At What Point Does Holland Deserve Blame?

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

Be honest. How much money would you pay to watch that team play?

Prolly about tree fifty.

[number9 3,297]

Be honest. How much money would you pay to watch that team play?

None if Brian's on the team. Not ever going within 10 miles of that animal

[Rivalred 630]

Please remember that if you can't add anything to the conversation, you should rethink posting in a thread.

How dare you try to moderate

I do agree with you, stay on topic

And on that note, It is a catch 22 with having success as we have not had too picks in the draft like other teams so Holland cannot take blame, but same time Holland needs to bring in some better players via FA for this team to get to the next round

Edited May 5, 2015 by Rivalred

[Nightfall 871]

I really would like to see someone create a poll on this topic. I bet we would see 95% of LGW Members say that Holland doesn't deserve blame while the vocal 5% are saying he should be blamed.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

I really would like to see someone create a poll on this topic. I bet we would see 95% of LGW Members say that Holland doesn't deserve blame while the vocal 5% are saying he should be blamed.

It's not a black and white thing. How many posters would say Holland deserves no blame whatsoever? 95%? I doubt it. Of course he should get at least some blame.

Edited May 5, 2015 by GMRwings1983

[number9 3,297]

I really would like to see someone create a poll on this topic. I bet we would see 95% of LGW Members say that Holland doesn't deserve blame while the vocal 5% are saying he should be blamed.

What GMR said

I think a better pole would be should he be fired. I think you'd find your vocal 5% then.

[reverb80 2]

But he seemed ill prepared for what was obviously going to be the biggest transition the team faced under his tenure. Uncharacteristic is the word that keeps coming to mind because he's usually three moves ahead of everyone else.

When Yzerman left he was a third liner and we had Datsyuk and Zetterberg, whereas Lidstrom was still our #1 d-man. Holland seemed surprisingly unprepared for what should have been something the franchise was planning for years in advance.

It's certainly easier written than done. Holland has an incredibly hard job, but has done it very well for so long. As I said above, I was just surprised how unprepared he seemed for something that was inevitable. Lidstrom's retirement was second only to the implementation of the salary cap in terms of its impact on the team.

I'm glad he drafted those players but it kind of supports my case. That's way too late to expect those guys to contribute to the lineup in Lidstrom's absence, especially with defensemen. It's almost like Holland was in as much denial as the rest of us that Lids would ever retire.

I think it's pretty clear that Holland had no idea that Rafalski was retiring. While everyone looks back now and thinks it was highly obvious that Lidstrom was retiring, he conceivably could have played another 3 or 4 years. Not true to say he did nothing to plan for Stuart's departure. He acquired Quincey in anticipation. Say what you will about him, but at the time, he had put together some good years with the Kings and Avs and Holland had been criticized for letting him walk.

Yeah, he could have had a Plan B if the Suter thing didn't work out, but I think he and Parise kind of threw a last minute monkey wrench into the process by selling themselves as a pair. He also signed DeKeyser, who was coveted by Yzerman and every other NHL team.

I agree with Playmaker, that only with hindsight is Lidstrom's retiring when he did, clear. I believe if it wasn't for the lockout being clearly on the horizon, that he would of played at least another season, maybe more. And I think all of us can agree that even being a few years older he still would of been amongst the best Defensemen in the league. If he had stayed those drafted D-men that Harold mentioned above would be much further along. Some would of been on the team already and the others could of been moved for something.

I think that the strategy to over developed prospects will remain in place until Holland is not the GM. I believe he want's to leave a full cupboard to his successor (Yzerman) when he does step down. I also think and that Illitch and Co are more focused on the Tigers and happy enough with the playoff streak and an outside chance of winning at the moment.

Once Z and Dats retire and (hopefully) Yzerman takes over, I think you will see a move away from the over ripe idea. Some big moves will be made with some of our, highly valued, NHL ready, prospects to rebuild the team with the Captains vision in mind and the beginning of a new era so to speak.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

What GMR said

I think a better pole would be should he be fired. I think you'd find your vocal 5% then.

I didn't know Holland was Polish.

Fire him!

