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I think Yzerman is still building this "particularly deep" lineup. Add Danielson and ASP and Cossa and Augustine and Mazur and and and... Since SY has taken over the plan was never to build around Larkin. Larkin (if he's still around) will be the old man on the Cup team. Just like Yzerman was. The actual core of the team started with Seider. I think @Jimmybigrigs69said the exact same thing years ago. The Red Wings didn't win diddly squat when Yzerman was their best player. They started winning when Lidstrom and Fedorov were their best players. Florida won a President's Trophy BEFORE they traded for Tkachuk. Yzerman is building a team of work horses and then he's (hoping) to go get a superstar or two to put them over the top. And it's not like his track record on this has been bad. His workhorses keep exceeding expectations. He's accomplishing the mission. I think you could argue that it's the periphery moves that are killing the momentum. For example, we drafted TWO absolute units on defense and they're were/are both playing out of their minds at an EXTREMELY early part of their careers. Things couldn't have gone better with Seider and Edvinsson and our defense still blows because we've surrounded them with puds. And it's not like we just couldn't land better talent. We ALREADY HAD IT. Swap Walman, Gostisbehere, and Maatta for Gustafsson, Petry, and Holl and your defense isn't a total nightmare. Keep one of Sprong or Fabbri instead of Motte and maybe our even strength scoring isn't absolutely abysmal. Swap Perron for Tarasenko and your team has a pulse... ...then add the Edvinsson, Kasper, Johansson, Sodorblom that we saw this season and you're looking at a much better team. Maybe not a contender, but a playoff team for sure. And you keep building from there. Nobody can blame this season on "too many kids, not enough experience". Our pro scouting has absolutely f*cked this team for two seasons in a row. Combined with the fact that Lalonde (and the organization as whole) has a default preference for milktoast puds who "defend well" over dynamic players who bring a number of other elements to the table. They justified Motte's roster spot because of his PK "prowess" and our PK is historically bad. Gustafson was supposed to be a cheaper, more defensively responsible, version of Ghost. In reality he's barely cheaper and no better defensively, but MUCH worse offensively. Tarasenko costs more, and scores less than any of Fabbri, Perron, or Sprong. There's no problem with Yzerman's plan (build around HIS draft picks). That's actually going really really well. The problem is that no team is built entirely of their own draft picks. And when SY and the gang flesh out the rest of the roster they routinely shoot themselves in the foot.

My point is we don't pop in either of the senses you're describing; we don't have 5,000-point scorers and we're not particularly deep. In a perfect world, we're Florida and we just run over everyone because we have no holes and our big guns kill and we forecheck like our lives depend on it. But teams like that are rare. My "realistic" hope is we become a team that's a pain in the ass to play against because every player is good and pulls his weight. But this is two straight seasons now that our personnel has wilted when the intensity ramped up and the stakes got real. A serious team doesn't drop both of those Columbus games. So, we can talk about Brayden Point...but do we have a lot of Brayden Points? Do we have any? Do we have x factors? Do we have the ingredients we need to become a team that gets it done in [insert any way you want]? To be fair, this is fan fatigue and frustration talking; I'm not being super-objective. But I look across the table at the super-objective crowd and it's just stats nerds and podcast bros (but I repeat myself) who will spend this summer writing Athletic pieces about how Yzerman needs to weaponize our cap space and take on some bad contracts in exchange for second-round picks, because that's how you build a winner. It's not all bad. Like I said, we do have good pieces. Edvinsson could end up being better than Seider; that's how good a rookie season he just had, imo. Kasper's a breath of fresh air. DeBrincat silenced his critics this season; he was great. Raymond's just getting started. ASP could be a gamechanger, or at least a really good complement to Seider and Edvinsson. (Maybe.) But is this going to be enough? Have we planted the seeds of perennial contention? Is time the only thing that separates us from glory? Or do we just have a lot of nice pieces and are we all going to feel quite silly if Carter Mazur's career is over before it even began? These are the questions that should be keeping Yzerman up at night.

