The 91 of Ryans 3,014 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, krsmith17 said: Khan on trading Nyquist "The Red Wings have three young forwards up for contracts in 2021 (Anthony Mantha, Andreas Athanasiou, Tyler Bertuzzi) and need to make room for a few more in the next couple of seasons (Filip Zadina, Evgeny Svechnikov, Joe Veleno). They're not likely to have the roster spot or money to keep Nyquist." I know this makes LGWs Nation excited to hear, but I worry that this is just a hand-out from Holland via Khan, preparing the fan base for a crappy return. 4:00pm Feb 25, 2019. Ken Holland: Quote "Well, uhhhhhhh, you know, we have three young forwards up for contracts in 2021 (Anthony Mantha, Andreas Athanasiou, Tyler Bertuzzi) and need to make room for a few more in the next couple of seasons (Filip Zadina, Evgeny Svechnikov, Joe Veleno). We're not likely to have the roster spot or money to keep Nyquist. So we took what we could get from San Jose. What the market dictated. A 4th rounder and some In' N' Out coupons" edit: grammar Edited February 22, 2019 by The 91 of Ryans 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 5 minutes ago, krsmith17 said: Helm a healthy scratch? Not going to happen. I don't even think de la Rose would be a healthy scratch or Ehn would play in Grand Rapids in favor of the waiver exempt players, even if they do outplay them. Looking at that lineup, either Svechnikov will be a healthy scratch, or Zadina, Veleno or Rasmussen will be in Grand Rapids... I have no issue with young players having to "earn their ice time", I have an issue with veteran players NOT having to earn their ice time... Again, I have no issue with signing Nyquist. I have an issue signing Nyquist long-term to a big money contract. He's not going to accept anything short-term, and long-term doesn't work for us... in my opinion. My roster was temporary. Like I said, I look to make a trade with my F depth. That opens up at least one spot to move Svech off the 4th and Helm into the lineup. Would rather have the problem of too many guys at F, than have the issue of not having enough. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 5 minutes ago, Dabura said: I just keep coming back to the term question. If Nyquist is cool with two years? Cool, bring him back. Three years? Doesn't excite me, but I could maybe live with it. Anything longer than three years? Hard pass. He's going to be 30 soon and he's having a career year in a contract year, so 1) I don't trust that he isn't going to immediately revert to a 48-point player, and 2) he ought to be looking to get paid. I don't know that signing him necessarily sets us up for a cap crunch in the near future, but it's ~$5M that we don't really need to be giving him (imo) and ~$5M that we wouldn't be able to give to a younger player and/or a UFA target. I'd like to think we're entering that stage of the rebuild where every cap-related decision the GM makes is extremely important, and I'd like to think that with the younger forwards taking over, Holland understands that Nyquist (at ~$5M) is more a luxury than he is a necessity. Yes. Nyquist would be a luxury. But every contender has those, and trades for those at the TDL. Dont have to give up anything to get a Nyquist when u already have one. These are exactly the kinds of players you need to compete. Doesn't make sense to me for teams to trade away guys like that during a rebuild only to have to give up assets later on to acquire them again. If you know ur going to need them, and you have them now, why not just keep them if you can? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 10 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: I know this makes LGWs Nation excited to hear, but I worry that this is just a hand-out from Holland via Khan, preparing the fan base for a crappy return. 4:00pm Feb 25, 2019. Ken Holland: So we took what we could get from San Jose. What the market dictated. A 4th rounder and some In' N' Out coupons" Get the f*** outta here with that s***... Holland will get us a 1st round pick for Gus Gus... 4 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said: Yes. Nyquist would be a luxury. But every contender has those, and trades for those at the TDL. Dont have to give up anything to get a Nyquist when u already have one. These are exactly the kinds of players you need to compete. Nyquist isn't going to be the same player he is now, when we're ready to compete... 6 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said: Doesn't make sense to me for teams to trade away guys like that during a rebuild only to have to give up assets later on to acquire them again. If you know ur going to need them, and you have them now, why not just keep them if you can? We don't "need" Nyquist now. We need to better our draft position and acquire picks. Whatever we get in a Nyquist trade could be just as, or more valuable in 3 years time when we're ready to compete... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 3 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said: Yes. Nyquist would be a luxury. But every contender has those, and trades for those at the TDL. Dont have to give up anything to get a Nyquist when u already have one. These are exactly the kinds of players you need to compete. Doesn't make sense to me for teams to trade away guys like that during a rebuild only to have to give up assets later on to acquire them again. If you know ur going to need them, and you have them now, why not just keep them if you can? I think you're reaching a bit here. Right now we're trying to get a new core together. Once we complete that task (which, if we're being honest, probably happens at least two or three years from now, not in September of 2019), we can think about contending. Once we're thinking about contending, Nyquist has likely aged out of relevance and we can justify paying for someone who's better than Nyquist because we'll be looking to win a Cup and that's what contending teams do -- they give up futures for immediate gain. 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 I do think dependable veterans are good to have around in a rebuild. I just don't want to give this one the contract he's likely seeking. 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 22 minutes ago, Dabura said: I think you're reaching a bit here. Right now we're trying to get a new core together. Once we complete that task (which, if we're being honest, probably happens at least two or three years from now, not in September of 2019), we can think about contending. Once we're thinking about contending, Nyquist has likely aged out of relevance and we can justify paying for someone who's better than Nyquist because we'll be looking to win a Cup and that's what contending teams do -- they give up futures for immediate gain. No I get it. My point is that contenders trade for luxury guys like Nyquist to bolster their roster for a playoff run. I hate the idea of giving up picks/prospects 3 years down the road to bring in another Nyquist. Would rather already have the "luxury", and keep the 1st/2nd round pick. Basically what I am saying is that we wouldnt have had to give up a Jarnkrok, Janmark, or a 1st if a Legwand, Cole, or Quincey were already here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said: No I get it. My point is that contenders trade for luxury guys like Nyquist to bolster their roster for a playoff run. I hate the idea of giving up picks/prospects 3 years down the road to bring in another Nyquist. Would rather already have the "luxury", and keep the 1st/2nd round pick. Basically what I am saying is that we wouldnt have had to give up a Jarnkrok, Janmark, or a 1st if a Legwand, Cole, or Quincey were already here. I hear ya. I'm still sour about the Legwand and Quincey deals. >:( Personally, I think the mentality is "What we have is not enough. We need more." Regardless of what you have, there's always the possibility that you can make improvements. Even if we have Nyquist and he's on pace for a 65-point season as a 32-year-old and we're a legit Cup contender, we're probably looking for some scoring help. Maybe Nyquist becomes injury-prone over the next couple of seasons and we want some insurance just in case he gets injured in what we're hoping is a deep postseason run. I'd also add that if we put ourselves into Cup contention without Nyquist...then I'd be pretty happy with the decision to move on from Nyquist (it would show that he wasn't an essential piece) and I'd be ok with the possibility that we'd have to give up some futures to add [a Nyquist type guy]. Edited February 22, 2019 by Dabura Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kickazz 5,459 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said: No I get it. My point is that contenders trade for luxury guys like Nyquist to bolster their roster for a playoff run. I hate the idea of giving up picks/prospects 3 years down the road to bring in another Nyquist. Would rather already have the "luxury", and keep the 1st/2nd round pick. Basically what I am saying is that we wouldnt have had to give up a Jarnkrok, Janmark, or a 1st if a Legwand, Cole, or Quincey were already here. That’s hindsight bias. We gave them up because we didn’t have them and at that point in time we needed them. And we’ll need to reaquire them once we’re contending again. We can’t predict when we’re going to contend or if the picks we acquire will translate to anything. It could take 3 years or 10. Which is why you trade until something falls together. But hanging onto vets and assuming that it’s good to keep them since we’ll be ready for playoffs in a couple years is reaching. Leafs did that for years and never actually got anywhere for a decade. Edited February 22, 2019 by kickazz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,014 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 7 minutes ago, Dabura said: I'd love to see Columbus single-handedly crush the market. DON'T trade Bob or Panarin and add Duchene. This would open up a lot of doors for Holland on Monday. 