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Kwame_Kilpatrick

will wings retire fedorov's 91?

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I think Fedorov could be a hall of famer, but don't think his Red Wings jersey should be retired. Having your jersey retired by an organization means you have been dedicated and contributed to that organization in a way only a select few have. Even if Feds point production sloped down like it has in the last few years, but he was still a red wing, then i could see his jersey being lifted, but he went to Anaheim, Columbus and then to the Capitals, where he hasn't dont bad for himself, but still hasn't put up a 25-30 goal season that is/was expected of him.

That said, Fedorov's contract is up at the end of the year...and while it's a longshot, it would be amazing to see him become a wing again. I say that if he finishes his career in detroit, give him a second chance, and then maybe his jersey will be lifted to the rafters.

Jesus Christ, not this crap again.

Feds is washed up and we have no room for him. Who would you sit so the "has been" can play?

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............and Dino has 600+ career goals. How many players have accomplished that feat? Just saying that stats don't tell the whole story.

I liken this ridiculously overdone question of whether Feds number should get retired to what Dino Ciccarelli faces with the Hall of Fame.

Are Dino's numbers/accomplishments good enough to get into the Hall of Fame. Hell Yes

Are Sergei's numbers/accomplishments good enough to warrant his number being retired? Yes, I think so.

Did Dino do anything controversial or that might have upset his chances of getting into the HOF? Yup.

Did Feds do anything controversial or that might have upset his chances of getting his jersey retired. I guess its a matter of opinion, but to many the answer is yes, he did.

As a Wings fan first, nobody comes before the organization for me.

That said, there are 3 guys that I would put up there because they have been great players (although not all superstars), they have been great Red Wings, they have accomplished great things and have proven their loyalty to the organization time and time again.

They are

1. Nick Lidstrom

2. Chris Osgood

3. Kris Draper

***Kirk Maltby

All this talk of Chelios and Shanny (2 of my all time favorite hockey players) is just ridiculous. Please stop it people. Hank and Pavs? Are we really discussing them right now? Hell, why not throw Kronwall into that discussion. Way too early so give it a rest people.

In the end none of our opinions matter. We have no say, no control. But as a betting man, I would bet anybody, anything they want and can back up that Fedorov won't ever have his jersey retired by the Wings. And frankly, I can live with that.

Dino has one of the weakest resumes of all the guys up for the HoF right now. It is more than his on/off-ice altercations that is keeping him from it. 600 goals loses a lot of its luster when you put them into the context of the 80s and consider Dino never even came close to the league leaders in goals in a single season. Longevity should be a part of the equation, but peak performance is an equal if not more heavily-weighted factor, and dino comes up woefully short in that department.

Bringing Kris Draper (or Maltby/McCarty) opens up the rafters to a number of players from the Red Wings past, many of whom have more accolades than Draper.

As I have brought up before - Ted Lindsay left this organization in about the worst possible way you can imagine. If the Wings and he could patch things up, surely they can with Fedorov - whom by many accounts has already bridged many of those divisions - enough that the Red Wings actually considered trading for him from Columbus, which would have been at a large premium considering Columbus is in the division.

If Fedorov's number is retired, I certainly agree it will not be any time soon.

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Jesus Christ, not this crap again.

Feds is washed up and we have no room for him. Who would you sit so the "has been" can play?

I know we have no room for him, which is disapointing, but i think he could help the young guys a little bit. i'm not going to get into who we would take out to let him play, that's Ken's job, i'm just saying i'd love to see Fedorov finish his career as a red wing, clear up the air, and skate into the sunset as a better man, not the "old washed up has-been" that everyone thinks he is.

Personally it's the best case scenario for me, but looking at the team, cap issues, etc it's never going to happen.

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I see where many are coming from on the topic of Draper, that he isn't a hall of famer etc. However, there is no rule that says you have to be a hall of famer to get your number retired is there? In my opinion, somebody who has their number retired should spend the vast majority of their career with the team and embody the finer qualities of the organization and of the city. To me that is quintessentially Draper, he spent most of his career with the wings, was a vital player on 4 cup winning teams, made an Olympic team and wore an A. Not to mention he was always a nose to the grindstone worker, and never caused a ruckus in any way, he just kept his mouth shut and worked his butt off for the betterment of the team and was a fan favorite. He is a perfect example of what every Red Wing should be, and that is why i think his number should be retired.