God bless the Saints for not taking Sanders last night lol Honestly I can see how Saints mgmt would think that. Campbell is a "players coach" and I complain about these types all the time in regards to hockey. Mostly because I think the mast majority of them are not effective in this approach, and one who is is really rare.

Who TF cares about these semantics at this point? Larkin's been taken off the PK. Copp takes on the elites. Larks still not producing and now whining publicly. Seider gained a legit teammate in Edvinsson. Still playing like the neutered version of his rookie self. I highly doubt Marco Kasper is the key depth piece that magically fixes this roster from top down. Maybe injecting a true "difference maker" turns the middle mush around. Maybe injecting 5 more solid depth pieces does the same. Who TF cares? Neither is happening anytime near soon. This roster is still so far from competitive its sad. We have a cultural problem that starts from the top down. Yzerman has accomplished none of his goals. 6 seasons in and we're employing an interim emergency coach picked up mid season because no other team wanted him. We have a captain that is morally shattered, publicly disastisfied with the team, and IMO has learned to be a "loser". Our other leader - Kane - already has his cups and is content coasting into retirement on a builder. Only reason he's even here is bc Detroit is perfectly nestled between his home in Illinois and his home in Buffalo. Team needs a collosal facelift shakeup IMHO.

I don't agree with your conclusions. Recent history has shown that deep teams, with more top end talent throughout their lineup, are better than teams that have elite top end talent but not as much depth. I can't imagine too many GMs would rather be Edmonton than Florida despite the fact that the Oilers have the better "difference makers". Contrary to what most people think, I don't believe we need those pad the stats guys. We need guys that will allow Seider to go from 45 points to 65 (think Duncan Keith) points and still be a rock defensively. We need the guy who eats some defensive zone starts so Larkin can stay healthy and score 95 points. Same with Raymond. We haven't had those guys because we've've lacked qualtiy depth forever. So our top end guys get keyed on. Depth changes that. If Marco Kasper can eat those "Anthony Cirelli" type minutes, then Larkin gets to play "Brayden Point" type minutes. Same with Raymond and Seider. Those guys stand to gain a lot when they're not eating the best the opposition can throw at them for 20 mins a night.

Well, the plan is to wait for the kids to magically turn us into a contender. Which sounds nice, but I'm not seeing it. I mean, I like the pieces. Don't get me wrong. Raymond could be a 100-point player in his prime. But if we're being brutally objective, it's looking like all Yzerman's really assembled is the bare minimum core you'd expect from a non-elite playoff team. We have a good 1C. We have a good 1D. We have a couple good scoring wingers. Edvinsson's good. Kasper's good. But if ASP isn't an absolute monster or Cossa isn't Carey Price...then I don't know what makes us special. So, yeah: mushy middle.

And then say fuq it and trade for Rempe too. This team needs a radical new identity. Larkin leaving is the perfect time to flip that on its head. NYR cant re-sign all their boys and may very well be losing Rempe anyway. To NYR: Berggren + Rasmussen + the extra 1st acquired from CBJ To DET: RW Rempe + LHD K'Andre Miller Johnny Bergers and Ras are too soft and gray for our teams new in your face mentality. Go do your perimeter scoring in the big apple. Miller has been on the block with NYR bc they likely cant afford his extension. But we can. Big 6'5" scary black man who can score. Welcome to the D big pimpin. Dcat - Kasper - Raymond Soderblom - Sillinger - JTC Tarasenko - Copp - Olivier Mazur - Danielson - Rempe Edvinsson - Seider Miller - Chiarot Ajo - Gustafsson Is this lineup going to win you the cup? No. Will it get pushed around while Kasper, Danielson, Soderblom, Sillinger, Mazur, Edvinsson, and Ajo develop? FUQ NO! That lineup would be littered with highmotor young guns in big roles, with nasty shopwreckers to back them up. Its okay to lose - but push the other teams s*** in every night and make them pay for it.

