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kliq

Who would you Rather Have?

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Who would you rather have?  

34 members have voted

  1. 1. Who Would you Rather Have?

    • Filip Hronek AND Dennis Cholowski
      22
    • Jakob Chychrun
      10


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3 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

So I guess, I'm not sure what they could have done to better prepare for Lidstrom's retirement, other than trade up in the top 10-15, but even that would have been a bit of a crap shoot. So I guess more than anything, they were unlucky taking defensemen for quite a few years. Hopefully that is about to change with the high volume of defensemen taken in the past few years.

Ya, the way I look at it Holland had 3 plans.

1) Sign Suter, he came close, but obviously this didnt workout. 

2) Draft a ton of kids, hope one breaks out. Again obviously this didnt workout, I remember back then they had high high hopes for Smith.

3) Elevate Kronwall. This is what he did.

Tough spot to be in when a franchise D retires, really can't replace that.

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4 hours ago, kliq said:

Hindsight

I had wanted us to trade for him at the time. Babcock had wanted us to trade for him at the time:

“They just hit a home run,” Babcock said of the Sharks. “That’s a gold medal pick. I’m pissed off.”

I agree that losing a franchise defenseman to retirement can put a GM in a tough spot. I disagree that you "really can't replace that."

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1 hour ago, Dabura said:

I had wanted us to trade for him at the time. Babcock had wanted us to trade for him at the time:

“They just hit a home run,” Babcock said of the Sharks. “That’s a gold medal pick. I’m pissed off.”

I agree that losing a franchise defenseman to retirement can put a GM in a tough spot. I disagree that you "really can't replace that."

I disagree because you can't replace the 1a or 1b best D-man of all time with even Brett Burns. Burns is awesome, but he's still no Lidstrom.

With that being said, I realize that you are not saying he is Lidstrom, but that is the context I am using when I said "really can't replace that."

Plus, nobody knew back then that Burns would become a Norris caliber D-man at 30, hence my comment of "hindsight". 

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22 hours ago, Andy Pred 48 said:

well Lidstrom but i guess you meant him Chris

What happens when Gustav Lindstrom makes the team? Do we call him Goose too? The slightly less perfect human? The slightly less perfect Goose? I find myself struggling with these questions on a daily basis. It consumes me.  

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6 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

What happens when Gustav Lindstrom makes the team? Do we call him Goose too? The slightly less perfect human? The slightly less perfect Goose? I find myself struggling with these questions on a daily basis. It consumes me.  

This is easy...."The perfect Goose".

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On 8/7/2017 at 5:58 PM, kliq said:

I disagree because you can't replace the 1a or 1b best D-man of all time with even Brett Burns. Burns is awesome, but he's still no Lidstrom.

With that being said, I realize that you are not saying he is Lidstrom, but that is the context I am using when I said "really can't replace that."

Ah, gotcha. :thumbup:

On 8/7/2017 at 5:58 PM, kliq said:

Plus, nobody knew back then that Burns would become a Norris caliber D-man at 30, hence my comment of "hindsight". 

I hear ya. I don't blame you for calling bull**** on me, as I didn't explain up front that I was on the Burns-or-bust bandwagon way back when the Wild were looking to move him.

I'd wanted us to land Burns because we'd just lost Rafalski to retirement, Lidstrom wasn't getting any younger, and we were in an arms race with the Sharks.

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9 hours ago, TheXym said:

I remember Dabura's posts back then.  The Rafalsky early retirement  surprised everyone if I recall correctly.

Lidstrom retiring was always gonna be a huge blow, but losing Stuart and Rafalski early over personal reasons were huge blows as well that I feel like get glossed over.

Lidstrom - Raflaski
Kronwall - Stuart

That was a dreamy top 4 :wub: then 3/4 were gone in a matter of a few seasons

Lidstrom - Rafalski
Kronwall - Stuart

Then the bums Kindl, Smith, Ericsson, and Quincey never stepped up either. This team was bound for doom in that scenario.

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On 8/18/2017 at 8:14 AM, TheXym said:

I remember Dabura's posts back then.  The Rafalsky early retirement  surprised everyone if I recall correctly.

