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13dangledangle

Member Since 22 Jun 2009
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#2186003 Wings unlikely to sign Osgood/Draper

Posted by Crymson on 16 June 2011 - 01:17 AM

great news! get lost, both of you.


Trololololol.

(Or, if you're not a troll, you're just a total ingrate).

Why commit to a backup who may not even play the full year, let alone put out a consistent performance for the team?


For Eva: Hudler #1; Osgood #2.


#2185998 Wings unlikely to sign Osgood/Draper

Posted by GoWings1905 on 16 June 2011 - 12:59 AM

Draper, Osgood possibly this year. Lidstrom hopefully not now, Holmstrom next year. All of the guys that have made this franchise what it is for two decades now are starting to go away. Not even bringing hockey into the equation, it is sad to see guys that have been a staple of this organization moving on.

It's all speculative still, but I just hope they ALL receive the proper appreciation when the time comes. Some of the short-sighted comments already are pathetic.


#2185990 Wings unlikely to sign Osgood/Draper

Posted by Doc Holliday on 16 June 2011 - 12:37 AM

I don't understand how that interview led to "unlikely to sign Osgood" in any fashion, except for the fact that St. James has always been part of the anti-Osgood crowd. The Wings don't have a goaltender in the system who is ready to take that step and take Osgood's job. However, Draper signing means he would be playing against Cory Emmerton, Drew Miller, Patrick Eaves, and Justin Abdelkader for a job. Which suggests that Holland's comment about 40 year-olds passing the torch was directed more at Draper than Osgood. I could be wrong. But given that Draper is a fourth line forward, and the Wings are working on re-signing forwards for the only two open spots on the roster - assuming everyone signed to a one-way deal makes the cut - that leaves Draper out. Osgood is as good as most backups and some starters, and the Wings won't be able to find an upgrade on him at anywhere near his cost. Howard is the starter, set in for long-term so they don't need to go hunting for a new guy there. A cheap vet backup or a prospect is what you'd see, and there's no options better than Osgood, unless his injury is so bad that it bothers him into next year; at which point he'll retire.


Why commit to a backup who may not even play the full year, let alone put out a consistent performance for the team?


#2185985 Wings unlikely to sign Osgood/Draper

Posted by eva unit zero on 16 June 2011 - 12:27 AM

I don't understand how that interview led to "unlikely to sign Osgood" in any fashion, except for the fact that St. James has always been part of the anti-Osgood crowd. The Wings don't have a goaltender in the system who is ready to take that step and take Osgood's job. However, Draper signing means he would be playing against Cory Emmerton, Drew Miller, Patrick Eaves, and Justin Abdelkader for a job. Which suggests that Holland's comment about 40 year-olds passing the torch was directed more at Draper than Osgood. I could be wrong. But given that Draper is a fourth line forward, and the Wings are working on re-signing forwards for the only two open spots on the roster - assuming everyone signed to a one-way deal makes the cut - that leaves Draper out. Osgood is as good as most backups and some starters, and the Wings won't be able to find an upgrade on him at anywhere near his cost. Howard is the starter, set in for long-term so they don't need to go hunting for a new guy there. A cheap vet backup or a prospect is what you'd see, and there's no options better than Osgood, unless his injury is so bad that it bothers him into next year; at which point he'll retire.


#2185983 Wings unlikely to sign Osgood/Draper

Posted by stinky fish taco on 16 June 2011 - 12:27 AM

all the negs in the world won't change the fact that both of these players not returning is GREAT news for the detroit red wings!

neg away, folks!


#2185974 Wings unlikely to sign Osgood/Draper

Posted by stinky fish taco on 16 June 2011 - 12:14 AM

True fandom, right here.

only delusional homers want osgood back.

get a clue.


#2185970 Wings unlikely to sign Osgood/Draper

Posted by stinky fish taco on 16 June 2011 - 12:12 AM

great news! get lost, both of you.


#2184844 10, no 8 - oops - 9 Years Ago today...

