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krsmith17

Predictions for the DRW 2014-15 Season!

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Well because I don't think any non-first rounder, sleeper, has any real good value till they play in the NHL.

Hasek went to Buffalo for a 4th rounder and a crappy prospect. Now he was a 10 round pick but I'm sure you get the point I'm trying to make.

It'd be like buying an awesome Tv for 100 dollars when it's really worth 200... then selling it for 50.

It wouldn't be like buying anything because they're your prospects, you didn't pay for them. Also, selling makes sense when you've got so many other (tvs?) that these ones will never get used. Also, quality guys get traded for unproven prospects and picks (in packages) all the time. Bobby Ryan did. So did Thomas Vanek. Just to name two in the last year. Package them with a top six forward and you could have Marian Gaborik or Jason Spezza or James Van Riemsdyk.

Again, I'm not saying just throw guys away. But I'm sick of everybody acting like the future of the Red Wings is hanging precariously in the balance, and should we move Backman, or Pulkkinen, or Tatar, or Nyquist, or Quellet, we'll all of a sudden become the Florida Panthers. We won't. Just so long as we don't move ALL of them.

Saying that drafting and developing is the key to success does not mean that you can never, EVER, move a homegrown talent lest the organization crash and burn. Just move them intelligently (e.g. not for David Legwand).

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It wouldn't be like buying anything because they're your prospects, you didn't pay for them. Also, selling makes sense when you've got so many other (tvs?) that these ones will never get used. Also, quality guys get traded for unproven prospects and picks (in packages) all the time. Bobby Ryan did. So did Thomas Vanek. Just to name two in the last year. Package them with a top six forward and you could have Marian Gaborik or Jason Spezza or James Van Riemsdyk.

Again, I'm not saying just throw guys away. But I'm sick of everybody acting like the future of the Red Wings is hanging precariously in the balance, and should we move Backman, or Pulkkinen, or Tatar, or Nyquist, or Quellet, we'll all of a sudden become the Florida Panthers. We won't. Just so long as we don't move ALL of them.

Saying that drafting and developing is the key to success does not mean that you can never, EVER, move a homegrown talent lest the organization crash and burn. Just move them intelligently (e.g. not for David Legwand).

Well see I trust management, whereas many of you don't. I'm going to be fine with the Legwand-Ironhook trade until Calle makes it big in the NHL. I like to think management knew what they were doing there.

I think once Mantha, Athanasiou, Marchenko, Pulkkinen, Ouellet, and Sproul (or a combination of others) officially join the team, and they are what we thought they would be. Then the trades you want will be made.

The Wings play REAL tight to the vest, and as a business man I operate the same way. IMO it's smart and minimizes risk, even if you lose some product in prospects who can't grace your system. All that means is that you're getting the best of the best.

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Well see I trust management, whereas many of you don't. I'm going to be fine with the Legwand-Ironhook trade until Calle makes it big in the NHL. I like to think management knew what they were doing there.

I think once Mantha, Athanasiou, Marchenko, Pulkkinen, Ouellet, and Sproul (or a combination of others) officially join the team, and they are what we thought they would be. Then the trades you want will be made.

The Wings play REAL tight to the vest, and as a business man I operate the same way. IMO it's smart and minimizes risk, even if you lose some product in prospects who can't grace your system. All that means is that you're getting the best of the best.

Yeah, it’s tricky because we talk about guys like Mantha, AA, Larkin, Pulkkinen, and of course Sproul and Ouellet.

Then you have Captain Deathstare who has a boner for guys like Glendenning and Backmann.

So, this team is a living organism which makes it very unpredictable.

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Well see I trust management, whereas many of you don't. I'm going to be fine with the Legwand-Ironhook trade until Calle makes it big in the NHL. I like to think management knew what they were doing there.

I think once Mantha, Athanasiou, Marchenko, Pulkkinen, Ouellet, and Sproul (or a combination of others) officially join the team, and they are what we thought they would be. Then the trades you want will be made.

The Wings play REAL tight to the vest, and as a business man I operate the same way. IMO it's smart and minimizes risk, even if you lose some product in prospects who can't grace your system. All that means is that you're getting the best of the best.

I'm not going to agree to disagree, because that's weak. But I am too tired to disagree, so I'm calling it a night. Good talk though buddy.

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Yeah, it’s tricky because we talk about guys like Mantha, AA, Larkin, Pulkkinen, and of course Sproul and Ouellet.