Was I even posting back then? I took, like, a one or two year break from LGW, if memory serves. I just remember being really ticked about the whole situation. Granted, I was younger and stupider back then, so pretty much everything ticked me off.

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Anyone else notice that Jakob Chychrun has only played 9 games this year. He just came back from a knee injury, but for his age he gets hurt a lot (that was his knock coming into the draft). Every day that goes by, this trade just looks more and more in our favour. 

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3 hours ago, kliq said:

Anyone else notice that Jakob Chychrun has only played 9 games this year. He just came back from a knee injury, but for his age he gets hurt a lot (that was his knock coming into the draft). Every day that goes by, this trade just looks more and more in our favour. 

@chaps80 would like to know about this 

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Chychrun 

I still rather have someone that can play in the NHL right now at the age of 18-19. Than 2 maybes let alone 1, this smells like Sproul and Ouellet again to me.

The kid is 19 playing 22min a night in his 2nd season. All things considering had a decent season for a 18 year old Dman last season that played 68 games with less than 17mins (ATOI 16:40 with APP of 30sec) a night on a super bad team. His injury doesn't not look like it's a problem now also.

I guess only time can tell at this point.

Edited by xault

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15 minutes ago, xault said:

Chychrun 

I still rather have someone that can play in the NHL right now at the age of 18-19. Than 2 maybes let alone 1, this smells like Sproul and Ouellet again to me.

The kid is 19 playing 22min a night in his 2nd season. All things considering had a decent season for a 18 year old Dman last season that played 68 games with less than 17mins (ATOI 16:40 with APP of 30sec) a night on a super bad team. His injury doesn't not look like it's a problem now also.

I guess only time can tell at this point.

Nvm reread the post.

Cholowski won’t be like Sproul or XO. He’s supposed to be more cerebral. 

Brain beats supposed hand skills. Time will tell.

Edited by kickazz

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6 minutes ago, xault said:

Chychrun 

I still rather have someone that can play in the NHL right now at the age of 18-19. Than 2 maybes let alone 1, this smells like Sproul and Ouellet again to me.

The kid is 19 playing 22min a night in his 2nd season. All things considering had a decent season for a 18 year old Dman last season that played 68 games with less than 17mins (ATOI 16:40 with APP of 30sec) a night on a super bad team. His injury doesn't not look like it's a problem now also.

I guess only time can tell at this point.

Ill be honest, I don't care even a little bit about who is NHL Ready as we are not winning the cup this year. All I care about is what their ceiling is.

What about Cholowski or Hronek's game make you think they are similar to Sproul and XO? I don't remember XO being talked about as anything more then a #5 or #6 guy, and Sproul was definitely hyped, but it was mostly about his shot.

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52 minutes ago, kickazz said:

Kliq is talking about us trading down Chychrun vs Cholowski and dumping Datsyuk contract.

Chychrun draft has nothing to do with XO or Sproul. 

 Never mind this post from me.

Edited by xault

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2 minutes ago, xault said:

Ah what? That's not what he says at all in his first post. He asks

" Please answer based on the defenseman in question, this pole has nothing to do with Datsyuk's contract or the signing of Nielsen. "

That would mean he's not talking about us trading down or dumping Datz contract, nor does he want us to consider the above when picking between the 2 choices given.

All I said is Filip Hronek and Dennis Cholowski have the same smell of Sproul and Ouellet. People around here talked both of them up pretty hard. More so Sproul. In my opinion it's following the same pattern. I said nothing about Chychrun draft having anything to do with XO or Sproul, I am not sure what you are pulling at here.

Relax lol. I misread your post and corrected it but you quoted the original response before the correction. You can read the edit and comment if you want, I addressed the difference between Cholowski and Sproul/XO

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Just now, kickazz said:

Relax lol. I misread your post and corrected it but you quoted the original response before the correction. You can read the edit and comment if you want, I addressed the difference between Cholowski and Sproul/XO

It's cool. I type slow and didn't see the edit before replying. I was more confusion than anything really.

