will wings retire fedorov's 91?

[jvxp 0]

i know most fans will remember sergei fedorov very well. he is in my humble opinion one of the most explosive and best wings ever. maybe he was pricy and a fancy player but he was one of the most clutch playoff guys ever for red wings and he had almost 1000 point for us. he was also a leader and probably the best player on 3 stanley cup clubs for us. no one has wore the number 91 since sergei the fancy. do u guys think wings will retire his number? i think so

Nope, it will never happen.

[Dabura 12,207]

There is a group of posters that say, "if there is any debate, there is no debate" but the reason there is any debate is because a sizeable chunk of the fanbase is acting like a bunch of jilted girlfriends that ritualistically torch every shred of evidence of the ex.

Like I've said, I understand and appreciate what Feds did for this team. I also understand the circumstances surrounding his departure from this organization. Specifically, I know he didn't simply pack up and say, "Seeya later, losers!" Even so, I don't see him as the kind of heart & soul Wing that gets his number raised. In all honesty, it pains me to say that; I idolized the guy as a kid. I even modeled my own game after his -- and it helped my career, while it lasted.

So I hold him very near and dear. But I just don't see 91 going up. Maybe it will, but I'll be surprised if it does.

[Kwame_Kilpatrick 0]

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but just want to clarify on some of the old-timers.

Sawchuk was bats*** crazy, and actually died from wounds inflicted while he was fighting a teamate when he was with the Rangers.

Lindsay was one of the most despised hockey players ever, and that was before he started trying to unionize which made him even more hated.

Time heals all wounds - and in twenty years most people will look back on Fedorov just like we do Lindsay and Sawchuk and think, "Wow, that guy was a legend."

i agree i mean when the young fans read about fedorov's career in twenty years, they will say wow he came in as an incredible offensive talent and became the best defender in the world, and he was always scoring clutch goals for detroit. not to mention he has almost a thousand points for us which is amazing

[titanium2 867]

The Wings have another category of jerseys that they just don't put into circulation for whatever reason. Vladdy #16 and Larry Aurie #6 (which is another discussion in itself). I think Ozzie's #30 and Drapes' #33 will also be pulled from circulation and I think that's what the Red Wings have done with #91. For all intents and purposes, those numbers are retired. No banner or ceremony, but they do get a face plaque somewhere in the Joe if that's any consolation.

The Red Wings organization does not retire jerseys so liberally. It's easier to get into the hockey hall of fame than to get your jersey retired as a Red Wing.

[norrisnick 1]

i agree i mean when the young fans read about fedorov's career in twenty years, they will say wow he came in as an incredible offensive talent and became the best defender in the world, and he was always scoring clutch goals for detroit. not to mention he has almost a thousand points for us which is amazing

It was the other way around. Fedorov was drafted as a defensive center as that is the role he played in Russia with Bure and Mogilny as his wingers. He stayed back and acted as the defensive conscience for that line. The level of offense he was capable of was a bit of a pleasant surprise.

[vangvace 12]

Which actualy makes the analogy to Lindsay even better - the whole point of Lindsay's fight was so players could earn more money, himself included. He was not a popular figure with owners, GMs, fans and even other players - who were happy to be earning a paycheck playing hockey at all, and thought it was disruptive to make a stink about it.

Fedorov was simply exercising that right Lindsay fought to give. Sure, it does not make him a legendary "team" guy like Yzerman, but Fedorov was a player who deserved to be amongst the league's best paid athletes.

Lindsay was fighting for unionization, pensions, and benefits where-as Fedorov was standing up for...

Sakic signed an offer sheet too..will that prevent Avs from retiring his jersey? Lindsay was traded because of what he had done.

They also retired Bourque's jersey. How many Wing's jersey's should be retired by that standard?

i agree i mean when the young fans read about fedorov's career in twenty years, they will say wow he came in as an incredible offensive talent and became the best defender in the world, and he was always scoring clutch goals for detroit. not to mention he has almost a thousand points for us which is amazing

I think his career will be lightly shadowed by what he had to go through to get to the NHL. It's the better story and his NHL career is the happily ever after.

[ashenhigh 9]

162 games played. 50 goals. 113 assists. 163 points.

In the playoffs.

Four consecutive 20-point performances. In the playoffs. And 3 Cups with the Wings.

