Blashill says struggling Wings must "Trust The Process."

[krsmith17 7,191]

34 minutes ago, F.Michael said:

That's what worries me most...

Regardless of how many 'top 10' picks the Wings might get over the next 2 to 4 years - the Wings need to be lucky in that they meet their potential.

For sure. We need Cholowski to develop into a top pair defenseman, and Rasmussen to develop into a number one center, as well as whoever we take in next year's draft to develop into a top tier player (hopefully elite). Unfortunately, I don't have much faith in Svechnikov developing into anything more than a middle six winger at this point. Hopefully he gets out of whatever funk he's in... Imagine, we could have taken Boeser with that pick. A Mantha - Larkin - Boeser top line would have been nice for the next 10+ years...

[kliq 3,755]

7 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

For sure. We need Cholowski to develop into a top pair defenseman, and Rasmussen to develop into a number one center, as well as whoever we take in next year's draft to develop into a top tier player (hopefully elite). Unfortunately, I don't have much faith in Svechnikov developing into anything more than a middle six winger at this point. Hopefully he gets out of whatever funk he's in... Imagine, we could have taken Boeser with that pick. A Mantha - Larkin - Boeser top line would have been nice for the next 10+ years...

Agreed, but if Larkin can develop into a 1C, then really as long as Rasmussen develops into a top 2C we should be fine. Cholowski on the other hand is crucial to our club moving forward as there is nobody else in our system with his upside.

[Learn2LuvIt 245]

The process sucks

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

1 hour ago, kliq said:

Agreed, but if Larkin can develop into a 1C, then really as long as Rasmussen develops into a top 2C we should be fine. Cholowski on the other hand is crucial to our club moving forward as there is nobody else in our system with his upside.

I want to see a defensive pairing with Witkowski and Cholowski.  

[kliq 3,755]

5 hours ago, GMRwings1983 said:

I want to see a defensive pairing with Witkowski and Cholowski.  

It would be entertaining lol

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

21 hours ago, GMRwings1983 said:

Does Blashill realize that Holland is the one that usually makes up the stupid quotes?  

Jenny Blasholland: "I like our team, but we really just need them to trust the process. We're kicking some tires on some different strategies and gameplans that we think can make us a playoff team."

[chaps80 1,591]

On 2017-12-13 at 12:04 PM, Son of a Wing said:

So what exactly do people expect Blashill to say? He's put it on himself. He's put it on the players. The teams not competitive and there's no magic wand.

What would you do if you got asked the same questions every day? 

Call out the vets? Guys like Helm, Nielsen, Ericsson? Where's that going to get us? Those guys aren't capable of turning the team around even if it did light a fire. It's just going to piss them off AND decrease their trade value and we'd still be stuck with them.

Ride it out. Go through "the process" and try your best to maintain a positive competitive culture where young players can still develop. That's all he can do.

We’re already stuck with Helm, Nielsen, and Errorsson for years to come. Unmovable contracts.  Nielsen may get interest if his contract wasn’t so bad for what he brings. Holland just threw money, term, and an NMC at him without considering that, although quite talented, he’s more of a high end complementary player, and he didn’t have the players to compliment him as a centre.  Might be able to ditch Helm or Nielsen at the deadline in their final season, bout it.

[chaps80 1,591]

17 hours ago, kylee said:

They still are. Look at where they are in the standings. They got lucky last year.

I dunno if it was luck. They had the same solid Cam Talbot last season that was in NY before. Despite not having a great D, he was a standout. He’s struggling this season. They got great production from McDavid, Draisatil, Lucic, Maroon, etc. Only McDavid is really doing much now. 

It could be regression, or it could be that other teams have them figured out and they need a new game plan to get some goals from their top players, and better goaltending from Talbot. 

If Mrazek is traded, I’d like to see him go there and thrive. If he does, he can easily have a Cup before the Wings do. Imagine a few more years of bottom feeding and Howard being finished and him retiring cup-less in Detroit with Mrazek already having one or two under his belt in Edmonton? I’m not sure if that scenario would be sad or funny right now. It’s a toss up.

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

11 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

I dunno if it was luck. They had the same solid Cam Talbot last season that was in NY before. Despite not having a great D, he was a standout. He’s struggling this season. They got great production from McDavid, Draisatil, Lucic, Maroon, etc. Only McDavid is really doing much now. 

