Potential new arena location

[RedWingsFanatic 4]

There was talk that the new arena would hold somewhere between 30-35 thousand, which would be awesome. The area around Comerica Park/Ford Field would be a great location. I really love going to JLA, even though it isn't anywhere near state-of-the-art, there are so many great memories in that building. Plus, whatever they name the new arena will sound nowhere as cool as saying "I'm going to the Joe."

There is no way the Wings would sell out a 35,000-seat arena for forty-two games a year. Not a chance.

[Elshupacabra 0]

Edit: just looked it up for fun, here is the list of the 10 oldest arenas in the NHL,

PIT-Mellon Arena (1961)

NYR-Madison Square Garden (1968)

NYI-Nassau Veterans Coliseum (1972)

EDM-Rexall Place(1974)

DET-Joe Louis Arena (1979)

NJD-Continental Airlines Arena (1981)

CGY-Pengrowth Saddledome (1983)

DAL-America West Arena (1992)

ANA-Arrowhead Pond of Anaheim (1993)

SJS-HP Pavilion at San Jose (1993)

I know that Dallas built a new building in 2001, I just could not edit it in time

Edited April 4, 2007 by Elshupacabra

[betterREDthandead 58]

There is no way the Wings would sell out a 35,000-seat arena for forty-two games a year. Not a chance.

Really? I bet they would. Ticket prices are ridiculously highly priced because of scarcity. I bet the Wings could sustain a 30,000 seat arena without much trouble. Maybe they'd miss selling out every once in a while, but that's not the worst thing in the world - they'd still be getting 27-28,000 where other teams can only pack in 18.

[Zetter is Better 0]

Question: Would more seats mean cheaper ticket prices?

I also hope the Wings get a new arena, the Joe is good an all but it ain't gettin' any younger.

[Kp-Wings 3]

From a business standpoint, a 30-35,000 arena capacity would be good, since theres more seats to go around, and they might just actually lower the price for once.

From a viewing standpoint though, that would be absolutly brutal to try and watch a game from the upper deck. That is way too many seats to have in an arena. I mean, people complain about the United Center in Chicago, and that has about half of that amount. Personally I think anything above 25,000 is way too much.

On another note, I like the area they chose for the new arena. It would be so close to all the bars and other forms of entertainment. I think it'd be cool.

[StevieY9802 6]

I made my first visit to the Joe last April and while I was in awe to finally be there, it wasn't the most visually pleasing arena I'd ever been in...the chairs weren't very comfortable...I think a new arena in the area near Ford Field and Comerica Park would be a great idea...now if we could get the Pistons to move downtown, we'd be all set!

You will have to keep dreaming about the Pistons moving downtown. Davidson owns that land. He's got the best setup in the world out there. And I actually like it out there. so much easier than having to try and go downtown.

Seating wise it will be around 20,000 just like everyone else. Playoffs tickets aren't going as fast as they once were so do they really need even more seats? Granted if they got to the finals they could pull it off but that doesn't happen every year.

I agree with most people that it would be a very difficult situation with 3 of the teams only blocks away. And parking would be a pain if there was more than one event going on. But we'll see. The Joe needs to go sadly. Its old and they can bring in more money with more suites. Only one ring of suites at the joe unlike the palace which has 3. The best thing I have to say about the joe though is that there is not one bad seat in the house. But we must say goodbye eventually.

Edited April 4, 2007 by StevieY9802

[BlakChamber 8]

So what Montreal has the biggest, that doesn't matter. They sell out every night and they are a mediocre team. But the Wings are an elite team, even when they are on the road they sell out buildings that are half empty every other night. I think 40k is a reasonable number considering the selling power of the Wings. That would also allow for lower ticket prices (if Illitch gives the fans a break and decides not all of us are rich).

All I am saying is that more than 20,066 people want to go to a Wings game, and the max. attendance should show that. More seats = more $ for Illitch.

40,000 people? A new arena, and lower ticket prices? Not a chance.

We've all seen the empty seats at The Joe this year. The only reason the Wings are keeping their sell out streak in tact is because the vast majority of the seats belong to season ticket holders and are already sold before the season starts. And, since a new arena is going to cost money, chances are the ticket prices would go up, not down.

Plus, given the way the Michigan economy is going, and especially the southeastern Michigan economy is going, are there really enough people to fill 40,000 seats for 42 games.

IMO, there's a better chance for me to beome a UM fan than there is for a new Wings arena to have more than 25,000 seats.

[detroitdan 0]

35,000, even 25,000 seats are too many...20,000 is more than enough...I can't imagine them selling out 35,000 seats every night over a full season...I don't care what people say, from watching the games this season, there seem to be a LOT of empty seats at the Joe, even when there is supposedly a sell out...I'd keep the capacity of a new arena at about what it is now at the Joe...no more than 21,000 seats.

