Filppula

[Guest Four]

lol what?

A jump from his career high 42pts to a minimum of 70pts is freaking huge. That's a massive leap in development. I'll be happy if he breaks 50pts. 50-55pts is a far more realistic goal for him to reach for.

As a point of reference Toews has never scored 70pts in the NHL.

Last year Filppula had 35 points in 55 games. An average of .64 points a game - take the whole season in to consideration he would have had 52 points. Being on the second line this year (and not the third) he could easily get 8 more points. I expect a breakout year for him which is why I say 70. Will he get 70? Most likely not, but he will definitely be over 60 if he stays healthy. Why would he put up the same points as last year if he's getting more ice time? Doesn't make sense.

edit:

season =/ reason

Edited October 13, 2010 by Four

[eva unit zero 271]

Last year Filppula had 35 points in 55 games. An average of .64 points a game - take the whole season in to consideration he would have had 52 points. Being on the second line this year (and not the third) he could easily get 8 more points. I expect a breakout year for him which is why I say 70. Will he get 70? Most likely not, but he will definitely be over 60 if he stays healthy. Why would he put up the same points as last year if he's getting more ice time? Doesn't make sense.

edit:

season =/ reason

Filppula has averaged 13:54, 13:33, and 14:39 at even strength over the past three seasons. He's currently averaging 14:36 at even strength, and that will probably stay fairly consistent unless there is a drastic shift in the play level of the first line, or several injuries to top-six forwards. So where exactly is this ice time increase? He's played 2:27 per game on the PP last year, and although he is slightly above that this year more games should bring the average PP time more towards the middle for the team and his PP time will be closer to what he played last year. I don't really see any ice time increase unless you expect his scoring increase to come on the PK. Of course, he IS a good defensive player which I guess means he's going to score a bunch of shorthanded points, so maybe you're right.

[Z and D for the C 712]

It's not his minutes, it's his linemates and role.

Either way, when was the last time Filppula started the season with 4 points in 3 games. This is going to be his break out year. Will he keep up the PPG pace? Probably not, but he will undoubtedly crack 60 points over 82 games, and likely near 70.

He is also 5th in the league so far in faceoff percent.

Edited October 14, 2010 by Z and D for the C

[Konnan511 1,736]

It's not his minutes, it's his linemates and role.

Either way, when was the last time Filppula started the season with 4 points in 3 games. This is going to be his break out year. Will he keep up the PPG pace? Probably not, but he will undoubtedly crack 60 points over 82 games, and likely near 70.

Id on't get why that's so hard to understand. Put Cheechoo with great linemates and he wins awards. If you have good skills and play with linemates with as good or better skills and you build chemistry, you put up more points. It's a simple concept than I'm sure compmites understand.

[eva unit zero 271]

It's not his minutes, it's his linemates and role.

Either way, when was the last time Filppula started the season with 4 points in 3 games. This is going to be his break out year. Will he keep up the PPG pace? Probably not, but he will undoubtedly crack 60 points over 82 games, and likely near 70.

He is also 5th in the league so far in faceoff percent.

Filppula played about 40% of his ES time last season with Bertuzzi. That's not a new linemate. Flip's most common line combination was Flip/Z/Bert for about 18% of his ES time.

So what you're basically saying is that Filppula will have a career year because Franzen is awesome?

[Doc Holliday 1,888]

Filppula played about 40% of his ES time last season with Bertuzzi. That's not a new linemate. Flip's most common line combination was Flip/Z/Bert for about 18% of his ES time.

So what you're basically saying is that Filppula will have a career year because Franzen is awesome?

Have you SEEN Franzen so far this season?

[eva unit zero 271]

Id on't get why that's so hard to understand. Put Cheechoo with great linemates and he wins awards. If you have good skills and play with linemates with as good or better skills and you build chemistry, you put up more points. It's a simple concept than I'm sure compmites understand.

Yes, a player's linemates affect his performance. However, Cheechoo was not an AHL player who suddenly scored 56 goals with Thornton; in 2003-04 he scored 28 goals playing with Mike Ricci and Scott Thornton on his line. The season afterwards, Cheechoo played most of the year with a broken thumb and scored a measly 37 goals. His producion started to drop after that. And while Thornton certainly deserves credit as the playmaker, Cheechoo had the ability to score those goals.