Then you have Captain Deathstare who has a boner for guys like Glendenning and Backmann.

So, this team is a living organism which makes it very unpredictable.

I just assume some will fail. I'm hot on Marchenko AA Mantha Pulkkinen Sproul and Ouellete right now. But who knows that might change. Larkin and all the new guys have yet to impress me.

EDIT: Was drunk and misspelled words

Edited by number9

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you're pretty much spot on. I just don't see things as black and white as you do. I look at a team like Philly, who tries to go balls to the wall every year, and I don't like the situation they're in. Then I see a team like the Oilers, who have been trying to rebuild for years and it's not working, and I don't wanna go through that either.

In the non cap era our strength was attracting FA vets who wanted to win... and we did that.

In the cap era our strength is drafting... and were doing that. But that means we're gonna have to be a helluva lot more patient with the results unlike the non cap era.

And I'm fine with that for the time being.

Well you saw kips post an do agree with him. The wings are missing so much on free agents and trades it's not even funny. But yes they're great at drafting but you can't win just via the draft. At some point some prospects need to be moved.

Trading jarnkrok was fine but only for a rental? That's not fine.

Since we can't get free agents we need to make a trade. Some of the guys being trades we should be on. Guys like Ryan and spezza etc etc.

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Well you saw kips post an do agree with him. The wings are missing so much on free agents and trades it's not even funny. But yes they're great at drafting but you can't win just via the draft. At some point some prospects need to be moved.

Trading jarnkrok was fine but only for a rental? That's not fine.

Since we can't get free agents we need to make a trade. Some of the guys being trades we should be on. Guys like Ryan and spezza etc etc.

Oh f*** you Mother f***** posting this s*** at 1 am when I'm good and drunk. I'll deal with you tomorrow after 5 pm when honest Americans have the reasonable ability.

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I'm not going to agree to disagree, because that's weak. But I am too tired to disagree, so I'm calling it a night. Good talk though buddy.

lol

Edited by kliq
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Oh f*** you Mother f***** posting this s*** at 1 am when I'm good and drunk. I'll deal with you tomorrow after 5 pm when honest Americans have the reasonable ability.

I wish I could "like" this 2,000 times. Definitely my favorite post in a good long time. Touche my man. Touche.

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I wish I could "like" this 2,000 times. Definitely my favorite post in a good long time. Touche my man. Touche.

Ha I vaguely remember posting this lol

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Well you saw kips post an do agree with him. The wings are missing so much on free agents and trades it's not even funny. But yes they're great at drafting but you can't win just via the draft. At some point some prospects need to be moved.

Trading jarnkrok was fine but only for a rental? That's not fine.

Since we can't get free agents we need to make a trade. Some of the guys being trades we should be on. Guys like Ryan and spezza etc etc.

The Wings are missing out on free agents maybe, but could you really say that any of those guys they targeted since Suter have been essential? If anything, missing out is helping to further the future of this team quicker, by allowing what we saw last season - guys like Jurco, Sheahan, Nyquist and Tatar have emerged as legitimate NHLers.

Prospects will undoubtedly be moved when the Wings feel the need is there, and when they feel they are absolutely ready to do something that will put them either very close or over the top. I don't feel that we necessarily need to make a trade right now, other than to erase Kindl from the roster to allow for Marchenko/Sproul or Ouellet to begin the year with the big club. What this team needs most right now is to get its top players healthy for 90% of the season, and have further growth from the young guys who were such a big part of the team last season.

Once that happens (and I firmly believe it will), then we all will have a better view of precisely what the Wings have and how good they could be. After that, something will happen to strengthen this team. All it is is patience. And in the trigger happy world that is the NHL, patience can be a virtue.

I don't think any of us would be sitting here moaning about the Jarnkrok trade still if we'd gone on a deeper playoff run. But so what? This has been battered to death so can we just forget about it?

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The Wings are missing out on free agents maybe, but could you really say that any of those guys they targeted since Suter have been essential? If anything, missing out is helping to further the future of this team quicker, by allowing what we saw last season - guys like Jurco, Sheahan, Nyquist and Tatar have emerged as legitimate NHLers.

Prospects will undoubtedly be moved when the Wings feel the need is there, and when they feel they are absolutely ready to do something that will put them either very close or over the top. I don't feel that we necessarily need to make a trade right now, other than to erase Kindl from the roster to allow for Marchenko/Sproul or Ouellet to begin the year with the big club. What this team needs most right now is to get its top players healthy for 90% of the season, and have further growth from the young guys who were such a big part of the team last season.

