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Franzen Buyout?

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   206 members have voted

  1. 1. Would you use an amnesty buyout on Franzen this summer?

    • Yes
      59
    • No
      125

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205 posts in this topic

Can't buy him out. Why reward his terrible effort, inconsistency scoring, and general disinterest with a $22.5M pay check and the opportunity to get paid more elsewhere? I hate watching this bum, but its never going to happen. I've said it for 3 years now: dock his ice-time, scratch him from time to time, do something, ANYTHING to get the guy playing like he should. He has had a free ride and he is way too comfortable.

Through 14 playoff games, Franzen ended up with 6 measly points and a team-worst -7 (tied for 3rd worst in the league). Worse than that, he played soft. Terrible effort, perimeter play, few quality chances despite the work of his linemates. Until a 3rd period flurry last night, he showed nothing. The guy has arguably the Top 3 skillset/talent on the team, but by far the worst effort. That is shameful. Imagine a guy with Zetterberg's drive given Franzen's tools (size/shot).

We can't buy him out, but next year when he is floating most of the season, can we stop pretending his point production off his linemates' work justifies his $4M cap-hit while he continues to cash $5M+ paychecks?

And can we put to bed his clutch playoff status, circa 2008-2010?

2008: 16GP 13G 18PTS +13 ($900K)

2009: 23GP 12G 23PTS +8 ($1.15M)

2010: 12GP 6G 18PTS +8 ($5.5M)

(AVERAGE: 1.157 PPG)

2011: 8GP 2G 3PTS -1 ($5M)

2012: 5GP 1G 1PT -1 ($5.25M)

2013: 14GP 4G 6PTS -7 ($5.25M)

(AVERAGE: 0.37 PPG)

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Franzen was pretty invisible this series... I kind of forgot about him.

LidsFan likes this

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Move Franzen if we can, if not buy him out. He is not worth the cap hit. Not now and not in the future. Those that defend Franzen like to say things like "you can't get a 30 goal scorer for 4 million per year". That is true, but Franzen isn't a 30 goal scorer. he has scored 30 goals in a season 1 time in his career-back in 08 when datsyuk and Zetterberg were also having their career years. if you look at his numbers Franzen is really a 25 goal per year guy, at best. Now who if the better buy? Franzen 33 at 4 million and 25 goals per year, or a guy like Ryan 25 and 33 goals per year at a 5.2 million cap hit? Ryan clearly is.

People are also tying in facts that have no bearing on Franzen. We are not a team with cap issues as of today. if he stays or goes we have room to spend. it is how we spend that matters.

The only thing that matters with reguards to Franzen is: can we get someone better? if so, you do it. There are some UFA's that are better, there are some that are equal and cheaper, and there is always the trade route. The biggest roblem with Franzen is he is 33 and only going to get worse. he is not a young kid that has time to improve. he is on the downward arc that everyone has after 30.

For those that are wondering about contracts, Capgeek has a very good section on this. If quotes the CBA and will provide the buyout rates for guys on the "contract advantage" list, which includes Z, Kronwall, and Franzen. If frnazen plays his whole contract, his cap hit is basicly 4 million per year. if he was to retire at say age 37/38 with 3 years left on his deal, his cap hit would be a little lower-about 2.8 million for the remaining years of his contract. Same is true for Z and Kronwall.

As of today, we have those 3 guys signed for 7/8 more years at a cap hit of 14.5 million per year. if all retire early are cap hit goes down to about 10 million per year.

It is possible that in 4 more years, we will be spending 1/7th of our total cap on guys no longer playing in the NHL. we need to fix this now, before it becomes a problem, and the guys in question still have some value, so that they can be moved.

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no but id buyout Sammy and bert bring goose and tats perminate

Sammy, yes. But not sure about Bert. Is there a deadline to buyout a player? Because I would like to give Bert a summer to heal and go from there. We are already a undersized team in the West; we'll be playing teams like Boston, Toronto and NYR next season. If you thought Anaheim and Chicago were physical with our small forwards...

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Buy out our top goal scorer who has a cap hit under 4 million? It worries me that 26 people have voted "yes". What are you thinking? The Wings aren't going to find a 25-30 goal scorer for any less than $3.9 on the market.

Buy out Sammy

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Buy out our top goal scorer who has a cap hit under 4 million? It worries me that 26 people have voted "yes". What are you thinking? The Wings aren't going to find a 25-30 goal scorer for any less than $3.9 on the market.

Buy out Sammy

He isn't our top goal scorer anymore, and due to his decline in production he is going to be a 20 goal scorer. But your point remains it still doesn't make sense to cut him, however he should be a trade candidate. I don't want him getting board and influencing our young players.

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Buy out our top goal scorer who has a cap hit under 4 million? It worries me that 26 people have voted "yes". What are you thinking? The Wings aren't going to find a 25-30 goal scorer for any less than $3.9 on the market.

