Say Goodbye to the C, Z.

[Wing Across The Pond 196]

I've never been in their locker room, but honestly I can't imagine Zetterberg or Lidstrom giving that speech either. Heck, I've never personally heard Yzerman giving a big speech.

It's one of those things that goes on in the locker room that we don't get to see.

Correct me if I'm wrong but this has always been the way that the (modern at least) Red Wings have operated. I remember someone saying (can't remember when, might have been when Lids took over) that generally it was never the captain that talked in the locker room, but usually someone like Draper, who COULD talk. And then when the captain did pipe up, you knew you were in trouble. I mean I can't really see Lidstrom giving big speaches, but heck if he started telling me what to do, I'd work my ass off every shift after that.

I think Dats would be good for the C because he's proved he's the best on-ice presence for this team. That doesn't mean Z or someone with better English can't join him as the face of this organisation.

On another note, I lol'd the other day when I saw somone post a pic of Hudler as captian for the Czech team but then I also noticed that after every game he's the last off the ice (bar Howard) and always talks longest to the goaltenders every game. Maybe there is some leadership there?! Plus the amount of times he's broken his face or at least have it cut open, only to come back and do it again... born leader. Huds for the C

[Jocke 53]

He IS the next captian...I cant see them giving it to anyone else!

He's playing a little better. Still has his work cut out for him.

Thanks!

@ Wings Across The Pond:

Hudler as captain?

[Wing Across The Pond 196]

Thanks!

@ Wings Across The Pond:

Hudler as captain?

Was just for lolz. Just wondering what made the Czechs give him the C. I'll try and find the pic again

EDIT: hehe

Edited November 27, 2011 by Wing Across The Pond

[Jocke 53]

Was just for lolz. Just wondering what made the Czechs give him the C. I'll try and find the pic again

EDIT: hehe

That's nasty

I suppose it's because he was the biggest star on the team(?)

Edited November 27, 2011 by Jocke

[Konnan511 1,736]

I wouldn't mind if Pavel was given the captaincy.

He seems to be bringing it every game, which is the mark of a captain and leader. I haven't seen that from Zetterberg this season. Too many off games.

The fact that he speaks better English than Pavel is not as important as his play every night.

I dealt with Pavel for a week straight at my job over the summer and spoke to him in both Russian and English; his English is fine and not as bad as people around here make it out to be.

Datsyuk never takes a shift off and never seems to have a down game.

And Datsyuk too soft spoken to be a captain? Really? We've had two of the most soft spoken captains in history right in a row. How in the world would you even know if Datsyuk was quiet in the locker room? I've been a big fan of Datsyuk being the next captain for 3+ years and my "want" of him to be the next captain grows more and more everyday.

[Krayzie_Bone 58]

Lindstrom is never going to retire so it does not matter.

[ComradeWasabi 109]

Lindstrom

Get the hell out.

[BlakKy 58]

Lindstrom

That tastes bad.

[chrisdetroit 189]

Another great game by Datysuk, this time against Boston. Pavel had a slow start (as usual), but he's really brought back his game. All things considered, there's no doubt he'll be the next to lead the Wings. That Pasha magic is best in the league - bar none.

No. Pav is clearly not comfortable in front of the media and has poor English. Z will be the next Captain. Kronwall probably has an outside chance but that's it.

Not sure Datsyuk is really the right guy for all the reasons discussed already, though primarily the language barriers. I think he's more of a leader than people give him credit for though and wouldn't be a terrible choice at all. What has he not excelled at in his career (besides maybe the first few weeks of a season...ha...)? Generally speaking, I've been saying for years that Datsyuk is the heart and soul of this team when it really comes down to the game on the ice, as much or maybe even more than Lidstrom. Dats is to the offense what Nick is to the defense, but like Nick, his contributions on his opposite end are just as impressive as what they do in their positional roles. But again, still not sure if his English-level is really up to the task.

That said, I don't know how I feel about Z these days. He just seems spottier more and more as time passes since the back issues first crept up. He's still a great player, but he is not our best player at all. He does not instill fear into opponents like Datsyuk does. Datsyuk is a superstar among superstars, again, much like Lidstrom, whereas Zetterberg exists on the fringe of superstardom at this point at best.

I'm not trying to suggest that being the best has anything to do with being a good captain at all, but it absolutely has something to do with the decision making process at the very least. Obviously, a less than great player can be a great leader and captain, and a great player can be a terrible leader and captain. But great players who possess a strong character that matches their skill set stand a solid chance at growing into being great leaders and captains. You're going to be looked at as a leader if you're the best whether you want to be or not, so it's inevitable that being the best has something to do with being the captain. As Jimmy D said after Steve retired, "your captain is your best player."