Some have thrown around Shanahan -- Shanny? 72 playoff points (44% of Fedorov's total in 65% of the games).

Fedorov's points-per-game in the playoffs eclipsed Yzerman's -- and is almost identical to Howe's.

Further, only 18 players have more playoff points than Fedorov if you only count his resume as a Wing. Of them, only Wayne Gretzky, Mark Messier, Jari Kurri, Glenn Anderson, Joe Sakic, Steve Yzerman, Bryan Trottier, Jean Beliveau, and Mario Lemieux have more with just one team. And four of those guys are associated with the Edmonton Oilers dynasty of the 80s.

No, Fedorov isn't a lock. But he should be (and yes, it feels like I've made this argument before...)

Great post btw....

Who would make the call if it came down to it? Would it be Mike Illitch's son? Assuming if it was to ever happen, it wouldnt be for a certain number of years.

[bringback91 2]

Like I've said, I understand and appreciate what Feds did for this team. I also understand the circumstances surrounding his departure from this organization. Specifically, I know he didn't simply pack up and say, "Seeya later, losers!" Even so, I don't see him as the kind of heart & soul Wing that gets his number raised. In all honesty, it pains me to say that; I idolized the guy as a kid. I even modeled my own game after his -- and it helped my career, while it lasted.

So I hold him very near and dear. But I just don't see 91 going up. Maybe it will, but I'll be surprised if it does.

Wanna join a beer leauge team?

[91to-the-rafters 0]

I've been a Wings fan since the 40 pt. 85-86 season. I saw their rise back to respectability, when just winning the first round was considered a decent season and losing to the Edmonton Oilers in the conference championship was an incredible success (I still have the highlight videos - "Just A Matter of Time", and "We're for Real!"...Classic!). The Wings then stumbled and fell from respectability (I blame the Oates-Federko trade - just an opinion). Their meteoric rise began in '91, coincidently the first year Fedorov really made his presence felt on the ice as a Wing. Obviously Fedorov isn't solely responsible for the incredible success the Wings experienced for a decade. I'll say this, if the powers that be at the Joe found five jersey's to retire for the Cup winning teams in the 1950's, there should be more than two jerseys representing the great team from '92-'02 in the rafters. If you follow that logic, Federov's 91 should be up there.

[YoungKaryia 0]

I didn't see them retire #19 don't think they'll retire #91.

[Statts 4]

I didn't see them retire #19 don't think they'll retire #91.

Look closer

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Like all great players you can find many articles on the internet singing their praises and complementing them about this and that. Here are some of the less flattering Fedorov articles I found with 1 search. The site actually has alot of really good articles about Feds. But the fact that these not so great articles exist is the reason why I never want his jersey retired. It's isn't smoke and mirrors and fiction when Wings fans gripe about his effort, question his heart, question his loyalty. He was a stellar player but it takes more than that IMO to have the honor of getting your number retired. You won't find articles like the following written about Lidstrom and Yzerman.

The Detroit News

February 27, 1998

DETROIT -- The Red Wings bolstered their chances to repeat as Stanley Cup champions Thursday by matching Carolina's $38-million, six-year contract offer to holdout forward Sergei Fedorov.

The Wings' bold move came just hours after arbitrator John Sands deemed the Hurricanes' offer sheet was valid. The NHL had contested a bonus clause.

"It has been a roller coaster of emotions that we have been through," Fedorov said in a statement. "I did indeed request a move to a team where I could play more in critical game situations. Now that Detroit has matched, I must put that request behind me."

Fedorov could be in the Wings lineup as early as tonight.

"I'm anxious to resume my career," Fedorov said.

The 28-year-old Russian will be paid handsomely to do it.

He receives a $14-million signing bonus, a $2-million base salary for the next six seasons and could earn a $12-million bonus this season if the Wings advance to the Western Conference finals. If the Wings fail to reach the conference finals, the $12-million bonus would be paid in $3-million installments over four years.

"This shows a tremendous commitment by the ownership here," Wings General Manager Ken Holland said.

"It's a lot of up-front money, yes. But if you look at the contract ... then it evens out." The contract averages $6.33 million a season.

"We've had some big (personnel) losses over the past year. During the regular season that doesn't show up as much as during the playoffs," Coach Scotty Bowman said in assessing Fedorov's return.

