Conn Smythe Trophy Discussion

[gcom007 1,465]

The thing about the shots that Osgood stops is that with our D so good, the opposing team has to make better plays to get shots so when they do go through, oftentimes they're of a more difficult nature. Osgood doesn't get a lot of easy stuff to pad has Sv.% with yet he's still in the upper .930's, no? There's something to be said for that without a doubt. I think it's going to be a tossup between him and Zetts but to say either has it outright over the other right now is just silly. If Zetts is up there, Datsyuk better be too as he's not far behind in points and has done more than his fair share of the little things as well. My gut's saying Osgood though...

[RockyMountainWingGal 108]

osgood should get the conn smythe because ever since he took over during the first round the wings have only lost 3 games

True but we were winning that series fairly handily vs. Nashville until Hasek melted down......

[gowingsgo 3]

My vote is to Osgood. However, the stuff Henrik Zetterberg did to help kill that 5 on 3 is the play LEGENDS are made from. Another big game like that from Hank and I'd almost be inclined to give him my vote.

[RockyMountainWingGal 108]

Sorry, with 2 shut outs in the SCF and the already impressive stats and record that Ozzie had, Z and others would have had to have incredible stats to beat him.

Z does have incredible stats. That's what makes it such a difficult choice. If his stats were just mediocre - Oz hands down. Z leads the POs with a +16, leads the team in pts w 23 (second to Crosby - barf) and is second to Franzen in goals w 13. I believe he will tally a few pts tonight and take over the pts and goals lead - if he does that along with his unreal +/- stat - he will get the trophy hands down.

[Opie 308]

True but we were winning that series fairly handily vs. Nashville until Hasek melted down......

Actually before Ozzie got a start the series was 2-2 so I am not sure how that is winning the series fairly handily. Plus Hasek let up 5 goals in game three, Ozzie hasn't given up 5 goals in the SCF.

Plus do any of you listen to the post game comments? Serious question.

Most of the Red Wing players will tell you that Ozzie has been instrumental and that he has saved their asses.

I think a lot of people are underrating Ozzie's performance. I see him as slightly ahead of Z and can see the opposite, but I just don't understand how some of you can say well Ozzie only makes x amount of saves, yeah well you know what MAF is making 30 saves a game, how many Conn Smythe votes is he getting?

[norrisnick 1]

Actually before Ozzie got a start the series was 2-2 so I am not sure how that is winning the series fairly handily. Plus Hasek let up 5 goals in game three, Ozzie hasn't given up 5 goals in the SCF.

Plus do any of you listen to the post game comments? Serious question.

Most of the Red Wing players will tell you that Ozzie has been instrumental and that he has saved their asses.

I think a lot of people are underrating Ozzie's performance. I see him as slightly ahead of Z and can see the opposite, but I just don't understand how some of you can say well Ozzie only makes x amount of saves, yeah well you know what MAF is making 30 saves a game, how many Conn Smythe votes is he getting?

We were up 2-0 and even in that 2nd game Dom started s***ting himself. Over the span of 5 periods or so Dom gave up back to back goals on consecutive shots FOUR times. Round 1 is a sweep if Dom were at all competent.

[Opie 308]

We were up 2-0 and even in that 2nd game Dom started s***ting himself. Over the span of 5 periods or so Dom gave up back to back goals on consecutive shots FOUR times. Round 1 is a sweep if Dom were at all competent.

That to me is a bit of an oversimplification but if it is your opinion you are entitled to it, but it is hard to argue with these numbers:

13-3

1.45

.936

If it weren't for Ozzie's name attatched to those numbers, for example if it were Turco, MAF, Broduer, Luongo, Giguere whomever people would be screaming up and down look at those numbers they are awesome.

But as Burnside points out in the article,

Was he ever a dominant player at his position? No.

But at the same time, he has displayed, later in his career, a mental toughness few would have believed possible, especially those who saw him a decade ago when he seemed ready to boil over at any moment, reacting to any slight.

[StevieY9802 6]

Like I said are the Wings here if Hasek stayed in net? I personally don't think so. I look how well they've played with Ozzie in there and how steady he's been. I look at those little things. But without Yzerman playing awesome in round 1 against the Canucks the Wings don't get out of round 1 in 02 and he played well, even though his point production went down, as the playoffs went on. But Lidstrom ended up with the MVP.

[Flip-check 6]

Assuming the series ends sooner rather than later, it's between Zetterberg and Osgood. And when it's close like this, I feel like it usually goes to the goaltender. Osgood is absolutely deserving of it. Even last night, Z was a monster, but Ozzy kept the Wings in the game by making huge saves on Crosby and Dupuis. For at least half the game, the Penguins had the better scoring chances.

I agree with harold. The back to back SCF shutouts on top of things don't hurt his case either.

And to be honest I want Ozzie to win this. I've watched the guy since he went off the ice in that Sharks early '90s series, the awesome tandem he made with Vernon in '97, through the whole run in '98, and all the years where he's hardly been given any credit by the league - I want a Conn Smythe going to this guy.

[norrisnick 1]

That to me is a bit of an oversimplification but if it is your opinion you are entitled to it, but it is hard to argue with these numbers:

13-3

1.45

.936

If it weren't for Ozzie's name attatched to those numbers, for example if it were Turco, MAF, Broduer, Luongo, Giguere whomever people would be screaming up and down look at those numbers they are awesome.

But as Burnside points out in the article,

Z and Oz are a coinflp choice. I just think Z has been a hair more instrumental in getting us here.

[puckloo39 5,686]

Z for the CS, with Ozzie a close second, I suspect. Six shutouts, breaking records in OT, etc. in 2002, didn't get Hasek a sniff of the Conn Smythe, not that he minded, I suspect. Goalies don't get the credit they deserve in Detroit, because the team is the star... not the 'tender.

