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Jimmy Howard - "I’m just sick and tired of getting run over.

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WTF happened to Abby? He used to hit people and fight the odd time and just be a pain in the butt. I think that Jimmy will be ran over more now that other teams know he can get rattled and not one player on the Wings will do a damn thing about it. Shame on them.

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Anyone who knows me, knows my feelings about teams who let their goalie get taken out, game after game. Jimmy has the credibility at this point to call them out himself - and he should. No one is saying that our players should go beat down the other team's players who offend. But someone (don't ask me who) needs to make sure they're looking over their shoulders when they touch one of our goalies. There are ways players can police these sorts of things on the ice, without resorting to goon tactics. I just wish some of our current players had that type of mentality - which I believe they do not.

I miss Mac and Shanny and some of our less "elite" players like Duschene, who had the heart and passion to make sure no one took liberties with our goalies. If Jimmy has to channel Vernon and fight for his own safety out there, then the Wings should know they might have to figure out how to win games without him, when he's injured or sitting out a suspension.

It makes my blood boil when players run Jimmy and then get rewarded for it. :ranting:

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I don't think Ken is against signing a tough guy, but those guys seem to come at premiums if they have any playing skill. If the right guy falls in Holland's lap, he'll sign him. BUt really, we have enough bottom six guys. Maybe Howard calling out some players will get them to react. Ericsson, Abdelkader, etc. I don't honestly think it's a "pansy" issue with most Wings players. As we've seen, even Datsyuk will fight. But they have so much skill that it would kill the team if thye were injured because of a fight. And because of that, they're reluctant to use the gloves.

And we have so many bottom 6ers, all of which are good enough on this team but not good enough to be valuable in a trade, how can we take on another bottom 6er? We might as well just throw in Commodore once in a while, or call up Smith for playoffs, etc. I'd still rather they go for a second line sniper.

Edited by VM1138

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WTF happened to Abby? He used to hit people and fight the odd time and just be a pain in the butt. I think that Jimmy will be ran over more now that other teams know he can get rattled and not one player on the Wings will do a damn thing about it. Shame on them.

I'd sure like to know.

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WTF happened to Abby? He used to hit people and fight the odd time and just be a pain in the butt. I think that Jimmy will be ran over more now that other teams know he can get rattled and not one player on the Wings will do a damn thing about it. Shame on them.

Abdelkader has been a huge disappointment in general this season. I'm not sure what it is, but he's just sort of disappeared into the woodwork.

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I'd sure like to know.

And me. Abdelkader is frustrating. He was a force in the AHL when he was charging around, scoring goals and fighting anything that moved and in his first couple of seasons here he was always looking for a hit, especially down low. He doesn't do any of those now.

You'd think someone who's only scored two goals this season (less than a large number of fighters/enforcers) would be looking to be contribute in as many other ways as possible.

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And me. Abdelkader is frustrating. He was a force in the AHL when he was charging around, scoring goals and fighting anything that moved and in his first couple of seasons here he was always looking for a hit, especially down low. He doesn't do any of those now.

You'd think someone who's only scored two goals this season (less than a large number of fighters/enforcers) would be looking to be contribute in as many other ways as possible.

Hard to play that style of game when any other team will be looking for fights after, and you have noone to back you up. Abdelkader in Grand Rapids just happened to be playing on one of the toughest teams in the league, I dont think its a coincidence that some of it rubbed off on him.

It was just like when May was here, guys like Cleary and Meech were scrapping than as soon as he was sent down there was none of that. Its a team mentality thing

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I was fretting about this last night. I love so much to see the fire that Jimmy has, that he will get up and defend himself. (or his teammates!) But this is just not something he should have to do for himself every single time. If there's anything that will cause him to look at moving on to another team when his contract is up, this is it. That just strikes me as shameful.

I am glad he called out his teammates on this. He has their backs night in and night out. He deserves some respect and protection in return. I hope it embarrasses them into making some changes. They don't even have to be big changes, but for cryin' out loud, at least shove the goalie-runners around a little. A face wash. Something. Don't let running our goalie be so damn easy.

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League agrees with Howard. The goal should have been waived off but no penalty.

Upon further review, am told league believes Jannik Hansen goal should NOT have counted last night.

<br style="color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: Arial, sans-serif; line-height: 19px; text-align: left; ">

...

