Flyers acquire, sign Hartnell/Timonen

[Guest Agalloch]

RedFX must have a bad/selective memory.

[FinRedWing 172]

We also signed over a couple of promising euro players. Setzinger probably has a good shot at making the team. Plus Peverly and Leahy who filled in some last season.

On defense. we still have...

Weber - Suter

Hamhuis - Zidlicky

Zanon will probably be re-signed. We've got Nolan Yonkman and Alex Henry who are NHL ready in milawaukee or we could bring up younger guys like Kevin Klein or Cody Franson.

and of course. Vokoun and Mason in net.

all of that without signing a single free agent other than our own 4th line guys.

Preds already signed Niskala,right? He could be your new Timonen,he's got great stats for a defenseman.

I guess I'm a little fuzzy on how all this works.

The trade deadline for the 2007 season has obviously passed, so I thought they technically could not be traded or signed in any capacity until July 1, when they became UFAs.

after the season ends, is the market back open for trades?

this fxing sucks!!!!!! What a bullshzt rule.

Let's trade the rights to Lang, maybe we can get a 6th rounder out of it.

Get it done Kenny!

$6.3m for Timonen? Jesus. Hopefully this doesn't put too many dollar signs floating around in Schneider's head...

He was actually 0.9m cheaper than Eklund the Great thought.

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

Someone tell me one specific time when Hartnell cheap-shotted someone.

Haha just ONE?

Okay. How bout the time he took out Fischer with the knee and tore his ACL? Or the year before that when he did the exact same to Chelios. Or wait there is more! How bout how he purposely rammed into Legace which caused him to be knocked out for a few seconds with a neck problem, and put onto a stretcher and taken to the hospital? And right after when Cujo came to fill in Hartnell rammed into him as well. That's lovely Scotty for ya.

And that is just what he's done against the Wings in the past few years.

Edited June 19, 2007 by HockeyCrazy3033

[Kp-Wings 3]

You guys are all a bunch of babies when it comes to Hartnell.

It's so funny hearing everyone on here ramble on like "HE SHOULD NEVAR WEAR A WING JERSEY THE CHEAP BASTARD!!!!!!!!!!!1" and all this stuff about how the Wings have never had dirty players before, so why start now. That's bulls***. Ulf Samulesson was the dirtiest player in the league when he was still playing (yes, as a matter of fact, I do consider on the level of Turtle). Jamie Macoun? Remember him? Slashed Pat LaFontaine in the face in his first season in Buffalo, in which LaFontaine only played 9 games. Or should I bring up Fischer's cross-check on Tommy Westlund in the 2002 playoffs?

Everyone would act like it's a first time in history for a dirty player on the Wings if we got Hartnell. Well, it wouldn't be. Stop being so blind to that just because you don't like him.

Edited June 19, 2007 by Kp-Wings

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

You guys are all a bunch of babies when it comes to Hartnell.

It's so funny hearing everyone on here ramble on like "HE SHOULD NEVAR WEAR A WING JERSEY THE CHEAP BASTARD!!!!!!!!!!!1" and all this stuff about how the Wings have never had dirty players before, so why start now. That's bulls***. Ulf Samulesson was the dirtiest player in the league when he was still playing (yes, as a matter of fact, I do consider on the level of Turtle). Jamie Macoun? Remember him? Slashed Pat LaFontaine in the face in his first season in Buffalo, in which LaFontaine only played 9 games. Or should I bring up Fischer's cross-check on Tommy Westlund in the 2002 playoffs?

Everyone would act like it's a first time in history for a dirty player on the Wings if we got Hartnell. Well, it wouldn't be. Stop being so blind to that just because you don't like him.

Jamie MaCoun? Jeez, could you dig any further back into the past for a name. Did you know that Scott Niedermayer slashed Peter Worrell over the head with his stick and he was suspended for it. Oh yeah, a one-time incident makes you a dirty player. Damn that dirty Jamie Macoun and his dirty mustache. Dude, you're reaching.

Ulf Samuelsson I give you. Definitely had the rep. Of course that too was like a trillion years ago.