Posted by Doc Holliday on 13 June 2011 - 11:47 AM

How many times can the thread title be wrong?

Come on, people. 9 years ago. Not 10. Not 8. 9.


#2184720 Changes in the offseason

Posted by Datsyerberger on 12 June 2011 - 01:31 PM

HAHAHAHAHA F*CKIN HILARIOUS....

God Damn Trolls have nothing good to say about any ideas....

--Reply to hockey23--

-Yes Tim Connolly has only played in 70 games one time since the lockout but you failed to mention that he has 250 points in 302 games since the lockout (0.828 points per game). Which isn't bad playing on a team like the Sabres. He was also playing on the top line for the majority of his time in Buffalo and you can argue that his points per game won't be as high playing on our third line but he also won't be playing against top players in the league all the time. He can easily put up 40-50 points, that along with the fact that he's a right-handed centerman that we desperately need I think he's well worth $4.5m.
Let's look at a comparable cap hit on our team shall we... Johan Franzen's cap hit is $500k less ($3,954,545) but his salary for the 2011-12 season is $750k more ($5,250,000)... Seems how you're so fascinated with passed numbers, since the lockout Franzen has played in 395 games and put up 219 points (0.554), (significantly lower than Connolly wouldn't you say?) and yes his point totals are getting higher, but his injuries are becoming more frequent meaning, like Connolly neither are expected to play a full 82 games...

-Honestly, I don't really care who is or isn't a fan of Zherdev, the guy would put up big numbers on a line with Datsyuk and that's all I care about. Can you or anyone honestly say you were a huge fan of Hossa? I doubt it, he's an offensively gifted player like Zherdev and before he came here he lacked on the defensive side of the game like Zherdev. He was put on a line with Datsyuk for the better part of the year and he flourished in his role and began to quickly learn defense playing alongside the best defensive forward in the world...

-I'd love to know how you are so confident we would not be able to sign Wisniewski for $3.75m? Because no players have come here or any other team for discounts at a real chance to win the cup... Not to mention it being his home state, so he was more than like a Wings fan growing up. And remember, I did have $2.8m in left over cap so if he wanted $4-4.25m I say we still go for it, he's a good defenseman with a lot of upside...

-A Babchuk-Ericsson pairing would cause every LGW'er to gouge their eyes out within the first month of the season. Hahaha I'd love to hear the explanation of this one... let me guess... another Ericsson hater... Both are young guys (27 years old) so they're bound to make mistakes, but they both also have a lot of upside... So if it doesn't work out split them up, there are countless ways to pair the 7 defenseman...

Keep complaining about everything fella's, I'd hate to have your negativity... I feel for you, I really do... actually not all that much.....


Uhhh. Okay, I personally agree with you about Connolly. I like Connolly. However, I'd rather us a (scoring) winger than a (playmaking) center. We have the latter in droves; the former, not so much. I think a team who needs a good center more will be more willing to pay Connolly. I wouldn't mind taking him for the right price... however, aforementioned needy teams will likely pay him more.

Now to the bolded: lololololol no, not even close. Many people here were fans of Hossa beforehand, self included. And he was certainly not a defensive bum before he came here. Hossa was recognized as one of the best backchecking wingers in the league and had a solid record of Selke votes before ever coming to the Wings. On top of that, he's far more offensively skilled and consistent than Zherdev, and a much harder worker. Zherdev has major attitude and commitment issues. They're very different... I suggest you do more research.

We won't get Wiz for 3.75. Actually, at this point I don't think we'll get him at all; last I read Montreal was rumored to be focusing on re-signing him and Markov. In any case, if he goes FA he'll get more than that and I'm not sure I'd want him anyhow (good offense, but he's got a lot of baggage). But even with baggage, if there's one thing that GMs pay for consistently, it's offense, particularly offense from the blueline. He'll get more than he probably should. Also, just because he's from Michigan doesn't mean he likes it and wants to come back. I'm from Florida and haven't missed a day apart from it. Not everyone likes where they come from.

