Jim Devellano on Mantha's play: "Very disappointing"

[number9 3,297]

Red Wings say something that is true.

Red Wings fans mad about this.

Got it.

[DickieDunn 2,571]

Lots of people went overboard on the Mantha hype train. 40 goal power forward, don't trade him for anything, etc.I think a liet of the laziness comes from how he was used in juniors. His coach had him out for 2 minute shifts, you can't skate hard that long, so he picked his spots. He has to adjust now.

I don't think anyone said don't trade him for anything. But no one was willing to trade nyquist mantha pulkinen and a first round pick for yandle. Also I still believe he can be a 40 goal power forward. He needs to bulk up but he has the frame and skills for it

A few people did. Deal breaker for Benn or OEL for some.

[GoWings1905 2,694]

Red Wings say something that is true.

Red Wings fans mad about this.

Got it.

Ken Holland said he wasn't trading for a rental at the deadline last season either. I don't take everything this organization says as gospel.

[wings7 62]

You guys are making a lot of excuses for this guy.

To the person who said he's been as good as Jurco…Isn't he supposed to be WAY WAY WAY better than Jurco?!

Come on be honest with yourselves. It's been a disappointing first season. That's true. So, what's the issue?

[number9 3,297]

Ken Holland said he wasn't trading for a rental at the deadline last season either. I don't take everything this organization says as gospel.

You don't think Mantha had a disappointing year?

[toby91_ca 620]

I think there was some disappointment in his player this year, but to be very, very, very disappointed, the expectations must have been way higher than they should have been.

My expectations of Mantha have never been extraordinarily high, so I must say that his first year was pretty much as expected. I expect him to be able to come in, develop and contribute quite nicely, but expecting him to become a superstar is just way overboard. I think many may have gotten too excited by his stats in his final year in junior. The way I have looked at is that any future NHL player should be dominating in their third year in juniors. A player that is going to be a future superstar is unlikely to even be playing a third year in juniors (unless they started underage).

There's always exceptions to that, of course, but that's the mindset I've always used and it certainly has kept be from being to hyped up about Mantha. The hope though was that he was a bit of a late bloomer and his 3rd year in juniors was his breakout and a glimpse of what to expect in the future.....with that possibility, you could chalk up this year's struggles to having to rebound from serious injury.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Red Wings say something that is true.

Red Wings fans mad about this.

Got it.

Apparently you don't.

Most people in this thread aren't mad and aren't arguing that Devellano's comments are inaccurate.

[number9 3,297]

Apparently you don't.

Most people in this thread aren't mad and aren't arguing that Devellano's comments are inaccurate.

Maybe you should reread the thread. The majority of people have expressed displeasure about Devellano being honest.

All he did was say something everyone already knows.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

Maybe you should reread the thread. The majority of people have expressed displeasure about Devellano being honest.

All he did was say something everyone already knows.

The displeasure comes from the fact that he could have kept his mouth shut. Or if he wants to be honest, why doesn't he "honestly" evaluate his performance as well as that of the other higher-ups?

Like hey, we can't win a playoff series, our young stars underwhelmed in the playoffs, our defense can't score and our signings/trades turned out poorly. I like honesty, but Devellano needs to come out and criticize other things and not just Mantha.

[GoWings1905 2,694]

You don't think Mantha had a disappointing year?

Compared to massive expectations, probably. He's still only 20 years old and not any worse off than Tatar and Jurco at the same point. The way Jimmy D went about this is what bothers me more than anything. Let Blashill handle this instead of calling out one of your top prospects through the media.

Edited May 6, 2015 by GoWings1905

[number9 3,297]

Compared to massive expectations, probably. He's still only 20 years old and not any worse off than Tatar and Jurco at the same point. The way Jimmy D went about this is what bothers me more than anything. Let Blashill handle this instead of calling out one of your top prospects through the media.

So we agree he didn't lie, good.

It's not like he sought out the media to get this off his chest. He responded to a question honestly about something everyone's aware of. I have no problem with that, it's better than some of Hollands shady answers.

The displeasure comes from the fact that he could have kept his mouth shut. Or if he wants to be honest, why doesn't he "honestly" evaluate his performance as well as that of the other higher-ups?

Like hey, we can't win a playoff series, our young stars underwhelmed in the playoffs, our defense can't score and our signings/trades turned out poorly. I like honesty, but Devellano needs to come out and criticize other things and not just Mantha.

See I don't mind when guys are honest to the media. Mantha doesn't deserve to be coddled. He didn't meet the high expectations we had for him in his first year. That's just truthful. Mantha thought he was gonna be a wing, he's well aware already about his disappointing season.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Maybe you should reread the thread. The majority of people have expressed displeasure about Devellano being honest.

All he did was say something everyone already knows.

I did. As I stated in the post you quoted, the problem most people have with Devellano's comments has nothing to do with their honesty.

Almost no one is arguing about its truthfulness. Just the timing and the source.

Your post was responding to an oversimplified argument no one was really making. Just one you invented.

So we agree he didn't lie, good.

It's not like he sought out the media to get this off his chest. He responded to a question honestly about something everyone's aware of. I have no problem with that, it's better than some of Hollands shady answers.

