cupforwings 138 Report post Posted February 10, 2010 Zetterberg Datsyuk homer Franzen Filppula Bertuzzi Cleary Williams Miller Helm Draper Eaves Williams and Miller are natural centers, or at the least we could trade for one. You could also switch Bert and Clears. They will not keep Zetterberg and Datsyuk together... Babcock has said this multiple times... When they might get one goal a game, it would be smarter to split them up and spread the depth to the other lines. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Four Report post Posted February 10, 2010 Zetterberg, Ericsson, Lebda, Williams and Cleary have all not earned a spot on the Wings with their production this year Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gcom007 1,465 Report post Posted February 10, 2010 It is the only way to roll 4 lines all with natural centers and not break up the Draper-Helm-Eaves line Thus your remaining centers are Datsyuk Zetterberg and Filppula. Each center a line. The other possibilities would involve swapping Bertuzzi and Franzen to be Bert-Dats-Homer Franz-Hank-Cleary Which I am also not opposed to, but I dont think you put either Miller or Williams on a top 2 line, and I don't want to break up Draper-Helm-Eaves Thus those 6 players are in the top 6 because Filppula needs to center a 3rd scoring line. EDIT: Also you could call almost any player on this team an underachieving forward so there will be one on every line... You've got to read between the lines on this one: he just doesn't like the idea of Flip being on the 3rd line. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gcom007 1,465 Report post Posted February 10, 2010 And to quote a music industry blogger I read... "What kind of crazy f***ed up world do we line in where..." ...the idea of trading Jason Williams evokes depression and sadness over our already depleted forward lineup? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GORM19 0 Report post Posted February 10, 2010 You know, at this point, I really don't care who gets shipped off. Seriously, don't care. Something just needs to be done. This team is just BADLY in need of a shake up, as our current lineup is just seriously not meshing well at all. I agree with you totally, something needs to be done they are not playing with passion or intensity at all. its pretty bad when franzen comes back from an injury that has kept him out all year long and he was one of if not our best player last night. Pavs or Z just don't seem to be clicking right now especially Z Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
McAwesome 754 Report post Posted February 10, 2010 I actually think its time to break up the Helm-Draper-Eaves line. They have been good and hardworking, but I would much rather see Draper back on the 4th and Helm centering the 3rd. Breaking up this line just gives us so many more options for line combos. Saw a little of this last night, Helm was out with Williams, Miller, and Cleary on his wings at different times in the 3rd, while Draper, Maltby and May hardly played at all. I think Williams/Helm/Eaves or Williams/Helm/Cleary could be a good 3rd line if Babcock to keep Zetterberg and Datsyuk together on the 1st line. Datsyuk/Zetterberg/Holmstrom Franzen/Filppula/Bertuzzi Williams/Helm/Cleary Miller/Draper/Eaves Gives us what we're used to, 2 very good top scoring lines, a 3rd line that has can provide secondary scoring and is defensively sound (Helm and Cleary more than cancel out Williams' defensive liability), and a 4th line of hard skating, high-energy grinders who are solid defenders and have just enough offensive knack. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Z and D for the C 712 Report post Posted February 10, 2010 (edited) You've got to read between the lines on this one: he just doesn't like the idea of Flip being on the 3rd line. Even you can't say Filppula doesn't deserve the second line center spot. At least, I hope you're not that biased. Edited February 10, 2010 by Z and D for the C Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyphoenix 153 Report post Posted February 10, 2010 There are a number of people on this roster that aren't doing much for us including May, Meech, Lebda, Williams, and Maltby but none of them have much trade value. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
russianswede919293 95 Report post Posted February 10, 2010 Even you can't say Filppula doesn't deserve the second line center spot. At least, I hope you're not that biased. He may deserve it but I don't want Williams or MIller as the 3rd line center. If Helm centers the 3rd line I could agree with you, although I'm reluctant to break that line up. Deserving it and depth allowing it are 2 very different things. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204 Report post Posted February 10, 2010 Williams hasnt been bad this year, but it wouldnt break my heart. As far as lines, why are people so blinded by 07-08? Datsyuk and Zetterberg arent the same guys together anymore, it used to just gel and they'd always make the smart easy play. They've been together alot this season, and all they do is force the play to one another and either turn it over, or take a low percentage shot from the boards. All the Filppula slappies should give up the notion that he'll be 2nd line center. He hustles hard, and has been pretty good in the games he's played, but if he was the 3rd line center playing against other teams 3rd line players he'd realisticly produce more. I'd rather have the Wings roll 3 strong scoring lines like they used to as opposed to 2. And as for this deal for a goalie, hahaha. Mike f***ed up, he's burning out Jimmy and letting Ozzie rot. Osgood was good the first couple of games he played this year (outside of in Sweden, what a ******* stupid idea it was to go over there) Now, he's got no rhythm, and wants to do everything right and ends up messing up. Plus, having Jimmy take all these losses and get 40+ shots a night, is burning him out and you can tell. We seriously need this Olympic break, and with all the injuries right now, I'd keep Homer, Kronner and the Mule out. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buppy 1,720 Report post Posted February 10, 2010 totally agree here, if someone in the offseason didn't want him why would they want him now after an injury riddled / unproductive season? (shootout goal last night was tight though) the loyalty the wings organization have to its players is killing us.... rafalski has taken a step in the wrong direction, dont recall last year him making the amount of mistakes he has this year. with his ntc its unlikely he will be moved but 6 mill a year for him is too funny. lidstrom started slow, but nick is nick. he is the man but at 8 mill a year he needs to take a paycut or something because we cannot lock up 14 mill to do D over 35 anymore.... its killing us. cleary, malts, drapes, thanks for everything but these guys could EASILY be replaced by helm, abs, miller eaves, cheaper replacements too holmer, though a PP specialist is a liability on the 5 on 5. great career, but i feel he will retire soon especially with the amount of time he has been in and out of the line-up the last couple of years.... how long can an individual take that beating he takes? anybody seen how good miller is in front of the net? he is. lilja, please get another headache.... seems like a nice guy and i feel for him but i dont think my heart can take to see lilja ericcson together, you think jimmy is hung out to dry now? just wait. ozzie.... well.... what can i really say? we cant even give jimmy a night off anymore, we need another young goalie, halak would be great with jimmy. i could keep going but ill stop there.... this team needs to take a step in the younger direction... being loyal only gets you so far. Few things: Nick is still a top tier defenseman. Just outside top 10 in scoring, and probably top 5 defensively. He might be not be quite worth 7.45 this year, maybe 6.5 - 7. Of all the things to complain about, he should be far down the list. If he decides to return next year, he will certainly take a pay cut. And I'll repeat something I said a while back: If we look at his value over his career as a whole, we probably still owe him about $100 million. He signed his current deal in the middle of a Norris winning season, and was a finalist in his first year of it. As for Helm, Miller, Eaves, and Abs EASILY replacing Draper, Maltby, Cleary, and Homer... no, it's not so easy. For starters, three of your 'replacements' are already on the team. Were you planning to clone them? How easy is that? Ok, Abs replaces Maltby, and only a slight downgrade. Who is available to replace the other three, or what reasonable trades can we make to get someone who isn't FA? Maltby and Homer are in their final years, and if they come back (and I have doubts about both) it will likely be at a reduced rate. Draper has one more year (and is having a decent season thus far). Cleary is not doing that bad either. All the people you mentioned are having decent seasons, with Cleary probably the only one performing below expectations. Seems to me the youth movement you want is already happening, and the majority of players you want to push out are some of the few players meeting expectations. So I fail to understand your 'loyalty' argument. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest ZetterbergFourty Report post Posted February 10, 2010 Major shake up!!! Whatever THAT means. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buppy 1,720 Report post Posted February 10, 2010 ...As far as lines, why are people so blinded by 07-08? Datsyuk and Zetterberg arent the same guys together anymore, it used to just gel and they'd always make the smart easy play. They've been together alot this season, and all they do is force the play to one another and either turn it over, or take a low percentage shot from the boards. All the Filppula slappies should give up the notion that he'll be 2nd line center. He hustles hard, and has been pretty good in the games he's played, but if he was the 3rd line center playing against other teams 3rd line players he'd realisticly produce more. I'd rather have the Wings roll 3 strong scoring lines like they used to as opposed to 2. ... Not that I totally disagree, but it's not just '08. For most of their careers, Pav and Hank have had a certain dynamic together. They haven't shown it this year, but that doesn't mean they can't find it again. And it's not like either has been significantly better while split up. As for Flip, putting him on the third line with less talented wingers could hurt his production just as much or more than it's helped by facing other third liners. Though his play since his return does certainly suggest he could do well. However, if he's going to get stuck on the third line, I'd much rather try to trade him for a goal scorer. We need that a lot more than we need to keep Draper and Helm together. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RedWingsRox 614 Report post Posted February 11, 2010 (edited) Well, you win some and you lose some. Bertuzzi surprisingly was a good sign with 15G and 18A Williams (yes, with injury) but 3G and 5A Both for 1.5 mill ... bye bye ... Williams Any chance we can trade Rafalski for Phaneuf ... straight up, 1 for 1, 6 mill for 6 mill ... I know that damn NTC . Edited February 11, 2010 by RedWingsRox Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjlegend 155 Report post Posted February 11, 2010 You forget secret scenario #4 - purposely injure Osgood in practice and put him on LTIR, then kill Lebda (this is just good for the NHL), bring Tim Cheveldae out of retirement as a temporary backup at league minimum I agree with most of this but Chevy's making almost as much as a firefighter in Saskatoon than he would as an NHL backup... Oh wait. Interesting first sentence in Chevy's Wikipedia profile: Cheveldae, known as Jesus Christ on Ice, began his junior ice hockey playing career in the 1985–86 WHL season with the Saskatoon Blades. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
