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Matt

Post-TDT: Red Wings stand pat, no additions

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Ok so Kenny can still hit a home run this summer. However he must clear some salary to do it. Hopefully the rumours of being able to buy out 1 contract and not have it count against the Cap will happen. Ericsson gets bought out. Cleary is traded for a pick. His no trade clause is no longer in effect. Sign Parise and Suter. Promote Nyquist, Tatar and Smith. Holmstrom retires. Hudler leaves as a UFA. Same with Stuart. Helm, Abdelakder and Quincey get raises as they are all RFAs. Kronwall's salary jumps to 4.75 mil. Anyway this is what I am hoping for next season...Is it realistic? I don't know. :D

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS

Johan Franzen ($3.954m) / Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / Todd Bertuzzi ($2.075m)

Valtteri Filppula ($3.000m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) / Zach Parise ($7.000m)

Justin Abdelkader ($1.500m) / Darren Helm ($1.500m) / Drew Miller ($0.837m)

Jan Mursak ($0.550m) / Cory Emmerton ($0.533m) / Gustav Nyquist ($0.875m)

Tomas Tatar ($0.840m)

DEFENSEMEN

Nicklas Lidstrom ($6.200m) / Ian White ($2.875m)

Ryan Suter ($7.000m) / Niklas Kronwall ($4.750m)

Kyle Quincey ($3.300m) / Brendan Smith ($0.875m)

Jakub Kindl ($0.883m)

GOALTENDERS

Jimmy Howard ($2.250m) / Joey MacDonald ($0.550m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)

(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)

SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,132,044; BONUSES: $247,500

CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $167,956

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Whatever the case, the fact that everyone wanted Smith yesterday--unsurprising given the exorbitant prices sellers wanted--fully explains why there were no major moves yesterday.

And here's one more for you. He overpayed for Quincey as well. Since when was a 3rd pairing defenseman worth a first round pick? So Holland shouldn't be hypocritical about not overpaying someone. He's done it over the last six months with Quincey and Ericsson. And if that's what the current market is, then it's not overpayment anymore, but the current trend. Heck, everyone seems to be overpaying. Except for Yzerman. He fleeced a good depth defensman from us for a 7th round pick.

Here's one more for YOU: Quincey was the ice-time leader in Colorado, and by no stretch of the imagination is he a third-pairing defenseman. And let's repeat AGAIN that this was a SELLER'S MARKET. When guys like Paul Gaustad garner a first-round pick, you know that prices are high. More, Quincey is NOT a rental. He's an RFA at the end of the season. A late first-round pick in a weak draft year is not an overly high price to pay.

You may now to return to your pre-scheduled bleating.

Edited by Crymson
kipwinger, Frozen-Man, 55fan and 1 other like this

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Whatever the case, the fact that everyone wanted Smith yesterday--unsurprising given the exorbitant prices sellers wanted--fully explains why there were no major moves yesterday.

Here's one more for YOU: Quincey was the ice-time leader in Colorado, and by no stretch of the imagination is he a third-pairing defenseman. And let's repeat AGAIN that this was a SELLER'S MARKET. When guys like Paul Gaustad garner a first-round pick, you know that prices are high. More, Quincey is NOT a rental. He's an RFA at the end of the season. A late first-round pick in a weak draft year is not an overly high price to pay.

But do feel free to return to your pre-scheduled bleating.

I think this deadline more than all the others in the past proves that if you want to add pieces to your roster then you should do it in the summer. There's just to many buyers now and not enough sellers so the price to acquire players is too high. I don't think Kenny would have traded Smith in any deal, even one for Nash.

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I think this deadline more than all the others in the past proves that if you want to add pieces to your roster then you should do it in the summer. There's just to many buyers now and not enough sellers so the price to acquire players is too high. I don't think Kenny would have traded Smith in any deal, even one for Nash.

The prices last summer were likewise too high. Things will likely be different this summer, with so many more UFAs hitting the market. Last year's UFA class was the worst in recent memory.

