2015 Draft

[Helmethead 235]

I suggested a week ago the Wings could trade Weiss to Arizona. Kenny would likely have to eat half his salary though. Weiss to Arizona or Carolina at 2.5 mil a season is better than 4.9 mil a season. 3 years of dead cap space is better than 6 years of dead cap space which would be the case if Weiss is bought out. Plus Weiss has a no move clause. I have to think he'd waive it to play on a team where he'd be a regular player getting lots of playing time.

Edited June 20, 2015 by Helmethead

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

I suggested a week ago the Wings could trade Weiss to Arizona. Kenny would likely have to eat half his salary though. Weiss to Arizona or Carolina at 2.5 mil a season is better than 4.9 mil a season. 3 years of dead cap space is better than 6 years of dead cap space which would be the case if Weiss is bought out. Plus Weiss has a no move clause. I have to think he'd waive it to play on a team where he'd be a regular player getting lots of playing time.

I wouldnt be completely against retaining some salary on him, but not half.

Him to Arizona seems like a good fit, but I highly doubt were going to see a trade between us and the canes with the whole ilitch/karmanos thing.

[MrazekFanBoy 223]

Lol talk about overrating Larkin , there is no way he even touches the top 5 in this draft class: McDavid, Eichel, Hanifin, Marner, Strome, Crouse should be set. Maybe 7 but I think Werenski or maybe that Russian kid will own that position .

I don't care about what position he would be wings for him at 17 and now have to develop both guys Larkin and Mantha.

Mantha will be fine and make Mr. Players are cattles eat cow.

I highly doubt that lmao He's a way more complete player than Strome, I think he would've went third to the Coyotes

[MrazekFanBoy 223]

Why do people think Strome is so good, yes he's a good PLAY maker, that's like picking Joe Thornton over Toews, now I bet if Larkin played in the O(He was drafted into one of those Canadian leagues) he would've been a 100 point guy I'm sorry but your a stupid gm if you take an amazing play maker over an amazing two way forward, unless you wanna play golf in the Spring like Crosby, to me Toews probably has the highest trade value in the league right now. I hate Chicago but you can't deny it who cares if he isn't point per game, he led a s*** franchise to 3 cups.

Do you want the Stanley cup or do you want money? Strome will bring you money Larkin will bring you a cup, two way forwards(centers) are the most valuable players in the league and on your team when they are elite(Toews, Datsyuk, Kopitar)

[Buppy 1,720]

Why do people think Strome is so good, yes he's a good PLAY maker, that's like picking Joe Thornton over Toews, now I bet if Larkin played in the O(He was drafted into one of those Canadian leagues) he would've been a 100 point guy I'm sorry but your a stupid gm if you take an amazing play maker over an amazing two way forward, unless you wanna play golf in the Spring like Crosby, to me Toews probably has the highest trade value in the league right now. I hate Chicago but you can't deny it who cares if he isn't point per game, he led a s*** franchise to 3 cups.

Do you want the Stanley cup or do you want money? Strome will bring you money Larkin will bring you a cup, two way forwards(centers) are the most valuable players in the league and on your team when they are elite(Toews, Datsyuk, Kopitar)

Strome is pretty good defensively himself.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

Why do people think Strome is so good, yes he's a good PLAY maker, that's like picking Joe Thornton over Toews, now I bet if Larkin played in the O(He was drafted into one of those Canadian leagues) he would've been a 100 point guy I'm sorry but your a stupid gm if you take an amazing play maker over an amazing two way forward, unless you wanna play golf in the Spring like Crosby, to me Toews probably has the highest trade value in the league right now. I hate Chicago but you can't deny it who cares if he isn't point per game, he led a s*** franchise to 3 cups.

Do you want the Stanley cup or do you want money? Strome will bring you money Larkin will bring you a cup, two way forwards(centers) are the most valuable players in the league and on your team when they are elite(Toews, Datsyuk, Kopitar)

There is a reason why Strome is a top 4 pick and Larkin wasn't . Stop overhauling every prospect. Especially the comparison to Toews. as good as Toews is he also has a lot of help in the form of Keith, Hossa, Sharp , Seabrook and Kane .

Larkin will never be another Pasha , Toews or Kopitar that's just through the roof expectations .

Whoever gets Strome has a close to NHL ready center in their hands.Larkin will need at least another year in the nhl to get used to the pro game.

