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Pilsnermonkey

Where were team-mates on the Smith headshot

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Didn't see the game.

That said - I'm not surprised.

I can understand Holland/Babcock not having fighters on the roster, but I tend to disagree with them, and feel that a few guys capable of dropping the gloves when needed is much needed, but that's just me.

I used to fell the same way. Now I think I understand the strategy. Being outside of Michigan I'm now always watching commentators not named Mick and Ken. I always here something to the affect of: The Red Wings are good, but not physical or dirty, so there's no reason to dislike them at all, here's to an honest hockey game.

I'm a pro physical hockey-guy, I like to see fights and would love to have a physical nasty bottom 6. But it's quite apparent to me at this point that the Wings are one step ahead of the league. They see, like myself, that despite our cravings for old time punch-em-in-the-face-hockey, that's not the direction the league is going. The Wings are fielding a pure sport team. Occasionally other teams will take advantage of that, but for the most part other teams respect us for how we play the game and most games remain honest. I get that, and like the classiness behind it, but I hatttttttttttttteeeeeeeeee when this kind of thing with Smith happens. I don't want a waste of space Mcgrattan or Orr type, but I would love if someone like Abdelkader or E would step up for their teammates.

Unfortunately the league is becoming soft whether we like it or not. Babcock already admits to steering his D-men away from fighting, and from that I'm guessing that he probably doesn't want his team in general to fight. In the long-run it's probably smart that we're focusing on the pure sport of hockey, but as an old-time hockey fan it just sucks to see our boys not get support.

Here's a late goodbye to an era.

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No. I don't see it that way at all. After the head shot, Brendan needed to go to the bench for concussion protocol. Someone else needed to step in. That's the deal. Cheap headshots will produce an immediate and angry response. At least they do for EVERY other team.

Disagree strongly here: a cheap shoulder to face on anyone should have the Wings buzzing like angry killer bees on the perp. That is NOT team play and needs to be rectified otherwise they will be known as pushovers and will be played accordingly. It is certainly not dropping gloves for no reason; it is avenging an ugly, intentional attempt to injure by illegal head contact. FWIW, I'd rather see goons bashing each other than cheap shot artists committing this kind of offence on players in vulnerable positions such as Brendan was. AND he got an extra 2 for 'slashing' when his retaliatory cross check was called. Not only were the team-mates MIA on this one, the referees were absolutely out to lunch.

Suspension forthcoming. If I was Brendan, I'd ask for a trade. He lays it out for the team every game and the team does not reciprocate. Brutal.

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I'm getting carried away. Of course Brendan isn't going anywhere. I do hope he's ok. I just can't stand cheap-shot/chicken-sh/t illegal hits like that to the head. Maybe Pancake gets a taste if it himself one day (on top of a suspension and public shaming) and I'll leave it at that. Brendan took one for the team tonight and I will salute that and wish him well.

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Yeah - as a fan of hockey from the late 70's - retaliation was something we came to expect.

As the game continues to evolve we will most likely see it banned from the pro level (NHL/AHL) within 10 years.

I feel the 'heat of the moment' types of fights still have their place in the game, but even that will go away eventually.

*sigh*

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I'm not sure where else to pose this query so I'll do it here.

Did Ouellet completely leapfrog Smith in the depth chart without anybody saying anything about it? I noticed he was out there late in the game when Babcock put Pav and Z back together, and he had more ice time than Smith. It's no secret that Babs likes the guy, but he's getting up around 20:00 a night in playing time as an injury replacement.

Edited by kipwinger

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Smith was actually the best fighter on the ice at that moment.

But yes, the Wings don't stand up for teammates enough. The Weber on Zetterberg play is a great example. The league is now about having smaller middleweights who can play hockey and fight. We don't even have those on this team, for some reason.

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Thanks!

I missed the game. I honestly can't stand guys who Jersey people when they fight. Nothing more chicken s*** then saying I can't beat you up so I have to make you blind to do it.

I don't get is why the Refs did not stop the fight after the jersey was pulled over his head. I have seen major injuries as a result of this carelessness by the refs. Soon as a player is at a disadvantage they are to break it up. just plain stupid.

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I don't get is why the Refs did not stop the fight after the jersey was pulled over his head. I have seen major injuries as a result of this carelessness by the refs. Soon as a player is at a disadvantage they are to break it up. just plain stupid.

Thats why I was mad too. Usually the refs jump in way to early and they stood there and watched Smitty take a few with his head covered.

The Wings have never stood up for each other in a long time. Dont be surprised by this one. Franzen running around being a ****** probably ends up in liberties being taken out on his teammates.

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Thats why I was mad too. Usually the refs jump in way to early and they stood there and watched Smitty take a few with his head covered.

The Wings have never stood up for each other in a long time. Dont be surprised by this one. Franzen running around being a ****** probably ends up in liberties being taken out on his teammates.

Here's why I think this "the refs should have stopped it sooner" argument is bunk. If Smith had been winning the fight, and the refs stopped it sooner, everybody would be irritated that the refs "should have let them go". When you say "usually the refs jump in TOO early" you're suggesting that they're doing something wrong by getting involved before they SHOULD. And now, you're advocating them getting involved before they DID. It's a judgment call for the refs, and when the fight is going well for our boys, people are almost never in favor of stopping the fight.