Fedorov's teammates are expected to welcome him back.

"He can come in and prove to all of the guys that this was just a business decision," center Kris Draper said.

The details The Red Wings' $38-million contract includes:

* $14-million signing bonus

* $12-million base salary -- $2 million annually

* Additional $12-million bonus to be paid over the next four seasons. However, if the Wings make it to the conference finals, the entire $12 million would be due immediately.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Even his teammates were acting like "jilted exes" according to NorrisNick. Those stupid teammates. I wish I knew what they had said. Props to Feds for seeming sincere in wanting to win the fans back but even he recognized that what he did didn't look good to the fans and he felt he needed to "right" the wrong.

Cynthia Lambert - The Detroit News

March 1, 1998

Less than a month ago, Sergei Fedorov said he did not want to return to Detroit, but he was forced to Thursday, when the Wings matched the Hurricanes' $38-million offer.

On Friday, Fedorov played in his first NHL game this season. He also spoke with The News' Cynthia Lambert.

Question. Do you now find hockey is now more of a business?

Answer. I never thought that way. Business is over now. Although I was preparing for the hockey the whole time I was out. I tried to stay in shape and hope for the best. It was never business for me. For me, the life path of Sergei Fedorov growing up in this sport until right now, I would not do this for such a long time, and have the passion I have for the game if it was a business. ... What I did was for the human-being part, not the player part. That's the way I'm looking at it. In negotiations, you have to stand up for what you believe in at the moment.

Q. When you signed the offer sheet with Carolina, did you really think Detroit wouldn't match it?

A. Yes, I believed that.

Q. How could you think that after the Wings said that they would match any offer?

A. I thought that it had been a long, frustrating time for both sides. And I thought for me it was better to move on. I said that in August. I'm not going to apologize for what I said. Still, I want to put that whole thing behind me, if I can. If I can't, then I will have to work on that.

Q. Were you looking forward to putting on a Carolina uniform?

A. It was pretty hard. I read some article that said I cut myself out of the (Detroit) community. I say, I never did. My heart and mind were always on my hometown, and I would like to reside here when I can. Work is a different matter. You have to do what you have to do for your life. At some point, you have to start thinking, "What do I want from this?"

Obviously, it's been very tough. It's not easy. I still feel light-headed about what happened. So many emotions I went through, even my body. I was so excited and hyper about playing (for Carolina). Then Detroit matched the offer, and I didn't expect that. It had been tough negotiations.

Q. You seem to be trying to win back Red Wings fans as much as you are trying to win games. Why is that so important to you?

A. I want to get all of them back. It's so important because they are the people who watch. The communication goes both ways. They support the team so much. Fans all over the world are nice, but these are the fans you want, the ones in Detroit. They brought us up to the next level. Like I said, they're entitled to their own opinion because they pay big bucks to see this show.

Q. You say "they can say what they want," but you say it matters to you what they say.

A. It matters because I know they are disappointed in me, some of them. That's why I said days, weeks or months I want to make it up to them.

Q. Does that take words or actions?

A. Probably words are 10 percent. More likely it's actions. Even (Friday) night I tried to do that. That game was difficult. There were mixed emotions running through me, but I wasn't the only one. There were mixed emotions running through a lot of people.

But during the (layoff), I was running around Detroit a lot, and I'd like to thank those people who wished me well. That meant a lot to me.

Q.What seems to be most mind-boggling is that could make $28 million over the next 4-5 months.

A. I got the money, but it doesn't bother me. I don't understand what that money means. I mean, I don't know.

Q. The question is, do you have enough?

A. How much is enough? That's the question. Money and dollar signs don't make sense to me. Believe me, in this world, in North America, money means something after you get off the ice, and you go do your things. When you're on the ice, it's never really the thing. I've played for 100 rubles. But it's a big sum, no question. I understand that.

Q. Is there anything you're going to buy with the $14-million signing bonus?

A. No, I'll probably just put it away, invest it somewhere. Make it work for me when I am done. Plus, I have my parents and my brother. I like to support them as much as I can. It's funny to me, too, people see the numbers and right away in their mind they see that number only, like it happened in one day. Nobody remembers the previous work, where you come from. So it's funny both ways.

Q. Will your relationship with Igor Larionov, Slava Fetisov and Slava Kozlov ever be the same, considering their criticism of you?