[kliq 3,763]

There is a reason why Strome is a top 4 pick and Larkin wasn't . Stop overhauling every prospect. Especially the comparison to Toews. as good as Toews is he also has a lot of help in the form of Keith, Hossa, Sharp , Seabrook and Kane .

Larkin will never be another Pasha , Toews or Kopitar that's just through the roof expectations .

Whoever gets Strome has a close to NHL ready center in their hands.Larkin will need at least another year in the nhl to get used to the pro game.

That really means nothing Frank. In 2006 Claude Giroux was chosen 22nd, in 2007 Sam Gagner was drafted #6 and Tomas Hickey #4.

Being drafted #4 just means that at that exact moment in time, you are projected to be the 4th best prospect in the world (or the highest probability of what a team thinks it needs). Larkin could very easily be a better player then Strome. If Larkin was eligible this year for the draft, I believe he would be a top 5 pick, or close to it.

Do you really think that Larkin has no chance to become a player like those you named? Or are you doing your "don't want to get your hopes up" thing so you can be positively surprised? Dont get me wrong, I agree those are high expectations, but the sky's the limit for someone that age.

I do agree with your assessment on Toews, I hate how he gets all the credit for Chicago's success when Keith, Hossa, Sharp , Seabrook Kane etc. have been there every step of the way. Nothing against him as a player, but he didn't do it alone like some people make it sound like.

Edited June 21, 2015 by kliq

[frankgrimes 1,836]

That really means nothing Frank. In 2006 Claude Giroux was chosen 22nd, in 2007 Sam Gagner was drafted #6 and Tomas Hickey #4.

Being drafted #4 just means that at that exact moment in time, you are projected to be the 4th best prospect in the world (or the highest probability of what a team thinks it needs). Larkin could very easily be a better player then Strome. If Larkin was eligible this year for the draft, I believe he would be a top 5 pick, or close to it.

Do you really think that Larkin has no chance to become a player like those you named? Or are you doing your "don't want to get your hopes up" thing so you can be positively surprised? Dont get me wrong, I agree those are high expectations, but the sky's the limit for someone that age.

I do agree with your assessment on Toews, I hate how he gets all the credit for Chicago's success when Keith, Hossa, Sharp , Seabrook Kane etc. have been there every step of the way. Nothing against him as a player, but he didn't do it alone like some people make it sound like.

Sure the draft position is just another step and it's not THE step but I think Strome has all the tools to become a very succesful NHLer maybe even a star. He is big, has a good two way game and seems to be dedicated to working hard. Personally I don't care if Larkin would be a 7, 1 or whatever in a draft. The fact of the matter is we got him at 15 and everything else is just speculation. His job now is to work as hard as he can and the Wings job is to bring him along at a realistic pace which means, let him acclimate to the pro game and when he's ready bring him up. Just for the record I would have said the same thing if we got him at #2.

Yes I honestly believe he has no chance of becoming another Toews, Pasha or Kopitar otherwise I wouldn't have mentioned it. I think it's hard enough to be a young NHL player especially if an original 6 team has drafted you, no need to put further pressure and incredible high expectations on an 18/19 old kid. I would be very happy if Larkin turns into a solid top 6 center with a better than average two way game.

I think Toews is an awesome, awesome player and judging by their cup celebrations also a very lucky bastard, sadly he is their version of Yzerman but he could never do it alone, nobody in hockey can and that's the beauty of the game even elite players need others to help them out. That being said I think Stamkos will crush the 10,5 annually cap hit soon, I think 12 per at least maybe even 14 with a 71 million salary caphit.

[krsmith17 7,191]

frank, your description of Strome also fits Larkin to a t... He's big, 6'1", nearly 200lbs, as an 18 year old, has an unbelievable two-way game, has a great work ethic... From the very little I've seen of Strome in the OHL last season and from articles I've read, I don't believe he is "great" on the defensive side of the puck. I'm not saying Larkin will be as awesome as Toews, but I do believe he will be compared to such players for his defensive acumen. He absolutely does have all the tools to be a Toews lite or a Kesler or better in a few years. I'm saying he will be a top two center, 60-70 point guy and a defensive stalwart. Does that mean he will captain the Red Wings next year and bring home 3 Cups in less than a decade? No. It means as an individual player, he can and I think likely will be a Toews / Kesler like player...