I doubt they wanna move Fantilli or Johnson. Theyre basically younger versions of Larkin so thats be a lateral move at best. BJs do make a lot of sense though. Theyd be adding a vet leader their young group needs after losing Gaudreau, and uniting butt buddies Dylan and Zach. They also have an extra 1st this year, so sending one to us is something they can easily afford. To CBJ: Larkin To DET: C Cole Sillinger + RW Mathieu Olivier + 1st Sillinger is the young replacement center we can develop. We drafted his dad Mike way back when, and he narrowly missed winning a cup with us in the 90s. Mike would be familiar with our entire nepotistic front office, and has done scouting work in the past, so might as well give him a job too. Olivier is probably the best pound for pound fighter in the league, outside maybe Rempe or Reaves. Except Olivier can also put up 30+ pts a season unlike those two goons. We could nab him now b4 his NTC kicks in. Dcat - Kasper - Raymond Soderblom - Sillinger - JTC Mazur - Copp - Olivier Berggren - Ras - Tarasenko

If our whiny baby captain who dissapears every March actually wants out... IMO this is who's next in line for the C. I've said it before, but he has NHL coach written all over him. Articulate, insightful, honest... and yet measured. He's a true student of the game, and is superb with the media. He came here and was asked to basically sacrafice all his personal stats to be THE shutdown center. Has he ever complained once about that? No. What happened when he went down for the season this year? Team totally collapsed. This is a hometown kid, good soldier, and leader in the lockerroom. My favorite interview of his will always be between periods after he scored his 100th goal. Q: Andrew, what does it mean to you to have 100 goals? A: It doesn't mean s***. Hopefully the next 100 come faster. Copp is a fuqqin G

Speaking of Larkin's EOY presser... Where is Yzerman's??? Never taken him this long to do it in the past... fuqqing coward.

Not to mention he's nowhere near as good as Larkin on a much worse contract. Hard pass. But... Given that Marco is looking really really good, I'd take Pettersson for something centered around Danielson tho. Larkin, Pettersson, Kasper down the middle would give McClellan a million options next fall. Let Larkin take the tough matchups, which he's used to (and that Pettersson can't handle). Give Pettersson the sheltered offensive minutes, which he's better at than Larkin anyway. And then absolutely cook teams with something like Sodorblom-Kasper-Berggren/Mazur on your third line. All for the cost of a really good prospect that we'd no longer need. Edit: Basically look at the trade that sent Sam Reinhart to Florida. A lottery protected 1st and a good but not great prospect (Devon Levi). I'd imagine any trade for Pettersson would look something like that.

The availability and scrutiny surrounding Pettersson in itself sorta telltale sign of 'run away'...His on ice performance has been erratic these past few seasons and it's been rumored that the Canucks screwed up and traded away the wrong guy (JT Miller) and it should have been Pettersson getting shipped out (locker room drama). Sending Larkin to Vancouver for Pettersson would be a big mistake.

Larkin is getting torched on Reddit for saying something that any Red Wings fan with eyes could see for themselves the last two seasons. The TDL is a time of extreme stress and uncertainty for players on bad teams. These guys genuinely have no idea whether they're going to lose friends, or have to uproot their families, or just "fold" on the season because your GM decided you were a "seller" again this year. So to put them through it year after year after year without committing to any particular direction is completely tone deaf. It drives ME nuts to see a flawed team that neither sells nor adds. I can't imagine how the players feel about it. What even is the point? It's clear going into the deadline that we're not good enough, everyone (including SY) can see it so obviously , and yet he decides to...bring in Craig Smith? Why even bother? Wouldn't the team have been better off just keeping Veleno...a guy they all loved?

This team desperately needs a physical heart and soul guy that can play... I'm not sure who that would be nowadays... I'm thinking on a range between McCarty and Shanny

Great work Lefty!

