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Will Tyler Bertuzzi Make the Team Out of Camp?

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15 hours ago, kickazz said:

Nielsen isn't a 3C. 

He's a 2C. Has always been a 2C. His entire career. If he's placed in the 3C position that would be the coaches decision not the GM. 

Nielsen isn't as good as he once was, and on a good team he probably would be a 3rd line center.

 

As far as trading Sheahan goes, it'll be a salary dump.  I'd rather move Glendening, personally, but I don't know if anyone would take him with his contract.  Sheahan at least only has one year left.

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26 minutes ago, DickieDunn said:

Nielsen isn't as good as he once was, and on a good team he probably would be a 3rd line center.

Had 54% faceoff percent (career high), 3rd highest goals on team, 4th in points.

Most power play points on the team.

Scored two short handed goals, also the most on the team.

How is this guy a 3C again? He played 2C under Tavares for years.

He's the next best center we have next to Zetterberg. 

Man ya'll just come up with the wildest theories. 

Edited by kickazz

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On 9/15/2017 at 10:48 AM, krsmith17 said:

I'm admitting that Jurco didn't turn out to what I expected now because it's only recently that it was clear. It's hard to deem a 22 year old that was misused by an organization a "bust". It turns out, at 24 he is a bust. I still think that's in large part to the way he was utilized but whatever.

I've never said that Jurco IS a top 6 winger, I either said he has the potential, or he will be, which again is an opinion. If you can't differentiate the difference between when someone is voicing an opinion and when they are stating fact, that's on you.

Nielsen has always been a 2C. But if he's being slotted as a 3C, what is he in that situation?

Stop bringing up the contract and trying to turn that around on me. You're the one that brought it up, saying it is too much to spend on a 3C, not me.

Nah bruh you always made it out to be that Jurco deserved top 6, deserved time with Datsyuk etc etc. That's a little more than just opinion. And when someone (like me) disagrees with you and gives you evidence why what you're saying isn't true you get pissy that we're dissing your opinion. Opinions can be wrong fyi. 

I never said anything about spending and relations to a and 3C, I made a snide remark directed at Blashill. I must add you also have a tendency to come up with narratives about what others post. Like you're fishing to start bitching about what I post because you don't like my argument style. Another example is making up that comment about how I supposedly said "just because Holland or Blashill are pros they can't be wrong", when in reality I've never said that. In fact, I've also gone as far as to criticise both of them multiple times. You should do yourself a favor and hit the ignore button if it bothers you that much. I will always disagree with "opinions" that are pushed as truth but can't be backed up with evidence. And just because you don't like that doesn't mean I won't disagree with yours. 

Your issue is you "like" peoples posts when they agree with you (you've liked plenty of my posts and you know that too) but as soon as they don't agree with your opinion and try to speak against it all of a sudden it's "annoying" and "you're a know it all". It's ironic that in 4 years of me being on this website, it has only become THIS annoying to you the first summer/offseason you've started disliking Holland. But when you were pro-Holland, it wasn't so bad now was it. Cmon bro, I've argued against anti-Holland crowed for years, and they too thought I was annoying, you're just a new fish in the bowl; on the other side. Say hello to your Holland hater friends for me. 

Edited by kickazz

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20 hours ago, kickazz said:

Had 54% faceoff percent (career high), 3rd highest goals on team, 4th in points.

Most power play points on the team.

Scored two short handed goals, also the most on the team.

How is this guy a 3C again? He played 2C under Tavares for years.

He's the next best center we have next to Zetterberg. 

Man ya'll just come up with the wildest theories. 

That doesn't mean he's a legit #2 center anymore.  Green was their best defenseman, that doesn't mean he's a #1.

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3 hours ago, DickieDunn said:

That doesn't mean he's a legit #2 center anymore.  Green was their best defenseman, that doesn't mean he's a #1.

He had better numbers with Islanders, comes to the Wings and drops. But he was still better than any other center we have besides Zetterberg. 

And Green was a 3rd pairing D-man in his last year in Washington. 

Edited by kickazz

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1 hour ago, kickazz said:

He had better numbers with Islanders, comes to the Wings and drops. But he was still better than any other center we have besides Zetterberg. 

And Green was a 3rd pairing D-man in his last year in Washington. 

And?

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I think sometimes people have too high of standards for what defines a #2 centerman. If we are being literal, it means you are a center who falls between the top 32-63 centers in the league. I think the reason why people have unrealistic standards is because they look at who the #2 centers are on elite teams, and sure if you are comparing a guy like Nielsen to Malkin, Kopitar, Kuznetsov etc. of course he doesn't appear at their level because he is not, but all those guys have the skill set of being a #1 center. 

Last year in total points Nielsen ranked 65th among centers with 41 points (1 point out of 63rd). What this tells me if we are just going from points is that Nielsen is a lower end #2 center, high end #3 center. Throw in the fact that he is a good two way player, and I would lean towards lower end #2 center.

With all that being said, do I think he is a great fit on this team given our roster......no. But that doesn't mean he isn't a #2 center.

http://www.nhl.com/stats/player?aggregate=0&gameType=2&report=skatersummary&pos=C&reportType=season&seasonFrom=20162017&seasonTo=20162017&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,1&sort=points,goals,assists

Edited by kliq

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We tried that argument with Kronwall as a top pairing defensman a few years ago.  Unfortunately a handful of people on LGW only think there are eight to ten number 1 defensman in the league.  I'm willing to bet there's also a handful of people who think there are only 10-15 top line centers and another 10-15 2nd line centers and everyone else is garbage. 