2 Dabura and amato reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 3 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: I'd love to see Columbus single-handedly crush the market. DON'T trade Bob or Panarin and add Duchene. This would open up a lot of doors for Holland on Monday. Chaos! I crave chaos! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,014 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 BJs needed a center, badly. Now they don't have any major holes. If they keep Panarin and Bobrovsky, they might finally make some noise in the postseason. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nyqvististhefuture 1,002 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) So what can we get for Gus now? Columbus gave up a 5’9 forward and a 2nd round pick prospect doesn’t sound like much lol also conditional first if he resigns 1st,conditional 2nd and a prospect? 1st/2nd and fabbro And I’m good or 1st and samberg from jets ... guessing pens and habs will also makes moves now cause of cbj trade Jensen ufa top d available? Haven’t really heard any d names Edited February 22, 2019 by nyqvististhefuture Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,014 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 12 minutes ago, Dabura said: That's what I said! 17 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said: So what can we get for Gus now? Columbus gave up a 5’9 forward and a 2nd round pick prospect doesn’t sound like much lol also conditional first if he resigns 1st,conditional 2nd and a prospect? 1st/2nd and fabbro And I’m good or 1st and samberg from jets ... guessing pens and habs will also makes moves now cause of cbj trade Jensen ufa top d available? Haven’t really heard any d names Meh. Depends on what some other GM wants to place, as a pure gift, on Holland's doorstep while he golfs. That's how it goes right? 2 krsmith17 and Dabura reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 Just now, The 91 of Ryans said: That's what I said! That's because you're secretly Max Bultman! holy moly Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,014 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 4 minutes ago, Dabura said: Pretty good return for Ottawa. If they end up with two 1st rounders for Duchene, that would soften the blow of what it took to get him in the first place. Especially if the balls knock them out of the top 3. Duchene better not talk s*** about Torts in some Columbus Uber. Because Tortorella doesn't play 3 Dabura, krsmith17 and Rick D reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 1 amato reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nyqvististhefuture 1,002 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 21 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: That's what I said! Meh. Depends on what some other GM wants to place, as a pure gift, on Holland's doorstep while he golfs. That's how it goes right? Nice to see your Still being a dickhead Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,014 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 6 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said: Nice to see your Still being a dickhead I guess I just don't understand then. You think Holland should be able to get a 1st or a 2nd+good prospect for Nyquist, who is a UFA? But you have also said countless times that he was "lucky" to get a 1st + for Tatar who still had term. Basically McPhee just handed this stuff over to him. So, it stands to reason, that in order to get a 1st rounder for a player who is very comparable to Tatar (except a rental!) that some other GM will have to approach Holland with the same spirit of unsolicited generosity this Monday. Correct? This is all I said basically. You follow? Do I need to use emojis? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nyqvististhefuture 1,002 Report post Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: I guess I just don't understand then. You think Holland should be able to get a 1st or a 2nd+good prospect for Nyquist, who is a UFA? But you have also said countless times that he was "lucky" to get a 1st + for Tatar who still had term. Basically McPhee just handed this stuff over to him. So, it stands to reason, that in order to get a 1st rounder for a player who is very comparable to Tatar (except a rental!) that some other GM will have to approach Holland with the same spirit of unsolicited generosity this Monday. Correct? This is all I said basically. You follow? Do I need to use emojis? Here we go again , he was lucky in the sense it was vegas’s First year in the league and they wanted to make a splash and since they were doing so good and a deal they wanted to make fell through with time running out, i never said holland never specifically demanded for pieces .... but if you want to keep beating a dead horse keep on being a dickhead since that seems to be your thing on this board, suits you As for duchene since hes also a ufa like Nyquist although much better he should still fetch a good return Edited February 22, 2019 by nyqvististhefuture Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
