Dom Drops Ball, Ozzie Answers Call

[shadow47 1]

"Dom Drops Ball, Ozzie Answers Call(?)"

---In his relief time, Osgood faced 4 shots. C'mon people.

---DH has had two lousy games, the Anaheim game and this one. It's easy to have a low sp% when you aren't facing a lot of shots, why doesn't anyone recognize this?

---Brodeur's save percentage is under .900 in more games. Should he retire?

---Some memorable Hasek off-nights vs. the Blues:

11/13/07.....8/12 4GA in 35 minutes

12/4/03 ......14/18 4GA in 65 minutes

10/29/03 .....9/13 4GA in 25 minutes

5/4/02.........11/16 5GA in 50 minutes

4/14/02.......23/28 5GA in 60 minutes

1/13/99.......26/30 4GA in 60 minutes

1/27/98.......16/19 3GA in 65 minutes

Keeping with a trend, the Blues are one of the those teams Dom can serve up a stinker against now and again.

---Anyone remember 8GA vs. the Sharks last year?

---97-98 with Buffalo was particularly bad start, see here:

10/01/97 33/34 3-1 W STL

10/03/97 28/34 6-2 L WSH

10/05/97 30/31 1-1 OT T TB

10/07/97 26/30 4-2 L DAL

10/09/97 29/31 5-2 W WSH

10/15/97 34/37 3-3 T CAR

10/17/97 37/42 5-1 L MTL

10/19/97 31/35 5-2 L CHI

10/21/97 17/18 4-1 W CGY

10/26/97 24/30 6-1 L PHX

10/28/97 16/19 3-2 L COL

Stats after 11 games 97-98 (oh the second Hart Trophy year):

GP: 11 ......... W-L-T: 3-6-2 ...... GAA: 3.28 ......... sp%: 894

Stats after 9 games 07-08

GP: 9 ........... W-L-T: 5-3-1 .......GAA: 2.76 ......... sp%: 869

In case any math experts are lost here, the difference in save percentage means that on every 100 shots compared to 97-98, Hasek will give up 2.5 more goals.

Sour, sour Osgood fans stirring things up not worth stirring.

Edited November 15, 2007 by shadow47

[Offsides 21]

2 bad nights = 86% sv%

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....

Ozzie should play, he just should, has nothing to do with bitterness against Dom.

edit: slip of the finger

Edited November 15, 2007 by Offsides

[Guest EZBAKETHAGANGSTA]

I hate Hasek. He blew us vs anaheim

[puckloo39 5,686]

"Dom Drops Ball, Ozzie Answers Call(?)"

---In his relief time, Osgood faced 4 shots. C'mon people.

---DH has had two lousy games, the Anaheim game and this one. It's easy to have a low sp% when you aren't facing a lot of shots, why doesn't anyone recognize this?

.

.

.

In case any math experts are lost here, the difference in save percentage means that on every 100 shots compared to 97-98, Hasek will give up 2.5 more goals.

Sour, sour Osgood fans stirring things up not worth stirring.

No amount of logic or evidence shall sway the faithful from their mission, Shadow. Nice job on the stats, BTW.

The good thing: the fans don't really have any say at all about what the Wings and Babcock will do in regard to goaltending chores.

[shadow47 1]

2 bad nights = 86% gaa?

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....

Ozzie should play, he just should, has nothing to do with bitterness against Dom.

Actually, yes, 2 bad nights. If you exclude the games against Anaheim and St. Louis, DH's stats:

GP: 7 ...... W-L-T: 5-1-1 ...... GAA: 2.10 ....... sp%: .896

Those are fine if not good numbers, if anything it should show how insanely low the shot totals have been. You can do this with any goalkeeper but it does indicate that his season is not quite as bad as people might think at a glance. BTW the Wings have the second best record in the league, Osgood's playing tons, is there any reason to complain?

[OsGOD 3]

2 bad nights = 86% save?