Once that happens (and I firmly believe it will), then we all will have a better view of precisely what the Wings have and how good they could be. After that, something will happen to strengthen this team. All it is is patience. And in the trigger happy world that is the NHL, patience can be a virtue.

I don't think any of us would be sitting here moaning about the Jarnkrok trade still if we'd gone on a deeper playoff run. But so what? This has been battered to death so can we just forget about it?

without that trade though would we have made the p/o ?

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The Wings are missing out on free agents maybe, but could you really say that any of those guys they targeted since Suter have been essential? If anything, missing out is helping to further the future of this team quicker, by allowing what we saw last season - guys like Jurco, Sheahan, Nyquist and Tatar have emerged as legitimate NHLers.

Prospects will undoubtedly be moved when the Wings feel the need is there, and when they feel they are absolutely ready to do something that will put them either very close or over the top. I don't feel that we necessarily need to make a trade right now, other than to erase Kindl from the roster to allow for Marchenko/Sproul or Ouellet to begin the year with the big club. What this team needs most right now is to get its top players healthy for 90% of the season, and have further growth from the young guys who were such a big part of the team last season.

Once that happens (and I firmly believe it will), then we all will have a better view of precisely what the Wings have and how good they could be. After that, something will happen to strengthen this team. All it is is patience. And in the trigger happy world that is the NHL, patience can be a virtue.

I don't think any of us would be sitting here moaning about the Jarnkrok trade still if we'd gone on a deeper playoff run. But so what? This has been battered to death so can we just forget about it?

Poilé robbed Holland pure and simple, there is no way of spinning this as a positive, period. You don't deal from a position of weakness to fix a secondary at best - for that time - situation. Jarnkrok was the best center prospect so if you package him it should have been for defensive help and not a few months of service. I didn't like the trade back then nor do I like it now it was clear at that time, that this time is far far away from being a contender as seen against the Big Bad Bear in the east. If the playoffs didn't open the eyes of some fans then I don't know what will.

Missing out on top free agents in the grand scheme of things has to be an alarming signal it basically means, the organization is NOT going into the right direction in the eyes of top players. While drafting is important you can't build your team purely from drafting the mixture between draft and UFAs is key here.

I also don't need a "better view" of what this team is, since 2009 I've seen this team getting worse and worse and last year they've barely made the playoffs. That to me is indication enough, to be go into the season with very low expectations and hoping to be surprised. Given that this is going to be the exact same roster I see no reason on why they should be doing better.

btw. I'd rather see the kids develop and maybe miss the playoffs then getting slaughtered in such an embarraing fashion again.

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Missing out on top free agents in the grand scheme of things has to be an alarming signal it basically means, the organization is NOT going into the right direction in the eyes of top players.

I don't think necessarily means anything, I think the reason for each missed UFA is purely situational. I think GM's sometimes get way to much credit when they attract a free agent, and at the same time get way to much crap when they don't get a free agent. There are a variety of things that a player looks at when deciding where to play, in no particular order: family, climate, skill set of team, money, the way a team treats its players, just to name a few. While there very well could be some players that went elsewhere because they thought another team had a brighter future then the Wings, I don't think we should take this as an alarming sign. Suter is a perfect example, he wanted to live closer to his wife's family, and unless Holland threw a dollar amount at him he simply couldn't refuse (thank our luck stars he didnt), he wasn't coming here........For the record, nothing against Suter, I just don't want a guy under contract for 14 years at 7mil+ cap hit.

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I don't think necessarily means anything, I think the reason for each missed UFA is purely situational. I think GM's sometimes get way to much credit when they attract a free agent, and at the same time get way to much crap when they don't get a free agent. There are a variety of things that a player looks at when deciding where to play, in no particular order: family, climate, skill set of team, money, the way a team treats its players, just to name a few. While there very well could be some players that went elsewhere because they thought another team had a brighter future then the Wings, I don't think we should take this as an alarming sign. Suter is a perfect example, he wanted to live closer to his wife's family, and unless Holland threw a dollar amount at him he simply couldn't refuse (thank our luck stars he didnt), he wasn't coming here........For the record, nothing against Suter, I just don't want a guy under contract for 14 years at 7mil+ cap hit.

