]

well, since we have Datsyuk and Zetterberg as our two star centers...we resign Franzen..and than we have holmstrom as our 4th forward..we could take the money that we are giving to Hossa..and use to it sign two lesser players..possibly role players...or just B level players to fill our other 2 spots. We dont need 5 or 6 stars as our top six forwards...we have 3-4, i think we'll be fine without Hossa. Yes, he's great..and i mean, great...but, would it be wiser to sign 2 playes who can fill the shoes of one superstar?

I like the way you think.

Let Hossa go, lock up the young guys who have serious potential, start shoring up the D in preparation for when Lids retires.

[DMAC 25 18]

i would like to see him stay but i just dont think its gonna work out, i dont think it would be a 10 year with salary going down

[Red Crazy 201]

If Holland was not scared to sign Z long term I would bet that he won't be afraid to sign Hossa long term. Leaving the whole loyalty thing out, Hossa would be a much better bet then Z due to all Z's back problems. Nobody can ignore the fact that Z's back could come back to bite us in the future big time. Long term contracts are a risk with any player but going in know that the player has back trouble scares me a little.

If Franzen has another good season and another great playoffs he could be worth 5.5-6m to some teams, I am guessing that he will go for the money at this point in his career.

I do however think that if Hossa is to be signed it would mean that Kronner and Flip would have to go to make space. Would this be worth it?

[frederick9125 0]

Hossa signed a 1 year deal so him and Gaborik could be free agents together and and play for the same team next year

[Mors 201]

Hossa signed a 1 year deal so him and Gaborik could be free agents together and and play for the same team next year

Wasn't this stupid blogger rumor already discredited in the trade rumors forum? I don't believe any team is suddenly going to have an extra $15-20 million laying around to sign both of them at the same time.

[Red Crazy 201]

Hossa signed a 1 year deal so him and Gaborik could be free agents together and and play for the same team next year

So what your saying is that he walked away from all the money that the Oilers offered him and signed with the Wings because he wanted a one year deal so he could play with Gabby????? Sorry but I don't buy this rumour. Why not go to the Wild for one year if he wants to play with him so bad?

[frederick9125 0]

Ducks for next year salary is at 37m

Thrashers is at 28m

Bos 42

so as you can see some one will have the money they just wont be solid in depth on all 4 lines

[frederick9125 0]

cuz the wild only have 2 million to spend