Thankfully we're talking about TODAY. And yes, the Wings cannot claim to be squeaky clean since their inception. However, they have been the cleanest, most un-dirty team in the league for about 10 years. PS: Fischer's cross check wasn't typical of Jiri's style of play. It was the playoffs and he got careless with his stick behind the net and got the guy up high. Hardly enough to equate him as a dirty player. Am I missing something?

People may hate Hartnell, I don't particularly, I think he'd be a welcome addition to our team b/c of our lack of "nasty" and frankly, I don't like being squeaky clean. However, people hating Hartnell doesn't change the fact that he, along with Tootoo are two of the most notoriously dirty players currently playing in the league right now. Hartnell is probably the most nefarious goalie crusher in the league. The guy refuses to stop and basically runs over a goalie weekly. People don't hate Hartnell b/c it gets their jollys going or b/c they don't like his haircut. People hate Hartnell b/c he's a dirty SOB.

What exactly makes people "babies" about not liking the guy? If he signed with the Wings i'd love it but I wouln't turn a blind eye to the FACT that the guy is a complete ****** bag.

Article in the Tennessean claims that Liepold is in effect the owner through the free agency period b/c the league will not have reviewed the sale by then and could undo the deal which would leave Leipold on the hook for any contracts. In effect, he'd still own the team that he claims has lost him 27 million over the past 2 years. In short, the article claims it'll be near impossible for the Preds to likely resign Kariya, Forsberg, Smithson, Vishnevski, Nichol, and even harder to pick up quality UFA's. They're toast.

Edited June 19, 2007 by GordieSid&Ted

[Legionnaire11 0]

IMO, b/c you have Vokoun the Preds will still be a solid team. However, they will have to learn to play a bit differently. Timonnen's presence and Hartnell's production are gone and not likely to be replaced by unknown Euro's, young prospects and guys like Peverly and Henry. If you think so then more power to you but sorry, minor leaguers and unproven rookies aren't Timonnen and Hartnell. You just lost 2 key cogs to your team. You don't replace that with rookies.

They should be more like the preds team from 03/04 that met the Wings in the first round. We're definitely not competing for the presidents trophy next season. But the 6th-8th spot in the playoffs is still very realistic. When the lockout ended, we came out as an all offense, wide up skating team and despite the regular season success, it was never a great system. Next season we'll have more grit and get back to the hard working, blue collar predators hockey that defined the first 5 seasons. Only difference is that this team is much better than those early expansion years.

on a side note, I believe this leaves Vokoun as the last of the original predators unless you want to count Legwand in there since he was the first pick and did play one game in the first season.

Article in the Tennessean claims that Liepold is in effect the owner through the free agency period b/c the league will not have reviewed the sale by then and could undo the deal which would leave Leipold on the hook for any contracts. In effect, he'd still own the team that he claims has lost him 27 million over the past 2 years. In short, the article claims it'll be near impossible for the Preds to likely resign Kariya, Forsberg, Smithson, Vishnevski, Nichol, and even harder to pick up quality UFA's. They're toast.

Forsberg was gone anyway.

Kariya, it's hard to tell. They're going to talk to him, if he wants to come back then I think they get it done. He's always been a hard guy to read though. I have a feeling all the uncertainty will drive him away though.

Vishnevski wasn't coming back because he never got on the ice, and many Preds fans wanted to rip Trotz a new one for that. Even David Poile apologized to VItaly in front of the team saying that when he made the trade, he thought he would get more playing time.

Nichol wasn't coming back because he's a moron. He is a dirtier player than Hartnell and Tootoo. If he were re-signed, the coaches would scratch him every game.

But Smithson I think is definitely coming back. He'll sign for less than $1M, and he's a great penalty killer. I don't think he'd get much attention from anywhere else.

As for bringing in quality UFA's, we weren't really going to be in the mix anyway. The gameplan for this summer was to get bigger and grittier on the third and fourth lines. I think we'll get 2-3 guys on the cheap to fill that need, and maybe a big veteran d-man for the third pairing.

[eva unit zero 271]

Exactly! Chelios was 1 of those guys not more than 10 years ago...I vividly recall a game which I was @ in the old Chicago Stadium; Cheli ran @ Feds - knocked him hard up against the pexi-glass, & added a few punches to the back of his helmet for good measure. Gallant was on top of Chelios soon after; needless to say Gerard Gallant was not afraid to drop the mitts when needed...This happened once again a few weeks later, but only Stevie was the victim of Cheli's wrath; once again it was Gallant whom went after Cheli

Point being how everyone in Detroit loathed Chelios for 1 reason or another; now we love the guy...Yeah Hartnell is a ****** bag, but a ****** bag I'd like to have on the Wings.

