Mckinley25 679 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 I know that the overwhelming consensus would be completely against this. But, does anyone think that maybe blowing up the team would be the best move? I'm not even sold on the idea my own self...but it's just something to discuss while we wait and see if anything happens to improve our team. Maybe doing what Philly did could help us, especially in the long run. Trading Zetterberg and/or Datsyuk for very high end younger players with superstar potential before they both decline to the point of having no value..... We could maybe fetch players like Oliver Ekman-Larson (who I believe will be the best defenseman in the league for a long time), Brayden Schenn, Evander Kane, Erik Gudbranson, Alex Burmistrov, Patrik Berglund, Bobby Ryan...ect... Trust me, my heart would shatter trading away either of them, regardless of the return. But, sometimes things like that can end up being a huge blessing is disguise....Any thoughts? Please don't kill me for bringing up the idea of it The same thing would happen to us that happened to Philly, whoever got Dats and Z would win the cup Seriously though, we rag on Detroit for being unnecessarily loyal, (and that maybe so) but with Dats and Z the loyalty is important. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red Crazy 201 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 I know that the overwhelming consensus would be completely against this. But, does anyone think that maybe blowing up the team would be the best move? I'm not even sold on the idea my own self...but it's just something to discuss while we wait and see if anything happens to improve our team. Maybe doing what Philly did could help us, especially in the long run. Trading Zetterberg and/or Datsyuk for very high end younger players with superstar potential before they both decline to the point of having no value..... We could maybe fetch players like Oliver Ekman-Larson (who I believe will be the best defenseman in the league for a long time), Brayden Schenn, Evander Kane, Erik Gudbranson, Alex Burmistrov, Patrik Berglund, Bobby Ryan...ect... Trust me, my heart would shatter trading away either of them, regardless of the return. But, sometimes things like that can end up being a huge blessing is disguise....Any thoughts? Please don't kill me for bringing up the idea of it I wouldn't trade Z or Pav but it wouldn't hurt my feelings if they shopped Mule and Fil to see what the offers might be. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 5,130 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Fil would bring you Ryan...plain and simple... Filppula, Mursak, Tatar, 2nd rounder gets us Bobby Ryan....MAKE THE FLIPPIN TRADE! 1 F.Michael reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Axe Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Losing Flip and gaining Ryan is a wash. That would be dumb. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Crymson Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Fil would bring you Ryan...plain and simple... Filppula, Mursak, Tatar, 2nd rounder gets us Bobby Ryan....MAKE THE FLIPPIN TRADE! How do you know this? Have you spoken with Bob Murray? If so, what else did he say? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Crymson Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Well lets have a look at Flip's production prior to his "breakout" seaon he just had shall we? 2010/2011 39 pts 2009/2010 35 pts 2008/2009 40 pts 2007/2008 36 pts You're right...He's not a 40 to 45 pts guy...More like a 35 to 40 pts guy. I do not see the reasoning behind your claim that a young, developing player who has finally hit his stride should suddenly regress to past numbers. By your logic, no young player who ever had a few seasons with the same numbers would ever improve. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Axe Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Flip produces on a point per game level when given 1st and 2nd line minutes. .5 per game when filling his normal 3rd line duties. What more can he do? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 5,130 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Saying Val Filppula is a wash with Bobby Ryan, you are on crack....Hey, maybe they'll trade us Ryan and a 1st rounder for Flip? Here's the problem, sure Flip and Ryan are the main cogs, but Holland will have to sweetin the deal in order to secure him. Throwing in two NHL ready prospects and a pick should more than entice Murray enough to trade Ryan to us...not unless Columbus offers them Rick Nash... Everything I have said is all speculation, of course, I do not know Mr. Murray, but he had said he wants a 2nd line center and some young talent...Could there be other teams with 2nd line centers they are willing to trade? Of course! I maintain that Holland has the trump in Filppula though, because of Selanne wanting to play with Flip in the NHL. He was asked last trade deadline if he would like to play with Flip and he said that when they play together on team Finland, they have great chemistry and he would enjoy playing in the NHL with him. Selanne has said he'd like to come back for another year and of course he only wants to play in Anaheim. Couple all that together and it's almost like a marriage made in Heaven. Murray gets Flip AND Selanne...PLUS he gets two NHL ready prospects AND a pick...We get Bobby Ryan, 24 year old phenom who is signed for three more years at a great rate and who will help usher in the next 20 years of dominance! We get younger, get a player at a position WE NEED, they get a player at a position THEY NEED and all are happy... Both sides would be crazy not to do this deal....Now, not unless Holland wants Nash more than Ryan, then we are talking a whole new ballgame! 