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It ain't like Smith is the Wings only tradeable asset. Holland probably just tries to lowball everybody which is why he's singing the same song after every trade deadline.

esteef

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Quincey was not an overpayment at all. He was acquired by Tampa for a good player in Steve Downie. Stevie Y then traded Quincey for a 1st round pick. Quincey has developed into a top 4 dman since he left Detroit. He is not the same guy whom Kenny placed on waivers 4 1/2 years ago. Detroit's 1st round pick will be somewhere between #27-30. So essentially it's more like an early 2nd round pick. Nashville gave up a #1 pick for a 4th line centre in Paul Gaustad. He is a UFA. To me, that is a dumb trade. If they can re-sign him it makes it a little better. But he's still a 4th line player. Quincey is a top 4 dman who is only on the 3rd pair with the Wings because the blueline is so deep. If Kenny can't sign Suter as a UFA this summer, Quincey is good insurance to slot in as a #4 behind Nick (if he plays another season), Kronwall and White.

The prices last summer were likewise too high. Things will likely be different this summer, with so many more UFAs hitting the market. Last year's UFA class was the worst in recent memory.

Kenny still did well in replacing Rafalski with White. He has been one of the better UFA signings this season. While last summer was not very impressive as far as quality UFAs go, this summer is. With Parise and Suter available, Kenny can really improve the team if he can get them. Easier said than done but I think it's possible.

Edited by Hatethedrake!

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It ain't like Smith is the Wings only tradeable asset. Holland probably just tries to lowball everybody which is why he's singing the same song after every trade deadline.

esteef

Speculation, and probably incorrect. Prices were high, and the other teams probably wanted the Wings` most notable prospect.

Edited by Crymson
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Speculation, and probably incorrect. Prices were high, and the other teams probably wanted the Wings` most notable prospect.

Sometimes the prices are high, beer at a ball game is a hell of a lot more than at home but if you wanna drink, you gotta pay it. I'm fine not sending Smith away but he probably wasn't the only name to come up throughout the entire deadline. And yes, I'm speculating.

esteef

Detroit # 1 Fan likes this

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Sometimes the prices are high, beer at a ball game is a hell of a lot more than at home but if you wanna drink, you gotta pay it. I'm fine not sending Smith away but he probably wasn't the only name to come up throughout the entire deadline. And yes, I'm speculating.

esteef

If beer at a ball game cost $50 per glass, you very likely wouldn't pay it.

Edited by Crymson
kipwinger, Frozen-Man and heikks86 like this

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If beer at a ball game cost $50 per glass, you very likely wouldn't pay it.

I was at the Air Canada Centre a few months ago and the beer was damn near 50 bucks a pop. :lol:

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If beer at a ball game cost $50 per glass, you very likely wouldn't pay it.

If my goal was to get buzzed and enjoy the game I would. Kenny would be drinking his cheap beer at home well after the fun's already over going "Yippee I saved some money!"

esteef

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If my goal was to get buzzed and enjoy the game I would. Kenny would be drinking his cheap beer at home well after the fun's already over going "Yippee I saved some money!"

esteef

I disagree with your speculations.

kipwinger likes this

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No it isn't.

It's fun to hate on E, but Kindl couldn't even hold his spot in the lineup over Commodore, let alone outplay Ericsson. The fact of the matter is right now Ericsson is a superior defenseman to Kindl.

Quincey can play on the PP, pick up time on the PK, and play somewhat physical. He's basically the kind of player they're hoping Kindl becomes.

So defensively we're looking pretty good. But I'm not crazy about our 4th line. It would've been nice to bolster that a little at the deadline.