Also, as I've stated before, I firmly do believe that if Larkin were to be drafted this year, he would absolutely go in the top 5. We're lucky to have gotten him where we did last year. I do agree with you 100% with the development process and that we shouldn't rush him. Let's bring him along slowly and hopefully he hits his ceiling. If he does we will have one hell of a player.

[MrazekFanBoy 223]

Exactly! I'm picking a two center who is actually really good on both sides of the puck, fast and big over a kid from the O who models himself after Joe Thormton a guy who has never won a Stanley cup, And I highly doubt Strome is ready for the NHL.. I wouldn't even say Eichel or Mcdavid are it's hard jumping to the nhl but it's possible, Larkin shutdown stars for USA this year, Stroke played against boys all year hell Strome still is a boy I'd be surprised to see him in the league next year, why can't I compare him to other two way centers?! He's a two way center he could very well be better than all of those players only time will tell nobody in the world can predict what a prospect will turn out to be Frank so I don't know why you said that he has no chance on being as good as them.

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

Exactly! I'm picking a two center who is actually really good on both sides of the puck, fast and big over a kid from the O who models himself after Joe Thormton a guy who has never won a Stanley cup, And I highly doubt Strome is ready for the NHL.. I wouldn't even say Eichel or Mcdavid are it's hard jumping to the nhl but it's possible, Larkin shutdown stars for USA this year, Stroke played against boys all year hell Strome still is a boy I'd be surprised to see him in the league next year, why can't I compare him to other two way centers?! He's a two way center he could very well be better than all of those players only time will tell nobody in the world can predict what a prospect will turn out to be Frank so I don't know why you said that he has no chance on being as good as them.

Mcdavid and eichel are definitely ready, the only reason eichel might not be in the NHL next year is if he stays in college to try to win a championship.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

I just don't think associating a 18 old kids with elite guys is doing them any favors. If Larkin turns out to be a Toews lite I would be incredible happy with that. A big local boy who just has the intangibles yep I'd take that .

McDavid is probably the most NHL ready player since Crosby same goes for to a lesser extent Eichel..next up would be Strome I think Hanifin needs to work on his defensive game so whichever team drafts him will send him back to juniors.

This draft will be the McDavid show mediawise.

[WingedWheel91 271]

Here we go again...

(1) Toews is a fantastic 2 way player - no doubt about it. He has also benefited from having the best coach in the NHL, the best defense pairing in the NHL, and an excellent core group of forwards (Kane, Hossa, Sharp) throughout this entire Blackhawks run. Don't forget, each year they have won the cup - they also lost players like Havlat, Madden, Versteeg, Ladd, Campbell, and Byfuglien. This year, they may lose Sharp, Shaw, Bickell etc... The point is, he hasn't been on a Stanley Cup winning team without playing for one of the absolute deepest (and prohibitive favourite) teams in the league.

(2) I'm not sure how much OHL we all watch - but my best friends little brother (I know I know) plays for the Oshawa Generals, and I recently had a good conversation with him back home about how they dismantled Erie last month... Long story short, he said that Strome was their primary focus and faced the (oldest) and best defensive players the Gens had. McDavid was impossible to stop so if they could eliminate the 1B line, they would win the series. To the Joe Thornton comparison: I am thinking more like Ryan Getzlaf.

(3) For as many people who love to use the "Larkin would be drafted top 5 this year" justification - you could also speculate that Strome would probably go #1 in any year but this one (last year, next year, etc). He led the OHL in scoring, as an 18 year old, playing on the 2nd line. If you think his numbers were inflated by McDavid - you literally haven't been paying attention... Take a look at Strome's production during the 21 games McDavid was out of the lineup... His PPG were higher. I have said it before and I'll say it again, do whatever you can to acquire this pick. Mantha, Nyquist and #19 gives you dynasty potential with Stome-Larkin down the middle.

[kliq 3,763]

Here we go again...

(1) Toews is a fantastic 2 way player - no doubt about it. He has also benefited from having the best coach in the NHL, the best defense pairing in the NHL, and an excellent core group of forwards (Kane, Hossa, Sharp) throughout this entire Blackhawks run. Don't forget, each year they have won the cup - they also lost players like Havlat, Madden, Versteeg, Ladd, Campbell, and Byfuglien. This year, they may lose Sharp, Shaw, Bickell etc... The point is, he hasn't been on a Stanley Cup winning team without playing for one of the absolute deepest (and prohibitive favourite) teams in the league.