If the plan is "tinker around the mushy middle" then I agree there is a plan. Otherwise I dont. For two seasons in a row now we have rolled into the TDL on our last legs, and in both instances the decision from SY has seemingly been "im praying too hard for playoffs too sell, but i also need my futures/prospects to build" so nothing. "The price of inaction is far greater than the cost of making a mistake" - some semi intelligent german Ahole >buying (even minimal purchases) = morale boost for the lockerroom = morale boost for the consumer (at least you tried) >selling = pressure off the lockerroom (no longer expected to win and therefore no longer your troops fault) = consumer at ease (looks to the future) >doing nothing = lockerroom in shambles (you believe in them... but not really) = consumer confused by lack of direction and doubt about org competance begins creeping in I know Ive been raging about this in in every thread. But its sooo fuqqing incompetant... im almost hoping someone will posit an argument that makes me see the silver lining. But to date ive found none. Unless there are some clownishly good moves up SYs sleeves this summer, this roster will be much the same next year, with much the same result. I could even see wheels falling off in Fall again, and we fire McClellan mid season. That reality is on the table right now. I wish Scott would come back already because his takes are always bizarrely ahead of everything - like the Alex Jones of LGW. >HES PULLING AN YZERSCAM, DONT BELIEVE HIS LIES. HES KEEPING PLAYERS ON THE ROSTER TO TURN THE TEAM GRAY. >we laugh >1 year later... wait... there is no plan and our team is gray...??? AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Hope you had a nice Easter Left. Well done on the rundown, I agree with about 99% of it. Caveat, I'd make... Since rejoining Detroit SY has dominated the trades in which he appears to have been able to sit back and work the tradeblock. Not so much when he's NEEDED to get something done and forced it. To use Fabbri as an example... I highly doubt SY originally coveted Fabbri or had his eye on him. But when he found out the underutilized player could be had cheap, he took a swing. However, when all of the sudden he felt he needed to move on from Fabbri ASAP, suddenly he's tripping over his own shoes. Staying with Fabbri, besides the reactive trade for him being good, and the proactive trading him away being bad, the timeline of events surrounding the former trade alludes to the lack of a grandiose plan. Surely SY would have known that guys he wanted to make plays for, like Stamkos, would have more than likely been available in the offseason, and that he needed to clear space to make a bid for them. If he didn't, that would show a level of incompetence, and would prove their isnt a grand stradegy at play... So if we give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he indeed had the foresight to see that coming, his decision ultimately was to not clear that space at the oppurtune time to do so (The TDL) and instead reluctantly give Fabbri away for nothing a few months later... only to lose out on the asset (Stamkos) he made that move to acquire. Sure... he wanted to make the playoffs... but if he wanted to make it that badly, he shouldve added to his roster at the TDL instead of doing nothing. And I'll support that by saying...look at what Kane and Larkin just said in this years exit interviews. The team was stumbling, getting hurt, but still fighting, and then the shot-in-the-arm/support at the TDL didnt come... and it continued to falter from there. Said in not so many words by our own leaders. Back to Fabbri, one could argue he didnt know he'd have to sell so insanely low on him in the summer, or that maybe there was no market for Fabs at the TDL. But there was a market for plenty of players like him, and its beyond obvious to everyone that there isnt the same market for players in summer as there is at TDLs. To add insult to injury, its rumored he could not get the stamkos deal done bc he did not get prior approval from Illitch. Indicating more lack of planning. And in the case of Walman, he did not even attempt to waive him - and Grier and other GMs indicated that they wouldve claimed him if done so - indicating another rash unplanned decision. And as a sidenote you had the agents in the agent pole this year literally stating there is no "plan" in Detroit. MY POINT IS THIS There is no plan. There is no grand stratedgy to what he's building. Yzerman is any fan with an Xbox playing GM mode. He's reacting often in the moment without much thought to whats to come. Is this terrible horrible bad news? No. But we do need to put the "yzerplan" narrative to rest. He's been exceptional at trades when he can sit back, take his time, and evaluate the block/market. He's been bad when he buys into his own teams hype, sits back and does nothing, and then feels forced to make panic trades later because of his own inaction. Not giving him a pass. I would like to see more and better planning, and a clearer direction. Its precisely his LACK of trades as of late that have been our downfall, not his wins and loses.