<br style="color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: Arial, sans-serif; line-height: 19px; text-align: left; ">

League’s feeling is that Jimmy Howard didn’t have a chance to make a save. Not worth a penalty to Van but should have been no goal.

<br style="color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: Arial, sans-serif; line-height: 19px; text-align: left; ">

...

<br style="color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: Arial, sans-serif; line-height: 19px; text-align: left; ">

When I say Hansen goal, of course I meant Hansen crashing into Howard and Edler scoring.

http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.php/tmr/comments/one_more_red_wings-canucks_thing...the_league_agrees_with_howard/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

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No way that ever would have happened if someone like the late great Bob Probert was still around. We need someone that can keep up with todays pace and contribute some points here and there and that other teams will think twice about when taking a run at jimmy. Or maybe just keep some beast chained up at the end of the bench and throw him the odd chicken bone to keep him satisfied till we need him. There is still a place in hockey for tough guys.

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There was multiple times the wings shoulda dropped the mitts last night, instead they gave a "facewash" or pushed and shoved. Im getting pretty sick of it..

Bertuzzi was out there, he shoulda dropped the mitts and taken the instigator penalty, show your ******* goalie you have his ******* back! Hes been playing great, and you cant even stand up for him, and show him that his ******* team is there for him. :ranting:

Edited by wings1110

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There was multiple times the wings shoulda dropped the mitts last night, instead they gave a "facewash" or pushed and shoved. Im getting pretty sick of it..

...again, who is gonna drops the gloves? They don't have anyone that will do it enough to even put a smidgen of a scare into any team. I am not saying they need a goon with no skills, but someone who is at least gonna stand up for their team.

No way that ever would have happened if someone like the late great Bob Probert was still around. We need someone that can keep up with todays pace and contribute some points here and there and that other teams will think twice about when taking a run at jimmy. Or maybe just keep some beast chained up at the end of the bench and throw him the odd chicken bone to keep him satisfied till we need him. There is still a place in hockey for tough guys.

IT doesn't even have to be a "Bob Probert" it could be a "Martin LaPointe" or a "Bob Rouse" or a "Gerard Gallant" or even a "Sean Avery." Problem is, Holland and Babcock do not like nor will they have on their team full time someone who is a fighter.

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minus 6 neg on my post for speaking the truth. guess some of our fans run away and are gutless too.

or perhaps you are just an idiot?

regarding the issue, i agree with the folks that just an enforcer isn't the answer. we need defensemen that will make guys pay for driving the net by either tackling them and/or punching their face in. aside from lidstrom, every single dman we have should be willing to do whatever it takes to protect howard and drop the gloves at the slightest hint of taking liberties.

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I wouldnt want Colton Orr. Give me Mike Brown or Jay Rosehill from the leafs, Orr just isnt a guy that could work with the wings system I dont think. Brown and Rosehill can be every day lineup players who are good on the forecheck and also fight.

And yea I do remember that rumour and they did sign May, when a wings rumour gets started on that site it usually has some truth to it because the only time people will talk about the wings otherwise is to chirp them.

I would think though that Holland is shopping for a Colton Orr type but looking to add a Mike Brown type to the bottom 6. There was a guy on here saying that he heard from a source that Eaves wasnt playing much because the bottom 6 guys were being showcased. Millers game right now could probably add a tough 4th liner who can play a bit.

He may be looking more at a guy like Moen since Motreal is garbage and he can actually play hockey.

Or maybe trading Kindl, and bringing up Smith could help address this problem. Move Kindl for Moen or someone like that and put Smith in his place and all of a sudden the team is much tougher. Speaking of which, do you have video of smiths last fight with Rouseel UK?

NHL Fight Club is your best friend. They have all the AHL fights up within a day or 2 whereas hockeyfights.com takes forever to get them up if at all.

oh and smith needs to be on this team right now.

http://www.nhlfightclub.com/videos/24780/brendan-smith-vs-antoine-roussel-dec-11-2011ahl-grand-rapids-griffins-vs-chicago-wolves.html

or perhaps you are just an idiot?

regarding the issue, i agree with the folks that just an enforcer isn't the answer. we need defensemen that will make guys pay for driving the net by either tackling them and/or punching their face in. aside from lidstrom, every single dman we have should be willing to do whatever it takes to protect howard and drop the gloves at the slightest hint of taking liberties.

Care to elaborate? Did you even read my prior post?

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minus 6 neg on my post for speaking the truth. guess some of our fans run away and are gutless too.