[DVDplayer 0]

I just hope that when the Wings finally get a new arena they can find someone to design the thing so that it does not end up being a carbon copy of the majority of other new arenas. A few years ago my husband and I were trying to see a game in all 30 NHL arenas and I was surprised by how similar (and downright ugly) most of the new arenas are. For example, the only major difference I saw between the design of the arena in Boston and the design of the arena in Chicago was the

color of the seats.

As far as parking goes, what the city of Detroit desperately needs is some REAL public transportation, but of course that's a whole other problem entirely.

[Echolalia 2,961]

How many seats does the Joe have?

Whatever it is, the new arena should have much more seats. There have been so many times where I wanted to go to a sellout game, only to see half the seats on tv empty because of all the corporate businesses buying season tickets. Also, they should set up some sort of corporate deal at the top of the lower bowl or something, so real fans can take the good seats at ice level.

And above all, there should be more leg room for us 6 foot + type guys

[TheLegend19 1]

I took the liberty to look it up on Google Maps here is the link.

http://www.google.com/maps?q=138+W+Columbi...ap&ct=title

A new arena would be nice, but I like the location of the Joe. Right on the river, the new arena is just a ways down from Comerica, and Ford Field. Looks to be to cluttered. Hard decision.

I say we keep the Joe for a few more years

I like the location near Comerica and Ford Field. Thanks for googling it.

There is no way the Wings would sell out a 35,000-seat arena for forty-two games a year. Not a chance.

You're right. It'd be impossible.

And that's why they only play 41 home games a year.

[BlakChamber 8]

How many seats does the Joe have?

Whatever it is, the new arena should have much more seats. There have been so many times where I wanted to go to a sellout game, only to see half the seats on tv empty because of all the corporate businesses buying season tickets. Also, they should set up some sort of corporate deal at the top of the lower bowl or something, so real fans can take the good seats at ice level.

And above all, there should be more leg room for us 6 foot + type guys

A sellout at The Joe is 20,066 people.

Does anyone know what percentage of season tickets are held by corporations and what percentage are held by "normal" people? I know it's popular to bash the corporate ticket holders, I've always wondered how many there actually are.

Another question to throw out, that I don't know the answer to. How come teams like the Habs, Leafs, Wild, etc that all have fairly new arenas and that routinely sell out, didn't build larger arenas? Both the ACC and Xcel seat less than 20,000. There must be some reason that teams don't want to go any bigger than 21,000 people. Possibly because you'd have to build another level up and it would be pretty crappy to watch a game from that high up?

[akustyk 84]

There must be some reason that teams don't want to go any bigger than 21,000 people. Possibly because you'd have to build another level up and it would be pretty crappy to watch a game from that high up?

security? I mean like: flushing 20k people through the gates within say 5 minutes is not exactly the same as doing it with 30k. if the only way to achieve the same level of security (gates` throughput in case of massive spectator`s escape) is scaling up the design, then you end up with an area having seats that far from the ice, that the view would be extremely poor. and you most certainly can not compress people more densely(sp?) on the same area as for 20k - in addition to security problem you also have ventilation(?) issue, medical assistance ability to reach certain places quickly etc. there's not a chance you'd get an allowance to build something like that

[Offsides 21]

Aw, I'm going to miss the Joe, I really will.

But I'm not so silly to think we will never move on...though I do have some concerns. One is the location.

Wants: Some of those cool electric runners that go all around the arena, an awesome scoreboard, comfy seats, more bathrooms, decent location where it's easy to get to but isn't ridiculous to park at, something that will feel like home, better access to food..., waiters ooh, maybe even a cool store and restaurant..

DOES NOT Want: An arena that's too big...seriously...at some point you might as well be at home watching on TV and the accoustics are horrible (you think it's quiet NOW), to pay MORE for parking...it's already ridiculous, to pay a lot MORE for tickets...same reason, to lose my season ticket seat at the end, a really HIGH arena, An upper bowl that overlaps the lower bowl, a parking nightmere.

[BlakChamber 8]

security? I mean like: flushing 20k people through the gates within say 5 minutes is not exactly the same as doing it with 30k. if the only way to achieve the same level of security (gates` throughput in case of massive spectator`s escape) is scaling up the design, then you end up with an area having seats that far from the ice, that the view would be extremely poor. and you most certainly can not compress people more densely(sp?) on the same area as for 20k - in addition to security problem you also have ventilation(?) issue, medical assistance ability to reach certain places quickly etc. there's not a chance you'd get an allowance to build something like that

Not a bad idea, but baseball and football stadiums hold far more people. Ford Field seats 65,000 and Comerica seats roughly 41,000. I don't think it's a security issue.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

There was talk that the new arena would hold somewhere between 30-35 thousand, which would be awesome. The area around Comerica Park/Ford Field would be a great location. I really love going to JLA, even though it isn't anywhere near state-of-the-art, there are so many great memories in that building. Plus, whatever they name the new arena will sound nowhere as cool as saying "I'm going to the Joe."

a 35,000 person arena would be a terrible place to watch hockey.