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.....

Ozzie should play, he just should, has nothing to do with bitterness against Dom.

and yet his latest good game raised it ever so slightly ... its not just a few bad games this season that bring that number about... at least not when a few good games doesn't raise it up.

Actually, yes, 2 bad nights. If you exclude the games against Anaheim and St. Louis, DH's stats:

GP: 7 ...... W-L-T: 5-1-1 ...... GAA: 2.10 ....... sp%: .896

Those are fine if not good numbers, if anything it should show how insanely low the shot totals have been. You can do this with any goalkeeper but it does indicate that his season is not quite as bad as people might think at a glance. BTW the Wings have the second best record in the league, Osgood's playing tons, is there any reason to complain?

I thought anything under 90% was horrible... at least is Osgood world it was... oh well... i understand the reasoning.

[Grittzkey 1]

I never hopped on the hasek wagon, so i can say this without feeling like a wagon hopper.

But screw Hasek and his old ass. Put Osgood in, and let Howard get some freakin PT, you drafted him to be the future, stop letting a freakin Dinosaur stop you from grooming your Future goaltender from future greatness or typical trade bait

Wewt, 4th Line Grinder Now@@@

Edited November 15, 2007 by Grittzkey

[OsGOD 3]

^^ That is Priceless

[HenryMalredo 2]

It is possible that this is the year that Hasek can no longer keep up with the game, but that doesn't mean Osgood will be leading the Wings to the promised land. Ozzie has already passed the peak age for goalies, and was never elite in the first place. Ozzie's been great so far, but judging by his history, especially the last two years, he won't keep it out. Theres a reason that the Wings have brought back Hasek the last two years despite his age and known health problems.

[Offsides 21]

It is possible that this is the year that Hasek can no longer keep up with the game, but that doesn't mean Osgood will be leading the Wings to the promised land. Ozzie has already passed the peak age for goalies, and was never elite in the first place. Ozzie's been great so far, but judging by his history, especially the last two years, he won't keep it out. Theres a reason that the Wings have brought back Hasek the last two years despite his age and known health problems.

Only 1 goalie will win the Cup. And a goalie is only 1 factor. But Hasek doesn't even look like he's on par to stay in the NHL let alone the starter, let alone the playoffs...so...

Again..not saying he can't recover, but he makes me nervous.

On a side note. What is that in your avatar, it looks like a doodlebop

[omaratcho 0]

but hasek obviously can't keep up wiht the wing's expectations of him. And i don't see what you mean by ozzie won't "keep out" i mean look at him. He's 8-1 for pete's sake, you're telling me that's not the sign of someone who can lead us to a stanley cup? Personally i do believe hasek is too old, too slow, and too sloppy to keep up with today's game. I've said this before, wiht all of those young players out there today with such fearlessness and edgy-ness it's going to take a WHOLE lot of conditioning and practice for Hasek to be back up to par with the NHL's standards. He once WAS the greatest in the world, now he's got to move over and let ozzie lead us to another cup because he obviously can't. i'm not saying ozzie will ever make it to the hall of fame or is even hall of fame material. but there is ABSOLUTELY no doubt in my mind that osgood is a great goalie and if anyone is going to lead us to another cup this year it's going to be him.

[eva unit zero 271]

Exactly one time huh?

One time where it wasn't a 'the goalie should usually stop that puck' situation. Here's a hint...highlight reel saves are often meaningless. If two goalies have similar numbers, the one with more highlight reel saves is the WORSE goaltender, not the better goaltender...highlight reel saves are often the result of the goalie being out of position in the first place. I didn't say Dom played poorly; he made the stops when he needed to and that's important as we've seen goalies, including Oz and Dom, not do that very thing.