Ya, some users will just neg you and not debate the reason's why. The Wing's have been "soft" for a while. Even when they had Brad May, they didn't play him enough to be considered tough. They need a full time player(s) that will fight every night if they have to while defending their team. Everytime we play St. Louis Backes runs around and knocks players around like he is on a mission, and he NEVER has to answer for it. You are right, teams know that they can rough our players up without any recourse. Ericsson is here for his size and (what was presumed to be) toughness, but he does nothing. More times than not, our players just watch as opposing teams take liberties against their teammates. How many times does Pavel have to defend himself? Howard? Zetterberg getting kneed? Come one! If Aaron Downey was stil playing and on this team, Kesler would have been eating teeth for dinner.

The problem is, and I wouldn't trade the 2008 Cup for anything, but Holland said it in the game 6 post game interview when he said, "Who said you couldn't win with Europeans?" That is his bag now, if not soft Euro's, then soft Euro-type players. When he does draft or sign a North-American style hockey player, they get minimal playing time or get stuck in GRR for 6 years until they are groomed to NOT be that type of player. Which is why Smith will not provide any changes to the toughness of the team, which is why Holland will NEVER try to acquire Weber at anytime. Which is why Hudler is still on this team, forget that nobody wanted him, just sit him for someone who is gonna actually throw a body check. Which is why Mike Commodore gets ZERO playing time. Which is why Holland didn't offer Wiz a contract or Jovo or Willie Mitchell. There is a reason why this team's D is leading the league in scoring and it isn't because the clear the front of the net. I will take the wins, but at what cost if Jimmy or Datsyuk or Zetterberg cannot play 100% because of a "Back Injury" or "Upper Body Strain" what then?

I was never a huge fan of McCarty, but at least he did what he was paid to do. Hell, even Maltby dropped the gloves every so often when he felt he needed to. Last year, when Brad Stuart (who at the time was arguably your best defender at that point of the season) was elbowed in the jaw in calgary, Abdelkader just looked at it happening and did nothing. That was unacceptable and last night's goal when Jimmy got ran, goal or not, penalty or not, Hansen should have at least been eating Louisville for the evening. For player like Bertuzzi to just watch it happen makes me sick. Holland needs to stop drafting the small skilled players or the big skilled players, we have enough of those here and down in GRR to last 20 or so years, he needs to draft and acquire big players that are gonna bruise the f*** out of someone if they take liberties on his teammates. You may not like Avery's antics off the ice, but all be damned if someone is going to get away with this crap while he is on the ice. Too bad Holland is going to stay with the same formula, and I wouldn't be surprised if we see the same lineup tonight in Calgary. They are good, borderline great, but they are soft, and until they address that issue, teams will continue to do what they are doing to them night in and night out...

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I agree with Howie, it is getting absolutely ridiculous. I hate to be one of those guys piling on Shanny, but since his lack of call on Lucic, it seems to have turned into open season on goalies ever since that moment to a level I can't recall in recent years.

Its gotten so bad recently, that in the latest issue of THN, not only is the cartoon about goalies getting run, but they also did a full article about it as well.

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or perhaps you are just an idiot?

regarding the issue, i agree with the folks that just an enforcer isn't the answer. we need defensemen that will make guys pay for driving the net by either tackling them and/or punching their face in. aside from lidstrom, every single dman we have should be willing to do whatever it takes to protect howard and drop the gloves at the slightest hint of taking liberties.

That is the answer, but that is also where the problem lies. Every defensman we have is in the mold of Lidstrom. Of all of the defensman, who do you expect to do what you are asking them to do? Keeping Lids out of the equation, I can name you 5 other's that aren't: Kronwall, Stuart, Kindl, White & Ericsson. That leaves noone. So until Babs puts away his pride and give Commodore a legit shot at playing or Holland gets off the soft-euro train and actually gets that type of defensman, then it isn't going to happen and Jimmy will wind up hurt one day and then we'll be stuck with Conklin/MacDonald for the playoffs. That is until someone runs one of them into an injury. Don't get me wrong, it's fine to have some of your defenders in the mold of Lidstrom, as a matter of fact, you NEED them, but draw the line at Lidstrom, Stuart, White and Kronwall. Ericsson is hot garbage and even though Kindl has been very solid, he is just another soft European player. I am not bashing just the Euro's, if they had a Euro that would hit and defend his team, that would be great, but Holland likes a certain type whether they are Euro or North American, and that is what we have. I am not saying Commodore is the answer either, but JHC, let's see if he is, eh?!?! I don't believe in Smith personally, but if he is the answer, let's bring his ass up here, sit Ericsson, and let's see if he can make his presence felt. We cannot argue with the teams record, but one of these times Datsyuk or Howard gets hit, they aren't going to get up...