1 F.Michael reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 5,130 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Flip produces on a point per game level when given 1st and 2nd line minutes. .5 per game when filling his normal 3rd line duties. What more can he do? He can get us Bobby Ryan...He is not a 2nd line center here...let's call this the Adam Oates, Jimmy Carson factor, great players with great careers, yet were always playing behind someone...especially Carson, he was behind Yzerman and Fedorov...Filppula will flourish in Anaheim, especially with Selanne...Once Getzlaf leaves next year, Flip will be the #1 center out there, he will never be that here... He will command and get $5M+ next July and for the money, Ryan is more valuable at $5.1M for the next three years HERE than Val will be as the #3 center or on the wing. Maybe this won't happen and we will still have Val..that's fine too, but if Holland really wants that top 6 sniper, he must sacrifice a little depth in order to get it...whether it be Nash or Ryan, he has to do what gets the job done...Mursak and Tatar are ready to be in the NHL, but it won't be here, at least not for awhile...they'll get instant ice in Anaheim....here Tatar is stuck in GR and Mursak will probably get traded or waived anyhow...and who knows, Flip may walk after this year to somewhere he can be a #1 or #2 center...all risks with no reward, trade them now and be rewarded for the next 13 years! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
number9 3,297 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 (edited) Bolded: players who are capable of playing in the top-6 Filppula-Datsyuk-Bertuzzi Franzen-Zetterberg-Brunner Cleary-Helm-Samuelsson Miller-Abdelkader-Tootoo Eaves, Emmerton, Mursak, Andersson, Nyquist That's 9 different players who are capable of and could potentially play in the top-6 next year. We won't be trading for another top-6 forward, i.e. Nash and Ryan are not going to be Red Wings. It would be a waste of assets to trade, especially with Semin and Doan still on the market. The next move is obvious: sign Semin or Doan and then trade away 3-4 bottom-6 forwards, or don't sign them and still trade away about 3 bottom-6 forwards. Either or the bottom 6 dump is coming. Hopefully the trade will net another D-man. Edit: Can't understand why everyone is discussing trading for Nash or Ryan while we have more than enough in the forward department and a GAPING hole in our defense still. Bizarre-O world? Edited July 9, 2012 by number9 2 esteef and Z Winged Dangler reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Axe Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Number 9, spot on. Semin-Datsyuk-Cleary Filppula-Zetterberg-Franzen Good enough. 1 number9 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 5,130 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Semin - Datsyuk - Doan Even better! I admit the Ryan trade is a remote, VERY remote possibility, and odds are Holland stops at Doan or Doan and Semin. Which would be fine and dandy with me! But until we DON'T have Bobby Ryan, a fan can wish.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Hatethedrake! Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Doan will most likely sign a 1 year deal with Phoenix and Semin will go to the KHL. Wings will likely sign Kubina as Kenny was rumoured to have interest in him at the trade deadline. Quincey and Abs will be re-signed. That will be it. Kenny will say how much he likes his team and that he will save his cap space for the trade deadline and will explore improving his roster. But really, nothing will be done. Kenny is all about adding and not subtracting. No impact trades will be made. Just depth ones. Realistically I think most Wings fans can agree that this team is good enough to make the playoffs but not good enough to go very far. This season and next season are stopgap seasons until our influx of young talent become the next decade's Red Wings. We are basically buying time for Jankrok, Jurco, Pulkkinen, Mrazek, Callahan, Nyquist, Tatar, Smith, etc. 3 pucktividi, number9 and Z Winged Dangler reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ShanahanMan 473 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Doan will most likely sign a 1 year deal with Phoenix and Semin will go to the KHL. Wings will likely sign Kubina as Kenny was rumoured to have interest in him at the trade deadline. Quincey and Abs will be re-signed. That will be it. Kenny will say how much he likes his team and that he will save his cap space for the trade deadline and will explore improving his roster. But really, nothing will be done. Kenny is all about adding and not subtracting. No impact trades will be made. Just depth ones. Realistically I think most Wings fans can agree that this team is good enough to make the playoffs but not good enough to go very far. This season and next season are stopgap seasons until our influx of young talent become the next decade's Red Wings. We are basically buying time for Jankrok, Jurco, Pulkkinen, Mrazek, Callahan, Nyquist, Tatar, Smith, etc. you gotta keep in mind the age of our core players. Hank is almost 32 and Dats will be turning 34 in 10 days!! It's usually around this age that production takes a huge hit, so people who are expecting Dats and Hank of 08 are due in for a reality check. Not to mention, Franzen 32, Sammy turning 36, Bertuzzi 37, Cleary 33.....this core won't remain our core for much longer and last time I checked, we had no prospects in line even close to potential Hank/Dats level, which causes tremendous worry. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Axe Report post Posted July 9, 2012 No semin now. Next. You suck, Holland. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 5,130 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Which is why Holland should make a deal for Ryan...he would start the next generation. He may influence the likes of Getzlaf and/or Perry next July...Same could be said about Nash too, he would have some influence throughout the league as well...one would think.. 1 Rick D reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Crymson Report post Posted July 9, 2012 No semin now. Next. You suck, Holland. Pardon? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
