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CaptainCaveMan

Atlanta Thrashers move to Winnipeg

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What a great time for hockey fans...I can only hope this plays itself out and Winnipeg gets a team as they deserve one a hell of a lot more than Atlanta, who barely supports the Braves. Ditto for Phoenix...we'll be talking about this same stuff next spring, only it will be relocating to Quebec City instead. Stop putting hockey teams in markets where they're not appreciated!!!

From ESPN:

Former Thrasher Ray Ferraro:

"The Braves won 11 straight division titles," he said. "The first year we were there, Andrew Brunette and I went to go to Game 1 of the playoffs. We didn't have tickets and we worried we couldn't get in. We go up to the box office and there's 11,000 empty seats. They had been in the playoffs 11 years in a row. You looking for a college football ticket? You're not going to get one. You want to go to NASCAR? You're not going to get a ticket. It's a market with different priorities. Pro sports is down the chain for sure."

Contrast the poor fan showings in Atlanta and Phoenix with Winnipeg last night:

portageandmain.jpg

And they don't even officially have a team yet, and haven't in 15 years!

Canucks' Jeff Tambellini said playing games in Atlanta wasn't fun.

"It's tough to go to a building where there is two good teams going at it, and there is no one in the building. There's no atmosphere, no buzz," said Tambellini. "That, we know, is something that in Canadian cities you'll never see.

"We should be putting our markets in the best places to have success. Winnipeg's a place with a great fan base. They deserve a fan base."

It sucks to say this, since I live in Arizona, but bring the NHL back to where people WANT it and appreciate it.

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About the last few posts...

- Marketing is valued much higher nowadays than quality assurance, that's where the money is spent in recent decades

- Gary Bettman has quite an ego

- He has put himself out there to keep the Coyotes in Phoenix extensively thus depending on the individual's stubbornness will variably go out of their way to get what they want for the sake of their image

- He has not done so for Atlanta

- Letting the Coyotes go to Winnipeg would have been a kick to Bettman's nuts

- He hasn't invested his image into keeping Atlanta in place.. so he has little to lose marketing wise and ego wise

- Some of these non viable teams have owners which constitute a vote on both whether or not he keeps his job and whether or not teams relocate

Understand that Bettman since he came in has done all he can do to put teams in places where they are not exactly the most viable. His legacy depends on his ability to manage this philosophy.

Edit: The last post is also correct.

What also can't be lost in this is how important ownership is.

The Atlanta Spirit are probably more to blame for this mess than anyone.

I'd like a team in Winnipeg... just not at the expense of the Thrashers.

There's 3 teams in the New York area. The Devils have recently won 3 cups, have a new arena, and no one cares. Move them!

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That would be great but I can't see the Central being that weak or having MON, TOR, and Detroit in one division. There would be too many hardcore canvases in one division. I'm sure the NHL wants that spread amongst weaker teams.

First of all, you would gather more TV money with more interdivision matchups and higher ratings, therefore more revenue.

In today's NHL, there is no such concept as a weak division, as they are supposed to be equal in potential and all have the capacity to win against any team.

The NHL radio (Sirus) is all over this as a done deal. I'd love to see the Wings end up in the (L)eastern conference. Think of all of the advantages. I'd love to debate the benefits of the playoffs.

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:unsure:

Wait, so what happens to Phoenix?

Phoenix is staying there. Glendale ponied up another 25mil to keep them in town for another year of attempts to sell in town.

On Thrashers going to Winnipeg... meh. Congrats.

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:unsure:

Wait, so what happens to Phoenix?

They get moved somewhere at the end of next season. Probably QC as it'll be easiest to find a prospective buyer for there at this point, even if the arena is utter crap. At least the crazy canadians there are trying to pass a law that would prevent people from challenging the public funding of a new arena.

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Kind of funny Bettman lets Atlanta finally die, yet he's trying his damnedest to hold onto Phoenix

Either way, the Wings aren't leaving the West. I'd be surprised if he let that happen..

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Kind of funny Bettman lets Atlanta finally die, yet he's trying his damnedest to hold onto Phoenix

Either way, the Wings aren't leaving the West. I'd be surprised if he let that happen..

Well its an ego thing, and Bettman has a huge ego. The Coyotes were his baby, and the Thrashers were not. Pretty pathetic, eh?