It could be regression, or it could be that other teams have them figured out and they need a new game plan to get some goals from their top players, and better goaltending from Talbot. 

If Mrazek is traded, I’d like to see him go there and thrive. If he does, he can easily have a Cup before the Wings do. Imagine a few more years of bottom feeding and Howard being finished and him retiring cup-less in Detroit with Mrazek already having one or two under his belt in Edmonton? I’m not sure if that scenario would be sad or funny right now. It’s a toss up.

Edmonton could dig up Terry Sawchuk, recover some of his DNA, splice in some Roy and Brodeur chromosomes, and the frankenstein clone that results is still not winning them a cup.

[chaps80 1,591]

4 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Edmonton could dig up Terry Sawchuk, recover some of his DNA, splice in some Roy and Brodeur chromosomes, and the frankenstein clone that results is still not winning them a cup.

You think if they make trades for defense  (good ones, not Strome at the cost of Eberle LOL), get great goaltending again, and their forwards are scoring like they did last season again, they aren’t a contender? 

I don’t like the Oilers either, especially after the 4 firsts in 5 years and blatant tanking, but they definitely have the pieces to contend. Either already in place, or in current assets to get them.

[kliq 3,755]

2 hours ago, chaps80 said:

I dunno if it was luck. They had the same solid Cam Talbot last season that was in NY before. Despite not having a great D, he was a standout. He’s struggling this season. They got great production from McDavid, Draisatil, Lucic, Maroon, etc. Only McDavid is really doing much now. 

It could be regression, or it could be that other teams have them figured out and they need a new game plan to get some goals from their top players, and better goaltending from Talbot. 

If Mrazek is traded, I’d like to see him go there and thrive. If he does, he can easily have a Cup before the Wings do. Imagine a few more years of bottom feeding and Howard being finished and him retiring cup-less in Detroit with Mrazek already having one or two under his belt in Edmonton? I’m not sure if that scenario would be sad or funny right now. It’s a toss up.

You realize if Mrazek does go, it’s likely as a backup or third stringer. I highly doubt he steals the job from talbot.

[chaps80 1,591]

5 minutes ago, kliq said:

You realize if Mrazek does go, it’s likely as a backup or third stringer. I highly doubt he steals the job from talbot.

He could get an actual chance. Talbot hasn’t been very good, and they may want to see what he’s got when he doesn’t only play once in awhile and the fact he has a contract to earn with them. Sometimes a team change can kick things into gear for ya. It’s a good opportunity. He’s not getting one here.

[Juklitz 85]

2 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

He cant even follow his own process.  I dont trust him in teaching others "THE" process.  

Do you know Yes, Prime Minister series? I can barely remember Sir Humphrey´s quote: "If you don´t wont to bother yourself with some topic, put it as a name." (or somehow like that). In this case, more and more Blashill is speaking about some process, less and less I do trust he has some idea what does it mean". I believe, best coaches are not speaking about some general processes, they are doing it. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

45 minutes ago, F.Michael said:

Lets be honest...Neither netminder will have stellar numbers considering the team in front of them, and the goof behind the bench.

That said - Mrazek had his fair share of opportunities, and thus far hasn't shown to be any better than Howard.

Either way - Mrazek won't likely be in a Wings sweater nest season...Hope the best for him because I do feel he's capable.

The bolded I completely agree with. However, I don't think anyone could argue that Howard has had a much longer leash than Mrazek. That's my issue with the way this organization operates. In a season that we're clearly not making the playoffs (nor should that be the goal), we should be doing everything we can to get the young goalie going. If for no other reason than to get a better idea of what he is. And no, I don't think it's clear at this point.

If the organization has already given up on him, I understand giving Howard the bulk of the starts, but I just think it's still too early to give up on a young goalie, that has struggled at times, and been brilliant at times. If we trade Mrazek, I could see him continuing to struggle, and moving back to Czech Republic in a year or two, but I could also see it turning into a similar situation as Philadelphia trading Bobrovsky. Maybe not quite to that extent, but a Mrazek trade could come back to haunt the Red Wings. Likely it ends up somewhere in the middle though...

I wouldn't dare say that he's been mishandled though... Obviously that can't be the case with the great Detroit Red Wing organization...