The main reason I like the Joe is it's a great venue for hockey games. steep seating and good sightlines. Making an arena big enough to hold that many people, especially because I'm assuming it would also have mid-level luxury boxes, would put the fans pretty far away from the game. Especially the upper bowl fans, who in my opinion are the core of the fan base.

Another question to throw out, that I don't know the answer to. How come teams like the Habs, Leafs, Wild, etc that all have fairly new arenas and that routinely sell out, didn't build larger arenas? Both the ACC and Xcel seat less than 20,000. There must be some reason that teams don't want to go any bigger than 21,000 people. Possibly because you'd have to build another level up and it would be pretty crappy to watch a game from that high up?

you said you didn't know the answer, then you answered it.

I think you're right. I'd guess that no one has figured out how to build an arena that big and still have it be a decent place to watch hockey. They probably rake in more money with the luxury boxes anyway, so it'd make more sense to go smaller and add more boxes than to try to add 5,000 or so more fans.

Edited April 4, 2007 by haroldsnepsts

[GuloGulo 0]

Tampa had their Thunderdome rink for a while. twas big. Real big.

[schulzte 18]

Back in the Early and Mid '80's, the Joe was too big. 20,000 is plenty big for an indoor arena; there is a reason that no arena in the NHL is bigger than 21K and 22K in the NBA. The seats, isles, legroom, and bathrooms at the Joe are small, but not the number of seats. If there were more mid-level club seats and suites, those high-rolling no shows could buy tickets there instead of near the ice. The level of fan interest was bound to wane after a while too, a great hockey team year after year is wonderful, but it isn't a novelty any more. I think in the late '90's you could sell 30K tickets/game, but not now.

[Kp-Wings 3]

Tampa had their Thunderdome rink for a while. twas big. Real big.

I remember when they played in the Thunderdome. The Lightning set an attendance record for like 27,000 at one game. I look at that picture though, and the upper seats look very far away. I wonder if they could even see the game from that high up.

[stevie for president 42]

Not a bad idea, but baseball and football stadiums hold far more people. Ford Field seats 65,000 and Comerica seats roughly 41,000. I don't think it's a security issue.

they playing field in hockey and basketball is significantly smaller than baseball and football, and football and baseball generally have outdoor arenas. that could be why they seat 2 or 3 times more than hockey and basketball. who knows?

[schulzte 18]

That is a cool picture of the Thunderdome pre Devil Rays. It actually looks like a decent hockey set up, better than I thought. I think hockey capacity was 28,000. I think they drew very well there when the hockey team and the dome was very new. Tampa has really been a good hockey market overall, probably the best in the South other than Dallas

[Yzermania19 1]

I remember back in the pre-Yzerman era (lol) the Wings were getting maybe 3,000 people at a game. When Ilitch first bought the team, he was giving away cars at every home game in order to put butts in the seats.

We've been very fortunate over the last 20+ years that the Wings have been very good and for the last 16 years they've made the playoffs. But what goes up must come down - face it, eventually the team will have to start sucking in the regular season and fewer people will go to games because of it. If you think the Joe looked empty in 1982 with 3,000 people, imagine what a 35,000-seat arena will look like with only 3,000 people in it. Look at Comerica Park as an example, how forlorn it looked before last season when maybe 8-10,000 people showed up for games on a regular basis. There were whole sections with no people in them.

I mean, it would be great in the short term to have more tickets available, but I don't think it's very practical.

[eva unit zero 271]

I remember back in the pre-Yzerman era (lol) the Wings were getting maybe 3,000 people at a game.

Hmm...you left off a digit. In 1982, the Wings were averaging 13,000, not 3,000.

We've been very fortunate over the last 20+ years that the Wings have been very good and for the last 16 years they've made the playoffs. But what goes up must come down - face it, eventually the team will have to start sucking in the regular season and fewer people will go to games because of it. If you think the Joe looked empty in 1982 with 3,000 people, imagine what a 35,000-seat arena will look like with only 3,000 people in it. Look at Comerica Park as an example, how forlorn it looked before last season when maybe 8-10,000 people showed up for games on a regular basis. There were whole sections with no people in them.

Comerica Park is different though. The Tigers had spent ten years losing, and making no realistic effort to even TRY and compete. All they were doing was trying not to be the worst.

There will be no point in the foreseeable future where that will be the case with the Wings.

[Matt 1,049]

There will be no point in the foreseeable future where that will be the case with the Wings.

That doesn't mean that a 35,000-seat arena is realistic. If the new arena is built I wouldn't put more than 22,000 seats in it. Maybe enough to just eclipse Montreal, but that's it.

[TheLegend19 1]

Not a bad idea, but baseball and football stadiums hold far more people. Ford Field seats 65,000 and Comerica seats roughly 41,000. I don't think it's a security issue.

It can't be. Michigan Stadium holds 107, 501...they've had 112,00+ in there.

Edit: I just noticed that today is my 3 year aniversary of joining LGW.

Edited April 5, 2007 by TheLegend19