(2) I'm not sure how much OHL we all watch - but my best friends little brother (I know I know) plays for the Oshawa Generals, and I recently had a good conversation with him back home about how they dismantled Erie last month... Long story short, he said that Strome was their primary focus and faced the (oldest) and best defensive players the Gens had. McDavid was impossible to stop so if they could eliminate the 1B line, they would win the series. To the Joe Thornton comparison: I am thinking more like Ryan Getzlaf.

(3) For as many people who love to use the "Larkin would be drafted top 5 this year" justification - you could also speculate that Strome would probably go #1 in any year but this one (last year, next year, etc). He led the OHL in scoring, as an 18 year old, playing on the 2nd line. If you think his numbers were inflated by McDavid - you literally haven't been paying attention... Take a look at Strome's production during the 21 games McDavid was out of the lineup... His PPG were higher. I have said it before and I'll say it again, do whatever you can to acquire this pick. Mantha, Nyquist and #19 gives you dynasty potential with Stome-Larkin down the middle.

I agree with most of this. As far as the bold part since I am the one who said that, I was never trying to put Strome down or dismiss his talent in any way, my #5 comments were in response to Franks who implied that Strome had superstar potential (which he does) and that Larkin has no chance at being at superstar level. My point was that both have a chance to be superstars.

[WingedWheel91 271]

Kliq - I didn't mean to direct that statement only at you... I've seen probably 10-15 Larkin re-draft scenarios.

But you are absolutely right, he certainly has a chance to be a superstar... I would just rather have Strome because his offensive instincts are head and shoulders above Larkin.

I hate to say this, but reality tells me Larkin has equal opportunity to be "two-way star" (Bergeron, Kesler) and/or "all around 3rd line C" (Filpulla, Sheahan, Vermette,)

To put Larkin in the same Class as Toews, Kopitar, is unrealistic in my opinion.

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

First the mantha and 1st rounder nonsense and now at the end of hockeycentral damian cox mentioned the redwings when they mentioned a few teams that could draft Ilya samsonov

Seriously? Think everyone knows detroit needs defensemen and not a Russian goalie when they got petr mrazek emerging ... Guys always saying bulls***

[PumpkinEscobar 136]

Not like they'd count on Samsonov pushing for a job in Detroit next season. I wouldn't be surprised if Detroit took a goalie at some point because there is no sure thing in net in Grand Rapids going forward. if they took a defenseman or a forward neither would be in Detroit on the next years anyway

[number9 3,297]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-OH23dui_w

^^^ 20 years before this very draft. A must watch. Per reddit.

[LeftWinger 5,152]

It's got to be just a coincidence that they put the girl of color in the Detroit jersey, right?

[number9 3,297]

It's got to be just a coincidence that they put the girl of color in the Detroit jersey, right?

Well I'll at least commend you for having the balls to say that on a public forum

[frankgrimes 1,836]

First the mantha and 1st rounder nonsense and now at the end of hockeycentral damian cox mentioned the redwings when they mentioned a few teams that could draft Ilya samsonov

Seriously? Think everyone knows detroit needs defensemen and not a Russian goalie when they got petr mrazek emerging ... Guys always saying bulls***

It's Damian Cox so

Personally I think the Wings should look at the option of trading down for Werensky, big hulking defenseman and in my mind the second best one in the draft after Hanifin.

http://www.sbncollegehockey.com/2015/6/22/8825243/zach-werenski-scouting-report-nhl-draft-profile guy is exactly what the doctor ordered

Plus he is a local boy so that adds some extra plus

Edited June 24, 2015 by frankgrimes

[nawein 324]

http://www.freep.com/story/sports/nhl/red-wings/2015/06/24/detroit-red-wings-draft-options/29231007/

Sounds like we'll take a goalie at some point. I seem to remember being told that the idea of us needing another goalie in the system was ridiculous.

[VM1138 1,921]

We should take a goalie. We need to replace Mrazek and goalies take years to develop. I'm not sure anyone we have currently will be more than a backup. Maybe not first round, but we absolutely should take a goalie in the middle rounds.

[kipwinger 8,767]

Craig Morgan ‏@cmorganfoxaz 27m27 minutes ago Phoenix, AZ

Coyotes GM Don Maloney says he's up to 4-5 "legitimate offers" for the No. 3 overall pick in the NHL Draft, with 3 to 4 more "tire-kickers."

Oh no...

[Helmethead 235]

Mantha.