I don't have that much of a problem with that statement. As I said, CuJo played a lot better than anyone ever gave him credit for. But I think you also have to point out that the offenses that we faced in 2002 were better than the offenses we faced in 2004. Vancouver led the league in goals with 254, St. Louis was right around the top 10 (227), and the Avs were further down (212 goals) but their best player missed the entire year and was back for the playoffs, so I think it's pretty reasonable to move them on up as well.

In 2004, Calgary was the #19 offense and Nashville was 12th.

And Hasek had the two best defensemen in the NHL at the time. That kind of helps.

I never said otherwise. All I said was Hasek was a part of the reason they advanced. But holding the #6 or 7 offense in the league to 9 goals in 6 games is pretty damn impressive. Particularly considering he gave up 3 goals in 3 games once we got down 2-1, including 28 saves in (guess what?!) another shutout on the road, in an elimination game, which no doubt could've been done by any goaltender with a pulse.

Saying Dom was not replicating the tasks of Hercules is not the same as saying anyone could have easily done it. That sort of argument is usually reserved for the Ozzie bashers who think the Wings could have won in 98 with Kris Draper in goal.

Yeah, he was good enough that Jeremy Roenick wouldn't sign here the next season because he didn't think we had a goalie.

Wasn't Roenick offered like 2m more by the Flyers? Because the Flyers had second year veteran Roman Cechmanek, who was far more infamous for his 2001 playoff meltdown. It is a dead end argument to say 'Osgood sucked because JR said so' since that leads to JR as having deemed Checkman as Cup-caliber, which destroys his credibility for evaluating goaltenders.

True, his numbers are worse than they've ever been in October. I just think it's silly for SO many people to proclaim this more than a slow start and simply a case of him losing it after he's lost 3 games in regulation, 2 to playoff teams. He's had nine starts, and he missed a couple of weeks. I'd be a lot more inclined to listen to this argument if it was January or February.

Like I said, he hasn't been great, but he's only had 2 truly "Bad" games in terms of the goals allowed, and he still would have us on pace for a 100 point season. It's not like he's going Dan Cloutier on us or anything. He's not submarining the season. And with our position in the division and conference, we're more than able to let him work through this without it hurting our playoff chances one iota.

There are plenty of other things to worry about on this team. Like who is going to score if the top line cools off, or who is going to be our 2nd pairing since Lilja and Kronwall both blow.

In terms of point per game, Samuelsson is top 90 an Huds and Cleary are top 180...meaning we have six 'top-six' scoring forwards and four first liners, based on offensive output.

[Kp-Wings 3]

Do people seriously think Hasek is an iron man or something? The guy is 42 and hasnt exactly been healthy over his career. It'd be one thing if he were 35 and people were saying hes done. Then there might be case for overreaction. But the fact that remains that it is completely reasonable, and dare i say logical, to assume that Dom is simply running out of gas. Over the hill. Overstayed his welcome. Etc. Etc.

And itd also be another thing to suggest Dom isnt what he used to be after 1 poor start. But lets face it. Going 4-11 is rock bottom after a string of rather poor and/or at the very least below average starts Dom has given us so far this year.

Thank you.

Hasek's play has been terrible all season. The only reason he has a winning record is because of the steller defense playing in front of him. You all seen that last night, when the defense decided to pack it in after the 1st period, Hasek was eaten alive.

He's 42 years old. He's old, injury prone, and in my opinion, has more than a few screws loose. He's a very weird guy, and I don't think he can handle a heavy workload anymore. In fact, I don't think he can handle playing at all any more, either.

...and before I get flamed out by everyone, let's get something straight here: I'm impartial to both goalies. I have no emotional connection to either of them, so don't try to accuse me of being a "sour Osgood fan" (I'm looking directly at you, Puckloo39). I don't really care which one does better, as long as one of them is getting the job done. And right now, Hasek isn't getting the job done. On the nights he hasn't just plain sucked, he's been mediocre, at best. That's not going to cut it.