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I see where many are coming from on the topic of Draper, that he isn't a hall of famer etc. However, there is no rule that says you have to be a hall of famer to get your number retired is there? In my opinion, somebody who has their number retired should spend the vast majority of their career with the team and embody the finer qualities of the organization and of the city. To me that is quintessentially Draper, he spent most of his career with the wings, was a vital player on 4 cup winning teams, made an Olympic team and wore an A. Not to mention he was always a nose to the grindstone worker, and never caused a ruckus in any way, he just kept his mouth shut and worked his butt off for the betterment of the team and was a fan favorite. He is a perfect example of what every Red Wing should be, and that is why i think his number should be retired.

Jimmy D has stated the official reason Larry Aurie's number was un-retired was because he is not in the Hall of Fame.

Under current owners and management, I would say HoF is definitely a must-have.

Guys like Aurie and Pavelich would need to go in well ahead of Draper.

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Maybe Draper and Maltby retire, and Sammy leaves through FA. Somehow I don't see retaining BOTH Hossa and Hudler. To fill in the blanks you're looking at Leino, Helm perhaps Abdelkader.

I know the topic's been done to death but seeing Fedorov back in red and white would be an awesome thing. For one, it'd be nice to clear the air with him (c'mon, can you honestly say we win 3 cups without him), and plus he still has plenty to offer as a role player for perhaps another year or two. I don't know what his contract situation is with Washington but dammit bring him back! :P

Oh, and his jersey won't be retired if he doesn't come back. HOF though? Hell, yes.

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I know we have no room for him, which is disapointing, but i think he could help the young guys a little bit. i'm not going to get into who we would take out to let him play, that's Ken's job, i'm just saying i'd love to see Fedorov finish his career as a red wing, clear up the air, and skate into the sunset as a better man, not the "old washed up has-been" that everyone thinks he is.

Personally it's the best case scenario for me, but looking at the team, cap issues, etc it's never going to happen.

I agree that it would be good to have him around as a mentor to some young Russian players but we have no young Russian players. As far as the other young guys, we already have enough older players to help them out - Lids, Malts, Drapes. I don't think we need more.

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Maybe Draper and Maltby retire, and Sammy leaves through FA. Somehow I don't see retaining BOTH Hossa and Hudler. To fill in the blanks you're looking at Leino, Helm perhaps Abdelkader.

I know the topic's been done to death but seeing Fedorov back in red and white would be an awesome thing. For one, it'd be nice to clear the air with him (c'mon, can you honestly say we win 3 cups without him), and plus he still has plenty to offer as a role player for perhaps another year or two. I don't know what his contract situation is with Washington but dammit bring him back! :P

Oh, and his jersey won't be retired if he doesn't come back. HOF though? Hell, yes.

I give up....Apparently, logic has no place in this thread..

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I was just thinking about whose numbers will be going in the rafters last night, here's what i came up with:

Locks: Lidstrom, Osgood

Probable: Shanahan, Zetterberg,Datsyuk (barring something unforseen happening to Z or Pav)

Possible: Fedorov -The messy break up is the only thing that puts him in this category,

Chelios-he played 7 seasons in Montreal and won a cup, 9 in Chicago and won 2 Norris Trophies, 9 in Detroit and won 2 Cups and will probably retire as a Wing....a very unique career, not many hall of famers split their career almost equally among 3 teams

Longshots/too early to tell- Draper, had an A, won 4 cups and made an Olympic team, Franzen- if he can keep up his production for the majority of his 11 year deal

I agree that Lidstrom is a lock, but (and with all due respect to Osgood), I don't see him as even probable. I also disagree that Shanahan will have his number retired and Z and Dats are way too young to be even considered for retirement at this point.

Due to Fedorov leaving the way he did, I don't think he'll get his number retired in Detroit either. I think far too many people don't realize how difficult it is to have your number retired in Detroit.

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Locks: Lidstrom

Probable:Osgood

Possible: Shanny,Chelli, Zetterberg and Datsyuk

:blink:

If we let people on this board vote, every player who has worn a Wings jersey would get their number retired, and we'd run out of numbers....

Chelios? No way - maybe if he goes back to the Hawks and they actually win a Cup with him doubtful) they'll hang it there.