The real question is, are you saying Filppula will put up a career high in points simply by existing on a line with Franzen and Bertuzzi? Because while that's great statistically, it still doesn't make Flip the star center a lot of people seem to think he is or will soon be.

Have you SEEN Franzen so far this season?

Do you understand context?

[Guest Four]

Yes, a player's linemates affect his performance. However, Cheechoo was not an AHL player who suddenly scored 56 goals with Thornton; in 2003-04 he scored 28 goals playing with Mike Ricci and Scott Thornton on his line. The season afterwards, Cheechoo played most of the year with a broken thumb and scored a measly 37 goals. His producion started to drop after that. And while Thornton certainly deserves credit as the playmaker, Cheechoo had the ability to score those goals.

The real question is, are you saying Filppula will put up a career high in points simply by existing on a line with Franzen and Bertuzzi? Because while that's great statistically, it still doesn't make Flip the star center a lot of people seem to think he is or will soon be.

Do you understand context?

Filppula spent all season long working on his shot. He barely shot last year, and even already you can see him with more confidence. You can deny Filppula all you want, but I'll quote you know for when you eat crow

[eva unit zero 271]

Filppula spent all season long working on his shot. He barely shot last year, and even already you can see him with more confidence. You can deny Filppula all you want, but I'll quote you know for when you eat crow

I have never said Filppula is a bad player, or denied top-six/first line potential. I've always placed him at that level and if you have ever read my posts maybe you would know that. But regarding his shot; good for him if he worked on his shot and he has more confidence. But there is this: He has two goals credited to him this season, and neither involved him shooting. He drove to the net on a rush and was basically used by Franzen to bounce the puck into the net. Then he him was driving the net while carrying the puck, and he mishandled the puck and through some miracle it ended up in the net.

If Flip scores 100 points, wins the Selke, the Hart, the Norris, and the Vezina, well great. That's awesome. But when, during a debate about Flip and whether he's be closer to 50 points or 80 points, a Flip supporter basically says that his career year is going to be because he happened to be on the ice when someone else did something? That's pathetic. Seriously.

Edited October 14, 2010 by eva unit zero

[Z and D for the C 712]

The real question is, are you saying Filppula will put up a career high in points simply by existing on a line with Franzen and Bertuzzi? Because while that's great statistically, it still doesn't make Flip the star center a lot of people seem to think he is or will soon be.[/font]

Do you possess no concept of that fact that players are affected by their linemates? Obviously god's gift to hockey Hudler could score 600 points if he was 2 inches taller while playing with a pair of sandles, but with other, lesser players, their linemates play a large part in their success. Filppula will have a better year playing with Franzen (and Filppula will also help Franzen to be better, as evidence of 2 of 3 of Franzen's goals this year) than he would playing with Cleary or Miller.

And yes, Bertuzzi is not brand new for him, but last year he spent a large amount of time with Miller, Cleary, Williams and Leino last year yet still was on a pace to score 50 points.

[dropkickshanahans 463]

Filppula has averaged 13:54, 13:33, and 14:39 at even strength over the past three seasons. He's currently averaging 14:36 at even strength, and that will probably stay fairly consistent unless there is a drastic shift in the play level of the first line, or several injuries to top-six forwards. So where exactly is this ice time increase? He's played 2:27 per game on the PP last year, and although he is slightly above that this year more games should bring the average PP time more towards the middle for the team and his PP time will be closer to what he played last year. I don't really see any ice time increase unless you expect his scoring increase to come on the PK. Of course, he IS a good defensive player which I guess means he's going to score a bunch of shorthanded points, so maybe you're right.

All of this means jack. It implies a player won't be improved, rather he needs an increase in ice time to put up higher numbers.

Filppula played about 40% of his ES time last season with Bertuzzi. That's not a new linemate. Flip's most common line combination was Flip/Z/Bert for about 18% of his ES time.

So what you're basically saying is that Filppula will have a career year because Franzen is awesome?

No, he'll have a career year if he stays healthy.

btw, where the hell do you get these stats?

Edited October 14, 2010 by dropkickshanahans

[hatrickswayze 0]

bump

so how has my 2nd favorite wing been looking playing on the wing?