A Babchuk and Ericsson pairing WOULD cause everyone to gauge their eyes out. I'm all for bringing Babchuk in for the right price and I don't mind Ericsson, either. However, aside from them both preferring the right side of the ice (afaik), a pairing of those two would be brutal. Kronwall - Babchuk, Lidstrom - Ericsson, Stuart - Kindl? That's better.

In regards to negativity.. well, personally, I'd rather be realistic and be happy when my expectations are exceeded than be foolishly optimistic and face likely disappointment.


#2184719 Changes in the offseason

Posted by krsmith17 on 12 June 2011 - 01:11 PM

HAHAHAHAHA F*CKIN HILARIOUS....

God Damn Trolls have nothing good to say about any ideas....

--Reply to hockey23--

-Yes Tim Connolly has only played in 70 games one time since the lockout but you failed to mention that he has 250 points in 302 games since the lockout (0.828 points per game). Which isn't bad playing on a team like the Sabres. He was also playing on the top line for the majority of his time in Buffalo and you can argue that his points per game won't be as high playing on our third line but he also won't be playing against top players in the league all the time. He can easily put up 40-50 points, that along with the fact that he's a right-handed centerman that we desperately need I think he's well worth $4.5m.
Let's look at a comparable cap hit on our team shall we... Johan Franzen's cap hit is $500k less ($3,954,545) but his salary for the 2011-12 season is $750k more ($5,250,000)... Seems how you're so fascinated with passed numbers, since the lockout Franzen has played in 395 games and put up 219 points (0.554), (significantly lower than Connolly wouldn't you say?) and yes his point totals are getting higher, but his injuries are becoming more frequent meaning, like Connolly neither are expected to play a full 82 games...

-Honestly, I don't really care who is or isn't a fan of Zherdev, the guy would put up big numbers on a line with Datsyuk and that's all I care about. Can you or anyone honestly say you were a huge fan of Hossa? I doubt it, he's an offensively gifted player like Zherdev and before he came here he lacked on the defensive side of the game like Zherdev. He was put on a line with Datsyuk for the better part of the year and he flourished in his role and began to quickly learn defense playing alongside the best defensive forward in the world...

-I'd love to know how you are so confident we would not be able to sign Wisniewski for $3.75m? Because no players have come here or any other team for discounts at a real chance to win the cup... Not to mention it being his home state, so he was more than like a Wings fan growing up. And remember, I did have $2.8m in left over cap so if he wanted $4-4.25m I say we still go for it, he's a good defenseman with a lot of upside...

-A Babchuk-Ericsson pairing would cause every LGW'er to gouge their eyes out within the first month of the season. Hahaha I'd love to hear the explanation of this one... let me guess... another Ericsson hater... Both are young guys (27 years old) so they're bound to make mistakes, but they both also have a lot of upside... So if it doesn't work out split them up, there are countless ways to pair the 7 defenseman...

Keep complaining about everything fella's, I'd hate to have your negativity... I feel for you, I really do... actually not all that much.....


#2184704 Changes in the offseason

Posted by krsmith17 on 12 June 2011 - 10:45 AM

I know a lot of people are going to hate some of these signings but they all make sense to me, and right now I am Ken Holland so this is what the team would look like next season. Feel free to bash any of my moves but quite frankly I don't care what all the know-it-all, wanna-be GM's think, just throwing some ideas out there...

My main goal was to find some solid right-handed shots to add to the line-up. I think it really hurts us having a team 95% left-handed shots, especially on the powerplay and in the faceoff circle...

So let's get to it....

Up front I started out with Draper and Modano retiring. Then I resigned Eaves to a reasonable $850k ($100k raise), let Miller walk and traded Hudler for a prospect and a late round 2011 draft pick.