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I was just thinking about whose numbers will be going in the rafters last night, here's what i came up with:

Locks: Lidstrom, Osgood

Probable: Shanahan, Zetterberg,Datsyuk (barring something unforseen happening to Z or Pav)

Possible: Fedorov -The messy break up is the only thing that puts him in this category,

Chelios-he played 7 seasons in Montreal and won a cup, 9 in Chicago and won 2 Norris Trophies, 9 in Detroit and won 2 Cups and will probably retire as a Wing....a very unique career, not many hall of famers split their career almost equally among 3 teams

Longshots/too early to tell- Draper, had an A, won 4 cups and made an Olympic team, Franzen- if he can keep up his production for the majority of his 11 year deal

Osgood is not a lock. Draper will not be up there either.

Guys, the number retiring is reserved for elite talents. Not fan favorites.

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Not sure if you were paying attention to this day by day like many of us were in 2003 - I'll give you my rendition. (why not - got a week off til more hockey)

During the course of the 02-03 year, the Wings had a 5 year 50 mill offer on the table. Sergei sat around for quite awhile without signing that offer. Some say he was going through his divorce with Anna, so he was '"upset" and needed time to think things over. Not sure about you, but I don't need time to think about 50mill.

At some point, the Wings rescinded that particular offer, a new one came up 4 yrs, 40 mill.

I am fuzzy on this but it might have been after the Wings got swept in the first round by the Ducks. Sergei rejected that too.

Anyhow, several days went by after the July 1 FA signing period and it seemed no other teams wanted to pay 10 mill per year for Feds (at least that's the impression I got). Rumor was he was still negotiating with Detroit.

Several days later his signed with the Ducks for 5 yrs/40 mill. So essentially he could have had 10 mill per year in Detroit but he took 8 mill per year from the Ducks. All the while his agent was spewing that Sergei only wanted to stay in Detroit.

What I as a huge Fedorov fan got from all this, besides a heartache, was that he never wanted or intended to stay with the Wings once he was a FA. That of course is his right, but it pissed the S^&% out of me as a Wings fan, and someone who hoped Feds retired a Wing. There aren't alot of players who have willingly walked from the Wings for less money, but he is the prime example.

The sad thing is, Fedorov has never been half the player he was since he left Detroit. Should have stayed comrade!

Yeah, in 2003, I was definitely more concerned with fitting in my 9th grade class than hockey. :P

Man, that sounds ridiculous. I wonder where people get the idea that Detroit pulled the contract on him at the last minute? I mean, from some posts I was reading on here before about it, they made it seem like it was one of the most classless things the Red Wings organization had ever done.

Given what you tell me, I don't think there's a chance in hell Feds' number is going to be retired here.

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Guest Crymson
i know most fans will remember sergei fedorov very well. he is in my humble opinion one of the most explosive and best wings ever. maybe he was pricy and a fancy player but he was one of the most clutch playoff guys ever for red wings and he had almost 1000 point for us. he was also a leader and probably the best player on 3 stanley cup clubs for us. no one has wore the number 91 since sergei the fancy. do u guys think wings will retire his number? i think so

Players like Yzerman and Lidstrom, utterly exceptional players in both the hockey sense and in the sense of their relation to the organization, get their jerseys retired. Players like Fedorov and Shanahan do not.

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i know most fans will remember sergei fedorov very well. he is in my humble opinion one of the most explosive and best wings ever. maybe he was pricy and a fancy player but he was one of the most clutch playoff guys ever for red wings and he had almost 1000 point for us. he was also a leader and probably the best player on 3 stanley cup clubs for us. no one has wore the number 91 since sergei the fancy. do u guys think wings will retire his number? i think so

Even if he's good enough, don't you think we should retire the number of players who wanted to play for the Wings instead of bolt every chance they got like Federov? He was a free agent twice. The first time he signed with Carolina and told the Wings not to match. The second time when we couldn't match he signed for LESS money to leave. Screw him.

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Where on earth are people coming up with these "probabilities." Ogsood, Draper, Shanny, what?