arag 308 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 No Semin is a good thing. Thumbs up for Kenny if he does not sign him? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StormJH1 231 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 you gotta keep in mind the age of our core players. Hank is almost 32 and Dats will be turning 34 in 10 days!! It's usually around this age that production takes a huge hit, so people who are expecting Dats and Hank of 08 are due in for a reality check. Not to mention, Franzen 32, Sammy turning 36, Bertuzzi 37, Cleary 33.....this core won't remain our core for much longer and last time I checked, we had no prospects in line even close to potential Hank/Dats level, which causes tremendous worry. Right, I think people are aware of that, it's just a question of "what do you do about it?!" The problem we have right now is that you can look at the entire roster, and the only two guys that come to mind as somewhat likely to take a big step forward in production are Nyquist and Brendan Smith. Seriously. I suppose Filppula could improve a little more, but not much more. And Brunner could be a stud, or he could be a fringe AHL player. The rest of the team has already peaked, and might even be on the way down, and that is SCARY. The point that we "need" defense yet mostly seem to talk about forwards is well-taken, except we've seen time after time how this team ends up lacking scoring when it counts the most, which is why a lot of people are interested in a Hossa-like addition to spark an already pretty full roster. I'm not really sure what the next move is, but if Flip and Mule and can be moved to acquire a Nash or Ryan type talent, that HAS to be explored. My gut, however, tells me that what will actually happen is that Holland will weigh the cost of that against keeping those players and adding something like Doan through FA, and favor the more conservative route. I just hate the feeling that Hockeytown is literally stalling until we can run into the next Datsyuk or Hank without using a high draft pick to find him, and that doesn't seem too likely to happen. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wings_Toledo 233 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 I haven't seen anyone mention Kurtis Foster as an option for D. Is he just way too injury prone and slow or what? He only made $1.8 mil last season and is a big body with a RH shot. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Z Winged Dangler 2,082 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 Pardon? Apparently Semin is not going to be a Wing though he hasn't signed anywhere else yet and may not work out on the Wings if he signed anyways. So Holland sucks...lol. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xtrememachine1 795 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 I just saw this on ProHockeyTalk.com OK, so here’s the deal. You’re a GM in need a forward. You have the opportunity to get one of Rick Nash, Bobby Ryan, Shane Doan, or Alex Semin. (Or, you can do nothing.) Of course, each one comes with a price… To get Nash, you’ll have to give up a solid roster player, a couple of decent prospects, and a first-round pick. Plus you have to take on his contract, which has six years left at a cap hit of $7.8 million. To get Ryan, it’s the same price as Nash. Contract: three years left, cap hit $5.1 million. To get Doan, you have to give him a three-year deal with a $5 million cap hit and a no-trade clause. To get Semin, it’s one year for $2 million, and if it works out he’s promised to re-sign a reasonable deal (and we’ll assume he won’t break his promise). Or, again, you can do nothing. http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2012/07/09/poll-nash-ryan-doan-or-semin-who-would-you-want/ I voted for the Rick Nash trade. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Red Crazy 201 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 I vote Nash and Doan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pskov Wings Fan 71 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 I haven't seen anyone mention Kurtis Foster as an option for D. Is he just way too injury prone and slow or what? He only made $1.8 mil last season and is a big body with a RH shot. Foster missed a whole season few years ago with broken femur. He has (or maybe had) a very strong shot from the point. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 5,130 Report post Posted July 9, 2012 (edited) I see on TSN.ca the Parise/Suter crap that shows them in their jersey's with A's on the front of them...probably another reason they didn't pick Detroit, no guaranteed A on their Chest.... Ok, back to the topic....(just didn't want to bump thier threads back to the first page....screw em!) BTW - Looking at their s*** eating grins really turns my stomach...I think I can honestly say Crosby has dropped to #3 on my hate list.....f***! Edited July 9, 2012 by LeftWinger Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