Buy out Sammy

He wasn't the top goal scorer, that was Datsyuk. If Franzen doesn't score 7 goals in 8 games, not only do the Wings not make the playoffs, but he's obviously in single digits for goals and assists. Is THAT worth 3.9 Million? It's not like he had 40 GAMES before that to do something, but he basically didn't do squat.

I am thinking this team needs a serious kick in the ass and a restructuring. What it doesn't need are guys with tons of talent but who sometimes play like a 5 year old girl learning how to skate for the first time. If this was Robert Lang (again), there would be no doubt, no matter what he was being paid. Some players on this team are complacent and Franzen is most assuredly one of them. This team needs a restructuring badly and that $4 mm would be a nice addition to the cap space.

Sammy, yes. But not sure about Bert. Is there a deadline to buyout a player? Because I would like to give Bert a summer to heal and go from there. We are already a undersized team in the West; we'll be playing teams like Boston, Toronto and NYR next season. If you thought Anaheim and Chicago were physical with our small forwards...

Bert's done. He may not know it yet.

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He isn't consistent, but he still contributes.

Funny, you can say this exact same thing about Filppula.

What the hell does Franzen do that Filppula doesn't? They both have the exact same amount of points, except Franzen played way more minutes, Filppula was way better on faceoffs, took less penalties, was better defensively, skated harder, battled better, scored at even strength, actually tried to contribute. But for you, Filppula is a momentum killer who needs to go while Franzen needs to stay. (Oh, and Filppula does this at almost a million less a year too)

Sorry dude, but any hope you had of giving objective commentary is gone.

Buy out our top goal scorer who has a cap hit under 4 million? It worries me that 26 people have voted "yes". What are you thinking? The Wings aren't going to find a 25-30 goal scorer for any less than $3.9 on the market.

Buy out Sammy

I'd rather have a 25-30 goals scorer who actually works for 5 million than Franzen, who scored that many goals because other people worked to get a great chance for him for 3.9 million.

Plus, lets not forget about the benefit recapture penalty. Either he plays 7 more years (which god knows I don't want) or we have a huge cap hit for a few years for nothing.

Edited by Z and D for the C
b.shanafan14 likes this

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As frustrating as it can be - who do we find via UFA to replace him?

I see the buyouts going to Sammy, and Bert...Those 2 will be replaced with the kids.

Agreed.

4 goals 2 assists and a -7 in 14 games. This was the season the Wings needed to lean on their star players more than ever and he delivered another mediocre playoff performance.

The reality is Franzen competes hard when he feels like it. But the Wings are already short on snipers. If they could package Franzen to bring back a big name, great. Otherwise the Wings just aren't deep enough to lose more offense.

LidsFan likes this

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only place i can see mule going to is vancouver as there stuck with a longterm contract themselves in luongo and desperately wanna move it and improve the team up front

canucks get franzen ... leafs get luongo ... we get leafs 1st round pick

if it wasnt for bettmans new penalty on teams id keep mule but i dont think he will play at 39-40 yrs old for 1 mill and we will get screwed so im looking ahead

As for replacing mule were gonna have to give the kids some extra ice time or hopefully we can get lucky and get a clarkson or someone whos bought our like richards/malone etc...

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Buy out our top goal scorer who has a cap hit under 4 million? It worries me that 26 people have voted "yes". What are you thinking? The Wings aren't going to find a 25-30 goal scorer for any less than $3.9 on the market.

Buy out Sammy

Can't buy him out. However, I'd love to see him traded for someone who currently scores a few less goals with much more work ethic. It'd be nice to get a player who can show up more consistently and do more for his linemates. The majority of Franzen's game these days is take, take, take. Too bad someone like Callahan isn't available.

LidsFan and marcaractac like this

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Like I said in another thread, he was smiling in the handshake line. That is NOT what I wanna see from a player who is on the losing side of an OT game 7. It screams "I don't care" IMO. If I were Holland, I'd make an attempt at moving him. There will be some team needing to hit the cap floor. Let him have his fun soaking up the sun in Florida for all I care.

LidsFan likes this

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We simply don't know, people act different. My last opponent was simling too after he lost the fight against me.

But back to topic : Without Mule we might have missed the playoffs and I, as many others here, think, that he puts up the Numbers which he is payed for. Tragic from tonight is if her buries is great chance in the third we are in the WCF and Mule is the hero of day. That he's frustrating to watch sometimes is also true but we wouldn't find a substitution for him at this price. Not to mention that we have other candidates to use the buy outs for.