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I agree. Howard has been hit way too many times already this season. And he's always the one to go after the guy. They need to start going after guys big time. Strike some fear. Hudler can use some of that UFC training.

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That is the answer, but that is also where the problem lies. Every defensman we have is in the mold of Lidstrom. Of all of the defensman, who do you expect to do what you are asking them to do? Keeping Lids out of the equation, I can name you 5 other's that aren't: Kronwall, Stuart, Kindl, White & Ericsson. That leaves noone. So until Babs puts away his pride and give Commodore a legit shot at playing or Holland gets off the soft-euro train and actually gets that type of defensman, then it isn't going to happen and Jimmy will wind up hurt one day and then we'll be stuck with Conklin/MacDonald for the playoffs. That is until someone runs one of them into an injury. Don't get me wrong, it's fine to have some of your defenders in the mold of Lidstrom, as a matter of fact, you NEED them, but draw the line at Lidstrom, Stuart, White and Kronwall. Ericsson is hot garbage and even though Kindl has been very solid, he is just another soft European player. I am not bashing just the Euro's, if they had a Euro that would hit and defend his team, that would be great, but Holland likes a certain type whether they are Euro or North American, and that is what we have. I am not saying Commodore is the answer either, but JHC, let's see if he is, eh?!?! I don't believe in Smith personally, but if he is the answer, let's bring his ass up here, sit Ericsson, and let's see if he can make his presence felt. We cannot argue with the teams record, but one of these times Datsyuk or Howard gets hit, they aren't going to get up...

oh i agree with what you are saying. i just think our dmen should be expected to stand up for him. a huge dude like ericsson should be expected to protect howard and if he doesn't he should get called out by babcock, teammates, holland, fans, ken and mick or whomever... same goes for stuart and kronwall. both are guys that are physical players. they can't be shying away from after the whistle stuff. the defensemen we have are good players, i just think they should be expected to stand up for their team. and the people that matter don't hold them accountable.

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oh i agree with what you are saying. i just think our dmen should be expected to stand up for him. a huge dude like ericsson should be expected to protect howard and if he doesn't he should get called out by babcock, teammates, holland, fans, ken and mick or whomever... same goes for stuart and kronwall. both are guys that are physical players. they can't be shying away from after the whistle stuff. the defensemen we have are good players, i just think they should be expected to stand up for their team. and the people that matter don't hold them accountable.

...and that is the problem. They don't and they won't. Ericsson, Kindl, Kronwall, Stuart, White. None of these guys could clear the net if they were paid to! Oh wait...anyhow, Kronwall and Stuart have great open ice hits, good offensive upside, but they are poor at clearing players from the front of the net. Ericsson and Kindl are even worse at it. You cannot expect your #1 & #2 guys to do it, so they need to acquire a couple of players that WILL. I would LOVE to see what Commodore can or cannot do for about 10 games, hell, even though I am not sold on him, bring Smith up for a 5-10 game stint. If they aren't what this team is starving for, then acquire two or three defenders that are. I am fine with 3-4 of the type we have, but having all 6 players trying to be scorer's from the blue line and not making players pay the price in front of the net and for sure not making them pay if the take liberties, it is gonna hurt this team in the long haul... It's nice having the highest scoring defense, but I'd rather have the number one scoring offense and the hardest defense to play against. But maybe that is just me...

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I was just rewatching this on my DVR and did anybody notice the shove Hansen gave Lids? Even before Jimmy got to him. At first I was thinking maybe that was why Jimmy went after him, but he was already headed his way. I don't think that helped calm Jimmy down at all though. I mean, it wasn't anything much, but I just don't understand why he would get up and shove a guy like Lids.

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Abdelkader has been a huge disappointment in general this season. I'm not sure what it is, but he's just sort of disappeared into the woodwork.

In other words, he's very expendable.

I said last season (during his awful playoff) that we should get rid of him. He doesn't give us anything we don't already have. I'd rather see his roster spot taken by an enforcer.

He's our worst bottom 6 forward right now. Doesn't score points, and doesn't fight for his teammates. Why is he on the team again?

Edited by GMRwings1983

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