See I don't mind when guys are honest to the media. Mantha doesn't deserve to be coddled. He didn't meet the high expectations we had for him in his first year. That's just truthful. Mantha thought he was gonna be a wing, he's well aware already about his disappointing season.

When you post your actual thoughts on the subject, there's a good discussion to be had. Thank you. This makes total sense to me.

[WingedWheel91 271]

I think your attitude has a lot to do with how management treats you.

[number9 3,297]

I did. As I stated in the post you quoted, the problem most people have with Devellano's comments has nothing to do with their honesty.

Almost no one is arguing about its truthfulness. Just the timing and the source.

Your post was responding to an oversimplified argument no one was really making. Just one you invented.

When you post your actual thoughts on the subject, there's a good discussion to be had. Thank you. This makes total sense to me.

Perhaps fact would have been a better word than the phrase "something that is true"

I never posed an argument about the truthfulness of his comments or debated that, I simply stated they were in fact truth. And that LGW has a problem with that.

Edited May 6, 2015 by number9

[PumpkinEscobar 136]

My question is..are Devellano's services really needed?

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

My question is..are Devellano's services really needed?

Good question. What does Devellano do?

[number9 3,297]

Mantha came into this year with the expectation that he could possibly step right into the NHL and perform. He was also protected by management in trades as an untouchable.

Yet he didn't make the NHL, and was average at best in the minors, often appearing as if he was just coasting.

Sure hes at the same point as Nyquist and Tatar in his career, but the later two exceeded the expectations the team had for them, not the other way around.

I think the public criticism is well warranted. This isn't a boom or bust prospect that is faltering. It's a blue chip vastly underperforming. I hope it lights a fire under his butt for this summer and next year.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

My question is..are Devellano's services really needed?

I don't think so

[KATIEBARTHEDOOR24 426]

Good question. What does Devellano do?

Pretty sure he is an informant for the Illich mob. But you didn't hear that from me.

My take from this is the Wings brass is pleased with him over all. The freep had something about it the other day. To me it sounded like Holland and company are just trying to light a fire.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

In retrospect, I was hard on Devellano in this thread.

This is a man who produced one of the greatest drafts in NHL history in 1983, when he drafted Yzerman, Probert, Kocur, Grimson and Klima.

There's a lineup I'd go to war with. I'm guessing the Wings must have been bullied in 1982.

[Helmethead 235]

1982. That's a long time ago. I was 6 years old then. I do recall Reed Larsson's bomb from the point. Johnny O was the man.

[kipwinger 8,524]

In retrospect, I was hard on Devellano in this thread.

This is a man who produced one of the greatest drafts in NHL history in 1983, when he drafted Yzerman, Probert, Kocur, Grimson and Klima.

There's a lineup I'd go to war with. I'm guessing the Wings must have been bullied in 1982.

Devallano knows what he's talking about. He was brought in to build a successful franchise and he built the most successful one in the NHL. People just rail against him because he criticized someone who is popular. And folks don't like that. It's not enough that the Wings, or the Griffins, be good. They have to be good with our favorite players too. Because if our favorite players turn out to be no good, what does that say about our own judgement?

What's true of Holland in the other thread is true of Devallano here. Nobody has had as much success with the modern Wings than these guys have had. More than Bowman. More than Babcock. More than Yzerman, or Lidstrom, or everybody else.

I think 30 years of unparalleled success affords you the right to say whatever the hell you want about a 20 year old prospect.

[Nightfall 871]

Mantha came into this year with the expectation that he could possibly step right into the NHL and perform. He was also protected by management in trades as an untouchable.

Yet he didn't make the NHL, and was average at best in the minors, often appearing as if he was just coasting.

Sure hes at the same point as Nyquist and Tatar in his career, but the later two exceeded the expectations the team had for them, not the other way around.

I think the public criticism is well warranted. This isn't a boom or bust prospect that is faltering. It's a blue chip vastly underperforming. I hope it lights a fire under his butt for this summer and next year.

So, as someone who has seen his play in the minors this year, would you think he is just coasting around out there?

I have been to roughly half of the griffins games this year since my company has season tickets, and I wouldn't classify him as just coasting.

[kipwinger 8,524]

Apparently come outta left field with odd comments.

And help build championship teams...a lot. I think he qualifies as what Mike Babcock would call a "serial winner". Here's a quick rundown of his resume.

Devellano has been a part of 15 championship teams: 7 Stanley Cup wins with the Islanders (1980, 1981, 1982), and Red Wings (1997, 1998, 2002, 2008); 3 American Hockey League Calder Cup wins with the Adirondack Red Wings (1986, 1989, 1992); 2 Central Hockey League Adams Cup wins with the Fort Worth Texans (1978) and Indianapolis Checkers (1982); 1 East Coast Hockey League Riley Cup win with the Toledo Storm (1994); and 2 American League Championship wins with the Detroit Tigers (2006, 2012)

[Helmethead 235]

I recall when Jimmy D took over Wings GM after being isles assistant GM to Bill Torrey. One of the first things he said was "I have a 9 year plan". I wonder how that would go over today? Lol