VM1138 1,921 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 Well, this offseason has been pretty miserable so far. We've lost: Hossa Conklin Samuellson Hudler Kopecky We've gained: Leino Howard Helm (Presumably) I'm not sure if we "gained" in this department. It's great to have them, yes, but they're going to be rookies and can' tjust step in and fill in for veteran players. Plus, they don't count because by using them we drain our depth for emergencies. Now, don't get me wrong. I don't dare doubt Ken Holland like some people do on here, but one has to wonder: we know that the team couldn't stay completely together, but did he picture it getting this bad? His plan previously was to make a play for a gritty forward in mid-July and trade a defenseman just before the season begins. Is he altering his plans? The team got hit hard the past week or two and the free agents that are left aren't all that impressive. I would imagine Holland would be looking for a forward a bit sooner than he expected, just to grab whatever talent is left out there. But here's another thing: I've never been one of those guys calling for the retirement of half our team. However, do you think that Holland may be subtly applying pressure for someone to step down to free up space? I have doubts if that's even possible, even if Holland were that kind of guy. Anyways, how does everyone see Holland adapting to the current "crisis" the team is in? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ShanahanMan 473 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 Well, this offseason has been pretty miserable so far. We've lost: Hossa Conklin Samuellson Hudler Kopecky We've gained: Leino Howard Helm (Presumably) I'm not sure if we "gained" in this department. It's great to have them, yes, but they're going to be rookies and can' tjust step in and fill in for veteran players. Plus, they don't count because by using them we drain our depth for emergencies. Now, don't get me wrong. I don't dare doubt Ken Holland like some people do on here, but one has to wonder: we know that the team couldn't stay completely together, but did he picture it getting this bad? His plan previously was to make a play for a gritty forward in mid-July and trade a defenseman just before the season begins. Is he altering his plans? The team got hit hard the past week or two and the free agents that are left aren't all that impressive. I would imagine Holland would be looking for a forward a bit sooner than he expected, just to grab whatever talent is left out there. But here's another thing: I've never been one of those guys calling for the retirement of half our team. However, do you think that Holland may be subtly applying pressure for someone to step down to free up space? I have doubts if that's even possible, even if Holland were that kind of guy. Anyways, how does everyone see Holland adapting to the current "crisis" the team is in? I agree the Hudler KHL signing was a major curveball for Holland. Because of the cap crunch, I can see him bringing in some free agents during training camp on a tryout basis (ala Dan Cleary) and if one happens to be impressive, try to sign him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Hatethedrake! Report post Posted July 8, 2009 I still believe the Wings are an elite level team. I'd use the $2 mil Holland had pegged for Hudler and use it on guys like Moen and Grier. I am guessing both those players want around 2 mil a year. It doesn't have to be those guys. Holland will find 1 or 2 players who are willing to come to the Wings for less than they could get with other teams. I look at a guy like Dan Fritsche who is only 23 years old and think that maybe the Wings could still make an effective player out of him. Blair Betts is a super penalty killer but he had that awful concussion from Brashear in the playoffs. I am guessing this is why he has not been signed as of yet. Kotalik has talent but Lindy Ruff had trouble getting him to play each night. 5 on 5 he is not very good. Tanguay has alot of pure talent but I cannot see him accepting 2.5 mil or less to come to Detroit. Maybe Holland makes a trade for a player(s) none of us have even thought about. Holland has all summer to do something and I believe he will not let us down. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zion 93 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 The rumor is that the franchise folds. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Z and D for the C 712 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 The off season isn't over yet (we're a week into it), we weren't going to make any big name signings. Just be patient. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
e_prime 1,936 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 Another SKY IS FALLING thread. WOOOOO! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Echolalia 2,961 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 I wouldn't call this a crisis, and I disagree that he wouldn't predict this outcome to be a possibility. Heck, I even suggested it as a possibility a couple months ago. Hossa was an anomaly on our team. He shouldn't have been here in a cap world, so you can't look at losing him as a loss (besides we won the Cup without him a year earlier). Instead compare our team to the 2007-2008 Wings. Leino for Sammy possibly Abdelkader for Kopecky Helm for Drake We have about 1.7M in free space right now, and that will go to about 2.5 after Holland trades a defensman off, and that's all the money the Wings really need to replace a Hudler (if he wants to be tricky about it, he might get a player better than Hudler with that capspace; the possibilities are certainly there). Meech can play as forward and defense, and players like Kindl, Ritola, and the like become our depth should an emergency occur. Remember, all of these players we are bringing up were at one point in the past couple years acknowledged as nhl caliber players, and would be in an nhl lineup if they didn't play for Detroit. Also: remember the Pens? They were absolutely decimated last year and everyone was questioning whether the would even make the playoffs. They won the Cup. Now its our turn, and again, this isn't a crisis. More reassurance? Our top 6 is as good as any in the league. They're our goal scorers. Our bottom six are grinders, and if the postseason is any indication of what they're capable of, my only worry next year lies in Draper and Maltby, not Helm, Abdelkader, and Leino. Our defense is as good as any in the league. Especially now that the Big Rig is a full timer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
numberthirtynine 0 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 Holland said he's trying to trade a defenseman, why not try to trade one for a decent scoring forward? Toss in some picks and see if we can get a goal scorer. I like the way Brian Little plays, anyone think ATL would part ways with him for a Dman? They're a horrible defensive team and little is an RFA next season. That could help or hinder the possibility of the deal I supposed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
titanium2 867 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 I wouldn't call this a crisis, and I disagree that he wouldn't predict this outcome to be a possibility. Heck, I even suggested it as a possibility a couple months ago. Hossa was an anomaly on our team. He shouldn't have been here in a cap world, so you can't look at losing him as a loss (besides we won the Cup without him a year earlier). Instead compare our team to the 2007-2008 Wings. Leino for Sammy possibly Abdelkader for Kopecky Helm for Drake We have about 1.7M in free space right now, and that will go to about 2.5 after Holland trades a defensman off, and that's all the money the Wings really need to replace a Hudler (if he wants to be tricky about it, he might get a player better than Hudler with that capspace; the possibilities are certainly there). Meech can play as forward and defense, and players like Kindl, Ritola, and the like become our depth should an emergency occur. Remember, all of these players we are bringing up were at one point in the past couple years acknowledged as nhl caliber players, and would be in an nhl lineup if they didn't play for Detroit. Also: remember the Pens? They were absolutely decimated last year and everyone was questioning whether the would even make the playoffs. They won the Cup. Now its our turn, and again, this isn't a crisis. More reassurance? Our top 6 is as good as any in the league. They're our goal scorers. Our bottom six are grinders, and if the postseason is any indication of what they're capable of, my only worry next year lies in Draper and Maltby, not Helm, Abdelkader, and Leino. Our defense is as good as any in the league. Especially now that the Big Rig is a full timer. Stop ruining the fun for those who need to complain in order to be happy! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
newfy 695 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 I wouldn't call this a crisis, and I disagree that he wouldn't predict this outcome to be a possibility. Heck, I even suggested it as a possibility a couple months ago. Hossa was an anomaly on our team. He shouldn't have been here in a cap world, so you can't look at losing him as a loss (besides we won the Cup without him a year earlier). Instead compare our team to the 2007-2008 Wings. Leino for Sammy possibly Abdelkader for Kopecky Helm for Drake We have about 1.7M in free space right now, and that will go to about 2.5 after Holland trades a defensman off, and that's all the money the Wings really need to replace a Hudler (if he wants to be tricky about it, he might get a player better than Hudler with that capspace; the possibilities are certainly there). Meech can play as forward and defense, and players like Kindl, Ritola, and the like become our depth should an emergency occur. Remember, all of these players we are bringing up were at one point in the past couple years acknowledged as nhl caliber players, and would be in an nhl lineup if they didn't play for Detroit. Also: remember the Pens? They were absolutely decimated last year and everyone was questioning whether the would even make the playoffs. They won the Cup. Now its our turn, and again, this isn't a crisis. More reassurance? Our top 6 is as good as any in the league. They're our goal scorers. Our bottom six are grinders, and if the postseason is any indication of what they're capable of, my only worry next year lies in Draper and Maltby, not Helm, Abdelkader, and Leino. Our defense is as good as any in the league. Especially now that the Big Rig is a full timer. Good Post. I agree the top 6 are as good as any in the league but its the grinders who seemed to kind of let us down this past season and playoffs. Drapes and Maltby did nothing in the playoffs, it would be nice to get some fresh faces on the bottom 2 lines this season and i think thats what Kenny has planned. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snazzy 0 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 When Holland signed Hossa to a one year deal, he was called a 'genius' on the boards. Though the entire year while he played here, we all knew Hossa was going to be gone. Then when it happen, when we let Hossa walk, Holland is put under fire on these boards. I'm sick of hearing that 'we loss' Hossa, because he wasn't ever going to be here after his 1-year rental agreement. We all knew that. We've GAINED! We are getting younger, we got Helm and Leino (Leino for damn cheap btw) and we are getting tougher and bigger with better defensive forwards! Wings, as a whole, are getting better, not worse! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StevieY9802 6 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 The off season isn't over yet (we're a week into it), we weren't going to make any big name signings. Just be patient. THANK YOU! They are NOT in any kind of crisis mode. Everyone is acting like the season starts tomorrow and they can't sign anyone else. We've got 2 months till camp starts thats a long time to find some help. Holland will take his time and find what fits. People here keep blaming Holland like he should have magically known Hudler was gonna sign with the KHL and all of that. People here would go and sign 3 guys right now because of emotion. Holland wont. Sorry to people who think they know more and would be better than Ken Holland. If thats true why are you, and I, sitting in front of our computers while he has 4 Cups and the last 4 years when he's gotten the most crap from fans in here, the Wings have finished 1st, 2nd, 1st and 3rd respectively. I think he knows what he's doing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ShanahanMan 473 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 (edited) When Holland signed Hossa to a one year deal, he was called a 'genius' on the boards. Though the entire year while he played here, we all knew Hossa was going to be gone. Then when it happen, when we let Hossa walk, Holland is put under fire on these boards. I'm sick of hearing that 'we loss' Hossa, because he wasn't ever going to be here after his 1-year rental agreement. We all knew that. We've GAINED! We are getting younger, we got Helm and Leino (Leino for damn cheap btw) and we are getting tougher and bigger with better defensive forwards! Wings, as a whole, are getting better, not worse! We've "gained?" We lose solid scorers in Hossa, Huds, Sammy (sometimes) and we've gained? We lose a potential of 80 goals in the regular season and we've gained? We have one guy who, though looking amazing in the playoffs, has never scored a single regular season NHL goal and we've gained? We have another who only played 5 games in the NHL last year and though looked good, only scored 15 goals in GR and we've gained? You're whole argument seems to revolve around the notion that "Younger = Better". I've got news for you kid, younger does NOT always equal better. These GR are potential superstars in the making, but to put all the pressure on them to step up with 20+ goals in their first full NHL season is simply unrealistic. Oh and btw, the only person we've gained is Leino with a nice two year contract. We didn't "gain" Helm as we already had him locked up until 2010. If anything, we maintained Helm and he gained a spot on his own. You seem to get stupider with every post. Edited July 8, 2009 by ShanahanMan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
germanwing 154 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 There are still 2 productive lines left! Last year, we had the luck, that the 3rd line was scoring really well. This year, we have to put the focus on the defense! Let the young guys step up! This team is still one of the best! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RedFX 48 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 (edited) Were screwed. Trade Datsyuk, Zetterberg, and Franzen and start over from square one. Or maybe we should wait until the season starts to panic Edited July 8, 2009 by RedFX Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StevieY9802 6 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 There are still 2 productive lines left! Last year, we had the luck, that the 3rd line was scoring really well. This year, we have to put the focus on the defense! Let the young guys step up! This team is still one of the best! Yeah everyone keeps comparing it to last year. This team was STACKED last year, well above what most teams are. They still have very good top 2 lines and now will actually have to deal with a 3rd line that isn't Filppula, Hudler and Samuelson. Thats a 2nd line on most teams. They gave up 61 more goals last year than 08 so if they can get fix the goals against the lost on offense won't sting as much. I also expect cleary to have a better regular season. He only scored 14 goals last year. He scored 9 in the playoffs alone. People need to relax. These are probably the same people who 4 years ago were in here saying the Blue Jackets and Blues were gonna be better than the Wings the first year out of the lockout. I wish I could find who those people were so I could mock them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bonan78 1 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 This is not a drill, the world really is ending! OK, I can't sustain sarcasm that long. Seriously, people, it is only 1 week into free agency, and most of the players that have been signed are either out of my price range to begin with, or signed for more than we could have offered them in the first place. Everything will be fine, Holland will be able to put a competitive team on the ice come October, we will be in contention for the Cup, and everything will be fine. Did I mention that everything will be fine? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UKWING 8 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 I wouldn't call this a crisis, and I disagree that he wouldn't predict this outcome to be a possibility. Heck, I even suggested it as a possibility a couple months ago. Hossa was an anomaly on our team. He shouldn't have been here in a cap world, so you can't look at losing him as a loss (besides we won the Cup without him a year earlier). Instead compare our team to the 2007-2008 Wings. Leino for Sammy possibly Abdelkader for Kopecky Helm for Drake We have about 1.7M in free space right now, and that will go to about 2.5 after Holland trades a defensman off, and that's all the money the Wings really need to replace a Hudler (if he wants to be tricky about it, he might get a player better than Hudler with that capspace; the possibilities are certainly there). Meech can play as forward and defense, and players like Kindl, Ritola, and the like become our depth should an emergency occur. Remember, all of these players we are bringing up were at one point in the past couple years acknowledged as nhl caliber players, and would be in an nhl lineup if they didn't play for Detroit. Also: remember the Pens? They were absolutely decimated last year and everyone was questioning whether the would even make the playoffs. They won the Cup. Now its our turn, and again, this isn't a crisis. More reassurance? Our top 6 is as good as any in the league. They're our goal scorers. Our bottom six are grinders, and if the postseason is any indication of what they're capable of, my only worry next year lies in Draper and Maltby, not Helm, Abdelkader, and Leino. Our defense is as good as any in the league. Especially now that the Big Rig is a full timer. fully agree. the wings won't be as deep as last year but last year was as talented a team as you will see in the cap era - they coasted through the regular season and were decimated by injuries in the playoffs yet they still came within 1 game of winning the cup. yes they have lost a few players but the wings were the deepest, most talented team in the NHL so they could afford to lose a few players. they still have their core intact and will again be one of the best teams in the league with a good shot at the regaining the cup. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holiday 0 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 Look at last year. We lost: Drake Hasek We gained: Hossa Conklin Both of those are improvements. We lost. How does that work you ask? The Stanley Cup is not awarded in the offseason. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StevieY9802 6 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 Look at last year. We lost: Drake Hasek We gained: Hossa Conklin Both of those are improvements. We lost. How does that work you ask? The Stanley Cup is not awarded in the offseason. I was just thinking about that a few mintues ago. This team upgraded talent and had a worse regular season and lost the Cup. Also with those additions some guys had worse regular seasons. I'm not worried. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mors 201 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 I don't consider it much of a loss...we have plenty of offense and talent, this gives us some cap room to sign at least one "goon with occasional offensive upside" (pretty please?) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VM1138 1,921 Report post Posted July 8, 2009 I still believe the Wings are an elite level team. Certainly the WIngs are still elite. But remember, we're Wings fans. If we're not making the Finals, it's a failed season. Being among the top teams isn't good enough if we're not 1 or 2. We've got a playoff calibre team that will make noise. What we lack at the moment is an edge and someone to give us that much needed boost. We're used to be so far ahead of all the other teams wheras next season it seems it'll be more competitive. So while some of us are a little worried, don't mistake it for some of us thinking the team will suck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Drake_Marcus 890 Report post Posted July 9, 2009 Another SKY IS FALLING thread. WOOOOO! OP: "Hey guys, how do you feel about the sky? It looks close to me, but I'd like to hear what you think of it" You: "Lolz 'tha sky uz falling'" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GORM19 0 Report post Posted July 9, 2009 We are all spoiled by the wings wining ways. What we all should realize is that with not much cap space and the cap goin down next year we have no choice to start a little bit of a rebuilding phase. I truly beleive that this is gonig to be lids last year as well as drapes and malts and after next season ozzy.holland has no choice but to finaly give some of the griffs a chance.Our drafting is what kept us afloat when shanny feds and yzerman left. Everybody that we had last year was either drafted by det or made good on tryouts with the exception of a few players. We have to trust kenny he knows whats best for this team shorterm and longterm P.S SMILE, A LITTLE BIT OF A REBUILD IS BETTER THAN WHAT THE LEAFS HAVE ENDURED OVER THE YEARS Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dominator2005 558 Report post Posted July 9, 2009 We still have GREAT 1st line : Z-D-H We still have SOLID 2nd line : F-F-C We are going to have NICE 3rd line : Leino - Helm - "Moen" We are still going to have Maltby - Drapes - Abdelkader Which isn't bad at all... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