Read it again, I didn't say that Kindl was better than Ericsson. I said Quincey/Kindl is better than Ericsson/Kindl. In this situation the comparison is whether Quincey is better than Ericsson, as Kindl is the common partner in each case. I didn't compare Ericsson to Kindl. Take a minute to catch up and then think to yourself, "is a pairing of Quincey and Kindl (what we have now because of an injury to Ericsson) a better pairing than one with Ericsson and Kindl (what we had two weeks ago because Quincey wasn't on the team)?" Obviously the best scenario is Quincey and Ericsson, and I suggested as much in my original post.

It was probably the slash that threw you off. I'll use a dash next time when denoting defensive pairings.

Edited by kipwinger

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It's funny how everybody always talks about how great Detroit's depth is and how awesomely they can pull good prospects out of nowhere, yet nobody seems to want any of them in a trade.

esteef

It seems as though the opposite scenario is what occurred. From press clipping and twitters (sp?) most teams wanted Detroits prospects. Holland said he was only willing to give up draft picks, that the prospects were virtually untouchable.

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Read it again, I didn't say that Kindl was better than Ericsson. I said Quincey/Kindl is better than Ericsson/Kindl. In this situation the comparison is whether Quincey is better than Ericsson, as Kindl is the common partner in each case. I didn't compare Ericsson to Kindl. Take a minute to catch up and then think to yourself, "is a pairing of Quincey and Kindl (what we have now because of an injury to Ericsson) a better pairing than one with Ericsson and Kindl (what we had two weeks ago because Quincey wasn't on the team)?" Obviously the best scenario is Quincey and Ericsson, and I suggested as much in my original post.

It was probably the slash that threw you off. I'll use a dash next time when denoting defensive pairings.

I just re-read your post. I totally misread it the first time. Sorry. Hadn't had coffee yet or something. I get what you're saying now. :P

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I just re-read your post. I totally misread it the first time. Sorry. Hadn't had coffee yet or something. I get what you're saying now. :P

No prob. People s*** on Ericsson enough around here that it's almost second nature to just assume that's what's happening whenever you see his name brought up. I, however, am one of the minority on record who think that he's been just fine this year. If not, then I am now: ERICSSON HAS BEEN JUST FINE THIS YEAR PEOPLE!

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It seems as though the opposite scenario is what occurred. From press clipping and twitters (sp?) most teams wanted Detroits prospects. Holland said he was only willing to give up draft picks, that the prospects were virtually untouchable.

Exactly. Kenny comes to the trading table with a bunch of McDonald's gift certificates and wonders why nobody wants to deal with him.

esteef

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Exactly. Kenny comes to the trading table with a bunch of McDonald's gift certificates and wonders why nobody wants to deal with him.

esteef

I was thinking about this too. The fact that every single roster player and higher end prospect was off the table before negotiations started does say something about the confidence that KH and Babs have in this lineup. Personally, I would have entertained offers on any of our forwards except Pav, Hank, and Filppula, just to see what kinds of offers we'd get, but apparently that's not KH's style.

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Quincey was not an overpayment at all. He was acquired by Tampa for a good player in Steve Downie. Stevie Y then traded Quincey for a 1st round pick. Quincey has developed into a top 4 dman since he left Detroit. He is not the same guy whom Kenny placed on waivers 4 1/2 years ago. Detroit's 1st round pick will be somewhere between #27-30. So essentially it's more like an early 2nd round pick. Nashville gave up a #1 pick for a 4th line centre in Paul Gaustad. He is a UFA. To me, that is a dumb trade. If they can re-sign him it makes it a little better. But he's still a 4th line player. Quincey is a top 4 dman who is only on the 3rd pair with the Wings because the blueline is so deep. If Kenny can't sign Suter as a UFA this summer, Quincey is good insurance to slot in as a #4 behind Nick (if he plays another season), Kronwall and White.

Kenny still did well in replacing Rafalski with White. He has been one of the better UFA signings this season. While last summer was not very impressive as far as quality UFAs go, this summer is. With Parise and Suter available, Kenny can really improve the team if he can get them. Easier said than done but I think it's possible.