13dangledangle 968 Report post Posted February 11, 2010 I still think we should trade: Flippula Williams Osgood Lebda Meech For T.J Oshie Sydor Conklin & picks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
55fan 5,133 Report post Posted February 11, 2010 Put Raffy on LTIR. Problem solved. Tell them he has pre-concussion syndrome. If they get nit-picky, bonk him on the head and say, "told you so". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest mindfly Report post Posted February 11, 2010 I still think we should trade: Flippula Williams Osgood Lebda Meech For T.J Oshie Sydor Conklin & picks It sucks to trade within the conference seeing all their faces so many times Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevkrause 1,247 Report post Posted February 11, 2010 (edited) Common Sense... Common Sense... anybody, anybody, Common Sense... Common Sense.... nope, not here in this thread. Edited February 11, 2010 by stevkrause Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deetroit dario 27 Report post Posted February 11, 2010 Common Sense... Common Sense... anybody, anybody, Common Sense... Common Sense.... nope, not here in this thread/board/internet. ahh, common sense....your oxymoron's oxymoron! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevkrause 1,247 Report post Posted February 11, 2010 (edited) ahh, common sense....your oxymoron's oxymoron! LGW GM Mentality: First, trade Lebda and Meech to Washington for Ovechkin and Backstrom, then trade Howard to Vancouver for Luongo, then bring Gerard Gallant out of retirement and trade him to Calgary for Jerome Iginla... trade Stuart and Rafalski's no trade clauses (not the players themselves, but actually trade their no trade clauses for a bag of pucks - this frees the player up to then be traded), then trade Rafalski for Atlanta's next 12 first round picks and Stuart to Tampa Bay for Vinny Lecavalier and Marty St. Louis... then trade Filppulla for Boogard (who needs a soft euro that's defensively responsible and capable of good offensive numbers??!!? - we need toughness!) promote McCollum, Kindl, Brendan Smith and a 14 year old prospect from BC - because he won a ton of fights in Bantam AAA and we really need that grit on the back end... force Holmstrom, Draper, Lilja, Maltby and Osgood to all retire... finally, get everyone to restructure their contracts (even though the CBA doesn't allow contract restructuring - they'll make an exception!) for league minimum Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Ovechkin Franzen-Backstrom-Iginla Cleary-Lecavalier-St.Louis Abdelkader-Helm-Boogard Lidstrom-Ericsson Kronwall-Kindl Smith-14 year old prospect Luongo McCollum what an infusion of vets and prospects! :blink: here, let me say this very clearly - you do not blow a team up that is only one year removed from a cup and was in the SCF last year. period. Edited February 11, 2010 by stevkrause Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Opie 308 Report post Posted February 11, 2010 Common sense is about as common as common courtesy these days Stev, even less common on the interwebz!1111111oneeno1111111! (OH I made my punctuation a palindrome!) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevkrause 1,247 Report post Posted February 11, 2010 Common sense is about as common as common courtesy these days Stev, even less common on the interwebz!1111111oneeno1111111! (OH I made my punctuation a palindrome!) w0rld w1d3s 1nt3rn3t5? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevkrause 1,247 Report post Posted February 11, 2010 Interesting first sentence in Chevy's Wikipedia profile: Cheveldae, known as Jesus Christ on Ice, began his junior ice hockey playing career in the 1985–86 WHL season with the Saskatoon Blades. haha, oh man I hope that's a legit posting and not just someone editing his wiki Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SweWings 45 Report post Posted February 11, 2010 LGW GM Mentality: First, trade Lebda and Meech to Washington for Ovechkin and Backstrom, then trade Howard to Vancouver for Luongo, then bring Gerard Gallant out of retirement and trade him to Calgary for Jerome Iginla... trade Stuart and Rafalski's no trade clauses (not the players themselves, but actually trade their no trade clauses for a bag of pucks - this frees the player up to then be traded), then trade Rafalski for Atlanta's next 12 first round picks and Stuart to Tampa Bay for Vinny Lecavalier and Marty St. Louis... then trade Filppulla for Boogard (who needs a soft euro that's defensively responsible and capable of good offensive numbers??!!? - we need toughness!) promote McCollum, Kindl, Brendan Smith and a 14 year old prospect from BC - because he won a ton of fights in Bantam AAA and we really need that grit on the back end... force Holmstrom, Draper, Lilja, Maltby and Osgood to all retire... finally, get everyone to restructure their contracts (even though the CBA doesn't allow contract restructuring - they'll make an exception!) for league minimum Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Ovechkin Franzen-Backstrom-Iginla Cleary-Lecavalier-St.Louis Abdelkader-Helm-Boogard Lidstrom-Ericsson Kronwall-Kindl Smith-14 year old prospect Luongo McCollum what an infusion of vets and prospects! :blink: here, let me say this very clearly - you do not blow a team up that is only one year removed from a cup and was in the SCF last year. period. Screw that. Lecavalier and St Louis are bums - why not just get Crosby and Malkin? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