And everyone talks about Steve setting the bar in a sense, but Steve didn't just become "The Captain." Before he was "The Captain," he was chosen to be the captain because he was the best player; he was the centerpiece of the organization. He became "The Captain" because frankly, there's likely less than two handfuls of athletes who were as much of a warrior than Steve Yzerman. What he did in the 2002 Playoff run is nearly unparalleled in all of sports. But none of that changes the fact that those reasons had nothing to do with why he was originally chosen to be captain. He started out as the captain because he was the best, and then became the best at being a captain and a leader when he wasn't necessarily the best player, quietly, without any pretense, and that's why he is "The Captain."

So clearly, being a leader of the magnitude that Steve Yzerman was is not where one starts out when becoming a captain, and that's why I'm not convinced that Pavel couldn't be the captain of this team and a great one at that over time. Z might be more similar to Yzerman as far as his playing career goes in being derailed offensively somewhat by injuries, but he wouldn't be starting out at captain as the best, or on top of his game. And like it or not, being the best does have something to do with the role.

But let's be clear about something: Nick retiring after this season is hardly a done deal. He obviously still has a lot of gas in the tank and there's really no reason other than a lack of motivation that he couldn't continue playing maybe even 4-5 more years. I don't know if he will, but I'm hardly convinced that he won't the way things are going. If he plays even another year or two past this year and you start looking at the next captain then, you've got a Zetterberg who will be closing in on his mid-30's, likely with more back issues and decreased output and more limited ice time, and chances are he won't be playing into his 40's like Nick who has managed to evade major or nagging injuries throughout most of his career. And with Datsyuk, while I could see him playing into his 40's more easily than Zetterberg, he's two years older than Z. Even Kronwall is already 30. These guys aren't spring chickens. If Lidstrom wasn't one of the absolute best players to play the game, he wouldn't have gotten the nod at his age, and only Datsyuk comes close to a Lidstrom-level of all-time greatness (obviously well behind Lids, but far ahead of Z).

Now, if Lidstrom retires next year, it'll obviously be Dats, Z or Kronwall (I think the matter would be discussed in that order personally, with Dats getting the nod so long as he was comfortable with it), but if he hangs around, I think we'll see the Wings looking to a younger player who has the potential to carry the torch for longer. I don't know who it could be (only a hope in a certain player stepping up in the next year or two) but I don't think it's a lock that Dats or Z will get it if Lids hangs around past this season.

Wow. You must be bored today to write a book about this issue.

Hey if Syd can be a Captain, anybody can.

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

Now the topic will be derailed....

[Forecheck808 10]

Assuming Nick retires this following summer, there are only three realistic choices for the next captain of this team: Datsyuk, Kronwall, and Zetterberg. All of whom dawn the A. It's reasonable to say Kronwall will not be the captain having just recently acquired the A. Not to mention going from the greatest two-way defenceman to ever play the game as your leader to Kronwall: isn't very inspiring (as underrated as he is). Which leaves us with one of two choices: Pasha or Zetta.

At this point Z is no captain. Apart from being invisible every game, the majority of the time when he does make a mistake it ends up in the back of our net. Take for example the Joe Thorton steal in the offensive zone against San Jose. Zetterberg is always praised for being hard on the puck and protecting it so well. Now keeping in mind that it was Joe Thorton, it was still very uncharacteristic of him. And that give away in front of Jimmy vs. Boston was just brutal. Also his lack of production offensively is disappointing. For those of you who don't know he's on pace for a forty-eight point season.

So we're left with Datsyuk. Not much can be said about him. He hits, steals, passes, scores, makes plays, breaks plays, P.K.s, power-plays and is the best two-way player to ever play the game. The only downside to Pavel is probably his slow starts to every season. Many of you seemed concerned with the way he speaks English, and that he wouldn't speak up in the locker room when needed. But can you really say he wouldn't? Do you really see Nick calling out anyone ? It's guys like Drapper who would say what the team needed to hear in and out of the locker room; Kronwall can definitely fill those shoes, and then some. And besides if worse comes to worse we can always get Zetterberg to give a speech/talk to the media: may as well make good use of that six million.

As of right now it is reasonable to think Pavel will be the next captain of the Wings. That being said, I hope Zetterberg can find his game again and be just as good as we know he is.

[Electrophile 3,554]

Two posts, both of which asserting that one of our star players, a player groomed to be the next captain from the start, isn't good enough to be captain.

Quite interesting. Only here.

[55fan 5,133]

I don't think it comes down to a competition. I think Z is a foregone conclusion, and it is his to lose. I don't see anything about Z that says to me that he shouldn't be a captain. This doesn't mean that Pavel or Kronner wouldn't make a good captain, just that they have had Z picked since his arrival.

He just needs to grow out his beard and hair to lengths that allow him to play up to his usually high level.