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Kind of funny Bettman lets Atlanta finally die, yet he's trying his damnedest to hold onto Phoenix

Either way, the Wings aren't leaving the West. I'd be surprised if he let that happen..

Well its an ego thing, and Bettman has a huge ego. The Coyotes were his baby, and the Thrashers were not. Pretty pathetic, eh?

I don't like Bettman, but this is just senseless hate.

Phoenix hasn't moved because Glendale has been unwilling to give up hope. Bettman hasn't hurt the situation, but it is definitely not his doing. Glendale is stuck with a brand new billion dollar public shopping and entertainment complex that is dependent on the Coyotes to succeed. This phoenix doesn't have fans stuff is crap too, after the last owner drove the organization into the ground. The NHL is keeping them alive for a sale, not promoting them like a new owner would be. There has also been comments by people that make it sound incredibly hard legally to move Phoenix currently. The Winnipeg mayor even said he didn't believe Phoenix would move due to deals made when they originally moved out there.

The Phoenix thread is here.

Edited by CaliWingsNut

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so if they go to to winnipeg, who moves to the eastern conference to balance the conferences back out? certainly the winnipeg thrashers couldnt still be considered an eastern team.

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Wings won't move. Columbus or Nashville will. Nashville would be the only CST team in the East, so I think all the East owners would whine about that, but on the other hand, CLB makes less sense in the Southeast.. and I think moving CLB to the Southeast would kill that franchise. 0 big draws for them in their own division. Nashville seems inevitable, and I won't miss playing against them. Let the east deal with Trotz.

The Wings, however, will move in what I feel to be an inevitable expansion in the next couple years that will almost certainly add two teams to the west (Kansas City and one of: Houston, Seattle, Portland, Vegas). In such a move I feel that the league would also try to realign things in such a way that Chicago joins Detroit going East. Quebec City will not see a team from expansion, but rather, relocation of an East team.

I see your point, but Nashville is almost as weak as Columbus is fan-wise and money wise, I think. Therefore there would be no huge draw if they shifted, either. I know it won't happen but the Wings moving could force some interesting realignments that would boost attendance.

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I'm very excited about this. It has been confirmed today that the Manitoba Moose are relocating to St. John's! So I'll get to be seeing some AHL hockey on a regular basis. Can't wait till the Griffins come to town!!

My link

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Kind of funny Bettman lets Atlanta finally die, yet he's trying his damnedest to hold onto Phoenix

Either way, the Wings aren't leaving the West. I'd be surprised if he let that happen..

I think its more that Glendale has a higher % of potential households that they can capture. Comes down to basic market share and market cap. Atlanta is a bigger city - but 54% of the city is black. AND THIS BETTER NOT TURN INTO A RACIAL DISCUSSION, but I mean, c'mon....you aren't going to capture a large portion of the black population to make it relevant.

The Glendale area is quite large, and is more of the NHL's target market. So, no, I don't think this is a fair place to hate on Bettman. I'm just betting they did their business math.

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I think the fact that Phoenix is putting up a playoff team lately, and the fact that Atlanta has been to the first round ONCE in 12 years is a major factor. Atlanta is not putting up much of a fight in keeping a team there that people want to see. At least Phoenix is making an attempt at fielding a competitive team so people might actually want to go and see. Atlanta is and never was a hockey market, and the hockey team has been dying ever since it moved in. Time to cut your losses and get rid of a mistake that should never have been made.

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"They" say that if a buyer comes forward, Atlanta will stay put.

Spoiler Alert: If fans of the Thrashers are expecting Bettman to rush in and save this franchise (see Phoenix/Glendale), it will not happen. He has looked like a total idiot with his "white knight" routine in his handling of the Coyotes debacle and he won't do it again.

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I don't like Bettman, but this is just senseless hate.

Phoenix hasn't moved because Glendale has been unwilling to give up hope. Bettman hasn't hurt the situation, but it is definitely not his doing. Glendale is stuck with a brand new billion dollar public shopping and entertainment complex that is dependent on the Coyotes to succeed. This phoenix doesn't have fans stuff is crap too, after the last owner drove the organization into the ground. The NHL is keeping them alive for a sale, not promoting them like a new owner would be. There has also been comments by people that make it sound incredibly hard legally to move Phoenix currently. The Winnipeg mayor even said he didn't believe Phoenix would move due to deals made when they originally moved out there.

