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RedWang

11/9 GDT: Lightning 3 @ Red Wings 2 (OT)

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you know your team is bad when helm is centering a 2nd line

any who like others say and have said for almost the whole season thus far we didnt deserve to win. sloppy and played in our own end

howard isnt at fault but he sure isnt stealing us any games

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They just announced Team Canada's lineup. Cleary is on the first line.

That joke is getting old. Babs is coming around. Cleary on the 4th line despite a depleted lineup? Safe to say we're past the worst I think.

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Need Ericsson back badly. Put Smith with Ericsson I bet he looks a lot better. Any of Kindl, Quincey, Lashoff can get benched for the whole season to get our rookies on the third pair for all I care.

Lashoff is a rookie on the third pair. He's played 48 games in the NHL, and i think he's mostly been fine.

Kindl continues to be incredibly frustrating. It's his 4th year on the team, he's a skill player, and he's really improved in the offensive zone. But he's still making terrible plays in his own end like one last night, along with turning the puck over too much with his desperate clearing attempts instead of solid first passes.

Quincey is well, Quincey. He's been plagued by this his whole career. Stretches where he looks very solid (which he has on the Wings), followed by stretches where you can't believe he's in the NHL.

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That joke is getting old. Babs is coming around. Cleary on the 4th line despite a depleted lineup? Safe to say we're past the worst I think.

Agreed.

He was utilized more where he belongs so maybe people will settle down. I don't think he's been as awful as everyone here makes him out to be, but he certainly shouldn't be on the 2nd line. 3rd and 4th line with some PK time is fine.

Against a team like Tampa you really see his lack of speed. On his penalty last night Cleary and another Wings player got crossed up on the switch. And if an opponent with any speed gets a step on Cleary it's pretty much over, so he ended up taking the hook.

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Agreed.

He was utilized more where he belongs so maybe people will settle down. I don't think he's been as awful as everyone here makes him out to be, but he certainly shouldn't be on the 2nd line. 3rd and 4th line with some PK time is fine.

Against a team like Tampa you really see his lack of speed. On his penalty last night Cleary and another Wings player got crossed up on the switch. And if an opponent with any speed gets a step on Cleary it's pretty much over, so he ended up taking the hook.

He's the embodiment of what's wrong with this team though. Too many passengers. Too few guys who actively contribute positive things on a nightly basis. That's why I'm not a fan of Lashoff. Should he be in the lineup because he's not terrible? Because he doesn't do a lot of mistakes? Or should we try Almqvist or Oullet/Sproul as regulars who may do more GOOD things? AA managed to stand out in a positive way more in 2 games than Lashoff has done all year.

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Thank you Kenny LOLland for trading a top pick for Kyle Quincey.

Thank you GM.

And exactly what has the Wings done with their # 1 picks when they retained and used that pick over the past 10 years or so? Kindl, Smith, McCollum, Sheahan and Mantha. Mantha might become worthy of his 1st round pick IF he learns to to play every game otherwise he will be just another lazy Francine.

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In the League's Modern Conference Era after the first eighteen games, this is only the second time that the Club's game differential (wins minus regulation losses) has been a plus, while their goal differential (goals scored minus goals allowed) has been a minus. The other season was the most recent lockout-induced season.

All-time? Only the third time; just add 1933-34.

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And exactly what has the Wings done with their # 1 picks when they retained and used that pick over the past 10 years or so? Kindl, Smith, McCollum, Sheahan and Mantha. Mantha might become worthy of his 1st round pick IF he learns to to play every game otherwise he will be just another lazy Francine.

Isn't that a further indictment of Holland?

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He's the embodiment of what's wrong with this team though. Too many passengers. Too few guys who actively contribute positive things on a nightly basis. That's why I'm not a fan of Lashoff. Should he be in the lineup because he's not terrible? Because he doesn't do a lot of mistakes? Or should we try Almqvist or Oullet/Sproul as regulars who may do more GOOD things? AA managed to stand out in a positive way more in 2 games than Lashoff has done all year.

But this is the grass is greener syndrome. People want the young guys to play, but then they apparently don't even get a full season to see if they're any good before they should get the hook?

Lashoff doesn't need to stand out. He's not really an offensive defenseman. But he's big, uses his size and has a decent first pass, and will probably get better. Like I said he's played 48 games in the NHL, so he's not nearly done developing. And he absolutely should be in the lineup because he doesn't make a lot of mistakes. That's a big part of his job. Consider how the Wings lost the game in OT last night.

But you want to yank him because Almqvist, Oullet or Sproul might do something better? Sure Almqvist scored a goal when he jumped into the play that one time, but he also looked like the rookie that he is out there too.

Lashoff can help provide mix of more stay at home guys to free up the d-men with more offensive talent. It's way too early to give up on him.

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But this is the grass is greener syndrome. People want the young guys to play, but then they apparently don't even get a full season to see if they're any good before they should get the hook?