[Shaman 713]

So since the bump: Who wants to place their bets

Two ponies in this race

50+ pts career season

Less than 50 same old Flipper

[LeftWinger 4,961]

I am beginning to conclude that Filppula will not be a 50+ point scorer, but his defense is invaluable, and he is always a threat out there, so other teams have to keep a close watch on him. I liked him on Datyuk's line in the playoff, he seemed to pick it up a little more offensively. So far he is pretty solid with Zetterberg and Franzen, but I think Bertuzzi is better off on that line and Helm-Eaves-Cleary together as the third line checkers. I would like to see Filppula and Datsyuk on the first line instead of Cherry (I mean Cleary) up there. That would leave Miller/Abdelkader/Holmstrom/Brunnstrom/Emmerton for the 4th line. I know Homer isn't much of a 4th liner, but he is pretty much just a powerplay specialist anymore and has already been a healthy scratch this year. This is probably his final year.

Filppula-Datsyuk-

Bertuzzi-Zetterberg-Franzen

Eaves-Helm-Cleary

Miller-Abdelkader-Holmstrom(Emmerton/Brunnstrom)

...I know, I know, where is Hudler, he is in the blank spot, but I cannot bring myself to type it without my fingers burning...

[eva unit zero 271]

I am beginning to conclude that Filppula will not be a 50+ point scorer, but his defense is invaluable, and he is always a threat out there, so other teams have to keep a close watch on him. I liked him on Datyuk's line in the playoff, he seemed to pick it up a little more offensively. So far he is pretty solid with Zetterberg and Franzen, but I think Bertuzzi is better off on that line and Helm-Eaves-Cleary together as the third line checkers. I would like to see Filppula and Datsyuk on the first line instead of Cherry (I mean Cleary) up there. That would leave Miller/Abdelkader/Holmstrom/Brunnstrom/Emmerton for the 4th line. I know Homer isn't much of a 4th liner, but he is pretty much just a powerplay specialist anymore and has already been a healthy scratch this year. This is probably his final year.

Filppula-Datsyuk-

Bertuzzi-Zetterberg-Franzen

Eaves-Helm-Cleary

Miller-Abdelkader-Holmstrom(Emmerton/Brunnstrom)

...I know, I know, where is Hudler, he is in the blank spot, but I cannot bring myself to type it without my fingers burning...

And stop stealing my third line.

[LeftWinger 4,961]

And stop stealing my third line.

Welcome.....To......Frrrright Night......For Real.

[redwingfan19 293]

same old flip, expect 35-40 pts and missing a dozen or so games for injury.

Edited October 13, 2011 by redwingfan19

[Z and D for the C 712]

Hi, I think Filppula is a good player.

[Scott Stevens 44]

Trade Filppula, Bertuzzi, Helm, Hudler, Mursak, Tatar, Abdelkader, Cleary, Miller, and Eaves since they don't score 60+ points a season.

Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Holmstrom

Holmstrom-Zetterberg-Cleary

Cleary-Datsyuk-Franzen

Franzen-Cleary-Datsyuk

That's how our 4 lines should look. pshhhh

Why is everyone so hell bent on holding our third line players to 1st line standards?

Cleary-Datsyuk-(Insert Player Worth His While)

Franzen-Zetterberg-(Insert Player Worth His While)

Hudler-Filppula-Abdelkader

Eaves-Helm-Mursak

We need two players. If we fill in the blanks with some good players once this season's over, Filppula and Hudler talks should go away.

[Buppy 1,720]

...

Why is everyone so hell bent on holding our third line players to 1st line standards?

Cleary-Datsyuk-(Insert Player Worth His While)

Franzen-Zetterberg-(Insert Player Worth His While)

Hudler-Filppula-Abdelkader

Eaves-Helm-Mursak

We need two players. If we fill in the blanks with some good players once this season's over, Filppula and Hudler talks should go away.

Flip and Happy aren't 3rd liners; they are top-6 complementary players. We were deep enough in '09 to play them on the third line even though they were advanced enough in their development to play a larger role. While it would be great if we could keep them there, we can't afford it anymore unless we find a very cheap star caliber player (fingers crossed for Nyquist or Tatar next year). We'll likely have a ton of cap space at the deadline this year, but few good assets to trade for anyone of impact. Next year we likely won't have the cap space to re-sign Hudler and pick up even one "Player Worth His While", much less two.

