• Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

Richdg

Fixing this mess....

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

Yes I understand there are parts of what follows that could be in about 5 different threads, but this is addressing all of the issues in one thread so bare with me here.

The first thing we all have to do is the easy part: identify the problems. There are several. We need to improve the D. Both defensively and offensively. But our biggest issue is our O. The problems with our O have been talked to death around here and elsewhere. lack of front of net guys, lack of guys working the corners, lack of guys working behind the net. lack of physical play. This year lack of shooting. The second half of the year G has been an issue. Howard was bad in January and lately Mrasek has not been sharpe-he might just be tired.

Now the harder part, fixing the problems. It is impossible to move/get rid of everyone that we should. In a cap world you can't just cut everyone that isn't performing. So this will take time. We have at least 2 more years of making changes ahead of us. I think most of us understand that we all just differ as to how we need to do it. Some want to tank and get the top 10 picks, others hope we can just keep patching holes and be better than everyone else at drafting. The former is a tough pill to swallow and the second is naive.

There are some players on this team that right or wrong are not going to get traded or cut. Z, Datsyuk, Abby, Kronwall and maybe Ericsson are here until they choose not to be or their contracts expire. There are some others we just will have to wait it out like Green.

So let's start with my thoughts.

1. We have a top line. Let Z-datsyuk-abby play together until retirement. They have alwasy been a good group and will continue to be, even though they are slowing down.

2. Second line starts with Larkin and Mantha. Find them a wing that can match their skill.

3. 3rd line should be Jurco-AA-Tangradi for next season. 2 young guys and a journeyman that does a few things well-like play in front of the net. Tangradi is here until Scvechnikov is ready in a year or 2.

4. The 4th line is made up of Sheahan and Glendening and whatever good skating checker we choose. be it from GR or sign a cheap UFA like Mike Martin to fill out the 3rd spot. Bring Miller back for one more year as the 13th forward.

5. Everyone else not listed above is allowed to walk as a UFA or becomes trade bait. There is only one hole left in the forward group. But we have guys like Nyquist, tatar, and Pulk that can be moved.

6. Plan on keeping 8 Dmen next year. My top pair would be DD and ????. The second pair would be Kronwall and Marchenko, with Ericsson and Green on the third pair. Oullett and Sproul are the 4th pair-otherwise we risk losing them via waivers. That leaves Smith as a tradable piece. 1 hole left to fill on the blueline.

7 G is Mrasek and find a new veteran backup. This means Howard can be moved.

By doing this we have 3/4 holes to fill: 2nd line winger, checking winger for the 4th line, top pair Dman,and backup G. But we have Nyquist, tatar, Pulk, Smith, and Howard as trade pieces. We would also have a large amount of cap space if those 5 are in fact moved if we decide to enter the UFA market.

Now the hard part. Filling the holes. We have to find dancing partners and more importantly we have to have a GM that looks and tries to make moves.

The very first move I would try to make is call the Jets and Islanders and put together a 3 way trade. Something along the lines of: Howard, tatar, and jensen to the Isles, they send Halak to us and hammonic to the Jets, and the Jets send Trouba to us. Halak becomes our vet G and Trouba gets paired with DD to develop as our top pair. That fills 2 of our 4 holes, the money washes out for everyone, and everyone gets a little better.

Now we can take Nyquist and Smith and try to work a deal for the second line winger to fill that hole. Our we can stand pat play Nyquist and move Smith for a pick. Same with Pulk.

This summer we then draft Gauthier and give him a year or 2 to get ready. After the 2016/17 season Scvechnikov replaces Tangradi who can then be traded. The following year Gauthier replaces Jurco.

Of course the big question is who replaces datsyuk in the summer of 2017?

Edited by Richdg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If we can get an elite goal scorer, a 1A d-man, and fix our PP, I think this team is fine. Nobody has the perfect team, its not 2002 anymore. I'm not denying that we have holes, but with all the kids we have coming up, and the talent we have on our roster, we are not as far off as some think.

If I am Holland, in the summer I am trying to sign Stamkos, make a trade for an elite d-man (this will be very hard), and i'm trying to dump some of our bigger contracts (not going to list them, we all know) that are not needed.

With that being said, if we cant do the first two idea's which likely we cannot do, we continue with the re-build.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If this team had any semblance of offense they would be comfortably in the playoffs. How bad is it? Shayne Gostisbehere a rookie dman from is only 4 goals and 4 pts off our team leaders while playing almost 20 games less than our top guys. This team has no goto scoring line. At this point Dats and Hank pretty much qualify as secondary scorers in this league and they are by far the best we got.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If we can get an elite goal scorer, a 1A d-man, and fix our PP, I think this team is fine. Nobody has the perfect team, its not 2002 anymore. I'm not denying that we have holes, but with all the kids we have coming up, and the talent we have on our roster, we are not as far off as some think.