Like I said: the only reason Hasek's record is above .500 is because of the Wings great defense. On average, Hasek has faced about 12-15 shots this season, and yet he manages to at least give up 1-2 goals a game. So, that means he's making about 10-12 saves a agme. Those are terrible numbers for him. He can do a lot better than that, at least he used to. I don't know if he has it in him now.

If Hasek steps it up and actually shows me something this year, than I'll be the first to come out publicly and eat crow with butter and garlic sauce on the side. But, that hasn't happened yet at all. He has to actually play a good game: not rely souly on the defense in front of him, and still give up 2 goals a game on only 10 shots. That isn't going to work for me.

It really doesn't matter to me which goalie takes the reins as #1. If Hasek steps it up, great. If Osgood wins the job instead, that's fine by me. It's whoever get's the job done is what counts.

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

Hold on, I think I've got the answer.....

Dom is lazy and he sucks.

Edited November 15, 2007 by BringHomeTheCup!

[Wings_Fan_In_Exile 3]

Hold on, I think I've got the answer.....

Dom is lazy and he sucks.

hahaha. That's funny.

Now I will preface this by stating that

A: I have never been a Hasek fan- hell some of you may remember the Paralyzed Snow Angel of Defeat debacle

B: I am one of the many saying "play Ozzie as much as possible for as long as that hot streak continues"

But even I am surprised at the backlash toward Dom. I can't stand his floppy style of play,. he makes me nervous every time he starts.... BUT still, it's waaaay too early IMO to be saying he sucks. Like somebody else stated earlier, if it were January/February and his SP% was still sub-90% I'd say he's done.......... But it's only November.

[Kp-Wings 3]

^^^lol Seinfeld

Did you find that somewhere (your avatar), or make it yourself?

[Wings_Fan_In_Exile 3]

^^^lol Seinfeld

Did you find that somewhere (your avatar), or make it yourself?

the last TV show I've watched religiously .

I nabbed it from photobucket since I have no artistic talent whatsoever. Good thing Offsides helps a brotha out from time to time.

[norrisnick 1]

If Dom were a coach this'd be the kiss of death...

http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/20...eks_strugg.html

[interminded 1]

If Dom were a coach this'd be the kiss of death...

http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/20...eks_strugg.html

What else should Holland do ?

There's not much more to say than he did, I guess..

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

I'm just glad Holland and Babcock and company don't constantly listen and make constant decisions off us armchair fans. Hell, tthey'd probably be laughing their butts off if they read some of the knee-jerk reactionary stuff in this thread.

[Offsides 21]

I'm just glad Holland and Babcock and company don't constantly listen and make constant decisions off us armchair fans. Hell, tthey'd probably be laughing their butts off if they read some of the knee-jerk reactionary stuff in this thread.

What?!? You speak for yourself. Holland and Babs listen to me ALL THE TIME. *nods*

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

I'm just glad Holland and Babcock and company don't constantly listen and make constant decisions off us armchair fans. Hell, tthey'd probably be laughing their butts off if they read some of the knee-jerk reactionary stuff in this thread.

Yeah, then we might actually have an enforcer who dresses regularly on this team.

[irishtemper14+25 11]

Yeah, then we might actually have an enforcer who dresses regularly on this team.

and we would have every player who ever played for the wings that is still playing today

[OsGOD 3]

What?!? You speak for yourself. Holland and Babs listen to me ALL THE TIME. *nods*

I have to agree... its quite scary at times.

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

Wasn't Roenick offered like 2m more by the Flyers? Because the Flyers had second year veteran Roman Cechmanek, who was far more infamous for his 2001 playoff meltdown. It is a dead end argument to say 'Osgood sucked because JR said so' since that leads to JR as having deemed Checkman as Cup-caliber, which destroys his credibility for evaluating goaltenders.

Perfectly said.

Anyways, im not going to rag on Dom. I do think he hasn't been the same and is probably finally slowing down, but with that said I won't bash him. I do think Ozzie should be playing majority of games until he cools down. That's fair and the way it should be.