Edited by Echolalia

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On 9/15/2017 at 10:08 AM, Jonas Mahonas said:

Smith is a good player.  He's going to do well this year.  Jurco and Frk, I dunno.  Both heavily misused in our organization so far.  Svech and Chowdog will be great.  They are light-blue chippers.

Interesting term "light-blue chipper".   Actually it seems to be a great characterization, nicely done if you are the one who coined it.  Chowdog?   Lol, giving me Emdog flashbacks. Hopefully it doesn't mean Chowdog is going to be the d-man equivalent of Cory Emmerton. ;)

On 9/15/2017 at 2:51 PM, LeftWinger said:

Where's blueadams when you need him? He'd set everyone straight on the line combos!

That's getting to be ancient history, only the board vets are going to get that reference.   Hopefully JUCK F**KING POTT never fades.

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3 hours ago, Echolalia said:

We tried that argument with Kronwall as a top pairing defensman a few years ago.  Unfortunately a handful of people on LGW only think there are eight to ten number 1 defensman in the league.  I'm willing to bet there's also a handful of people who think there are only 10-15 top line centers and another 10-15 2nd line centers and everyone else is garbage. 

I'd personally put it as there are 8-10 truly elite at any position, and the rest of the #1 whatever are still damn good but never going to get the accolades as he top 8-10.  Having Lidstrom as your number one D-man for years is going to inevitably skew one's expectation of number one d-man since the guy is easily top 5 all-time (I would put him 1A and 1B with Bobby Orr personally).  For perspective, garbage in my book is Jason F'n Williams.

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On 9/15/2017 at 2:09 PM, Jonas Mahonas said:

Svechnikov - Svechnikov - Mantha

Tatar - Larkin - Zetterberg

Frk - Athanasiou - Nyquist

Glendening - Helm - Sheahan

Would love to get either Andei Svechnikov or Rasmus Dahlin. Here's to the tank.

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8 hours ago, TheXym said:

I'd personally put it as there are 8-10 truly elite at any position, and the rest of the #1 whatever are still damn good but never going to get the accolades as he top 8-10.  Having Lidstrom as your number one D-man for years is going to inevitably skew one's expectation of number one d-man since the guy is easily top 5 all-time (I would put him 1A and 1B with Bobby Orr personally).  For perspective, garbage in my book is Jason F'n Williams.

Pre-Torres or Post-Torres?

 

Getting back to Lil' Bert - he's definitely got the heart, but is that enough for him to hold down an NHL spot?  I like the fact that he became something extraordinary in the playoffs for the Griffs for sure.  How do we think that translates to a 4th liner?  What are the expectations?  How do we measure good production for him?

 

For my money - a positive plus minus, 5+ goals, 15+ points and some good ol' crashing and banging is all I would expect out of someone with his skill set for a rookie campaign.  Especially with his expected black hole of a center.

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On 15/09/2017 at 4:30 PM, kickazz said:

Nah bruh you always made it out to be that Jurco deserved top 6, deserved time with Datsyuk etc etc. That's a little more than just opinion. And when someone (like me) disagrees with you and gives you evidence why what you're saying isn't true you get pissy that we're dissing your opinion. Opinions can be wrong fyi. 

I never said anything about spending and relations to a and 3C, I made a snide remark directed at Blashill. I must add you also have a tendency to come up with narratives about what others post. Like you're fishing to start bitching about what I post because you don't like my argument style. Another example is making up that comment about how I supposedly said "just because Holland or Blashill are pros they can't be wrong", when in reality I've never said that. In fact, I've also gone as far as to criticise both of them multiple times. You should do yourself a favor and hit the ignore button if it bothers you that much. I will always disagree with "opinions" that are pushed as truth but can't be backed up with evidence. And just because you don't like that doesn't mean I won't disagree with yours. 

Your issue is you "like" peoples posts when they agree with you (you've liked plenty of my posts and you know that too) but as soon as they don't agree with your opinion and try to speak against it all of a sudden it's "annoying" and "you're a know it all". It's ironic that in 4 years of me being on this website, it has only become THIS annoying to you the first summer/offseason you've started disliking Holland. But when you were pro-Holland, it wasn't so bad now was it. Cmon bro, I've argued against anti-Holland crowed for years, and they too thought I was annoying, you're just a new fish in the bowl; on the other side. Say hello to your Holland hater friends for me. 

How is that a little more than an opinion? It's just that. An opinion... You can disagree all you want, and that's fine by me. Saying I think a player should be given an opportunity to play with a certain player is not wrong, no matter how much you may disagree. I think Jensen and Ouellet should be ahead of Kronwall and Ericsson. You may disagree, but that doesn't mean my opinion is wrong. You think Nielsen should play above Larkin. I disagree. Doesn't mean your opinion is wrong.

I "like" people's posts when they agree with me? Well no s***... I also "like" people's posts that I agree with. What a concept...

I find you "annoying" most of the time. I just choose to ignore it when it's not directed at me. You are a know-it-all, which is why you always say other people's "opinions" are wrong.

Yup, I was pro-Holland for a long time, and looking back on his career, I believe I had good reason to be. He's been making a lot of poor decisions lately "in my opinion", and I think he should be gone after this season.

The rest of your post is too ridiculous to respond to...

Anyway, yes I believe Bertuzzi should and will make the team out of camp.

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