Not more than 10 season ago+Gerard Gallant=contradiction. Gallant's last season in Detroit was 1992-93, and he retired after one season with Tampa Bay.

[Kp-Wings 3]

Jamie MaCoun? Jeez, could you dig any further back into the past for a name. Did you know that Scott Niedermayer slashed Peter Worrell over the head with his stick and he was suspended for it. Oh yeah, a one-time incident makes you a dirty player. Damn that dirty Jamie Macoun and his dirty mustache. Dude, you're reaching.

Ulf Samuelsson I give you. Definitely had the rep. Of course that too was like a trillion years ago.

Thankfully we're talking about TODAY. And yes, the Wings cannot claim to be squeaky clean since their inception. However, they have been the cleanest, most un-dirty team in the league for about 10 years. PS: Fischer's cross check wasn't typical of Jiri's style of play. It was the playoffs and he got careless with his stick behind the net and got the guy up high. Hardly enough to equate him as a dirty player. Am I missing something?

People may hate Hartnell, I don't particularly, I think he'd be a welcome addition to our team b/c of our lack of "nasty" and frankly, I don't like being squeaky clean. However, people hating Hartnell doesn't change the fact that he, along with Tootoo are two of the most notoriously dirty players currently playing in the league right now. Hartnell is probably the most nefarious goalie crusher in the league. The guy refuses to stop and basically runs over a goalie weekly. People don't hate Hartnell b/c it gets their jollys going or b/c they don't like his haircut. People hate Hartnell b/c he's a dirty SOB.

What exactly makes people "babies" about not liking the guy? If he signed with the Wings i'd love it but I wouln't turn a blind eye to the FACT that the guy is a complete ****** bag.

Article in the Tennessean claims that Liepold is in effect the owner through the free agency period b/c the league will not have reviewed the sale by then and could undo the deal which would leave Leipold on the hook for any contracts. In effect, he'd still own the team that he claims has lost him 27 million over the past 2 years. In short, the article claims it'll be near impossible for the Preds to likely resign Kariya, Forsberg, Smithson, Vishnevski, Nichol, and even harder to pick up quality UFA's. They're toast.

My point that I'm trying to prove here is that the Wings most certainly have had dirty players on this team before. Everyone thinks they haven't.

It's not just because they don't like him is what makes me mad. It's saying that he would totally ruin the team if he was brought here. They all act like Holland would be signing Satan on the team. (and no, I don't mean the guy who plays for the Islanders either)

I know Hartnell is a douchbag, but he is somebody that the Wings could use. Quite frankly, I'm sick of everyone going off on this whole "classy" thing, acting like the Wings have never in their franchise history carried a dirty player. It's just annoying. I don't give a two-s***s if the guy is dirty. If he can help us win a Cup, then who the f*** cares? Just because we didn't do it with a team full of Chinese Sages makes it not count or something? Apparently here it does, which is why everyone is still screaming over Anaheim winning.

The point that I'm trying to make is this: People shouldn't deny the fact that Hartnell would help this team very much, even if they do hate him. He may be a dirty SOB, but the man still scored 22 goals while playing on the 3rd line with a bunch of nobody's. Saying that he wouldn't help this team is just ridiculous, dirty player or not.

edited for grammar

Edited June 19, 2007 by Kp-Wings

[OsGOD 3]

Ahoy, excellent... Thank you for not pullin' the trigger on harnell Kenny, gar! This is the best news e'er. Now go out and Sign Robbie "rotten" Langer, gar!

Haha just ONE?

Okay. How bout the time he took out Fischer with the knee and tore his ACL? Or the year before that when he did the exact same to Chelios. Or wait there is more! How bout how he purposely rammed into Legace which caused him to be knocked out for a few seconds with a neck problem, and put onto a stretcher and taken to the hospital? And right after when Cujo came to fill in Hartnell rammed into him as well. That's lovely Scotty for ya.

And that is just what he's done against the Wings in the past few years.