[number9 3,297]

I didn't know Holland was Polish.

Fire him!

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

I didn't know Holland was Polish.

Fire him!

Ba dum TSS.

Yeah. The poll option has way too many variables, it would have to be wayyyyy more generic.

Like has Holland lived up to his billing as a top gm, or something to that effect.

He's done a great job drafting, and replacing the scores of people who have left for bigger roles..

That in itself is harder than people give him credit for, IMO.

If any other team lost as many people in the f.o. I doubt they'd have been replaced as effectively as they were by Holland.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

Agreed.

A simple poll of 'fired, or kept as GM' would see many more participants.

I wouldn't want him fired just to move up the ladder as president of hockey and give another GM - preferable the Captain - the chance before he re-upped with the Bolts

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

Agreed.

A simple poll of 'fired, or kept as GM' would see many more participants.

Well, it's a long thread already, so I think participation has been fine.

[Dylanr19 0]

The Detroit Red Wings are going to ask their players to tank the year and break the playoff streak so they have a shot at a first overall pick.....

wtf ?

My thoughts exactly haha tanking is gutless and definitely not the Detoit Red Wing way.

[Ally 448]

This thread is a perfect example of the fact that you can't make everyone happy. We want him to spend more but also spend less. We want him to make big trades but not give anything of value away. We want him to get us a top 10 draft pick but we don't want to miss the playoffs. We also ask that he have a crystal ball that warns him if a player will be injured at any point.

He deserves blame for his mistakes, of course but he also deserves a metric ton of credit.

This thread has actually been way more positive than I expected and lots of great points being made which is really nice to see after a first round exit.

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

This thread is a perfect example of the fact that you can't make everyone happy. We want him to spend more but also spend less. We want him to make big trades but not give anything of value away. We want him to get us a top 10 draft pick but we don't want to miss the playoffs. We also ask that he have a crystal ball that warns him if a player will be injured at any point.

He deserves blame for his mistakes, of course but he also deserves a metric ton of credit.

This thread has actually been way more positive than I expected and lots of great points being made which is really nice to see after a first round exit.

I just wanna know why they took the seeds out of watermelon laffy taffy, and when they'll put them back.

If Holland can figure this out for me, I'll blame him for nothing.

There's a community of people who are as outraged as me.

https://m.facebook.com/wonka/posts/10150991969773893

Get on it ken.

Edit.

Are.

Not bare.

Although, one would say, that without the seeds, that taffy is bare.

Maybe its because most watermelon is seedless now?

A great question, that ken Holland could answer.

Ya know what I'm saying ally?

Edited May 6, 2015 by jimmyemeryhunter

[BottleOfSmoke 5,965]

I just wanna know why they took the seeds out of watermelon laffy taffy, and when they'll put them back.

If Holland can figure this out for me, I'll blame him for nothing.

There's a community of people who are as outraged as me.

https://m.facebook.com/wonka/posts/10150991969773893

Get on it ken.

Edit.

Are.

Not bare.

Although, one would say, that without the seeds, that taffy is bare.

Maybe its because most watermelon is seedless now?

A great question, that ken Holland could answer.

Ya know what I'm saying ally?

Can someone please call 911

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

Can someone please call 911

Don't patronize me.

[BottleOfSmoke 5,965]

Don't patronize me.

*hands jimmy a seedless watermelon laffy taffy*

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

*hands jimmy a seedless watermelon laffy taffy*

[BottleOfSmoke 5,965]

*hands jimmy a seedless watermelon laffy taffy*

*is confused and strangely aroused by the presence of that ruler in the picture*

*blames Holland*

[Euro_Twins 4,476]

*is confused and strangely aroused by the presence of that ruler in the picture*

*blames Holland*

Its almost 7 inches long

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

Bow chicka wow wow

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

Its almost 7 inches long

So not in McGrattan or Lilja's league?

[Euro_Twins 4,476]

So not in McGrattan or Lilja's league?

They are big tough guys cause they have to over compensate, their laffy taffy is only 4 inches

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

They are big tough guys cause they have to over compensate, their laffy taffy is only 4 inches

She disagrees.