Should Valtteri Filppula be traded?

[cupforwings 138]

Filpula has been a beast these last 2 games

[titanium2 867]

I stole this from RWC.--For once they had a genuine discussion thread that did not go off topic after the OP.

It's quite an interesting slew of comparative information in regards to Filppula in order "to get a better understanding of how exactly Filppula compares to second line centers across the league":

Total Points 2010/2011 Season

1. Vancouver - Ryan Kesler: 53 Games 30 Goals 20 Assists 50 Points

2. Chicago - Patrick Sharp: 51 26 21 47

3. Dallas - Mike Ribeiro: 52 10 36 46

4. Philadelphia - Danny Briere: 49 26 19 45

5. Colorado - Matt Duchene: 51 20 25 45

6. Boston -- Patrice Bergeron: 52 19 25 44

7. Carolina - Tuomo Ruutu: 52 12 28 40

8. Toronto - Mikhail Grabovski: 50 21 18 39

9. San Jose - Joe Pavelski: 44 11 24 35

10. Los Angeles - Jarret Stoll: 52 14 18 32

11. Detroit - Valtteri Filppula: 48 12 19 31

12. Minnesota - Matt Cullen: 48 10 21 31

13. St. Louis - Patrik Berglund: 50 11 19 30

14. Atlanta – Bryan Little: 48 14 15 29

15. Columbus - Antoine Vermette: 51 12 17 29

16. NY Rangers - Artem Anisimov: 54 11 17 28

17. Montreal - Scott Gomez: 50 6 20 26

18. Nashville - Colin Wilson (I think?): 52 12 14 26

19. Tampa Bay - Vinny Lecavalier: 37 8 16 24

20. Calgary - Matt Stajan: 47 4 20 24

21. Florida - Mike Santorelli: 52 14 14 28

22. Anaheim - Saku Koivu: 52 11 17 28

23. New Jersey - Jason Arnott: 52 13 10 23

24. Ottawa - Mike Fisher: 52 13 9 22

25. Buffalo - Tim Connolly: 36 6 14 20

26. Phoenix - Martin Hanzal: 46 11 9 20

27. NY Islanders - Robbie Schremp: 36 7 12 19

28. Edmonton - Shawn Horcoff: 30 7 11 18

29. Washington - Marcus Johansson (I think?): 40 6 6 12

30. Pittsburgh - Jordan Staal: 14 3 5 8

Points/game 2010/2011 Season

1. Vancouver - Ryan Kesler: 53 Games 30 Goals 20 Assists 50 Points 0.94 Points/game

2. Chicago - Patrick Sharp: 51 26 21 47 0.92

2. Philadelphia - Danny Briere: 49 26 19 45 0.92

4. Dallas - Mike Ribeiro: 52 10 36 46 0.88

4. Colorado - Matt Duchene: 51 20 25 45 0.88

6. Boston -- Patrice Bergeron: 52 19 25 44 0.84

7. San Jose - Joe Pavelski: 44 11 24 35 0.80

8. Toronto - Mikhail Grabovski: 50 21 18 39 0.78

9. Carolina - Tuomo Ruutu: 52 12 28 40 0.77

10. Detroit - Valtteri Filppula: 48 12 19 31 0.65

10. Minnesota - Matt Cullen: 48 10 21 31 0.65

10. Tampa Bay - Vinny Lecavalier: 37 8 16 24 0.65

13. Los Angeles - Jarret Stoll: 52 14 18 32 0.62

14. St. Louis - Patrik Berglund: 50 11 19 30 0.60

14. Atlanta – Bryan Little: 48 14 15 29 0.60

14. Edmonton - Shawn Horcoff: 30 7 11 18 0.60

17. Columbus - Antoine Vermette: 51 12 17 29 0.57

17. Pittsburgh - Jordan Staal: 14 3 5 8 0.57

19. Buffalo - Tim Connolly: 36 6 14 20 0.56

20. Florida - Mike Santorelli: 52 14 14 28 0.54

20. Anaheim - Saku Koivu: 52 11 17 28 0.54

22. NY Islanders - Robbie Schremp: 36 7 12 19 0.53

23. NY Rangers - Artem Anisimov: 54 11 17 28 0.52

23. Montreal - Scott Gomez: 50 6 20 26 0.52

25. Calgary - Matt Stajan: 47 4 20 24 0.51

26. Nashville - Colin Wilson (I think?): 52 12 14 26 0.50

27. New Jersey - Jason Arnott: 52 13 10 23 0.44

28. Phoenix - Martin Hanzal: 46 11 9 20 0.43

29. Ottawa - Mike Fisher: 52 13 9 22 0.42

30. Washington - Marcus Johansson (I think?): 40 6 6 12 0.30

Points/game/CapHit 2010/2011 Season:

1. Florida - Mike Santorelli: 52 GP 14G 14A 28P 0.54 Points/game $0.6M CapHit 0.9000 P/G/CapHit

2. NY Islanders - Robbie Schremp: 36 7 12 19 0.53 $0.750750M 0.7060

3. NY Rangers - Artem Anisimov: 54 11 17 28 0.52 $0.821666M 0.6329

4. St. Louis - Patrik Berglund: 50 11 19 30 0.60 $1.246667M 0.4813

5. Washington - Marcus Johansson (I think?): 40 6 6 12 0.30 $0.9M 0.3333

6. Nashville - Colin Wilson (I think?): 52 12 14 26 0.50 $1.725M 0.2899

7. Colorado - Matt Duchene: 51 20 25 45 0.88 $3.2M 0.275

8. Toronto - Mikhail Grabovski: 50 21 18 39 0.78 $2.9M 0.2690

9. Atlanta – Bryan Little: 48 14 15 29 0.60 $2.383333M 0.2518

10. Phoenix - Martin Hanzal: 46 11 9 20 0.43 $1.8M 0.2389

11. Chicago - Patrick Sharp: 51 26 21 47 0.92 $3.9M .2359

12. Detroit - Valtteri Filppula: 48 12 19 31 0.65 $3M 0.2167

13. Anaheim - Saku Koivu: 52 11 17 28 0.54 $2.5M 0.2160

14. Carolina - Tuomo Ruutu: 52 12 28 40 0.77 $3.8M 0.2026

15. San Jose - Joe Pavelski: 44 11 24 35 0.80 $4M 0.200

16. Vancouver - Ryan Kesler: 53 Games 30 20 50 0.94 $5M 0.188

17. Minnesota - Matt Cullen: 48 10 21 31 0.65 $3.5M 0.1857

18. Boston -- Patrice Bergeron: 52 19 25 44 0.84 $4.75M 0.1768

19. Dallas - Mike Ribeiro: 52 10 36 46 0.88 $5M 0.1760

20. Los Angeles - Jarret Stoll: 52 14 18 32 0.62 $3.6M 0.1722

21. Columbus - Antoine Vermette: 51 12 17 29 0.57 $3.75M 0.1520

22. Calgary - Matt Stajan: 47 4 20 24 0.51 $3.5M 0.1457

23. Pittsburgh - Jordan Staal: 14 3 5 8 0.57 $4M 0.1425

24. Philadelphia - Danny Briere: 49 26 19 45 0.92 $6.5M 0.1415

25. Buffalo - Tim Connolly: 36 6 14 20 0.56 $4.5M 0.1244

26. Edmonton - Shawn Horcoff: 30 7 11 18 0.60 $5.5M 0.1091

27. Ottawa - Mike Fisher: 52 13 9 22 0.42 $4.2M 0.1000

28. New Jersey - Jason Arnott: 52 13 10 23 0.44 $4.5M 0.0978

29. Tampa Bay - Vinny Lecavalier: 37 8 16 24 0.65 $7.727273M 0.0841

30. Montreal - Scott Gomez: 50 6 20 26 0.52 $7.357143M 0.0707

FO% 2010/2011 Season

1. Los Angeles - Jarret Stoll: 57.7 FO%

2. Vancouver - Ryan Kesler: 56.3

3. Boston -- Patrice Bergeron: 55.9

3. St. Louis - Patrik Berglund: 55.9

5. Columbus - Antoine Vermette: 55.3

6. San Jose - Joe Pavelski: 54.8

7. Minnesota - Matt Cullen: 54.6

8. Detroit - Valtteri Filppula: 52.2

9. Anaheim - Saku Koivu: 51.9

10. New Jersey - Jason Arnott: 51.6

11. Phoenix - Martin Hanzal: 50.9

12. Calgary - Matt Stajan: 50.6

13. Montreal - Scott Gomez: 50.4

14. Colorado - Matt Duchene: 49.2

14. Ottawa - Mike Fisher: 49.2

16. Edmonton - Shawn Horcoff: 48.9

17. Tampa Bay - Vinny Lecavalier: 48.8

18. Florida - Mike Santorelli: 48.6

19. Nashville - Colin Wilson: 48.5

20. NY Islanders - Robbie Schremp: 48.2

21. Chicago - Patrick Sharp: 48.1

22. Dallas - Mike Ribeiro: 47.6

23. Toronto - Mikhail Grabovski: 47.1

24. Atlanta – Bryan Little: 46.6

24. Buffalo - Tim Connolly: 46.6

26. NY Rangers - Artem Anisimov: 43.6

27. Pittsburgh - Jordan Staal: 43.5

28. Philadelphia - Danny Briere: 45.7

29. Washington - Marcus Johansson: 4 39.8

30. Carolina - Tuomo Ruutu: 38.9

Interesting stuff.

[Guest Crymson]

Looks like he's doing well.

[brett 1,029]

he would probably be doing even better if they had a healthy team.

nice stats to whoever took the time to do all that

[St. Michael (the Red Wing) 422]

Nice stats indeed. I wouldn't be opposed to trading Filppula however it's highly unlikely. The only big complaint I have for Filppula is his price tag. 3 mil a season? Seams to high to me but what do I know nothing...