[gcom007 1,465]

No. Pav is clearly not comfortable in front of the media and has poor English. Z will be the next Captain. Kronwall probably has an outside chance but that's it.

Wow. You must be bored today to write a book about this issue.

Hey if Syd can be a Captain, anybody can.

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

Now the topic will be derailed....

Ha, actually, yes, I was bored at that moment and on top of that, I was a history major for awhile and had to write at least 3 10-15 pages (or more) papers a week while in the program. You learn to write a lot in as fast a manner as possible. I've unfortunately never been able to dial it back down since deciding I had no interest in being a lawyer at all and switched programs.

Edited November 28, 2011 by gcom007

[Motown4013 350]

Assuming Nick retires this following summer, there are only three realistic choices for the next captain of this team: Datsyuk, Kronwall, and Zetterberg. All of whom dawn the A. It's reasonable to say Kronwall will not be the captain having just recently acquired the A. Not to mention going from the greatest two-way defenceman to ever play the game as your leader to Kronwall: isn't very inspiring (as underrated as he is). Which leaves us with one of two choices: Pasha or Zetta.

At this point Z is no captain. Apart from being invisible every game, the majority of the time when he does make a mistake it ends up in the back of our net. Take for example the Joe Thorton steal in the offensive zone against San Jose. Zetterberg is always praised for being hard on the puck and protecting it so well. Now keeping in mind that it was Joe Thorton, it was still very uncharacteristic of him. And that give away in front of Jimmy vs. Boston was just brutal. Also his lack of production offensively is disappointing. For those of you who don't know he's on pace for a forty-eight point season.

So we're left with Datsyuk. Not much can be said about him. He hits, steals, passes, scores, makes plays, breaks plays, P.K.s, power-plays and is the best two-way player to ever play the game. The only downside to Pavel is probably his slow starts to every season. Many of you seemed concerned with the way he speaks English, and that he wouldn't speak up in the locker room when needed. But can you really say he wouldn't? Do you really see Nick calling out anyone ? It's guys like Drapper who would say what the team needed to hear in and out of the locker room; Kronwall can definitely fill those shoes, and then some. And besides if worse comes to worse we can always get Zetterberg to give a speech/talk to the media: may as well make good use of that six million.

As of right now it is reasonable to think Pavel will be the next captain of the Wings. That being said, I hope Zetterberg can find his game again and be just as good as we know he is.

Are you F'n joking? Do you watch the games?

He's had a slow start and Z had a BRUTAL giveaway two games ago...but EVERY SINGLE PLAYER ON THE ROSTER gives it away once in a while. How can you honestly write that he is invisible every game- six points in the last 4 games doesnt really seem like he isn't relevent, especially when you fail to mention that Datsyuk went through a very similar drought at the begining of the season. I love how posters will make these ridiculous statements about players of Zetterbergs caliber.

You may not think he should be the next Captian of this team so just say that- dont make stupid and ignorant suggestions that he's not visable or relevant. He's worth his paycheque...every penny.

[Forecheck808 10]

<br />Are you F'n joking? Do you watch the games? <br />He's had a slow start and Z had a BRUTAL giveaway two games ago...but EVERY SINGLE PLAYER ON THE ROSTER gives it away once in a while. How can you honestly write that he is invisible every game- six points in the last 4 games doesnt really seem like he isn't relevent, especially when you fail to mention that Datsyuk went through a very similar drought at the begining of the season. I love how posters will make these ridiculous statements about players of Zetterbergs caliber.<br />You may not think he should be the next Captian of this team so just say that- dont make stupid and ignorant suggestions that he's not visable or relevant. He's worth his paycheque...every penny.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

There's a difference between being bad and being "Datsyuk bad". Zetterberg has had maybe three decent games in the last twenty-two and you wanna argue the fact that he's been invisible? Stop riding him and take an unbiased look at how things are. And to call my post a "stupid and ignorant suggestion" because we don't see eye-to-eye is probably a testament to how low your quality of life is. And for future reference, what I posted wasn't a "suggestion" it was an opinion. And if you're comfortable with paying six million a year for a player who's on pace for forty-eight points then I'm sure there's a Montreal forum you should be on: let a lone the captain of the Wings.

[number9 3,297]

<br /><br /><br />

There's a difference between being bad and being "Datsyuk bad". Zetterberg has had maybe three decent games in the last twenty-two and you wanna argue the fact that he's been invisible? Stop riding him and take an unbiased look at how things are. And to call my post a "stupid and ignorant suggestion" because we don't see eye-to-eye is probably a testament to how low your quality of life is. And for future reference, what I posted wasn't a "suggestion" it was an opinion. And if you're comfortable with paying six million a year for a player who's on pace for forty-eight points then I'm sure there's a Montreal forum you should be on: let a lone the captain of the Wings.