[DickieDunn 2,571]

His process is work harder not smarter.  All the forwards collapse into the middle in the D zone, which means there are no outlet passes for the D when they get the puck, which leads to turnovers because they have to either wait too long or hurry a pass, and a bad transition game when the pass does connect.  Bad line management, terrible special teams, and a roster that looks increasingly like they don't have much hope of winning on a game to game basis.  If the goal is to try and make the playoffs, he needs to be fired today, because every game puts them further out.  If the goal is to get the best possible shot at the #1 pick, he needs to double down on everything he's doing.

 

BTW, am I still a hater for saying this?  I was last year.

Edited December 15, 2017 by DickieDunn

[kliq 3,755]

1 hour ago, DickieDunn said:

His process is work harder not smarter.  All the forwards collapse into the middle in the D zone, which means there are no outlet passes for the D when they get the puck, which leads to turnovers because they have to either wait too long or hurry a pass, and a bad transition game when the pass does connect.  Bad line management, terrible special teams, and a roster that looks increasingly like they don't have much hope of winning on a game to game basis.  If the goal is to try and make the playoffs, he needs to be fired today, because every game puts them further out.  If the goal is to get the best possible shot at the #1 pick, he needs to double down on everything he's doing.

 

BTW, am I still a hater for saying this?  I was last year.

I don’t think so, this was a well written post. Nothing over the top, no name calling.

[Hockeymom1960 5,107]

lol I can't wait if Petr is traded that he does win a Vezina with another team.  Some of you are hilarious lol

Edited December 15, 2017 by Hockeymom1960

[kliq 3,755]

1 hour ago, Hockeymom1960 said:

lol I can't wait if Petr is traded that he does win a Vezina with another team.  Some of you are hilarious lol

What else can we as fans assess a player on outside of his performance? The guy was given 2 years to show what he could do and he failed, plain and simple.

I dont have any personal issues with Mrazek, I would love it if he  was able to steal the job back from Jimmy, but I am a believer that as a player (especially a goalie) you need to take advantage of the opportunities you are given. He was able to do it back in 2014 in limited starts, so other then regression or other teams learning the playbook on him, what why can't he do it now. I dont buy the "he cant get into a rhythm" narrative.

If Mrazek does leave, I wish him the best and if does win a vezina/cup etc. I would be happy for him. But you can't hold on to guys who play like crap because of the fluke chance that they MIGHT get better later. Do I wish he was playing more this year...yes. Is he owed anything..no.

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

23 hours ago, chaps80 said:

You think if they make trades for defense  (good ones, not Strome at the cost of Eberle LOL), get great goaltending again, and their forwards are scoring like they did last season again, they aren’t a contender? 

I don’t like the Oilers either, especially after the 4 firsts in 5 years and blatant tanking, but they definitely have the pieces to contend. Either already in place, or in current assets to get them.

So they need defense, goaltending, and their forwards to score. Where have I heard this before? 

[chaps80 1,591]

11 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

The bolded I completely agree with. However, I don't think anyone could argue that Howard has had a much longer leash than Mrazek. That's my issue with the way this organization operates. In a season that we're clearly not making the playoffs (nor should that be the goal), we should be doing everything we can to get the young goalie going. If for no other reason than to get a better idea of what he is. And no, I don't think it's clear at this point.

If the organization has already given up on him, I understand giving Howard the bulk of the starts, but I just think it's still too early to give up on a young goalie, that has struggled at times, and been brilliant at times. If we trade Mrazek, I could see him continuing to struggle, and moving back to Czech Republic in a year or two, but I could also see it turning into a similar situation as Philadelphia trading Bobrovsky. Maybe not quite to that extent, but a Mrazek trade could come back to haunt the Red Wings. Likely it ends up somewhere in the middle though...

I wouldn't dare say that he's been mishandled though... Obviously that can't be the case with the great Detroit Red Wing organization...

Yes. before he is traded, if that’s indeed the goal (not the first time Holland’s dangled a player out there to see who bites and what the return is, then decide not to make a move), then they need to see if he can increase his value by playing him more. Or if Holllands on the fence, then maybe if he does well, he will stay. Perfect opportunity to at least do that before shipping him out. 