[brett 1,029]

no hes a very reasonable price.

theres only 7 players on that list that are under 2 mil and a lot of them are rookies or sophmores.

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Still no.

He needs to shoot the puck more still though.

[Guest Heaten]

Nice stats indeed. I wouldn't be opposed to trading Filppula however it's highly unlikely. The only big complaint I have for Filppula is his price tag. 3 mil a season? Seams to high to me but what do I know nothing...

If you look at the chart Titanium posted, you'll see that Filppula's salary is very, very reasonable (if not under paid) compared to other 2nd line centers in the league.

Top 10 in PPG

Top 10 in Faceoff %

And one of the top players @ best bargain.

-Rant (not directed at you, Michael)

Wings are slumping not because they need a "shake up", but because key players are out.

A) Team defense will be better with Datsyuk and Stuart.

B) Power play will improve when Holmstrom and Datsyuk return.

C) Penalty kill will improve when Stuart returns (and Jimmy pulls his head out of his ass)

When healthy, this team doesn't need any different skater to go all the way. The weakest area of this team is goaltending.

[Pucks 66]

Filppula isn't the kind of player you trade away, he's the type of young player teams covet.

[Dimaline312000 51]

The only player I would trade right now would be Salei. He just hasn't impressed me enough to be on the team. Filps I would only trade if we could get a great realistic deal for him.

[Konnan511 1,736]

If you look at the chart Titanium posted, you'll see that Filppula's salary is very, very reasonable (if not under paid) compared to other 2nd line centers in the league.

Top 10 in PPG

Top 10 in Faceoff %

And almost top 10 in cheapest of the 2nd line centers.

This is how good GMs work. They overpay in the first couple years, then at the end of your contract you are being underpaid. This is why 95% of LGW would make terrible GMs. It's not a win now league, it's a win now and the future league.

[chrisdetroit 189]

If you look at the chart Titanium posted, you'll see that Filppula's salary is very, very reasonable (if not under paid) compared to other 2nd line centers in the league.

Top 10 in PPG

Top 10 in Faceoff %

And one of the top players @ best bargain.

-Rant (not directed at you, Michael)

Wings are slumping not because they need a "shake up", but because key players are out.

A) Team defense will be better with Datsyuk and Stuart.

B) Power play will improve when Holmstrom and Datsyuk return.

C) Penalty kill will improve when Stuart returns (and Jimmy pulls his head out of his ass)

When healthy, this team doesn't need any different skater to go all the way. The weakest area of this team is goaltending.

Exactly, I would trade Flip for a top goaltender but I don't see any of them on the trading block right now.

[Z and D for the C 712]

I would trade Flip for a top goaltender

So you would trade one weakness (goaltending) for another (2nd line center)?

[eva unit zero 271]

So you would trade one weakness (goaltending) for another (2nd line center)?

Detroit has eight forwards among the top 180 forwards in scoring who are natural centers:

Beyond that, there are two more who are right on the cusp.