In '09, Flip was excellent for a 3rd liner. Happy was phenomenal as a 3rd liner/PP specialist. Last year both had mediocre years. Happy was horrible the first half, very good the second. Flip looked great (as usual) but the production wasn't there. With Helm and Abby RFAs, Eaves, Miller, Emmerton, and Mursak signed, and other prospects knocking on the door our bottom-6 and reserves should be set. Flip and Happy either need to produce like legit top-6 forwards or be moved for someone better (we likely will have the cap space to upgrade one of them, though maybe not both). They are two of our few potentially tradeable assets, and playing roles where we need better performance; hence all the trade talk.

[kylee 727]

as others have noted, Filppula in the first few games does indeed look more aggressive in the offensive zone, and if he keeps it up, eventually they will start getting buried more often than passing the puck all of the time. Looking for Fil to finally break the 20-25 goal mark this year which only makes him that much more of a solidified two way forward.

[Scott Stevens 44]

Flip and Happy aren't 3rd liners; they are top-6 complementary players. We were deep enough in '09 to play them on the third line even though they were advanced enough in their development to play a larger role. While it would be great if we could keep them there, we can't afford it anymore unless we find a very cheap star caliber player (fingers crossed for Nyquist or Tatar next year). We'll likely have a ton of cap space at the deadline this year, but few good assets to trade for anyone of impact. Next year we likely won't have the cap space to re-sign Hudler and pick up even one "Player Worth His While", much less two.

In '09, Flip was excellent for a 3rd liner. Happy was phenomenal as a 3rd liner/PP specialist. Last year both had mediocre years. Happy was horrible the first half, very good the second. Flip looked great (as usual) but the production wasn't there. With Helm and Abby RFAs, Eaves, Miller, Emmerton, and Mursak signed, and other prospects knocking on the door our bottom-6 and reserves should be set. Flip and Happy either need to produce like legit top-6 forwards or be moved for someone better (we likely will have the cap space to upgrade one of them, though maybe not both). They are two of our few potentially tradeable assets, and playing roles where we need better performance; hence all the trade talk.

Why do you feel this way?

We've got 4 of our top 6 locked up long term, 10 mil in cap space right now, and 4 more opening up with the departure of Bertuzzi/Holmstrom. Sure, we've got Lidstrom/Helm/Kronwall to resign, but this shouldn't chew up 20 million. I don't want to see Huds or Filps on the top two lines. They are third line players. The problem with all the Huds/Filps bashing lies in the fact that people seem to think they are 1st liners.

Why can't we grab 2 UFA's for 4-5 mil a piece in the off season? Say Boyes and Grabovski.

[sean 19]

Same ol' Flip is good ol' Flip, IMO. Plays great D, knows the Wings' system, usually turns it up in the playoffs.

I think Flip playing on the third line has to do with the fact that the Wings like to be strong down the middle, and Flip is a natural center. Larionov was once a third line center.

Edited October 13, 2011 by sean

[Lonewuhf 47]

Why do you feel this way?

We've got 4 of our top 6 locked up long term, 10 mil in cap space right now, and 4 more opening up with the departure of Bertuzzi/Holmstrom. Sure, we've got Lidstrom/Helm/Kronwall to resign, but this shouldn't chew up 20 million. I don't want to see Huds or Filps on the top two lines. They are third line players. The problem with all the Huds/Filps bashing lies in the fact that people seem to think they are 1st liners.

Why can't we grab 2 UFA's for 4-5 mil a piece in the off season? Say Boyes and Grabovski.

I can't for the life of me understand why you think Flip is no more than a 3rd line center... His point production is right at the end of 2nd line players but he missed 11 games last season. He's got as good of a defensive mind as any 2nd line player.

That being said, I have been as disappointed with his production as anyone. He's got the skills to produce more, he just needs the 'shoot more' mindset. This year he seems to have it. He's much more aggressive, he's shooting more, and he's in really good positions for rebounds. He was one of our top (if not our top?) point producer in the pre-season (yes I know that means nothing, but it's at least proof that he can score). People who say he's not a 2nd line player seem to be looking at what's expected out of him instead of what he's producing. If he's not producing what people expect, he's apparently a bad player (I don't get it...)

[hatrickswayze 0]

Granted I don't get to see all the Detroit games, so maybe I'm off, but it seems like Flip might be one of those players where you're constantly saying this:

This year he seems to have it

The kind of guy whom you're always waiting for to take it to that next level, but he just never does. Which wouldn't be a terrible thing in his case, since he's already a very good player. But maybe the production will never match his potential.