Edited by derblaueClaus

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damn just saw if brad richards retires with 1 year left on his deal at 1 million salary the rangers will get screwed 17 mill in the cap recapture , hawks 18 million same scenario with hossa ... franzen and zetterberg probably around the same amount of $$

cant take the chance with both , hank i can see him play but not mule

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damn just saw if brad richards retires with 1 year left on his deal at 1 million salary the rangers will get screwed 17 mill in the cap recapture , hawks 18 million same scenario with hossa ... franzen and zetterberg probably around the same amount of $$

cant take the chance with both , hank i can see him play but not mule

No concern for this happening with Franzen as he makes a lot less money than Richards or Hossa. Zetterberg makes more yes, but he is signed until he is 40, not 42 like Hossa.

I don't think Franzen should be bought out at all. He can be traded. His cap hit isn't high at all, making the term less of an issue. He would be a prime candidate for a team that barely spends above the cap year in and year out.

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franzen makes 1 million at 39 yrs old and same at 40 .... same as zetterberg .. were in the same boat as the richards/hossa deals

No. Because Hossa and Richards are a lot more likely to retire before their deals are up, and make a lot more money. So their respective teams will be on the hook for a lot more in terms of a cap hit than the Wings would be. Even if Franzen and Hank retire when they would start on their 1 million dollar years, the cap hit the Wings would have to endure would be nowhere near what Chicago and NYR would have to deal with.

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just checked ... if he retires at 39 we get a penalty of 8.318 million ... still f*cken high

Whatever the cap hit is is relative to how many years are left, based on what he is paid vs what his cap hit was over those years. the difference then is split up over the remaining years left once retired. considering franzens cap hit, if he retired with 2 years left (most likely scenario) you take the money he was paid, subtract the total cap hit of the years played, divde that number by 2 and that would be the cap hit for two years. and it would be SOOOOOO much less than this 8.318 million you're coming up with.

By my math, and what I've read on this rule, if Franzen retired with 2 years left, Detroit would have a cap hit of about 2.95 million a year for two years. Not the end of the world.

If Hank retired with 2 years left, he'd leave us with a cap hit of arounf 5 mil a year for 2 years.

As of right now, the Wings saved just over 5 million because of Franzen's cap hit. So if he was traded this summer, then retired with 2 years left. When those two retired years get here, the wings would be responsible for the current cap savings of the first 4 years of his deal, where as the team he is traded to would be on the hook for the cap savings on the last two years.

Edited by marcaractac

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For those that think illitch wouldn't buy him out frankly don't know anything. Illitch has always been willing to throw money at his teams. They're also businesses and sometimes you have to cut your losses. The question isnt if illitch would be OK with it.

Its a question of if Holland would do so and basically admit it was a bad contract. Which I don't see happening. This team needs to free agents to play on the second line. Not paying fil or FTA Zen gives us the money to do so.

By "don't know anything" do you mean "clearly understand the cap value of scoring wingers in today's NHL"? He has a sub 4 million dollar cap hit and has averaged 0.37 goals per game since signing the contract (0.37, 0.37, 0.38 and 0.34 goals/game in the seasons from 09-10 to 12-13). That is a pro-rated 30 goals per season over 82 games. Simply said- you can't get 6'3 30 goal scorers for that cheap anymore unless they're on an entry level or short-term RFA contract. Calling Franzen's contract a 'bad contract' displays true ignorance of the reality of contracts in today's NHL.

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By "don't know anything" do you mean "clearly understand the cap value of scoring wingers in today's NHL"? He has a sub 4 million dollar cap hit and has averaged 0.37 goals per game since signing the contract (0.37, 0.37, 0.38 and 0.34 goals/game in the seasons from 09-10 to 12-13). That is a pro-rated 30 goals per season over 82 games. Simply said- you can't get 6'3 30 goal scorers for that cheap anymore unless they're on an entry level or short-term RFA contract. Calling Franzen's contract a 'bad contract' displays true ignorance of the reality of contracts in today's NHL.

I don't think it is a bad contract at all, which is why I think Franzen would make good trade bait. I think buying him out would be idiotic. But getting something for him would be a smart move IMO. Come playoff time, it would be better to have a 15-20 goal scorer who works his ass off each and every night. Franzen had a few years now to try and show that 2008 wasn;t a one time thing. I think he has had enough chances.

I don't hate the guy, and wouldn't be upset to see him with the team next season. I just don't think he has the heart or hunger to be a winner any more, and that his best use to the team would be as a tradable asset.

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Some guys lack the hunger and drive after they've already won the championship and got the long term contract. I think he fits this description. I loved 08 Franzen and we wouldn't have won it without him but he seems disinterested and disappears quite often now. He has his moments but a hustling, grinding 25 goal scorer would suffice.

Edited by GoWings!
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No. If he retired with one year left, they would be on the hook for a one year cap hit of 2.95 million.

That link you post shows what his penalty would be if he retired with 2 years left.

Edited by marcaractac

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