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48 minutes ago, kliq said:

Ill be honest, I don't care even a little bit about who is NHL Ready as we are not winning the cup this year. All I care about is what their ceiling is.

What about Cholowski or Hronek's game make you think they are similar to Sproul and XO? I don't remember XO being talked about as anything more then a #5 or #6 guy, and Sproul was definitely hyped, but it was mostly about his shot.

I just feel more comfortable with something I can already see and know. Rather than maybes. Chychrun right now at the age of 19, already looks like he could fit the role of a low-mid tier #2. In the 9 games he has played this year, he has been. Which granted is a very small sample size, consider last season and what he's done this. Chychrun will have anywhere from 2-4 seasons under his belt before Cholowski or Hronek play any real meaning full amount of games in the NHL. Experience even more so for D in the NHL can go a long way.

Also, in my opinion. The Wings have not proven that they can develop any D into anything better than Brandon Smith in over 15 somewhat years. So yes, I have little faith Cholowski or Hronek will turn out to be top pair guys.

I only see Chychrun getting better, playing decent and more real NHL experience, meanwhile I am still waiting for Cholowski and Hronek to even make the line-up.

Regardless it matters not what I think in the end. Cholowski and Hronek are next up and I am willing to be proven wrong. Until than Chychrun is ahead of the race for me, Cholowski and Hronek will have some ground to make up before I put one of them let alone both over Chychrun.

I've read your posts that circle Chychrun or issues than invalid him in the past. We simply don't agree on Chychrun when it comes to this, I think we've even butted heads once about it already.

I do agree we aren't winning the cup this season. 

 

Edited by xault

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1 hour ago, xault said:

I just feel more comfortable with something I can already see and know. Rather than maybes. Chychrun right now at the age of 19, already looks like he could fit the role of a low-mid tier #2. In the 9 games he has played this year, he has been. Which granted is a very small sample size, consider last season and what he's done this. Chychrun will have anywhere from 2-4 seasons under his belt before Cholowski or Hronek play any real meaning full amount of games in the NHL. Experience even more so for D in the NHL can go a long way.

Also, in my opinion. The Wings have not proven that they can develop any D into anything better than Brandon Smith in over 15 somewhat years. So yes, I have little faith Cholowski or Hronek will turn out to be top pair guys.

I only see Chychrun getting better, playing decent and more real NHL experience, meanwhile I am still waiting for Cholowski and Hronek to even make the line-up.

Regardless it matters not what I think in the end. Cholowski and Hronek are next up and I am willing to be proven wrong. Until than Chychrun is ahead of the race for me, Cholowski and Hronek will have some ground to make up before I put one of them let alone both over Chychrun.

I've read your posts that circle Chychrun or issues than invalid him in the past. We simply don't agree on Chychrun when it comes to this, I think we've even butted heads once about it already.

I do agree we aren't winning the cup this season. 

 

What have I said to invalidate him in the past? I think he is a good player, and if he can stay healthy can be a very high level player, but I think he is injury prone Do disagree that he is injury prone?

Here is why I think he is injury prone. He's only 19, and here is what I could find in 5min.

He missed 28 games this year with a knee injury. https://www.nhl.com/coyotes/news/chychrun-suffers-knee-injury/c-290586656

In December 2016 he missed a game with a concussion. 

In juniors he had major injury issues http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/juniors/bmo-chlnhl-top-prospects-game-profile-jacob-chychrun-of-the-sarnia-sting/

Here is a blurb from the link below:

"He’s hoping the left shoulder problems that ended last season after only 42 games are behind him. He had a tear in a posterior muscle, and the shoulder kept popping out. When it came out again in a fight against 6-foot-5 Brock Phillips of Guelph, he was shut down for the season and had surgery on April 1."

Sorry, but that is a lot of injuries for a 19 year old.

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On 7/30/2017 at 4:30 PM, DickieDunn said:

Konstantinov would be suspended every other game if he played like he did back then.  Wussification of the USA (and Canada)

Chances are Putin would be pressuring Vladdy to be a hitman for the KGB since he's such a bad a$$.

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