I was never in favor of letting Quincey go, but I wouldn't have given up a first round pick for him, knowing that pick would give me more options at the deadline. Also, he had injury problems last year, which are something to consider.

And yes, Nashville's trade was totally stupid, but that's their problem.

Exactly. Kenny comes to the trading table with a bunch of McDonald's gift certificates and wonders why nobody wants to deal with him.

esteef

We have some good prospects but no one who should be labeled as "untouchable", except for maybe Smith, since we're lacking good defensive prospects as it is. If Holland is unwilling to trade prospects, and has traded his top pick already, it's no wonder we didn't make many deals.

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We have some good prospects but no one who should be labeled as "untouchable", except for maybe Smith, since we're lacking good defensive prospects as it is. If Holland is unwilling to trade prospects, and has traded his top pick already, it's no wonder we didn't make many deals.

I guess it's convenient for you to ignore the report that every team wanted Smith as part of a deal. A first-rounder was not enough for anything this year.

Eh, I'm wasting my time.

dat's sick likes this

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Here is my roster and salaries for next year if Staurt and Lids leave... Now the contracts here are typical of Holland. A bit lower salary for long term contract. (at least 5 years)

FORWARDS

Zach Parise ($6.700m) / Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / Johan Franzen ($3.954m)

Valtteri Filppula ($3.000m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) / Todd Bertuzzi ($2.075m)

Jiri Hudler ($3.000m) / Darren Helm ($1.000m) / Daniel Cleary ($2.800m)

Drew Miller ($0.837m) / Justin Abdelkader ($0.900m) / Patrick Eaves ($1.200m)

Cory Emmerton ($0.533m)

DEFENSEMEN

Niklas Kronwall ($4.750m) / Ryan Suter ($6.200m)

Ian White ($2.875m) / Kyle Quincey ($3.000m)

Jonathan Ericsson ($3.250m) / Brendan Smith ($0.875m)

Jakub Kindl ($0.883m)

GOALTENDERS

Jimmy Howard ($2.250m) / Joey MacDonald ($0.550m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)

(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)

SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,417,044; BONUSES: $0

CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $882,956

...yes, I know damn well that other teams will offer Suter and Parise the world, but this is just what I would love to see and with long term guaranteed contracts, the salary difference is not to off. Of course if Lidstrom comes back, this throws either Suter or Parise out of the mix. In that case I would choose to sign Suter over Parise because you will need to replace Lidstrom sooner than later...not unless Nashville only re-ups Weber for one more season and Holland would rather get Parise now and roll the dice on Weber in 2013...

Yes, I have re-signed Hudler (hard to believe, eh?) and at a modest raise. He gets Filppula's salary for a long term contract. Helm and Abby both get modest raises for a few years each and Quincey takes a small cut, but gets a long term contract...

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I was never in favor of letting Quincey go, but I wouldn't have given up a first round pick for him, knowing that pick would give me more options at the deadline. Also, he had injury problems last year, which are something to consider.

And yes, Nashville's trade was totally stupid, but that's their problem.

We have some good prospects but no one who should be labeled as "untouchable", except for maybe Smith, since we're lacking good defensive prospects as it is. If Holland is unwilling to trade prospects, and has traded his top pick already, it's no wonder we didn't make many deals.

Or the fact a center version of a less talented Justin Abdelkader went for a first round pick might have something to do with the lack of trades

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For people upset Holland ONLY made the Quincey deal at the deadline, I was reading that teams don't like to trade with the Red Wings. They don't want to make the Wings stronger. And I'll add, Holland wins most of the deals he makes so the other GMs probably up what their asking for when Kenny calls.

dat's sick likes this

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I guess it's convenient for you to ignore the report that every team wanted Smith as part of a deal.

I bet Smith was part of deals involving players like Nash, Carter, Roy, and Brown but Gaustad and Pahlssen? Boooools***. That's just Holland covering his ass. Again, Smith ain't the only tradeable asset on the Wings.

esteef

F.Michael likes this

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