Why does every thread end up with Hasek bashing somewhere in it? Just curious.

Edited June 2, 2008 by puckloo39

[Matt 1,049]

Zetterberg gets my vote.

[miller76 463]

Z or Ozzie for sure. I think I am going with Ozzie though, because he stepped in and just took over and has been very good and very mature throughout the transition. I like what Babcock spoke of the other day saying something like 'when you change goalies in the playoffs your done, and we proved that normal fact wrong'

But if Z won it, I would still be ecstatic!

[RWK23 0]

I'm going to look at it like I do with every MVP-type award. Where is that team if you removed that player from the team? Do they make the playoffs, do they lose a lot more games, do they make it to the championship? Basically, who is the most important player on the team? This becomes a lot more difficult with a team like the Red Wings, because they are so deep and such a good team.

Basically, it comes down to Chris Osgood, Nick Lidstrom, and Henrik Zetterberg, IMHO. Now, the player that is universally accepted as the most important Red Wings player is Nick Lidstrom. However, we all know he isn't going to win it, despite similar numbers to his 2002 Conn Smythe performance.

No matter how I look at it, it's an unbelievably hard decision. Ozzie's performance has been one for the ages. Hank's two-way play has been breathtaking. But, when you look at where the Wings were before Ozzie (tied 2-2 with #8 seed Preds with a goalie giving up goals from the blue line with frequency) and since Ozzie (13-3 with three shutouts), I think you have to give it to Ozzie. It's such a hard call and I honestly believe it is going to come down to who plays better in the clinching game(s).

[norrisnick 1]

Z for the CS, with Ozzie a close second, I suspect. Six shutouts, breaking records in OT, etc. in 2002, didn't get Hasek a sniff of the Conn Smythe, not that he minded, I suspect. Goalies don't get the credit they deserve in Detroit, because the team is the star... not the 'tender.

Why does every thread end up with Hasek bashing somewhere in it? Just curious.

He brought it on himself?

[puckloo39 5,686]

He brought it on himself?

It's not really worth discussing, especially at this point in time... but how is that?? It's really ridiculous.

Wonder who everyone is going to blame for everything next season?

[Shaman 713]

Hank is #1 in my mind but, Ozzie is 1a, its that close.

[Chaldean 0]

..

Edited June 4, 2008 by Chaldean

[Chaldean 0]

I think its an even tie now between Zetta and Osgood. I think whatever happens in game 6 is going to decide the conn smythe.

[Kira 451]

Z for the CS, with Ozzie a close second, I suspect. Six shutouts, breaking records in OT, etc. in 2002, didn't get Hasek a sniff of the Conn Smythe, not that he minded, I suspect. Goalies don't get the credit they deserve in Detroit, because the team is the star... not the 'tender.

Why does every thread end up with Hasek bashing somewhere in it? Just curious.

Because they think they have to. They think it's not a complete thread without bashing Dom.

[Kira 451]

Z for the CS, with Ozzie a close second, I suspect. Six shutouts, breaking records in OT, etc. in 2002, didn't get Hasek a sniff of the Conn Smythe, not that he minded, I suspect. Goalies don't get the credit they deserve in Detroit, because the team is the star... not the 'tender.

Why does every thread end up with Hasek bashing somewhere in it? Just curious.

Because they think they have to. They think it's not a complete thread without bashing Dom.

[Datsyerberger 279]

At this point, Id call it pretty even between Ozzie and Z, with Dats trailing close behind. If any one of them steals the winning game, they're likely getting the Conn Smythe. If neither Z or Dats have an amazing game, and Ozzie has a solid (but perhaps not flawless) game, it'll probably go to him.

[10 Minute Misconduct 104]

Zetterberg and it's not even that close anymore. Ozzie needed to play a better game 5, he was very shakey. Ummm, if this thing goes 7 and Fleury steals game 6 you'd have to throw him in for Pitts.

[YoungGuns1340 1]

Yeah, I dont really think Osgoods in the running anymore. In fact, I think its more clear cut than some of you think. Hank was stellar defensively in Game 4, and he brought the offense in game 5 with a pair of assists. If he has a good game in any aspect in Game 6 when we close this thing out, its his.

He has 25 points so far, and has been a dominant defensive force. Basically, hes been doing his job damn well all over the ice, all playoffs long. Plus hes got an A on that sweater. Id say its his without a doubt at this point.

[eva unit zero 271]

Yeah, I dont really think Osgoods in the running anymore. In fact, I think its more clear cut than some of you think. Hank was stellar defensively in Game 4, and he brought the offense in game 5 with a pair of assists. If he has a good game in any aspect in Game 6 when we close this thing out, its his.

He has 25 points so far, and has been a dominant defensive force. Basically, hes been doing his job damn well all over the ice, all playoffs long. Plus hes got an A on that sweater. Id say its his without a doubt at this point.

I am completely shocked by this attitude. The Wings have won three games in the finals. Osgood is the only player who has been a three star selection more than once in a Wings win...he has been first or second star each time. The Wings would not be a win away without the way Osgood has played; that is difficult to say with as much certainty about any other player, including Lids, Dats, and Z.

Osgood had one game where he could have played better, and suddenly he's not in the running? Even though his stats say he's got one of if not the best playoff performance in the past 15+ years even with his 'bad' game? Yeah, he only has no chance because his name is Osgood. if it were Hasek, Brodeur, or Roy with the same exact run, highs and lows...they'd be shoo-ins. Please try and give a little respect to the second greatest Wings goaltender ever, k?