A. Whew. We're all grown-ups I guess. I just wish for one minute they could not have made those comments public. Then everything now would be normal. I guess it will take some time. But it will eventually come back to normal.

Q. Were you glad to be able to play your first game at home?

A. That was kind of my game plan all along, to play as soon as I could, whether it was at home or on the road. Why wait? I got a pretty warm welcome, I thought. I'm telling you, it was so emotional. It's going to take some time to do this over and over again.

Q. I get the sense you're glad to be playing hockey, but not necessarily glad to be back with Detroit.

A. The first step was (Friday) night. The coach showed he believed in me and played me in key points. And it seems to me that I didn't let them down. That was important.

Edited April 30, 2009 by GordieSid&Ted

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

More stuff about Feds teammates being stupid, bong smoking, jilted ex girlfriends. How dare they force Fedorov to pick up the tab.

David Flemming - Sports Illustrated

April 20, 1998

Tradition calls for Detroit Red Wings rookies to buy the rest of the team dinner at some point during the season. But in late February, after veteran center Sergei Fedorov ended a bitter and at times divisive contract dispute that had kept him out of action for 59 games by signing a six-year, $38 million deal, the team decided it was time to break with tradition. This season it would be the rich 28-year-old Russian who would pick up the dinner tab.

Last summer Fedorov had alienated his three Russian teammates by skipping a historic trip to Moscow with the Stanley Cup they had just won. A restricted free agent after the season, he hacked off everyone else in the organization by pledging as late as January never to play for Detroit again and then signing an offer sheet from the Carolina Hurricanes, which earned him the nickname Nyet Wing. The Red Wings eventually matched the offer, which could net Fedorov $28 million in salary and bonuses this season. Just a couple of weeks after he signed, the Detroit players decided that Fedorov would take them all to a steak house as a first step toward patching things up with them.

The Red Wings, it turns out, were more than happy to bury the hatchet with Fedorov that night--right into about three dozen porterhouse steaks. "We ate everything we could stick in our faces," says forward Joey Kocur. Seafood platters followed the steaks. Waiters rushed to the table with expensive ports, Godiva chocolates and fistfuls of cigars. The bill came to more than $10,000 before Fedorov added a tip roughly the size of a small car loan. "We gave Sergei a bit of a hard time when he came back," says right wing Darren McCarty. "It was all in good fun. But he's a smart guy, and he knew the best way to shut up a bunch of hockey players was to put food in our mouths. We pigged out.".

Since that banquet Detroit has been feasting on opponents. With the regular season drawing to a close, no team has been hotter than the defending Stanley Cup champions, who at week's end were 9-1-2 in their last 12 games and had the second best record (44-20-15) in the Western Conference, two points behind the Dallas Stars.

A few days before hosting the feast, Fedorov walked up to Red Wings owner Mike Ilitch in the team's dressing room in the Joe Louis Arena and said, "I will earn every penny." After a slow start Fedorov is starting to keep that promise. Detroit's playoff hopes lie mostly in the hands of goalie Chris Osgood, but the team's surge is due in large part to Fedorov, who in 1993-94 was the league MVP and won the Selke Trophy as the NHL's best defensive forward. Fedorov was the Wings' leading playoff scorer (20 points) last season and is perhaps the most gifted skater in the game, but he still hasn't beaten the rap that he doesn't play hard all the time. "Anyone who questions the money Sergei got doesn't understand one thing--there aren't two Sergei Fedorovs in the NHL," says McCarty. "When he wants to play, he can be the best player in the league.".

After leading the Russian Olympic team to a silver medal in Nagano, Fedorov returned to Detroit in excellent shape and, with the addition of a weight program to his workout regimen, has been playing more like a power forward, muscling defenders and digging pucks out of the corners. He's so happy to be back, he comes to the rink on his days off for conditioning work or just to sit at his locker and tape his sticks. The contract has done what no one thought a huge deal could possibly do: It has lit a fire under Fedorov. Through Sunday he had 10 points in his last eight games, including a goal and an assist in a 5-2 romp over the New York Rangers last Saturday at home. "Sergei changes the dynamic of this team because he is a unique talent," says Detroit assistant coach Dave Lewis. "It's hard to put into words. It's his speed, his versatility. He's a guy the opponent must always be aware of on the ice, kind of like Wayne Gretzky.".