Of those ten forwards, six are natural centers. Only one is not considered a very good defensive forward.

And that doesn't even factor in Modano, whose production rate isn't quite at that level but was improving.

I know you love your Flip, but the Wings would hardly have a weakness at center on the second line if Filppula were traded for a goaltender. If anything, the Wings are super-deep at center. The Wings have played 25 skaters this season, 12 of which played through amateur hockey and began pro careers as centers. This is compared to seven defensemen and six wingers.

There's the obvious choice to split Dats and Z. But let's say they stay together. So who centers the second line? Franzen? Hudler? Helm? Maybe it doesn't provide the general all-around player Flip is, but all of them are valid choices. If Flip were dealt, with no other roster players, for a goaltender to take the reins from Howard, I would like one of these:

Z/Dats/Homer

Franzen/Hudler/Bertuzzi

Cleary/Helm/Eaves

Draper/Abdelkader/Miller

Franzen/Z/Cleary

Holmstrom/Datsyuk/Hudler

Eaves/Helm/Bertuzzi

Draper/Abdelkader/Miller

[Nevermind 363]

There's the obvious choice to split Dats and Z. But let's say they stay together. So who centers the second line? Franzen? Hudler? Helm? Maybe it doesn't provide the general all-around player Flip is, but all of them are valid choices. If Flip were dealt, with no other roster players, for a goaltender to take the reins from Howard, I would like one of these:

Z/Dats/Homer

Franzen/Hudler/Bertuzzi

Cleary/Helm/Eaves

Draper/Abdelkader/Miller

Franzen/Z/Cleary

Holmstrom/Datsyuk/Hudler

Eaves/Helm/Bertuzzi

Draper/Abdelkader/Miller

Hudler is not a center in the NHL. It doesn't matter if he played center in Europe for his junior team or whatever. He lacks the speed, defensive conscious and more than likely the faceoff ability to ever play center in the show. And since Franzen started scoring goals, he's far better at wing.

Losing Filppula for a goalie forces us to keep Pavel and Z on separate lines. Though Fil's offensive consistency is frustrating, he's extremely solid defensively and has a lot of speed through the middle. We simply don't have another player who can adequately pivot the second line. In a cap world, Filppula's a very good second line center. Hopefully he hasn't reach his offensive ceiling quite yet.

[eva unit zero 271]

Hudler is not a center in the NHL. It doesn't matter if he played center in Europe for his junior team or whatever. He lacks the speed, defensive conscious and more than likely the faceoff ability to ever play center in the show. And since Franzen started scoring goals, he's far better at wing.

Losing Filppula for a goalie forces us to keep Pavel and Z on separate lines. Though Fil's offensive consistency is frustrating, he's extremely solid defensively and has a lot of speed through the middle. We simply don't have another player who can adequately pivot the second line. In a cap world, Filppula's a very good second line center. Hopefully he hasn't reach his offensive ceiling quite yet.

Hudler has improved considerably at the dot since his rookie year and is probably average to above average for a center on faceoffs, although his stat line says he's DOMINANT!!!!!!! He's not a lockdown center defensively but when compared to the league and not to the Wings, he's not a liability. He's a skilled playmaker with a very good shot. Yet you're telling me that putting him in a playmaker-first role with Bertuzzi and Franzen (two big, defensively responsible wingers capable of scoring goals) Maybe Hudler centering Holmstrom and Miller wouldn't be a great choice, but I think Huds between Franzen and Bert would make for as good a second line as any in the league. The opposition wouldn't be able to focus on any one player because Bert and Hudler are both dual threats as playmakers and goal-scorers, and Franzen is arguably the team's top sniper. Teams like Los Angeles, San Jose, or Tampa Bay have that one key player who drives the second line and can be taken out. would be a bad idea.

[Wingzman91 134]

The question is and still should be, why trade flip?

because he has value vs hudler?

Those are poor reasons.

Everyone is looking to make the trade that makes immediate impact.

Because saying that you would solidify the forwards and maybe make a minor d move or get a backup goalie doesnt sound flashy enough to post.

I like the team, and this year is a great year for the standard, "Getting our players back from ir is our deadline move".

No center we get would have nearly the same chemistry as flip does with this team.

So, no, he shouldn't be traded.