Players go to other teams bc their buddies are there too. Imagine going to work with ur best friends everyday. That's how Minny got Parise Vanek and Suter now (plus the home thing). Orpik convinced Niskanen to go to WSH with him. Alfredsson came here for the Swedish connection.

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Players go to other teams bc their buddies are there too. Imagine going to work with ur best friends everyday. That's how Minny got Parise Vanek and Suter now (plus the home thing). Orpik convinced Niskanen to go to WSH with him. Alfredsson came here for the Swedish connection.

There is also a money factor or wanting to win. That's how hossa fell into Hollands lap. He wanted a cup and the wings were still relevant.

I also thought that's why fil left? He was offered a deal but wanted more so tested the open market he all ready had his cup.

I don't think necessarily means anything, I think the reason for each missed UFA is purely situational. I think GM's sometimes get way to much credit when they attract a free agent, and at the same time get way to much crap when they don't get a free agent. There are a variety of things that a player looks at when deciding where to play, in no particular order: family, climate, skill set of team, money, the way a team treats its players, just to name a few. While there very well could be some players that went elsewhere because they thought another team had a brighter future then the Wings, I don't think we should take this as an alarming sign. Suter is a perfect example, he wanted to live closer to his wife's family, and unless Holland threw a dollar amount at him he simply couldn't refuse (thank our luck stars he didnt), he wasn't coming here........For the record, nothing against Suter, I just don't want a guy under contract for 14 years at 7mil+ cap hit.

I agree about the 14 year deal. In every sport I'm always worried about long term big money deals.

But at te same time guys like suter and weber deserve it. So if that's what it takes to get them you have to consider it for sure.

Just like baseball....verlander and miggy have deals that hurt use own the road(or now in verlanders case) but when you have someone playing at a superstar level for several years you can't just let them walk.

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There is also a money factor or wanting to win. That's how hossa fell into Hollands lap. He wanted a cup and the wings were still relevant.

I also thought that's why fil left? He was offered a deal but wanted more so tested the open market he all ready had his cup.

I agree about the 14 year deal. In every sport I'm always worried about long term big money deals.

But at te same time guys like suter and weber deserve it. So if that's what it takes to get them you have to consider it for sure.

Just like baseball....verlander and miggy have deals that hurt use own the road(or now in verlanders case) but when you have someone playing at a superstar level for several years you can't just let them walk.

I definitely see your point, but in hockey specifically it worries me because of the cap. I would hate to see in 2018, 2019 or whenever they became UFA's. having to let a player like Tatar or Nyquist walk away at their peek because we cant fit them under the cap due to a bad long term contract. In baseball I am much more for long term deals then hockey.....plus, in baseball you can always trade that bad contract to the Yankees ;)

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I definitely see your point, but in hockey specifically it worries me because of the cap. I would hate to see in 2018, 2019 or whenever they became UFA's. having to let a player like Tatar or Nyquist walk away at their peek because we cant fit them under the cap due to a bad long term contract. In baseball I am much more for long term deals then hockey.....plus, in baseball you can always trade that bad contract to the Yankees ;)

Lol good point. But that's also why I wish hockey would change their salary cap system. In the NFL players can be cut or have their contracts restructured. Now yes cut players count against the cap still but it's only a fraction of what I could be.

But the PA won't ever allow that cause they're quite greedy.

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I gotta say, looking at rosters. A lot of people have pegged Buffalo or Florida to get the 1st round pick, but i thinks its gonna be Calgary for once. Their roster is despicable.

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I gotta say, looking at rosters. A lot of people have pegged Buffalo or Florida to get the 1st round pick, but i thinks its gonna be Calgary for once. Their roster is despicable.

Florida added some players right?

But I agree Calgary and buffalo will be the two worst IMO.

Wouldn't be surprised to see hudler moved either.

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Calgary may have a bad roster but for sure they are also going to have a very entertaining one with McGrattan Engelland and Westgarth nobody will touch their star players.

And all of that in a McDavid year so their future may not be as bad and with Burke you can bet more grit help will be on the way

The Panthers may have added a young Shea Weber if the develop him the right way

Edited by frankgrimes

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Calgary may have a bad roster but for sure they are also going to have a very entertaining one with McGrattan Engelland and Westgarth nobody will touch their star players. And all of that in a McDavid year so their future may not be as bad and with Burke you can bet more grit help will be on the way The Panthers may have added a young Shea Weber if the develop him the right way

What star players?

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