If I am Holland, in the summer I am trying to sign Stamkos, make a trade for an elite d-man (this will be very hard), and i'm trying to dump some of our bigger contracts (not going to list them, we all know) that are not needed.

With that being said, if we cant do the first two idea's which likely we cannot do, we continue with the re-build.

Yandle may be available as UFA no?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If we can get an elite goal scorer, a 1A d-man, and fix our PP, I think this team is fine. Nobody has the perfect team, its not 2002 anymore. I'm not denying that we have holes, but with all the kids we have coming up, and the talent we have on our roster, we are not as far off as some think.

I think thats about half of what they need. They need an elite scorer and another consistant 2nd tier guy. A top dman would be great to the problem is for a team that wants to control the puck the other four dman are pretty bad. They cannot handle any semblance of a fore-check. The only time Detroit manages to get consistant pressure on teams this year seems to be when they are either ahead so much they sit back and let Detroit attack giving the dman all the time they want or they arent tough fore-checking teams. Adding a guy or two that can make a good pass under pressure is a major need.

Yandle may be available as UFA no?

If Holland makes a play at Stamkos no they can sign Yandle to.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If this team had any semblance of offense they would be comfortably in the playoffs. How bad is it? Shayne Gostisbehere a rookie dman from is only 4 goals and 4 pts off our team leaders while playing almost 20 games less than our top guys. This team has no goto scoring line. At this point Dats and Hank pretty much qualify as secondary scorers in this league and they are by far the best we got.

That is definitely a big part of the problem. I cant blame either of those two, as they have busted their butts for this team for years and are simply older and beat up. But they are no longer guys you can count on to get you a PPG for 82 games. Hopefully next year they can be our secondary scorers while some of our kids combined with a UFA signing can move up to the first line. That's a lot to ask of a Larkin at 20, but if this team could land a Stamkos (ya I know it wont happen) having Larkin, Stamoks, AA, Z, D, Abby in our top 6 is a top 6 I feel good about!

Yandle may be available as UFA no?

Ya he is. I would have to do the exact math to be sure, but if we could trade Howard, E, and possibly Green, with Richards and Quincy coming off the books we could make a play for Stamkos and Yandle. Stamkos is likely going to be around a 10mil cap hit, and Yandle 6/7ish....so we need to clear 17mil for those two. Howard and E alone 9 together, Green is 6, Quincey/RIchards are 7.

Edited by kliq

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't see how we land Stamkos anymore.

I wish we could but Toronto seems to have unloaded a ton of money ($20 million free I believe) and likely will give him a FORTUNE. We barely have cap space... :(

Edited by kickazz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't see how we land Stamkos anymore.

I wish we could but Toronto seems to have unloaded a ton of money ($20 million free I believe) and likely will give him a FORTUNE. We barely have cap space... :(

You're probably right, but if I am Holland my pitch to Stamkos is you are a 4 hour drive up the 401 and a 1hr plane ride away from your home town, and in Detroit you are playing with so much less pressure then if you play in Toronto.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't see how we land Stamkos anymore.

I wish we could but Toronto seems to have unloaded a ton of money ($20 million free I believe) and likely will give him a FORTUNE. We barely have cap space... :(

20 million free doesnt mean anything when they cant give him anymore than a max contract. Holland doesnt need to clear 20 mill to compete. He just needs to clear to max.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's what I mean.

We have a lot of RFA's to re-sign - they (Toronto) cleared space to max him out (speculation on my part) - we need to resign our own guys. I was keeping up with the math months ago but with all the playoff fiasco I've fallen off the cap radar.

But like kliq said we would have to trade away a bunch of guys and we could go all in.

I personally hope they would.

Howard, Green, Ericsson go bye bye and pitch for Yandle and Stamkos.

Only downside is we may have to retain at least Howard's salary.

Edited by kickazz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That's what I mean.

We have a lot of RFA's to re-sign - they (Toronto) cleared space to max him out (speculation on my part) - we need to resign our own guys. I was keeping up with the math months ago but with all the playoff fiasco I've fallen off the cap radar.

But like kliq said we would have to trade away a bunch of guys and we could go all in.

I personally hope they would.

Howard, Green, Ericsson go bye bye and pitch for Yandle and Stamkos.

Only downside is we may have to retain at least Howard's salary.