I’ve read a few articles with differing opinions, but the subject of him being mishandled and having a very short leash has come up. I think he fully expected Holland would trade Howard so he could have a proper go and focus better. With a young goalie you want to become your long term starter, you can’t say to him “Your our guy”, then when he starts having problems, yank  and bench him and throw the guy he supposedly replaced (that should have been traded) back into the starting role. Blash is always worried about not putting Howard down after a bad game, because it can shake him. But Mrazek gets treated how he does and he’s supposed to battle through and suck it up. 

Other opinions are that he still remains a valuable asset, and not hanging onto him unless the return justifies it is jumping the gun . Any interest in him is teams taking notice that he isn’t playing, and hope to trade for him and get a bargain price of $2 million and a half assed pick for a player with potential they can work with, give opportunity to, and turn into something great.

People say he’s had “many opportunities”. Not really. 

In the end, Holland will do whatever he does. He’s traded, he’s traded. We move on. But it would make the organization look ridiculous if they dumped him for next to nothing at this point and it blew up in their face. If they were contending, maybe that wouldn’t matter. But they aren’t, so it does matter. 

[chaps80 1,591]

12 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

So they need defense, goaltending, and their forwards to score. Where have I heard this before? 

It’s different when you have the players the Oilers do, and the expendable assets they do. That’s what going all in on a full rebuild for years when you clearly need one does.

Detroit has a roster at the cap limit full of bad veteran contracts they’re stuck with until they expire, and have only begun to give their other top two young forwards a proper shot. Not much in the way of assets, Long road ahead!

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

33 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

It’s different when you have the players the Oilers do, and the expendable assets they do. That’s what going all in on a full rebuild for years when you clearly need one does.

Detroit has a roster at the cap limit full of bad veteran contracts they’re stuck with until they expire, and have only begun to give their other top two young forwards a proper shot. Not much in the way of assets, Long road ahead!

That's been the case for years tho, and nothing has changed. Yes, the Oilers have some good talent. But they've had good young talent for YEARS with little to show for it. They've been in rebuild mode for as long as I can remember, and the poster child for how NOT to do it. They've had tradable assets for years too. How many of their lottery picks have they traded away now? And now there are rumors of them trading away RNH too. Despite all of their trades, I haven't seen any real improvements (although I don't follow them admittedly). They may have more young pieces or even better young pieces, but their years of ineptitude makes me skeptical. Could they become a contender before the Wings? Yes. But I don't think so. And I don't think Mrazek changes that. But if you follow them, maybe you know something I don't.

Edited December 16, 2017 by Neomaxizoomdweebie

[kliq 3,755]

44 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

Yes. before he is traded, if that’s indeed the goal (not the first time Holland’s dangled a player out there to see who bites and what the return is, then decide not to make a move), then they need to see if he can increase his value by playing him more. Or if Holllands on the fence, then maybe if he does well, he will stay. Perfect opportunity to at least do that before shipping him out. 

I’ve read a few articles with differing opinions, but the subject of him being mishandled and having a very short leash has come up. I think he fully expected Holland would trade Howard so he could have a proper go and focus better. With a young goalie you want to become your long term starter, you can’t say to him “Your our guy”, then when he starts having problems, yank  and bench him and throw the guy he supposedly replaced (that should have been traded) back into the starting role. Blash is always worried about not putting Howard down after a bad game, because it can shake him. But Mrazek gets treated how he does and he’s supposed to battle through and suck it up. 

Other opinions are that he still remains a valuable asset, and not hanging onto him unless the return justifies it is jumping the gun . Any interest in him is teams taking notice that he isn’t playing, and hope to trade for him and get a bargain price of $2 million and a half assed pick for a player with potential they can work with, give opportunity to, and turn into something great.

People say he’s had “many opportunities”. Not really. 

In the end, Holland will do whatever he does. He’s traded, he’s traded. We move on. But it would make the organization look ridiculous if they dumped him for next to nothing at this point and it blew up in their face. If they were contending, maybe that wouldn’t matter. But they aren’t, so it does matter. 

So what has the last 2 years been? He has played 104 games in the last 2 seasons, please explain to me how that is not an opportunity to show what he has? We're not talking 20 games a year, he averaging 52 games a year in the past 2 years. 

[chaps80 1,591]

25 minutes ago, kliq said:

So what has the last 2 years been? He has played 104 games in the last 2 seasons, please explain to me how that is not an opportunity to show what he has? We're not talking 20 games a year, he averaging 52 games a year in the past 2 years. 