First, to replace Hudler I signed Nikolai Zherdev to one-year $1.75m, a slight pay-cut due to the fact that he is running out of options in the NHL, but I am willing to take a gamble on him. Also, knowing he would start the season playing alongside Datsyuk helped lure him here. I know a lot of people are sceptical about this signing just because of his lack of defensive ability, but let's be honest, was Hudler that much of a better defensive forward, hell no. And with Zherdev's offensive upside I'd take him in a heart beat, so I did. Put him on a line with Datsyuk and Filppula (two of the three most defensively aware forwards on the team) and not only would it make up for his lack of defense but it would help his defensive game watching these two guys working their asses off at both ends of the ice. Zherdev is more than capable of putting up 50-60 points on the top line with Pav and Fil.
Then I went out and signed Tim Connolly to a three-year $4.5m per, to fill the void of a right-handed centerman we desperately need. I don't think it would be too much to think Connolly could put up 40-50 points in a third line role with Bert and Cleary.

So my Forward Lines look something like this...

FORWARDS

Valtteri Filppula ($3.000m) / Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / Nikolai Zherdev ($1.750m)
Tomas Holmstrom ($1.875m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) / Johan Franzen ($3.954m)
Daniel Cleary ($2.800m) / Tim Connolly ($4.500m) / Todd Bertuzzi ($1.937m)
Justin Abdelkader ($0.787m) / Darren Helm ($0.912m) / Patrick Eaves ($0.850m)
Jan Mursak ($0.550m) / Cory Emmerton ($0.533m)

I think they're solid looking lines with a lot of chemistry and depth... Mursak and Emmerton would be our first call-ups and could possibly be inserted into some sort of rotation involving Abdelkader, Eaves and possibly Holmstrom... If Holmstrom were the odd man out I would have Cleary up in his slot with Hank and Mule, bump Abby up with Connolly and Bert and Mursak with Helm and Eaves, another solid option in my opinion...


On the back end I started out with Rafalski retiring, letting Salei walk, Lidstrom resigning a possible final one-year $6m contract, and Ericsson resigning at a reasonable three-year $2.2m per contract.

Then I went out looking for two solid right-handed shots, one that could chip in offensively and help out on the power-play (replacement for Rafalski), and the other to give us a little more depth and help out on the penalty kill (replacement for Salei). So I signed James Wisniewski to a four-year $3.75m contract and Anton Babchuk to a one-year $1.8m contract, two perfect replacements to help out our team and give us a little more balance and depth on the back end. No, I don't think Wisniewski is going to completely fill the loss of Rafalski, but he can definitely help us out. He's not going to make that first breakout pass like Rafi could and there's not too many in the league that can but he brings just as much to the table in my opinion. He's a slight upgrade in size but much harder on the puck and can clear the front of the net as good as anyone and is not afraid to drop the gloves. Not to mention he can put up pretty reasonable numbers, he's not a quarterback on the power-play but can defintely help out if paired with Lidstrom which I would do for the first PP unit. As for Babchuk, I think he is an upgrade to Salei and would pair great with Ericsson. Babchuk is not quite the same stay at home style defenseman as Salei, he is a little more mobile and has a decent shot from the point.

So my Defense Lines look something like this...

DEFENSEMEN

Nicklas Lidstrom ($6.000m) / Niklas Kronwall ($3.000m)
Brad Stuart ($3.750m) / James Wisniewski ($3.750m)
Jonathan Ericsson ($2.200m) / Anton Babchuk ($1.800m)
Jakub Kindl ($0.883m)

Like the forwards, my main goal was to pair guys that I think would complement each others style of play, would mesh well together, as well as looking for balance in the pairings.


When looking at the goalie situation, first Ozzie retires and I let Joey MacDonald walk. Now I'm looking for a decent goaltender for a reasonable price that can play 25 - 35 games when called upon. So I signed Brian Boucher to one-year $850k. Boucher is a decent back-up goaltender that can play well behind another solid goalie, he had a decent season last year but struggled in the playoffs when he was the number one guy. I think the pressure got to him a little but as long as Jimmy can stay healthy and on top of his game I think Boucher is very competent to play a solid 25+ games for us.

So the goalies look like this...