The Phoenix thread is here.

huh. Gary actually bought the team with the NHL's money. That IMO is going waaaay to far to try and keep the team in Phoenix. This makes zero sense business wise. The whole thing is fishy. If it's not Bettman's ego, what is going on?

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I see your point, but Nashville is almost as weak as Columbus is fan-wise and money wise, I think. Therefore there would be no huge draw if they shifted, either. I know it won't happen but the Wings moving could force some interesting realignments that would boost attendance.

What I would like to see - but I'm not holding my breath.

Atlanta to Winnipeg and into the Northwest division

Minny to the Central

Detroit to the Northeast

Boston to the Atlantic

Pittsburgh to Central

Nashville to the Southeast

New divisions

Northwest

Vancouver

Calgary

Edmonton

Winnepeg

Colorado

Central

Chicago

Minnesota

St. Louis

Columbus

Pittsburgh

Northeast

Montreal

Toronto

Ottawa

Detroit

Buffalo

Atlantic

Boston

NY Islanders

NY Rangers

New Jersey

Philadelphia

Southeast

Nashville

Washington

Tampa

Florida

Carolina

But like I said, it will never happen...

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huh. Gary actually bought the team with the NHL's money. That IMO is going waaaay to far to try and keep the team in Phoenix. This makes zero sense business wise. The whole thing is fishy. If it's not Bettman's ego, what is going on?

The NHL took control of the team, rather than the previous owner illegally putting it into bankruptcy court (allowing them to break contracts made with people in Phoenix) and handing it over to a person the league didn't approve of. Big difference.

Edited by CaliWingsNut

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The NHL took control of the team, rather than the previous owner illegally putting it into bankruptcy court (allowing them to break contracts made with people in Phoenix) and handing it over to a person the league didn't approve of. Big difference.

No matter how you dress it up - a turd is still a turd...This turd of a franchise hasn't made any $$$ since they left Winnipeg...Big contracts/new building/fancy shops or not - this team, and the city of Glendale are still gonna bleed millions of $$$ every year.

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What I would like to see - but I'm not holding my breath.

Atlanta to Winnipeg and into the Northwest division

Minny to the Central

Detroit to the Northeast

Boston to the Atlantic

Pittsburgh to Central

Nashville to the Southeast

New divisions

Northwest

Vancouver

Calgary

Edmonton

Winnepeg

Colorado

Central

Chicago

Minnesota

St. Louis

Columbus

Pittsburgh

Northeast

Montreal

Toronto

Ottawa

Detroit

Buffalo

Atlantic

Boston

NY Islanders

NY Rangers

New Jersey

Philadelphia

Southeast

Nashville

Washington

Tampa

Florida

Carolina

But like I said, it will never happen...

Hmm - 5 divisions?

Playoff bracket of 1st seed taking on the 16th?...2nd taking on the 15th?...etc/etc.

I can live with it - however IMHO I'd like to see the 2 Conference 4 Division format of Wales/Campbell Conferences along with Norris/Symth/Patrick/Adams Divisions.

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I agree with earlier comments that the Phoenix situation mostly deals with the new hockey only arena in Glendale. The Thrashers share an arena with the Hawks, they won't be missed, the Coyotes will.

What a horrible decision by the Coyotes to not continue to share an arena with the Suns.

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I agree with earlier comments that the Phoenix situation mostly deals with the new hockey only arena in Glendale. The Thrashers share an arena with the Hawks, they won't be missed, the Coyotes will.

What a horrible decision by the Coyotes to not continue to share an arena with the Suns.

This decision to build their own arena has pretty much put them in the dire financial situation that they're in today.

From what I understand a fair number of the area residents say that Glendale is too far of a drive, and with traffic many aren't interested in going to Coyote games.

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From what I've heard, Winnipeg could potentially stay in the South East for next season only. Then the following season, the league may take the time to think about re-alignment, possibly for other teams as well.

To be honest, I think it is a bit silly to leave the possible Winnipeg team in the southeast for a year. What type of things really change with a move in divisions? Isn't it really just scheduling issues?

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