Rumors Thread

[Jimmybigrigs69 366]

@kipwinger @Dabura

Every conversation about this I've seen (not just here) always boils down to the same thing:

"But muh prospect pool"

No one doubts Yzerman has built a strong one. And if you're content to continue to be a patient and wait for the kiddos, you're probably smarter than I, because that's obviously "the plan".

What annoys me about this line of thinking is that it's the same reductive line of thinking thats persisted for the last 10+ years. DONT WORRY FELLAS, JUST WAIT TILL Pulkkinen, Backman, Sproul, Jurco, Frk, Athanasiou, Mantha, Svechnikov, Cholowski, Rasmussen, Petruzelli, Veleno, and Zadina GET HERE... then we'll be good. 

My point =

1. The grass doesnt always get greener. SY is about to select his 7th Wings draft class. Of his picks, so far he's graduated a 4th overall, two 6th overalls, and an 8th overall. That's it. Many would argue that's par for the course. Until some of his other picks start making an impact, it's difficult to argue that our prospect pool is something to hedge our bets on. And the last 10+ years of prospect hype and subsequent let downs, is evidence why we shouldnt give Yzerman an automatic win based on prospect hype. 

2. This argument (excuse) has a timeline. And the pressure to produce on Yzerman is building... naturally. Patience will run out. I dunno that he has a leash long enough from the fanbase to make it another 3-4 seasons without some pretty serious results. Tik tok. Tik tok. 

3. Development. Doesnt matter how filled up your pool is if you cant teach the kids to swim. Again, we've only graduated top10 picks so far... but further, I question the enviroment/situation we've established to incubate these prospects. GR is GR, but Detroit is a mess. SY held onto a legitmately bad head coach in Blashill for quite a while... only to install another mediocre/bad coach in Lalonde... only to panic replace him midseason with a coach pulled off his couch. These are our teachers/leaders/developers for our premium prospects? And now we have a lockerroom being led by a depressed fed-up captain and an ex-superstar who quits on coaches midseason. I'm not sure Yzerman understands the enviroment he's cultivated. 

[kipwinger 8,754]

2 hours ago, Jimmybigrigs69 said:

@kipwinger @Dabura

Every conversation about this I've seen (not just here) always boils down to the same thing:

"But muh prospect pool"

No one doubts Yzerman has built a strong one. And if you're content to continue to be a patient and wait for the kiddos, you're probably smarter than I, because that's obviously "the plan".

What annoys me about this line of thinking is that it's the same reductive line of thinking thats persisted for the last 10+ years. DONT WORRY FELLAS, JUST WAIT TILL Pulkkinen, Backman, Sproul, Jurco, Frk, Athanasiou, Mantha, Svechnikov, Cholowski, Rasmussen, Petruzelli, Veleno, and Zadina GET HERE... then we'll be good. 

My point =

1. The grass doesnt always get greener. SY is about to select his 7th Wings draft class. Of his picks, so far he's graduated a 4th overall, two 6th overalls, and an 8th overall. That's it. Many would argue that's par for the course. Until some of his other picks start making an impact, it's difficult to argue that our prospect pool is something to hedge our bets on. And the last 10+ years of prospect hype and subsequent let downs, is evidence why we shouldnt give Yzerman an automatic win based on prospect hype. 

2. This argument (excuse) has a timeline. And the pressure to produce on Yzerman is building... naturally. Patience will run out. I dunno that he has a leash long enough from the fanbase to make it another 3-4 seasons without some pretty serious results. Tik tok. Tik tok. 

3. Development. Doesnt matter how filled up your pool is if you cant teach the kids to swim. Again, we've only graduated top10 picks so far... but further, I question the enviroment/situation we've established to incubate these prospects. GR is GR, but Detroit is a mess. SY held onto a legitmately bad head coach in Blashill for quite a while... only to install another mediocre/bad coach in Lalonde... only to panic replace him midseason with a coach pulled off his couch. These are our teachers/leaders/developers for our premium prospects? And now we have a lockerroom being led by a depressed fed-up captain and an ex-superstar who quits on coaches midseason. I'm not sure Yzerman understands the enviroment he's cultivated. 

It's not about "being content" with it. It's just obvious that's what's going on. When Larkin, Seider, Raymond, Dcat, Edvinsson, Kasper, etc. get us to the playoffs...then we'll go big game hunting in FA to add the elite talent. And it's not like that's a crazy idea. Elite offensive guys like Rantanen and Marner are available almost every year.

My personal preference would be to go get Pettersson right now while the price is (presumably) low. I saw some hockey media guy said the other day that Pettersson isn't well thought of around the league. Good. Buy low. I think you'd have to do something around an unprotected 1st OR Danielson but not both. That would give us this to build around:

???-Larkin-Raymond

Dcat-Pettersson-???

Sodorblom-Kasper-???

Compher-Copp-Ras

 

???-Seider

Edvinsson-???

Chiarot-???

 

And before we even think about UFA we have Mazur, MBN, Plante, Lombardi, Buchelnikov, ASP, Wallinder, Buium, Finnie, Cossa, and Augustine (I might be missing some too)  to plug some of those holes. THAT'S a pretty solid place to build from. Add Provorov/Gavrikov and Will Cuylle from outside and you've got a genuine contender IMO.

[LeftWinger 5,129]

Soderblom and Johansson are also Yzerman's picks that are full-time NHL players. He drafts well, very well! Need to win some UFA signings! Well, he did win the Kane UFA signing. 

[Jimmybigrigs69 366]

3 hours ago, kipwinger said:

It's not about "being content" with it. It's just obvious that's what's going on. When Larkin, Seider, Raymond, Dcat, Edvinsson, Kasper, etc. get us to the playoffs...then we'll go big game hunting in FA to add the elite talent. And it's not like that's a crazy idea. Elite offensive guys like Rantanen and Marner are available almost every year.

My personal preference would be to go get Pettersson right now while the price is (presumably) low. I saw some hockey media guy said the other day that Pettersson isn't well thought of around the league. Good. Buy low. I think you'd have to do something around an unprotected 1st OR Danielson but not both. That would give us this to build around:

???-Larkin-Raymond

Dcat-Pettersson-???

Sodorblom-Kasper-???

Compher-Copp-Ras

 

???-Seider

Edvinsson-???

Chiarot-???

 

And before we even think about UFA we have Mazur, MBN, Plante, Lombardi, Buchelnikov, ASP, Wallinder, Buium, Finnie, Cossa, and Augustine (I might be missing some too)  to plug some of those holes. THAT'S a pretty solid place to build from. Add Provorov/Gavrikov and Will Cuylle from outside and you've got a genuine contender IMO.

This is kinda my point. 

Is it a pretty solid place to pull from? Many have argued in the past the same thing, and almost every single of those guys didnt even come close to working out...

So when I see "but our prospect pool so good" in reponse to angry fans, I don't really buy that as a valid excuse. Until those kids actually play I'm not sold.

What I'd like to see is some creativity and action by our GM to address some very obvious current problems. Whether that's getting Pettersson or Marner, or getting tougher, or shaking up leadership... i dont care. But more nothing TDLs and summers of signing bad vets to bloated contracts, and hunting for our 200th goalie in 5 years, and I will call it firing time.