Theres a reason why numbers don't get retired all the time. Its once in a blue moon that it happens, and thus far, there are 3 criteria that have to be considered:

1. Commitment to the Red Wings - this can usually be circumvented if the player was traded against his will

2. Inducted into the HHOF

3. Considered one of the best at your position ALL TIME.

Osgood has NOT EVER been considered one of the best all time at his position. At this point, whether folks like it or not, you can easily look at Osgood's wins and chalk it up to the teams he played behind. Nobody thinks of Osgood being the reason the Wings were great for years on end. We've had all kinds of goaltenders and had success. We've won the cup 4 times with 3 different goaltenders. Osgood has never been a common denominator to our success. That alone should tell you his number won't hang. And it shouldn't. That puts Osgood on par with Lidstrom, Yzerman, Howe, Abel, etc. And he simply does not belong in that category.

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I am one of THE biggest Fedorov fans on earth. Up until last off season, I was a huge proponent of retiring #91. He still ranks up there in career points as a Wing, he did score 400 goals with the Wings, Hart Trophy, Selke Award, 3 Stanley Cups. Even the fact that he left for Anaheim as a UFA, didn't sway me from believing he would have #91 up next to the rest of them. But, and this is a big but, he must have come back to the Wings and finish his career here. I was vry optimistic that we'd pick him up at the 2008 trade deadline, I was angry when we didn't. The Stanley Cup (and asking price) helped that anger to leave. Fast forward to July 1st, Marian Hossa. OMG! Marian Hossa! Even with that, I still held out hope that Sergei would come here for a million or less to finish his career back "HOME." Well, he didn't. HE re-signed with Washington for WAY more than that, and now, with the cap issues and the prospectof siging Hossa for life, it is highly unlikely (considering he will be 40 in December) will re-sign here. Thus, ending any, if not all hope of #91 going up where it belongs. Outside chance, maybe (maybe more if Hossa cannot re-sign) he'll be able to come back for Darren McCarty type money. But I believe that the next numbers to go up in the rafters are as follows:

#5

#33

#30

...then we'll have a long time to see if #13, #40, #93 or #81 (doubt it) goes up. Feds will definately go into the Hall. If he enters as a Wing, he has a shot at #91 going up, but if he ends up winning a Cup in Washington, he just may want to shun the Ilitch's again and enter as a Capitol. I am still hoping, but every year he doesn't come back, makes it less and less likely. Just my two cents...

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Yeah, in 2003, I was definitely more concerned with fitting in my 9th grade class than hockey. :P

Man, that sounds ridiculous. I wonder where people get the idea that Detroit pulled the contract on him at the last minute? I mean, from some posts I was reading on here before about it, they made it seem like it was one of the most classless things the Red Wings organization had ever done.

Given what you tell me, I don't think there's a chance in hell Feds' number is going to be retired here.

2003 was such a long time ago. I think the people who did not play close attention to the Wings get the wrong ideas.

The word classless should not be used in the same sentence.

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I agree that Lidstrom is a lock, but (and with all due respect to Osgood), I don't see him as even probable. I also disagree that Shanahan will have his number retired and Z and Dats are way too young to be even considered for retirement at this point.

Due to Fedorov leaving the way he did, I don't think he'll get his number retired in Detroit either. I think far too many people don't realize how difficult it is to have your number retired in Detroit.

Agreed.

#19 was a lifer

*points to hat*

# 5 is a lifer

*points to NN's user name*

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2003 was such a long time ago. I think the people who did not play close attention to the Wings get the wrong ideas.

The word classless should not be used in the same sentence.

I was actually using words from a post I came across some time ago where someone wrote that the way the Red Wings treated Feds in that situation was "one of the most classless moves I've seen from this organization."

So I used the term classless because that's literally what I read.

Edited by Ms_Hockey

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I was actually using words from a post I read where someone wrote that the way the Red Wings treated Feds in that situation was "one of the most classless moves I've seen from this organization."

So I used the term classless because that's literally what I read.

Guess that person was misinformed. I always consider the source, usually. Just to make it clear, I did not think you were calling the organization classless.

I am just stating the word classless should not be used to describe this organization because most of us at least know it is false.

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Players like Yzerman and Lidstrom, utterly exceptional players in both the hockey sense and in the sense of their relation to the organization, get their jerseys retired. Players like Fedorov and Shanahan do not.

This is the big thing. In his prime, Feds was one of the most absurdly phenomenal guys to ever play the game and a big part of the Wings' resurrection and dominance in the 90s. But you need to have had a very special relationship with the Wings' organization if you're going to have any hope of the organization raising your number.

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