Under terms of his contract, Fedorov received a $14 million signing bonus, gets $2 million in salary and will be paid a $12 million bonus if Detroit reaches the conference finals--all for four months' work. But over the life of the contract Fedorov will earn an average of $6.3 million per season, which is a fair price for a player of his caliber. (Philadelphia Flyers center Eric Lindros, for example, makes $8 million per season.).

Fedorov knows the value of money, for it was a bribe of 500 Swiss francs to a Soviet team official that allowed him to defect from the Red Army team in July 1990. During that period of his life, he didn't have a car or much money, and he lived in an army barracks. "That was sucking very, very much," Fedorov says.

Still, the potential playoff bonus was hard for the members of the Detroit organization and some fans to swallow. The Wings tried unsuccessfully to get the league to throw out the offer sheet, saying that the clause calling for the $12 million bonus was unfair to Detroit because the powerful Red Wings had a good chance to advance to the conference finals while the Hurricanes would be hard-pressed to even reach the playoffs. Earlier in the season one teammate was quoted in a Detroit newspaper as saying, "How can you pay a guy $6 million or even $5 million if you have to go to him before every game and ask him to play (hard)?" (Fedorov did help dispel his reputation as a soft player in last year's conference finals against the hated Colorado Avalanche when he skated with broken ribs and scored the series-winning goal.).

Upon his return to the lineup six weeks ago, the home crowd booed Fedorov mercilessly until two things happened: Coach Scotty Bowman called a local sports radio show from his car phone and told the fans to lay off, and Fedorov scored both goals in a 2-0 home win against Colorado on April 1. After receiving a standing ovation when he was named the game's first star, Fedorov was near tears.

"I knew the price I would pay for getting this contract," says Fedorov. "Right now I'm just being laid-back and quiet. I will just breathe hockey and think nothing but hockey, because playing my heart out every day is the best way to move forward.".

Fedorov also had to overcome the wrath of his Russian teammates, incurred when he skipped the Stanley Cup tour of their homeland, which was supposed to be a symbolic gesture toward the players who never got to leave the former Soviet Union for the good life in the NHL. Fedorov says he wasn't invited and didn't want to celebrate without teammate Vladimir Konstantinov, who was in critical condition in a Detroit-area hospital after suffering head injuries in an automobile accident. "There are no hard feelings," center Igor Larionov says now. "In Russia we have a saying, 'Do not talk about the past, otherwise you will lose your eye.'".

The Red Wings must be adhering to that philosophy. On the verge of the playoffs, they are focused on one thing: another Stanley Cup.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Mitch Albom - Detroit Free Press

Wednesday, April 19, 2000

excerpt:

Sergei Fedorov, in the middle.

He is 30 now. He has been an NHL story for 10 years. But in many ways, Fedorov remains the most puzzling star in hockey.

"Some people -- some journalists, I think -- are a little bit afraid of me," he says. "They don't know how to take what I say. They say, 'Where is this guy? Where is his heart, his soul, his mind?' "

All good questions. For rarely has there been, this side of Barry Sanders, a sports star who has stayed so long in one town yet eludes description like a bee eluding a swat. Fedorov, depending on whom you listen to, is either the most gifted player in the NHL or the most self-absorbed; the most misunderstood man on his team, or the least interested; a rocket in the playoffs, or a floater in the regular season; the most sensitive Russian, or the most aloof.

He is intelligent; he is gossip fodder; he cuts a movie star figure; yet he is often his own worst enemy. When he thinks he's being sweet, others think he's showing off. When he thinks he's being erudite, others think he's being evasive. He barely said a word about dating tennis star Anna Kournikova -- journalists did all the talking, giggling and whispering -- yet he took the brunt of the spotlight and the criticism.

Where is his heart, his soul, his mind?

Much of it is still inside the bony frame of that 10-year-old boy, who always thought his skating was all he was supposed to bring to the rink.

[YoungKaryia 0]

I didn't see them retire #19 don't think they'll retire #91.

When did they do that? I thought I remembered talking with someone and they said they didn't.....maybe they were talking league wide like Gretzky.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Ugghhh....I forgot what a psycho Feds dad was.