Aye, i remember him slewfootin' feds causin' an injury... Maybe it was nah hartnell but the name just sticks like it was him.

[Opie 308]

Dude not to harp on you about your math skills but 91 was well more than 10 years ago!!

[Opie 308]

No some folks just need legibly written posts. Punctuation does matter, three periods in a row is used in continuation of a thought, not the end of a thought, that is what the single period is for.

Using ... is like using KEWL, what good does it do you, I understand using things like BTW, because that serves a function you have to type less.

Well at least I am not the only one with lead in my water, because others were confused by that too.

Either way yes i agree, guys like Chelios and Holmstrom are guys you hate until they are on your team, same with Maltby and others. I agree, the difference is that Homer has always been a wing, and Chelios is an automatic HOF, I am not even sure the need a voting process for him. Hartnell on the other hand would have needed to join the team before he wuold have been accepted, but I guarentee you the first time he knocked an Avalanche or Duck helmet off of a guys head he would have become the fan fav.

BTW I would have like to have Hartnell, just to strike fear into the hearts of the enemies.

So any of you think Pronger would have tried that crap on homer if he knew Hartnell was skating around waiting for a reason to cheap shot someone?

[OsGOD 3]

No some folks just need legibly written posts. Punctuation does matter, three periods in a row is used in continuation of a thought, not the end of a thought, that is what the single period is for.

Using ... is like using KEWL, what good does it do you, I understand using things like BTW, because that serves a function you have to type less.

Arrr, hey be you knockin' the way the captain is natterin'... That is grounds t' have my crew offer you the mark. I think that would be kewl, gar!

Arrr, is this an english class assignment? Nah!

Am I gettin' paid for this (aka a job)? Nah!

tharfore punctuation and grammar scalwags can kiss my Cutlass, gar!

Aye, by the way... the... (...'s) be kewl

Edited June 19, 2007 by OsGOD

[Guest Agalloch]

No some folks just need legibly written posts. Punctuation does matter, three periods in a row is used in continuation of a thought, not the end of a thought, that is what the single period is for.

Using ... is like using KEWL, what good does it do you, I understand using things like BTW, because that serves a function you have to type less.

Well at least I am not the only one with lead in my water, because others were confused by that too.

Either way yes i agree, guys like Chelios and Holmstrom are guys you hate until they are on your team, same with Maltby and others. I agree, the difference is that Homer has always been a wing, and Chelios is an automatic HOF, I am not even sure the need a voting process for him. Hartnell on the other hand would have needed to join the team before he wuold have been accepted, but I guarentee you the first time he knocked an Avalanche or Duck helmet off of a guys head he would have become the fan fav.

BTW I would have like to have Hartnell, just to strike fear into the hearts of the enemies.

So any of you think Pronger would have tried that crap on homer if he knew Hartnell was skating around waiting for a reason to cheap shot someone?

Hypocrite. Don't correct people until you learn to use punctuation yourself. Hell, don't correct people period. This isn't English class.

[RedFX 48]

Hey, alot of people in Nashville consider Draper a dirty player for his slash to the face of Timonen and subsequent suspension in 2000. Alot of people consider Holmstrom a dirty player for what he does, alot of people consider Maltby a dirty player for a violent slash on Nichol after the whistle last year.

Personally, I wouldn't classify Hartnell as a dirty player. I think he's just a hard-nosed, gritty power forward, which is why I thought we should have picked him up because he's the exact player we need. Yeah, he rammed Legace, once. But to call him a dirty player, you'd have to call Cleary a dirty player for doing the same thing to Kiprusoff. That knee-to-knee hit (and Cheechoo even admitted this) was a result of Cheechoo trying to side-step the hit from Hartnell.

I guess "dirty player" depends on your perspective. If your guy does it, it's good tough hockey. If the other team does it, its cheap. For instance, McCarty destroying Lemieux was well-deserved payback and good, old-time hockey. To Colorado, it was "a cheap-shot for the ages" (as so said the Denver Post). It's a matter of perspective.

By the way, would you consider Steve Yzerman a classless player for getting three misconducts and an ejection for arguing with the refs in 2004?

