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RedWingsRox

Holland losing his moxie? Is Detroit slipping as UFA destination?

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maybe thats a problem too. you can just get better when you play against better teams. in my opinion our young guys dont get enough chances to develop them selves. if you play constantly in lower leagues you gonna adapt this style of playing and speed. our draft picks should get a chance earlier to play nhl, instead of playing minors for years.

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Well.....uh, to be fair, it would have been a bit hard for those guys to put up minutes for us while they were playing for other teams........or other leagues.

You can even add Nyquist to that list cause he was on GR most of the year at a point per game. On top of that he was scoring at about .70 points per game when Franzen was out and he was on the 2nd line and didn't get another point after he was relegated to a line with Homer and Emmerton after Mule's return and much less ice time. For guys to say Gus, a Hobey Baker runner up and leading scorer for GR last year i believe, can't put up 50-60 points playing in the top 6 as well as Brunner who no matter what league he played in last year, he led it in points, then people need to sit back and watch this year and criticize when they don't reach 50 pts this year. Barring a lockout of course.

WingsAlways likes this

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Good point ZWD. I believe any winger should put up 40 pts with Z or D as his center. Thats a starting point. 60 is good and 80 is great. Nyquist and Brunner need to get bigger, however. They are not gonna crash the net and bang home our standard 45 foot perimeter shot rebounds at 170 lbs a piece. While our top 6 forwards look promising speed, skill, and defensive wise, they are sorely lacking what counts in the playoffs- muscle, grit, and bang. Gotta work on that.

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just some comparable stats for 3 of our most NHL ready prospects....pts/gp

Nyquist-----------Filppula--------------Hudler

AHL: 62/64------AHL: 74/77----------AHL: 179/185

Jarnkrok-----------Franzen

SEL: 76/132------SEL: 58/165

Andersson--------Helm

AHL: 74/153------AHL: 68/122

Edited by number9

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Its a tough year the market is very weak and the prices are steep. You can't expect kenny to over pay for anyone no matter how bad we may need players. The worst part about it is the owners approve these over paid contracts then they turn around and complain that there not making enough money

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I have to believe that the problem is not Holland or that the Wings are not the premier place for free agents but, that the city of detroit and all of its' problems have made the top free agents head to other cities, that have more to offer.

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Its a tough year the market is very weak and the prices are steep. You can't expect kenny to over pay for anyone no matter how bad we may need players. The worst part about it is the owners approve these over paid contracts then they turn around and complain that there not making enough money

I don't think it's so much a matter of not wanting to overpay or looking for bargains. I think Kenny's just looking at the big picture and doesn't want to make big commitments to marginal players just to say he's doing something. We need a star, not an extra. We're willing to pay for a star. We offered Suter ~$7M for 13 years, probably would have matched Minnesota's offer if we wouldn't have also had to offer Parise the same. We were willing to make big commitments to both, just not quite as big as Minnesota. We looked into Nash and Weber.

But guys like Carle, Garrison, etc. aren't going to make any difference. If we're as bad as some people think then Carle isn't an answer. Better off not bothering. If we're not as bad as people think, we're still better off riding it out while we try for someone who can make a difference, who can be or become the leader of this team. If we have to be mediocre for a couple years, maybe miss the playoffs, so what. Every other team has managed to do so without the world ending. 2nd and 3rd tier players are always available to add later if we need to. We added a few pieces to give us some trade flexibility. We need one more defenseman. We add anything more than that and we have to make a trade or lose assets for nothing. As it is, we have the option of waiting for the right move.

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I have to believe that the problem is not Holland or that the Wings are not the premier place for free agents but, that the city of detroit and all of its' problems have made the top free agents head to other cities, that have more to offer.

Since when has any pro athlete lived in the Detroits ghettos?

WingsAlways likes this

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Who needs overpriced UFA's? In 3-4 years, Smith will be better than Suter and one of our young Euro's will be netting more goals than Parise/Semin or Doan... Let's get Abby signed, sort out the bottom 6 and bring on the season!

WingsAlways and number9 like this

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LW, love the optimism. I hope youre right. I really like Smith and Kindle, but i dont like Nyquist or Tatar at all. I hope Brunner shows up.

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LW, love the optimism. I hope youre right. I really like Smith and Kindle, but i dont like Nyquist or Tatar at all. I hope Brunner shows up.

What your issue with Nyquist? Edited by Hey man nice shot!

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No speed and no size. The kid has good hands and good vision. Im not saying he's worthless. I just dont think he has much of what the Wings are lacking right now besides youth.

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No speed and no size. The kid has good hands and good vision. Im not saying he's worthless. I just dont think he has much of what the Wings are lacking right now besides youth.

gotcha

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I have to believe that the problem is not Holland or that the Wings are not the premier place for free agents but, that the city of detroit and all of its' problems have made the top free agents head to other cities, that have more to offer.

Guys like Datsyuk, Zetterberg, and Cleary don't seem to mind the city of Detroit. They've been here for years. The city is rough, but its not like any players live on the outskirts of Detroit. The 'burbs are still nice. Personally, I'd focus more on the team than the city in which they're located.