The first of the two is a moot point. Mrazek had the better stats that season overall, he wasn’t as bad as people think he was. Always hear that he’s been bad for two seasons. It’s been one season. Does that justify not giving him a  proper chance to redeem himself, especially after the expansion and attitude and work ethic comments, which by all accounts, he worked hard in the off-season to correct?  I don’t think it does. Yet he’s had what? 7 starts and 3 other appearances when Howard has already lost the game for the team? And as a bonus, he gets stuck with two of those losses. 

Like I said, if he’s not gonna get a proper shot, then they should trade him. It’s not the smartest move right now, but it’s better he gets at least a shot elsewhere than riding pine in Detroit. He’s skill set hasn’t dissapeared. He needs to work stuff out by playing.

[kliq 3,755]

1 hour ago, chaps80 said:

The first of the two is a moot point. Mrazek had the better stats that season overall, he wasn’t as bad as people think he was. Always hear that he’s been bad for two seasons. It’s been one season. Does that justify not giving him a  proper chance to redeem himself, especially after the expansion and attitude and work ethic comments, which by all accounts, he worked hard in the off-season to correct?  I don’t think it does. Yet he’s had what? 7 starts and 3 other appearances when Howard has already lost the game for the team? And as a bonus, he gets stuck with two of those losses. 

Like I said, if he’s not gonna get a proper shot, then they should trade him. It’s not the smartest move right now, but it’s better he gets at least a shot elsewhere than riding pine in Detroit. He’s skill set hasn’t dissapeared. He needs to work stuff out by playing.

Guess i’m just a bit pissed with this team lately, and to me, trading the younger goalie is a step backwards. 

Was he given the role going into 2015/16? I thought he stole that one for a bit due to his play? His play fell off, Howard got the job back. Fair enough. Then he lost it two games into the playoffs.

When he signed his extension going into 2016/17, he was named starter heading into the season. Howard was on the trade block, presumably done in Detroit. Yet he wasn’t. That’s where things get a bit messed up and I think Mrazek got the s*** end of the stick. He had a bad season, Howard is still around, gets the job back because he decided to dig in and work harder at the right time after losing his job? Should have been to little, too late, and Mrazek should have had a chance at redemption. Howard is a 9 year vet that’s had enough chances already. I’m tired of the round and round with this guy, but seems he’s not going anywhere soon, probably till he retires, so I guess I should get used to it.

Howard outplayed him two years in a row? You sure about that? Mrazek had a GAA of 2.33 to Jimmy’s 2.80 the first of the two. And let’s just not compare playoff stats in the same timeframe.

I just pasted both, no reason to have two Mrazek convo's in two separate threads.

Ok, so you agree last year Mrazek played like crap.

2 years ago, (ie. 2015/16 season), Mrazek did have better stats on the entire year, but like I said he fell apart after his birthday. Just look at his stats pre/post all star game:

Pre all star game - GAA of 2.02 and - Save % of 93.2

Post all star game - GAA of 2.86 and - Save % of 89.9

He played poorly in the second half, and Jimmy had to come in and at the end to help them go on a run to make the playoffs. In the NHL its not how hot you start, its how you finish and Mrazek didnt finish great. Howard didnt play great that year either, but that's why Mrazek got the starting job the following year 2016/17.

In 2016/17 they gave him a chance to get the job back, and he was one of the worst goalies in the NHL, he was literally awful. Add that to the attitude issues (if true) and I can see why they gave up on him.

For the record chaps, I want Mrazek to play well, and I am pulling for him, but at some point the responsibility needs to be on the player, as you can't just blame management/coaching every time a player does poorly and for some reason when it comes to Mrazek people will pull out ever excuse in the book. There are certain players that I agree were not given a chance (ie. Jurco comes to mind) but IMO Mrazek was not one of them. 

Goalies don't need to be "handed the job" or "named starter", its quite simple, you want to start, outplay the other guy, Mrazek can still do that. Limited starts do not mean you can't play well, there are countless goalies who play just fine in spot start.  I hope he steals the job back, its better for all of us if he does, but my issue is when people say he is entitled it. Nobody is owed anything in sports.

With that being said, if we are offered anything for Jimmy next year at the deadline, trade him. Unless we win the lottery and sign JT we are not going anywhere in the next couple years and the more assets the better.