Lashoff doesn't need to stand out. He's not really an offensive defenseman. But he's big, uses his size and has a decent first pass, and will probably get better. Like I said he's played 48 games in the NHL, so he's not nearly done developing. And he absolutely should be in the lineup because he doesn't make a lot of mistakes. That's a big part of his job. Consider how the Wings lost the game in OT last night.

But you want to yank him because Almqvist, Oullet or Sproul might do something better? Sure Almqvist scored a goal when he jumped into the play that one time, but he also looked like the rookie that he is out there too.

Lashoff can help provide mix of more stay at home guys to free up the d-men with more offensive talent. It's way too early to give up on him.

Lash can be a servicable 6th/7th D, but I don't think he fits into the Wings style. Atleast not what used to be our style. I don't really see a good first pass from him, he usually makes very simple plays, often up the boards. He's not good with the puck, he's got absolutely zero offensive ability. If we can go back to being a team that has the puck more than the other team has it we won't care so much about having big d-men who don't make a lot of mistakes. Pair up Almqvist with Dekeyser and that's a great puck-moving d-pair. Let Kindl/Lashoff/Smith/Oullet fight for 5th and 6th.

The Griffs are tearing it up. We need Nyquist, but why settle for that? Jarnkrok is adapting to the NA game and is a great puck-possession player. Nyquist-Jarnkrok-Tatar on the 3rd line anyone? Andersson? Another unspectacular "doesn't make a lot of mistakes" player that I don't see in the Red Wings system. Stop being a dump and chase team, stop exiting the zone by shooting it up the boards. We should be beating teams by using our skill and playing the Red Wings way again.

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Lash can be a servicable 6th/7th D, but I don't think he fits into the Wings style. Atleast not what used to be our style. I don't really see a good first pass from him, he usually makes very simple plays, often up the boards. He's not good with the puck, he's got absolutely zero offensive ability. If we can go back to being a team that has the puck more than the other team has it we won't care so much about having big d-men who don't make a lot of mistakes. Pair up Almqvist with Dekeyser and that's a great puck-moving d-pair. Let Kindl/Lashoff/Smith/Oullet fight for 5th and 6th.

The Griffs are tearing it up. We need Nyquist, but why settle for that? Jarnkrok is adapting to the NA game and is a great puck-possession player. Nyquist-Jarnkrok-Tatar on the 3rd line anyone? Andersson? Another unspectacular "doesn't make a lot of mistakes" player that I don't see in the Red Wings system. Stop being a dump and chase team, stop exiting the zone by shooting it up the boards. We should be beating teams by using our skill and playing the Red Wings way again.

I agree but this is not Lashoff's fault. The Wings keep filling holes with guy's that are not meant for those spots. Like using Helm as a second line center! Ken Holland has us in a really bad position where we have zero tradable assets to fix what needs fixing. We have way to many bottom six guys that are not worth a cent on the market. Sammy, Cleary, Miller, Abby, Tootoo, Eaves, Anderson, to name a few. If Pav, Z or Dek goes down long term we could easily miss the playoffs. sad.

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Rebuilding is a process. We have serviceable vets filling in for now but Holland will continue to upgrade every chance he can. Right now we have a lot of good prospects where a couple years ago we didn't even have that. Holland couldn't build a true contender with what was available after Lidstrom retired. What do you expect him to do? People continue to ask for a true power forward and elite defensemen but you can't even name a player remotely available. Next year when all these oldies contracts are up you'll see a true changing of the guard.

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Rebuilding is a process. We have serviceable vets filling in for now but Holland will continue to upgrade every chance he can. Right now we have a lot of good prospects where a couple years ago we didn't even have that. Holland couldn't build a true contender with what was available after Lidstrom retired. What do you expect him to do? People continue to ask for a true power forward and elite defensemen but you can't even name a player remotely available. Next year when all these oldies contracts are up you'll see a true changing of the guard.

All I see is people simply asking Holland to dump dead weight and bring up more youth. He didn't have to wait until next year if he didn't act like a ******* moron in the 1st place, especially this year. Nobody is claiming to be able to replace Holland themselves, but it's pretty telling when 99% of armchair GM in Red Wings nation can all agree on a terrible move.

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Isn't that a further indictment of Holland?

I was willing to give Quincy some slack last season but He is pretty bad and Kindl seems to be regressing.

HOWEVER, the 3 year deal to Samuelsson and resigning Cleary is what really is disgusting and it appears we now have another albatross in Weiss.

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I was willing to give Quincy some slack last season but He is pretty bad and Kindl seems to be regressing.

HOWEVER, the 3 year deal to Samuelsson and resigning Cleary is what really is disgusting and it appears we now have another albatross in Weiss.

Cleary and Sammy I agree with for sure. But you CANNOT blame Kenny for Weiss. Before the season began, I think a large number of us were thrilled thinking that he would step up and be the 2nd line centerman that Fil has never been since 2008. Besides, I am still holding out my belief that Weiss will find his game.

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