If Brendan Smith had the sweater pulled over Panik's head and was serving him his lunch, everybody would have been fine with the refs' inaction. They'd have LOVED seeing a Red Wing win a fight for once. But because Riley's Brother was getting handled it's somehow wrong for the refs to stand back and "let em' go".

I don't buy it.

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Here's why I think this "the refs should have stopped it sooner" argument is bunk. If Smith had been winning the fight, and the refs stopped it sooner, everybody would be irritated that the refs "should have let them go". When you say "usually the refs jump in TOO early" you're suggesting that they're doing something wrong by getting involved before they SHOULD. And now, you're advocating them getting involved before they DID. It's a judgment call for the refs, and when the fight is going well for our boys, people are almost never in favor of stopping the fight.

If Brendan Smith had the sweater pulled over Panik's head and was serving him his lunch, everybody would have been fine with the refs' inaction. They'd have LOVED seeing a Red Wing win a fight for once. But because Riley's Brother was getting handled it's somehow wrong for the refs to stand back and "let em' go".

I don't buy it.

You're making assumptions here. Not too many people would be happy about that. I wouldn't want to see someone on the wings win a fight by cheating. If he loses fairly then it's all well and good. If he wins fairly then I'm happy. If cheating is involved to create a clear advantage on either side the fight should be stopped immediately.

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You're making assumptions here. Not too many people would be happy about that. I wouldn't want to see someone on the wings win a fight by cheating. If he loses fairly then it's all well and good. If he wins fairly then I'm happy. If cheating is involved to create a clear advantage on either side the fight should be stopped immediately.

That's my whole point. You say that now. But I don't believe, in the wake of just such a hypothetical fight, that you'd take the moral high ground. Nothing personal against you, I'm just basing this off of a long established homer bias that all fans (of all teams) have. People go to EXTREME lengths deny, or justify, reality when it's in favor of the Wings, but not the other way around. Why do you think people get so irritated when Eddie Olczyk talks about the Wings' "subtle interference"? He's not the only one who's called the Wings on that. We DEFINITELY do it. And yet, you can almost hear an audible hiss from our fans each time he brings it up.

If Brendan Smith won that fight nobody would be talking about this right now. I'm not saying this because our fans are duplicitous or wishy washy. I'm saying this because our fans are like every other fan on earth. They like getting away with one, and hate when the breaks don't go our way.

Edited by kipwinger

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Here's why I think this "the refs should have stopped it sooner" argument is bunk. If Smith had been winning the fight, and the refs stopped it sooner, everybody would be irritated that the refs "should have let them go". When you say "usually the refs jump in TOO early" you're suggesting that they're doing something wrong by getting involved before they SHOULD. And now, you're advocating them getting involved before they DID. It's a judgment call for the refs, and when the fight is going well for our boys, people are almost never in favor of stopping the fight.

If Brendan Smith had the sweater pulled over Panik's head and was serving him his lunch, everybody would have been fine with the refs' inaction. They'd have LOVED seeing a Red Wing win a fight for once. But because Riley's Brother was getting handled it's somehow wrong for the refs to stand back and "let em' go".

I don't buy it.

The problem I have your argument is your assuming that would be our feelings.

I do believe it is a heated topic if fighting belongs in our game. I for one do not think its necessary part of the game but I there are tones of other thread I could make that statement in.

I would have not been upset if it was the other way. With all the evidence of what head trauma does to athletes, this needs to be stopped. Boxing and UFC are sports that is only about fighting has rules against someone that a disadvantage.

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The problem I have your argument is your assuming that would be our feelings.

I do believe it is a heated topic if fighting belongs in our game. I for one do not think its necessary part of the game but I there are tones of other thread I could make that statement in.

I would have not been upset if it was the other way. With all the evidence of what head trauma does to athletes, this needs to be stopped. Boxing and UFC are sports that is only about fighting has rules against someone that a disadvantage.

I agree with your position on fighting, but I don't really want to make his a pro vs. anti fighting thread.

And you're right, I am assuming people would react differently. That's because in all my life, I've never known a sports fan who was ok with with a questionable referee decision if said decision wasn't in their teams' favor. Occasionally fans will begrudgingly accept a refs' decision if it's too obvious to ignore, or else the outcome of the decision is inconsequential. But if it matters at all, every fan will always take their teams' side. That's what being a fan is all about. So if Smith is winning it's "let em' go ref" and if he's losing it's, "they need to get involved earlier".

Same with penalties. Think about it. People ***** and moan about the refs CONSTANTLY on this site, but conveniently leave out the part about how the Wings get more powerplays than almost every other team in the league. Pretty mum on that one, because it helps us out.

Edited by kipwinger

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Guest DeGraa55

I actually thought the refs times it about right.

Even with the sweater over his head smith was still fighting...granted not effectively but he was still trying.

But as he slowed down the refs did step it and stop it.

If smith stopped earlier maybe the refs step in sooner...

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