Also with the trade, both Hartnell and Timonen stated in the paper today that they wanted to resign with Nashville, but were never contacted by the team until after the trade. If this isn't an indication that they are dumping players to steer away fans, I don't know what is.

[Guest Agalloch]

No, nobody considers Yzerman, Maltby, Holmstrom, etc dirty players. Nobody except you and your fellow Preds fans.

I like how you compare McCarty fighting Claude to Hartnell tearing a guys ACL. McCarty was getting revenge for the hit on Draper, and he did it by fighting. Hartnell just goes around and knees people for the hell of it. He IS A DIRTY PLAYER. Put your bias aside. There's no way around it. His track record is ridiculously huge when talking about how many people he's cheapshotted.

Yzerman getting ejected one is the same thing as Hartnell putting people out for the season dozens of times? Okay, please go away if you think that. No one considers people that go to the front of the net dirty, either. They think that people who knee others repeatedly are cheapshotting douchebags. Hey, that sounds like Hartnell!

[Legionnaire11 0]

Yzerman getting ejected one is the same thing as Hartnell putting people out for the season dozens of times?

hahaha, Hartnell has put guys out for the season DOZENS of times? I want to see the roll call on that one. List them up here. Might want to list all of Hartnell's suspensions with it too, because he's the biggest goon in the league he must be suspended a lot too right? or is the league office just so inept that they can't suspend the guys who most deserve it?

[Opie 308]

Hypocrite. Don't correct people until you learn to use punctuation yourself. Hell, don't correct people period. This isn't English class.

I wasn't correcting, I was trying to explaining how I misunderstood his point. I guess I should learn to be called basically retarded and not respond with any sign of disagreement in my tone.

Either way, Hartnell would have been a good fit and I would have cheered for him, however that is as they say, all just dust in the wind!

Yzerman arguing with the refs pails in comparison to some one using a stick or a dirty hit, and no matter what the Denver Post says about McCarty/Lemiuex they will always be wrong, think about it they hired Woody Paige, something has got to be wrong there.

[akustyk 84]

By the way, would you consider Steve Yzerman a classless player for getting three misconducts and an ejection for arguing with the refs in 2004?

a big mistake on this, actually. I guess you didn't even see the game and what happened. if I recall correctly Yzerman got his misconducts for yapping at refs, and this basically were very bad calls. these was by no means panalties for any type of physical play. and even, there's a long distance from physical play to things Hartnell does. Yzerman did nothing resembling what we're talking about here

I'm fine with counterarguments, but let us stick to reasonable examples

Edited June 19, 2007 by akustyk

[glasgowcelticwing 18]

Hypocrite. Don't correct people until you learn to use punctuation yourself. Hell, don't correct people period. This isn't English class.

That really gets on my nerves on this board . At time's people are being all high and might and taking it upon themselve's to correct people's spelling and grammar..WTF?!?!?!?....as long as what's written can be understood then that's the main thing.

Oh yeah , s***ty deal by both team's Nashville look like they're ready to bomb bigtime by slashing their salary and losing some descent player's and The Flyers have tied themselve's down to two very long and expensive contact's.

Edited June 19, 2007 by glasgowcelticwing

[Winged Scooter 0]

I wasn't correcting, I was trying to explaining how I misunderstood his point. I guess I should learn to be called basically retarded and not respond with any sign of disagreement in my tone.

Either way, Hartnell would have been a good fit and I would have cheered for him, however that is as they say, all just dust in the wind!

Yzerman arguing with the refs pails in comparison to some one using a stick or a dirty hit, and no matter what the Denver Post says about McCarty/Lemiuex they will always be wrong, think about it they hired Woody Paige, something has got to be wrong there.

Woody Paige is in Denver now? That will make my wife happy, she said wtaching him talk made her carzy because it looked like his tongue was too big for his mouth!

Woody Paige is in Denver now? That will make my wife happy, she said wtaching him talk made her carzy because it looked like his tongue was too big for his mouth!

Please disregard the above post, I am a complete moron and was thinking of Woody Woodruff!