I agree with you that Datsyuk is the better player, but this suggestion/opinion/argument is stupidish? ignorantish? lol i honestly laughed when finishing your post.

Anybody who thinks that Zetterberg has been invisible at all this year doesnt watch the wings or hockey for that matter.

I am beyond comfortable paying Z 6mill. I would pay 8 mill + for him on the open market.

You, I, and everyone else here knows he will score well above 48 pts this season, and so will datsyuk. So forget your on-pace garbage lol it means nothing.

Forget Montreal, theres a Columbus/NYI forum screaming your name.

[13dangledangle 968]

How did I miss this thread!

I think it's safe to assume we all know I wouldn't mind seeing Dats get the "C". I don't think he will but anyone who would complain about it are crazy. I do however think Z will still get it, Im guessing thats what Pavel wants as well so and you should too.

[Learn2LuvIt 246]

A slight challenge for Pav getting the "C" is the language barrier. Captains need to be able to interact and have discussions with the officiating crew--in English. As Rule 6 states, the team captain alone is the only one to hold this discussion privilege with the refs. I don't know if Pav's English is good enough to be effective with this role.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

A slight challenge for Pav getting the "C" is the language barrier. Captains need to be able to interact and have discussions with the officiating crew--in English. As Rule 6 states, the team captain alone is the only one to hold this discussion privilege with the refs. I don't know if Pav's English is good enough to be effective with this role.

Agreed. Pavs is hilarious, in part due to how his humor comes across in his broken english. But the guy makes Homer look fluent.

As others have mentioned, the most talented guy on the team doesn't necessarily have to be the one wearing the C.

Edited November 28, 2011 by haroldsnepsts

[Kira 451]

Pasha is a lot smarter than he lets on...I think he tries to buffalo people into thinking he doesn't speak English all that well because he's really a very shy person. He's actually a very brainy fellow. Once you get to know him, you find out that he's a lot smarter than he shows to everyone.

As far as him being captain, I see no reason why he couldn't be. Getting mad, I've seen his temper before...I remember a game in St. Louis where he got so mad he walked in the locker room and slammed his stick into the rack. There was an anger in his eyes I'd never seen before...he was really ticked. I think if the situation called for it, he could summon the anger forces and let loose. I wouldn't put it past him.

[hockeyrhino 9]

Z has been groomed for years now to take over; Lids is going to retire and I think he should while he is on the top of his game. His oldest son is already staying with family in Sweden because he does not want his kids in American schools. He needs to concentrate on his family now; he has given us 20 stellar years.

Pav is God, but he is too shy and too self-effacing to be a captain in the media spotlight.

Wouldn't mind Kronner; he has such grit and is just as pretty as Z (oh, stepped in it there...)

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Pasha is a lot smarter than he lets on...I think he tries to buffalo people into thinking he doesn't speak English all that well because he's really a very shy person. He's actually a very brainy fellow. Once you get to know him, you find out that he's a lot smarter than he shows to everyone.

As far as him being captain, I see no reason why he couldn't be. Getting mad, I've seen his temper before...I remember a game in St. Louis where he got so mad he walked in the locker room and slammed his stick into the rack. There was an anger in his eyes I'd never seen before...he was really ticked. I think if the situation called for it, he could summon the anger forces and let loose. I wouldn't put it past him.

I don't think anyone is questioning Pavel's intelligence. Just his fluency in English.

EDIT: And I heard Z has 7 points in his last 6 games. Hopefully he's getting on track the way Datsyuk has.

Edited November 29, 2011 by haroldsnepsts

[Jocke 53]

I love Pavel.

But do you really expect this man to talk to the media/referees on a regular basis?

Edited November 29, 2011 by Jocke

[SouthernHockeyHoney 20]

How did I miss this thread!

I think it's safe to assume we all know I wouldn't mind seeing Dats get the "C". I don't think he will but anyone who would complain about it are crazy. I do however think Z will still get it, Im guessing thats what Pavel wants as well so and you should too.

I see what you did there!

Seriously, though... Dats, Z, either way, I'm good with it.

[Guest stinky fish taco]

Pasha is a lot smarter than he lets on...I think he tries to buffalo people into thinking he doesn't speak English all that well because he's really a very shy person. He's actually a very brainy fellow. Once you get to know him, you find out that he's a lot smarter than he shows to everyone.

As far as him being captain, I see no reason why he couldn't be. Getting mad, I've seen his temper before...I remember a game in St. Louis where he got so mad he walked in the locker room and slammed his stick into the rack. There was an anger in his eyes I'd never seen before...he was really ticked. I think if the situation called for it, he could summon the anger forces and let loose. I wouldn't put it past him.

do you know datsyuk personally?

your posts about him are really creepy.