Reuters

MOSCOW -- Russia's Sergei Fedorov should quit the Detroit Red Wings after they "disrespected" the All-Star center by asking him to play defense, his father told the Sport-Express newspaper.

"This summer, when Sergei becomes an unrestricted free agent, I urge him to change the club," said Viktor Fedorov. "Sergei has already proved everything to everyone in his past 11 seasons in Detroit."

Fedorov, who last month was named in Russia's Olympic team for the Winter Games in Salt Lake City, is in the final year of a six-year, $38 million contract.

His father added: "I believe this (playing defense) is the latest display of disrespect to my son by his coach and general manager, who are responsible for the team's composition.

"I'm convinced that coaching experiments by (coach) Scotty Bowman were the only real cause of my son's drop in scoring in December, when the coach broke up an excellent line of Fedorov, (Kris) Draper and (Brendan) Shanahan.

"For many years, Bowman has been reducing Sergei's playing time in favor of lesser players, which prevents Sergei from showing all his talent.

"Therefore, when there was talk about trading Sergei to Philadelphia for (Eric) Lindros last summer, I was all in favor of it."

Sergei Fedorov was voted the NHL's Most Valuable Player in 1994 and helped the Red Wings win the Stanley Cup in 1997 and 1998.

He joined them in the summer of 1990 when he decided to remain in the United States instead of returning to the Soviet Union following the Goodwill Games in Seattle.

In his 11 previous NHL seasons, the 32-year-old has scored 333 goals and 470 assists for a total of 803 points. He has 14 goals and 22 assists so far this season.

Viktor Fedorov, a hockey coach, trained his son as a junior.

[Reds4Life 51]

wow brilliant posts GordieSid&Ted, they ALL really matter.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

wow brilliant posts GordieSid&Ted, they ALL really matter.

Yeah, they actually do matter to me in regards to whether or not he should have his jersey retired.

He is no Steve Yzerman. He is no Nick Lidstrom. Those are his contemporaries. Those are the 2 players to which I would compare him to in regards to having the highest Red Wing honor bestowed upon him.

Nobody ever questioned Stevie or Nick like they did Fedorov. And these are just issues he had in the late 90's. None of these articles even speaks about the last contract clusterf***s.

I have my reasons for not wanting his jersey retired. Thanks to the many, many articles documenting his not so selfless side when it came to the Red Wings organization, I feel justified in how I come to my decision.

You want his jersey retired, so be it. I don't. ******* get over it Sally.

[Reds4Life 51]

Yeah, they actually do matter to me in regards to whether or not he should have his jersey retired.

He is no Steve Yzerman. He is no Nick Lidstrom. Those are his contemporaries. Those are the 2 players to which I would compare him to in regards to having the highest Red Wing honor bestowed upon him.

Nobody ever questioned Stevie or Nick like they did Fedorov. And these are just issues he had in the late 90's. None of these articles even speaks about the last contract clusterf***s.

I have my reasons for not wanting his jersey retired. Thanks to the many, many articles documenting his not so selfless side when it came to the Red Wings organization, I feel justified in how I come to my decision.

You want his jersey retired, so be it. I don't. ******* get over it Sally.

Get over what? I don't care what you think. I just have to laugh at your ridiculous attempt to belittle Fedorov's importance by posting some media crap about him and saying he wasn't like Yzerman or Lidstrom.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Get over what? I don't care what you think. I just have to laugh at your ridiculous attempt to belittle Fedorov's importance by posting some media crap about him and saying he wasn't like Yzerman or Lidstrom.

It must break your heart that for every person like you who loves Fedorov and thinks he never did anything wrong, there is a person like me who thinks the highest honor a Red Wing could ever get means you have to do better than Fedorov.

You don't see me arguing about his importance in winning cups or how great a player he was or how many points he put up, do you? No, because those things are indisputable. He was a world class player and essential to those 3 cups.

However, I cannot overlook the things he did that put himself ahead of the organization. You just call them dumb articles. Okay, so every great article ever written about Sergei is just a dumb article too. You want to play that game or you want to be rational about the debate?

Feds has issues that for alot of fans take away from what he contributed on the ice and make the decision of retiring his number a difficult one.

You don't have to care what I think or how many people agree with me. It's enough for me to know that the debate is real, that it is a legitimate debate, that it kills you personally to accept that fact and that his jersey isn't ever going to be retired....and it shouldn't. I'm content with that. Good luck getting through life with that disappointment.