Edited June 19, 2007 by Winged Scooter

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

They should be more like the preds team from 03/04 that met the Wings in the first round. We're definitely not competing for the presidents trophy next season. But the 6th-8th spot in the playoffs is still very realistic. When the lockout ended, we came out as an all offense, wide up skating team and despite the regular season success, it was never a great system. Next season we'll have more grit and get back to the hard working, blue collar predators hockey that defined the first 5 seasons. Only difference is that this team is much better than those early expansion years.

on a side note, I believe this leaves Vokoun as the last of the original predators unless you want to count Legwand in there since he was the first pick and did play one game in the first season.

Forsberg was gone anyway.

Kariya, it's hard to tell. They're going to talk to him, if he wants to come back then I think they get it done. He's always been a hard guy to read though. I have a feeling all the uncertainty will drive him away though.

Vishnevski wasn't coming back because he never got on the ice, and many Preds fans wanted to rip Trotz a new one for that. Even David Poile apologized to VItaly in front of the team saying that when he made the trade, he thought he would get more playing time.

Nichol wasn't coming back because he's a moron. He is a dirtier player than Hartnell and Tootoo. If he were re-signed, the coaches would scratch him every game.

But Smithson I think is definitely coming back. He'll sign for less than $1M, and he's a great penalty killer. I don't think he'd get much attention from anywhere else.

As for bringing in quality UFA's, we weren't really going to be in the mix anyway. The gameplan for this summer was to get bigger and grittier on the third and fourth lines. I think we'll get 2-3 guys on the cheap to fill that need, and maybe a big veteran d-man for the third pairing.

Oh I definitely have the Preds making the playoffs. However the NHL can be a fickle ***** and we've seen teams like Anaheim and Edmonton and Carolina get to the finals one year and miss the playoffs entirely the next. Still, with Vokoun and a solid backup in Mason its a great start. Goaltending is still top notch for you. The problem will be maybe what we saw out of Roberto Luongo (i'd like to say I TOLD YOU SO) to all those who crapped on Luongo when we talked about getting him ("oh, he's never played a playoff game and blah, blah) Was this guy in the running for MVP this year? I digress. Anyway, with a bunch of kids (although somewhat seasoned) Vokoun may be seeing many more quality chances than in the past and his numbers could inflate a bit. You definitely need that veteran presence but with the uncertainty of the team who knows if any UFA's are going to want to come. In the end money walks so somebody will probably sign with you guys.

Smithson is a pretty decent role player, he plays hard. It'd be good to re sign him.

Up front is going to be kinda iffy for you guys if Kariya doesn't come back. Still have Sully and Rads and Legwand and Erat but it gets awful thin real quick and no Forsberg, Kariya, Hartnell means lower numbers from those guys. Its amazing how great players can turn 10 goal, 30 point guys into 25 goal 50 point guys but if you lose Forsberg and Kariya that's alot of talent gone and not easily replaced.

At least you have Chicago, Columbus and St.Louis to play 24 times so that'll help get you into the playoffs.

[kylee 727]

No, nobody considers Yzerman, Maltby, Holmstrom, etc dirty players. Nobody except you and your fellow Preds fans.

I like how you compare McCarty fighting Claude to Hartnell tearing a guys ACL. McCarty was getting revenge for the hit on Draper, and he did it by fighting. Hartnell just goes around and knees people for the hell of it. He IS A DIRTY PLAYER. Put your bias aside. There's no way around it. His track record is ridiculously huge when talking about how many people he's cheapshotted.

Yzerman getting ejected one is the same thing as Hartnell putting people out for the season dozens of times? Okay, please go away if you think that. No one considers people that go to the front of the net dirty, either. They think that people who knee others repeatedly are cheapshotting douchebags. Hey, that sounds like Hartnell!

reference: http://wingsfights.110mb.com/fights-0304-03.htm

see it for yourself.

Yzerman did not get tossed cause he was gooning up.

[esteef 2,679]

Yay! Hartnell doesn't come to the Wings! Continue hating him everyone...

esteef

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

reference: http://wingsfights.110mb.com/fights-0304-03.htm

see it for yourself.

Yzerman did not get tossed cause he was gooning up.

A game like that would never happen with the current Wings because they just don't have that many guys who would drop the gloves.

Also when a game gets out of hand like that, you can tell the players have zero respect for the refs working that game. they clearly lost control of it.

Edited June 19, 2007 by haroldsnepsts

[The_Cub 0]

Thats alot of cash for those two guys. Looks like nothing has changed over in Philly.