Edited by Bring Back The Bruise Bros

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holland had always been able to draw free agents because they knew they were going to be contending for the cup. that isnt the case anymore. we are entering a different era in redwings hockey. the future doesnt look so bright. hopefully something happens to change that. personally i don't have as much faith as some people here in our prospects.

centcougar07 likes this

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I agree with you. If prospects are really good, they develop in the NHL. Not Grand Rapids.

centcougar07 likes this

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I agree with you. If prospects are really good, they develop in the NHL. Not Grand Rapids.

hahahah says the guy who obviously knows nothing about our development system

Howard

Kronwall

Filppula

Hudler

Quincey

Helm

Abdelkader

Ericsson

all developed with the griffins....

the only way you go straight to the wings is if your name is Datsyuk or Zetterberg....we over-ripen the rest of em

Edited by number9

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Kronwall- 100 games. Filppula- 75 games. Helm- 125 games. And 5-10 years ago, our team was STACKED. Future Hall of Famers like were taking up roster spots. Not overpaid has-beens. Today, a prospect worth his salt should be able to bump out Bertuzzi, Holmstrom, Tootoo, Eaves, Samuelsson, & Abdelkader without much problem. Our forward prospects just arent that good, im afraid.

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Kronwall- 100 games. Filppula- 75 games. Helm- 125 games. And 5-10 years ago, our team was STACKED. Future Hall of Famers like were taking up roster spots. Not overpaid has-beens. Today, a prospect worth his salt should be able to bump out Bertuzzi, Holmstrom, Tootoo, Eaves, Samuelsson, & Abdelkader without much problem. Our forward prospects just arent that good, im afraid.

lmao nice redirection there.

This has nothing to do with hall of famers and not one of the players you listed is an overpaid has been anyway....with the exception of Samuelsson...and Homer won't be playing for us this season so yeah.

If you knew anything about the wings you'd know we are notorious for keeping our talent in the minors for long periods of time. Smith has been NHL ready for years and only now is getting his first shot at a full NHL season. Has nothing to do with the caliber of the prospect and everything to do with our development philosophy.

Yakupov would be starting the season in the minors on this team. Unless your the next Pavel Datsyuk that's the way things work.

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lmao nice redirection there.

This has nothing to do with hall of famers and not one of the players you listed is an overpaid has been anyway....with the exception of Samuelsson...and Homer won't be playing for us this season so yeah.

If you knew anything about the wings you'd know we are notorious for keeping our talent in the minors for long periods of time. Smith has been NHL ready for years and only now is getting his first shot at a full NHL season. Has nothing to do with the caliber of the prospect and everything to do with our development philosophy.

Yakupov would be starting the season in the minors on this team. Unless your the next Pavel Datsyuk that's the way things work.

Smith wasn't NHL ready until last season, he had maturity and dedication problems until his last year at Wisconsin, and that being the case he would need at least a year at the AHL to make sure those problems were in the past.

centcougar07 likes this

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Stupidest thing Ive ever heard. Why would the Red Wings not play the best players? If Holland and Babcock are such great hockey minds, do you think they'd keep better players in the AHL/College? Give me a break. Smith and Brunner are gonna play because theyre good. Fact. Smith has played 63 AHL games. Yah, they have really been holding him back for years! Ha ha ha. You must not watch the development of these guys thru college, the ahl, and then their first few stints on the big squad.

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Stupidest thing Ive ever heard. Why would the Red Wings not play the best players? If Holland and Babcock are such great hockey minds, do you think they'd keep better players in the AHL/College? Give me a break. Smith and Brunner are gonna play because theyre good. Fact. Smith has played 63 AHL games. Yah, they have really been holding him back for years! Ha ha ha. You must not watch the development of these guys thru college, the ahl, and then their first few stints on the big squad.

I sure hope that these two live up to the expectations that we have for them. Smith for sure has to perform

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Stupidest thing Ive ever heard. Why would the Red Wings not play the best players? If Holland and Babcock are such great hockey minds, do you think they'd keep better players in the AHL/College? Give me a break. Smith and Brunner are gonna play because theyre good. Fact. Smith has played 63 AHL games. Yah, they have really been holding him back for years! Ha ha ha. You must not watch the development of these guys thru college, the ahl, and then their first few stints on the big squad.

uhhhhhh cause we overipen them.....I don't think your understanding...this is not MY philosophy or MY interpretation, It's the franchises and they openly operate this way. Almost every wings fan knows this....some how I'm not surprised you don't. You can disagree with it all you want but its not going to change things. The wings always choose mature veterans over 18 - 23 yr olds, plain and simple. Guys like Jurco wouldn't do a better job at guys like Abdelkaders role anyway...

Brunner is going to play because he's 26 and not a young gun lol though he may still end up doing some time in GR if he underachieves. And Smith is going to play because he's our best prospect, he was ready last season, we have a huge hole in our D and hes a D-man. Simple.

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So we just "over-ripen" players for the hell of it. Even if they could help us win more games now because they're better than current players. We just wont let em play. Nope.

Youve been listening to the Wings announcers too long. The Wings farm system is full of mediocre talent that is not making an impact on the big club, and that "over-ripening" b.s. is just a way to put lipstick on the pig.

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