[hockeysattva 8]

http://www.detroithockey.net/history/retired.php

Retired numbers are a rare thing indeed... look at the rafters and ask, seriously, "who belongs with them?"

More than half the suggestions for the Hall of Fame won't ever make it either, maximum four players a year.

[hockeysattva 8]

As of 2008, 240 players, 97 builders and 15 on-ice officials have been inducted into the Hall of Fame.

There are currently 96 retired numbers in the NHL.

[egroen 384]

I actually enjoyed reading those articles. Dads are dads, just most of them know better than to mouth off to the media when they think their famous son is getting the raw end of the deal. A junior hockey coach is going to play his best player as much as possible, so I can understand him thinking Sergei was being "disrespected", but Bowman was running a professional team.

At times, Sergei wanted something different - and he twice tried to get away. I guess I am just not that offended by it. People change jobs, pack up and move elsewhere all the time and leave friends and others behind. It's ultimately a job for these guys. What I get from these articles is that Sergei did genuinely care about the organization, his teamates, the fans and about playing hockey. I dont think it was ever as much about the money, but the chance to really lead a team. Sure, it is a different attitude than Yzerman and Lidstrom, but I don't think it is a terrible thing to want at all. You may have highlighted that he had alienated some fans and teamates for a while, but he also did a lot for charity in Detroit. No matter who you are, $2+ million is a lot to give.

His charity still operates in Detroit, he still has a home here. He has said on more than one occassion he would welcome the opportunity to play in Detroit again. And by many accounts he frequently visits the Ilitch family. Just not a lot for me to feel "jilted" about there. He's still playing hockey at his age, and by all accounts is a huge team player, leader and still a hard worker. Obviously he does not need to be doing any of that with all he has accomplished and the money he has made. He'll even still play defense on occassion, and while I can't fault him for preferring to play forward, he still does it, and does it well.

Lidstrom has threatened to play in Sweden a few times, and it may have been a tactic for more money - neither he nor Yzerman are infallible. Yzerman certainly made a lot more money than he was worth this decade. Stevie clashed with Bowman as well. None of it is that big of a deal to me.

I feel the good Sergei contributed to this team and community vastly outweighs the negatives, but I will certainly admit they are negatives. I just don't think those negatives are enough to keep a deserving candidate from getting his number retired in Detroit.

[Opie 308]

Lidstrom has threatened to play in Sweden a few times, and it may have been a tactic for more money - neither he nor Yzerman are infallible. Yzerman certainly made a lot more money than he was worth this decade. Stevie clashed with Bowman as well. None of it is that big of a deal to me.

I am staying out of the rest of this post we have been here done that about 8000 times on this board.

However are you seriosly trying to tell me that the guy who willing gave up money for more talent to join the team used playing in Sweden as a threat?

First off I have never seen Lids say, "I don't want to play for the Wings any more."

I have heard rumblings that he would like to go home and play for his native Sweden, to me that is very very different from saying, "I would love to play for the Hurricanes/Ducks, I don't want to play in Detroit".

What was his reasoning, Ana was closer to Russia?

Saying you want to go back and play for your home country or play back home is different than saying I want to play for another team in your league because I don't like you.

A comparison of Lids and Feds ends at the fact they both wore the winged wheel! Lids is a consummate pro, Feds is and only ever has been worried about himself. I have no problem with that, doesn't bother me, but that attitude sure as hell keeps you from getting your number retired in Det.

List of things lids did that make him a Red Wing at Heart (which is pivotal in getting your Jersey to the rafters):

- Took a lesser contract to get more talent here.

- Surrendered money (He, Stevie, and Shanny all gave back money (pre-cba) to get Hull, Dom, Luc in Det)

- Wore the C (say what you want this weighs heavy, it takes a lot to get the C on your chest on this team)

- Kept contracts and whatever other business in house.

- Always put the Org ahead of himself.

- Lids is one of the top 5 (depending on your view #2 imo) of all time at his position, both reg and post season.

- NEVER HELD OUT! (your and my opinion of this as a business decision is moot, The Org's opinion on this is a huge bone of contention).

Anyone else feel free to add on!

Edited April 30, 2009 by Opie