I dont think there is any way they move Green one year into his contract unless they already have Yandle signed. They will end up having to eat a bunch of Howards salary and if they do find a trade partner for Green they will likely have to eat some of his after his play this year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First fire Blashill. If an entire team falls off it's on the coach

Your second sentence is somewhat true. But our team has been in a major decline since March of last year. While Babcock was still coaching.

We were 5-8-2 in March last year and 3-2-1 in April. We went through a stretch of losing 6 out of 8 games in that period.

Maybe the obvious decline was another reason why Babcock booked it. Among other things.

OK, I'm naked.. now what?

Lol! Edited by kickazz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why would Stamkos want to come here? This team isn't close to a cup and won't be able to offer him max cap salarywise. The guy can make 13 plus mill a year in Toronto and even more with all the endorsement deals coming his way, in short he will be loaded with cash to decades to come. this contract is going to easily put the ones of Toews and Kopitar to shame .

The Green situation is funny, he was a cast off in Washington yet the Wings thought he would be good enough to take a massive chance on and offer him a 6 mill aav. He provides some offense but his defensive game leaves a lot to be desired. I like Yandle a lot but he is basically a better younger version of Green. The Wings need a guy who can provide offense AND doesn't need Danny D. to cover up for all his mistakes, that guy would have been Alex Pietrangelo but of course no offer sheet :( Looking back at it, one can really appreciate how awesome guys like Lids, Niedermayer and Pronger have been. Some of today's defenseman don't even deserve that tag because they are playing like forwards

I think people would be wise to lessen their July 1 expectations, save for Stamkos no elite guy is available. A team which needs a top goalscorer, a number one defenseman and an elite center isn't going to find that in one off season, some teams are looking for that longer than a decade that's how difficult it has become to fix that positions!

Obviously the most important one would be that elite defender but there is nobody which sucks for the Wings so that leaves the draft option as the only viable one because nobody is going to give one up if the package coming back isn't a ridiculous one. Hopefully Mantha can become a constant top 6 scoring winger, willing to use his size this at least would somehow fix one problem.

But finding an elite center will also have to be done via draft, because nobody is available. There is no quick fix for his mess. I mean when you are talking about the 2 most important positions I hockey and only have like 2 or 3 guys other teams might be interested in that's not a good sign.

Btw. firing Blashill who inherited a declining team, fixed with Patchworks would be a mistake. It's not his fault that people expected an almost seem less transition and put unrealistic expectations on Tatar and Nyquist. Maybe just maybe the anti Babcock crowd can now appreciate how good of a job this guy has done by just getting this team into the playoffs?

tldr: there are no quick fixes thanks to a thin UFA market and not enough high end talent to pull of the needed major trade. Which leaves the draft as the only option

Edited by frankgrimes

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My only worry on forward is when Dats leaves we'll have no dependable center unless Larkin and AA work their butts off in the off-season. Signing Stamkos would allow them to come into that role when they're ready.... Oh and of course the defense needs a total overhaul

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If we are being honest with ourselves we have 11 guys on next years roster that we either want or can't move: Larkin, Mantha, AA, DD and Mrasek are the wants while Z, Datsyuk, Abby, Kronwall, Eericsson, and Green are the guys that we can't do much about. Scvenhikov is a must hang onto guy but he needs some time in GR. Every other player on the roster, in GR, in Toledo, still overseas/in junior/college is possible trade bait.

Now there are players RUMORED to be available that I would hope we are talking about.

Here are some I would be after:

Nicheshkin 6-4/215 LH RW 21

Krieder 6-3/230 LH LW 25

Rychel 6-1/215 LH LW 22

Drouin 6-0/190 LH C

Fowler 6-1/205 LH D 24

Trouba 6-2/205 RH D 22

Hamonic 6-2/210 RH D 26

All are available and all should be pursued.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is Krieder a FA... He would be a great add

Still think the focus should be on defense. Pretty sure the Wings are done with Smith and Quincey. Nobody in GR looks like a top 4. Kronwall is broken

he is rfa and the rags have cap issues, which is why he might be available.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First fire Blashill. If an entire team falls off it's on the coach

So Kenny fires Blashill but retains his job? That would take some nerve.

I would love to acquire Kreider or Rychel and Trouba, but unfortunately I don't see any of those happening...

If you were a free agent, would you want to sign with this team? And keep in mind, we're not exactly known for dishing out money to free agents.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So Kenny fires Blashill but retains his job? That would take some nerve.

If you were a free agent, would you want to sign with this team? And keep in mind, we're not exactly known for dishing out money to free agents.

none are ufa's, all would require Holland to make trades.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now