GOALTENDERS

Jimmy Howard ($2.250m) / Brian Boucher ($0.825m)


CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $63,500,000; CAP PAYROLL: $60,692,044; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $2,807,956

I think this team is capable of not only making the playoffs but as long as we're relatively healthy we can win it all in 2012. We still have a little flexibility with $2.8m in cap space to make a move at the trade deadline if necessary.




#2184522 Changes in the offseason

Posted by Majsheppard on 11 June 2011 - 03:38 AM

Those days are gone. Holland was one, if not the first, to use long contracts for a salary cap benefit. Now since New Jersey, Philly and Chicago ruined it by going to extremes, long term contracts are less attractive. I bet we'll see fewer long term contracts this season.


I disagree. It depends only on how the player turns out. If anything it seems more attractive when you can bounce the player to the AHL.

Look at what even a six year deal has done for Pavel. Made him a steal at his current salary due to inflation. Same goes for Zetter. I remember the same being said for Kronners contract. Franzen might be the illustration of how it didn't work if he remains inconsistent, but it is still a good deal as of right now. Rafalski himself looked like a bad signing in terms of being expensive, but good in terms of talent. In a few years it was a friggin steal. If he signed a deal and became UFA when Campbell did... Could you imagine us signing him back for 8 million?!?!

It has worked out for many teams, and there are just as many teams where it was a huge bust.

Most of them have circumvented this problem or dealt with it. It comes down to how the player turns out, which is how any contract really works. It seems pretty clear that overpaying is a problem that becomes less noticeable over time. I would like to see more of the clear cut bluechips signed to age 37. I know if Helm wants that term for somewhere around 2-2.75 Million, I would take it in a heartbeat. It will eventually be a steal.


#2184517 Changes in the offseason

Posted by CaliWingsNut on 11 June 2011 - 02:47 AM

I want these super long term deals to end. We're getting kinda screwed by Rafalski and I really am worried what would happen if Dats/Z/or Franzen ever got injured. Also we need some speed and youth on the back end. Lidstrom retiring is really going to suck for this organization and we have to start developing/sign replacements for him


Those days are gone. Holland was one, if not the first, to use long contracts for a salary cap benefit. Now since New Jersey, Philly and Chicago ruined it by going to extremes, long term contracts are less attractive. I bet we'll see fewer long term contracts this season.


#2184298 Wojtek Wolski

Posted by stevkrause on 10 June 2011 - 08:12 AM

I'll pass. When a player is too lazy to even make it on the Rangers, there's usually a bigger problem there.

He has tons of talent, but unless he comes REAL cheap, there are better options, including the ones already on our team. I would rather him than Hudler, though. But not necessarily at that price.

Rangers seem to be buying a lot of players out by the rumors. Who is next?

Look what he's had to deal with and the crap teams he's been on... as I said in my original post, all the kid needs is some consistency and leadership around him and I think the Red Wings organization is exactly that... I think the kid would explode here...

Also, I question how much you've watched him play if you think he's lazy... if anything, his scoring consistency is the only thing in question, never his effort...


#2184096 Changes in the offseason

Posted by eva unit zero on 09 June 2011 - 01:06 PM

Remember how astonishingly awful the Hudler-Modano-Cleary third line was? I'm not sure a Hudler-Drury-Cleary line would be any kind of improvement.


The problems with the Hudler/Modano/Cleary line were as follows:

1) All three players had terrible starts to the season; the fact they were all on a line together only magnified this.

2) The Hudler/Modano combination working was extremely unlikely. Modano's offensive style was to take the puck on a rush and get off a quick shot, and possibly a second shot, which didn't work while with Hudler's average speed. Hudler worked best on long-term puck possession in the zone setting up a high-quality shot, which is something that didn't work well with Modano's tendency to take a shot whenever he had a clear line. Cleary, meanwhile, was having serious trouble handling the puck (I think he may have been injured) and this led to complete ineffectiveness from that line. Hudler and Cleary were very effective together when together with any other center. Drury is much more similar to the team's current centers in offensive style than Modano, so the chances of that line working well would be much greater. Especially with Hudler and Cleary likely to have better starts to their seasons.