[Broken 16 381]

Hudler has improved considerably at the dot since his rookie year and is probably average to above average for a center on faceoffs, although his stat line says he's DOMINANT!!!!!!! He's not a lockdown center defensively but when compared to the league and not to the Wings, he's not a liability. He's a skilled playmaker with a very good shot. Yet you're telling me that putting him in a playmaker-first role with Bertuzzi and Franzen (two big, defensively responsible wingers capable of scoring goals) Maybe Hudler centering Holmstrom and Miller wouldn't be a great choice, but I think Huds between Franzen and Bert would make for as good a second line as any in the league. The opposition wouldn't be able to focus on any one player because Bert and Hudler are both dual threats as playmakers and goal-scorers, and Franzen is arguably the team's top sniper. Teams like Los Angeles, San Jose, or Tampa Bay have that one key player who drives the second line and can be taken out. would be a bad idea.

Are you really trying to sell Hudler as second line center? Really?

Holy crap. Franzen/Hudler/Bert? You're mad. First off, Bert has improved his defensive game, but he's still a retro-fit. No offense Bert. Franzen is NOT a 'defense first' forward. Yes, he's defensively capable when he wants to be, but not enough to carry a line. That leaves Hudler with the most defensive responsibility on the second line and center to boot. God help us.

Unless you figure that they are gonna score so many goals that it won't matter, in which case I would like to point out that you've put arguably the three most streaky Wings on the same line. Lol.

Edited February 7, 2011 by Broken 16

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Are you really trying to sell Hudler as second line center? Really?

Holy crap. Franzen/Hudler/Bert? You're mad. First off, Bert has improved his defensive game, but he's still a retro-fit. No offense Bert. Franzen is NOT a 'defense first' forward. Yes, he's defensively capable when he wants to be, but not enough to carry a line. That leaves Hudler with the most defensive responsibility on the second line and center to boot. God help us.

Unless you figure that they are gonna score so many goals that it won't matter, in which case I would like to point out that you've put arguably the three most streaky Wings on the same line. Lol.

It's eva unit zero and Jiri Hudler. Don't get him revved up anymore than he already is...

Edited February 7, 2011 by SouthernWingsFan

[Broken 16 381]

It's eva unit zero and Jiri Hudler. Don't get him revved up anymore than he already is...

I try to avoid stirring him up too much most times... but c'mon...

[titanium2 867]

I try to avoid stirring him up too much most times... but c'mon...

Did you know that Zetterberg is a power forward?

[Finnish Wing 110]

Did you know that Zetterberg is a power forward?

[Nevermind 363]

Did you know that Zetterberg is a power forward?

Did you know that Datsyuk is an enforcer?

[Z and D for the C 712]

Detroit has eight forwards among the top 180 forwards in scoring who are natural centers:

Beyond that, there are two more who are right on the cusp.

Of those ten forwards, six are natural centers. Only one is not considered a very good defensive forward.

And that doesn't even factor in Modano, whose production rate isn't quite at that level but was improving.

I know you love your Flip, but the Wings would hardly have a weakness at center on the second line if Filppula were traded for a goaltender. If anything, the Wings are super-deep at center. The Wings have played 25 skaters this season, 12 of which played through amateur hockey and began pro careers as centers. This is compared to seven defensemen and six wingers.

There's the obvious choice to split Dats and Z. But let's say they stay together. So who centers the second line? Franzen? Hudler? Helm? Maybe it doesn't provide the general all-around player Flip is, but all of them are valid choices. If Flip were dealt, with no other roster players, for a goaltender to take the reins from Howard, I would like one of these:

Z/Dats/Homer

Franzen/Hudler/Bertuzzi

Cleary/Helm/Eaves

Draper/Abdelkader/Miller

Franzen/Z/Cleary

Holmstrom/Datsyuk/Hudler

Eaves/Helm/Bertuzzi

Draper/Abdelkader/Miller

Eva, Hudler will NEVER EVER EVER EVER play center on this wings team. Get that through your skull. It will NEVER happen. Give it up. Holmstrom would play center before Hudler. Franzen might get moved to center when we're injured (like when Flip was out), but that's only temporary.

I know we are deep at center, but that's mostly in the bottom 6. We have 3 forwards who are good enough to play top 6 center. 2 of those forwards should be together on the top line.

[Konnan511 1,736]

Z/Dats/Homer

Franzen/Hudler/Bertuzzi

Cleary/Helm/Eaves

Draper/Abdelkader/Miller