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Faceoff violation Penalty


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#1 Jaymister

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 12:11 AM

I'm still steamed about that call last night against Datsyuk that cost us the game against LA.  Its a call that's rarely made and to make it in a close game to put a team down two men is a complete joke.  The linesman need to drop the puck and not try to be the star of the show.  Don Cherry was complaining about it earlier this season and he's right, that call should never be made.


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#2 Euro_Twins

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 12:54 AM

agreed, he barely touched the puck, he literally fell on it



and the constant kicking people out of the circle, just drop the puck, stop trying to get all the face time!


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#3 toby91_ca

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 10:15 AM

I was probably watching a different feed because I didn't see any replays of what happened.  Presummably though, he touched the puck with his hand off the draw?  If that is the case, I disagree that it is hardly called.  From the games I've watched so far this year, that call is pretty much automatic.  I don't like it, but that's the way it is.  I don't mind the rule, but when when guys play the puck with their hands in such a way that is is obviously not what the intention was going into to try to win the draw, I don't like it.  That collateral damage of a rule though that is meant to eliminate something else.



#4 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 10:21 AM

I was probably watching a different feed because I didn't see any replays of what happened.  Presummably though, he touched the puck with his hand off the draw?  If that is the case, I disagree that it is hardly called.  From the games I've watched so far this year, that call is pretty much automatic.  I don't like it, but that's the way it is.  I don't mind the rule, but when when guys play the puck with their hands in such a way that is is obviously not what the intention was going into to try to win the draw, I don't like it.  That collateral damage of a rule though that is meant to eliminate something else.

The penalty on Datsyuk they didn't show a replay but I rewound the DVR and watched it a few times.  It was hard to know for sure but it sure looked like he kept both hands on his stick even though his stick was flat on the ice, then the puck shot out from somewhere else.  

 

Then the center ice ref called the penalty and everyone else looked like they had no idea what was going on, including the linesman who dropped the puck and the ref much closer to the play. 

 

I can't say for sure Dats didn't touch it, but it sure didn't look like it.  I don't know if they can or not but they should let the lineseman who drops the puck call the penalty.  Anyone outside the scrum that is a faceoff is going to have a hard time seeing what exactly happened.  



#5 Rick D

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 10:25 AM

I cant think of a dumber reason to make someone sit for 2 mins.

 

The first time i saw someone use their hands on a face-off Draper did it, and i thought it was such a smart play.

 

There is no reason this shouldn't be allowed. Taking a teams center out of the game for making a clever play is silly. Quit with all of the silly stoppages, and just let the game be played.


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#6 rrasco

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 10:36 AM

It's a new rule which is why it seems like they don't call it.  They have.  I've seen it called 4-5x at least during games I've watched.

 

Having said that, I'm not sure Pavs touched it with his hand, and if he did, his hand was still on the stick so it's not like he closed his hand on the puck.  They showed a replay of it, from the camera that was facing Pavs on ice level.  Puck was behind his gloves/stick, but I didn't see if he touched it or where it went.

 

What I don't get is, they allow hand passes in the defensive zone, but you can't do it off the faceoff?  If you're in the d zone, it's a hand pass, nothing more.  If you're not in your zone...then it's a hand pass and they call it down.  Why assess a penalty?  I don't remember which zone they were in, but that's irrelevant, it shouldn't be a penalty.


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#7 wingslogo19

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 10:53 AM

Really don't like this new rule. I get that winning a faceoff with your hand isn't right, but shouldn't be 2 mins.


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#8 toby91_ca

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 11:10 AM

So, this is what I can gather from hand passes in general:

 

 - on the faceoff, they want draws taken as intended, not by falling to the ice and swatting back with your hands.  They made the rule that results in a penalty if you place the puck with your hands on the faceoff (doens't matter what zone of the ice you are in).  After the faceoff is complete, you go back to regular hand pass rules.

 

 - What I don't really like is that hand passes are allowed in the d zone, but nowhere else.  Got me thinking back about why this is the case.  From what I remember hearing, I think the rationale is that when a defending player would lose his stick, he was immediately try to pass the puck with his hands to get a stoppage in play.  To avoid the delay in the game from such a stoppage, they decided to allow hand passes in the d zone. 

 

There are some GMs out there today who would like penalties to be assessed for hand passes in the d zone.  Some might think this is a complete flip (i.e. not simply going from allowing it in the d zone to not allowing but, but going even further and calling a penalty?).  The thing is, if they decided to simply not allow it anymore, it would actually give the defensive team an advantage by being able to get a stoppage in play by doing it.  So, you either leave it as is (my preference), or assess penalties.



#9 Din758

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 01:28 PM

I thought he clearly played the puck with his hand. And pretty sure FSD showed the replay of it. Still really stupid rule. If you can play the puck with your hand anywhere else on the ice (except closing your hand on it) why shouldnt you be allowed to in the circle?

 

Stupid rule, but hopefully well get a break our way because of it.


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#10 amato

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 02:14 PM

The center ice ref being the one to call it is the dumbest part about the whole thing. It's like the ref not on the blue line calling offsides..

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#11 Wings_Dynasty

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 02:33 PM

I disagree with the penalty, just stop play and do the face-off again and kick the guy out of the circle.

 

I can see their POV as well though, they don't want face-offs to degenerate into 2 guys dropping to their knees and slap fighting over the puck as soon as it drops.


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#12 MabusIncarnate

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 02:40 PM

Reminds me of that South Park Mormon episode..

 

New faceoff rule this season.. dumb da da dumb dumb dumb.

 

Eliminating it next season.. smart smart smart.

 

I say leave it as it was. You close your hand on the puck, delay of game. You push it back with your glove, legal.

 

That penalty essentially decided the game, and it shouldn't have. Ask me again about this rule though in a few weeks when i'm not pissed anymore about the outcome and refereeing of that game.


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#13 StormJH1

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 02:48 PM

It has certainly been called fairly routinely around the league.  I don't remember the team and player involved in the first one, but I believe it cost that team the game as well.

 

I don't like the rule, but I can't say it's the "dumbest" 2-minute penalty in the game - that honor would probably go to the shoot out of play in the defensive zone penalty, or the trapezoid rule.  (Question here: Has any goalie actually ever been called for the trapezoid rule?  I've never seen one since they put the rule in after the 05' lockout, but it's pretty ridiculous watching goalies try to dodge it with nobody around).

 

You can see arguments for this one.  It could be a safety thing for hands and wrists (much like the no kicking rule in the goal crease).  But it's probably more to avoid faceoffs becoming a rugby match where you have centers that aren't even trying to win a draw with skill. 



#14 Euro_Twins

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 03:31 PM

It has certainly been called fairly routinely around the league.  I don't remember the team and player involved in the first one, but I believe it cost that team the game as well.

 

I don't like the rule, but I can't say it's the "dumbest" 2-minute penalty in the game - that honor would probably go to the shoot out of play in the defensive zone penalty, or the trapezoid rule.  (Question here: Has any goalie actually ever been called for the trapezoid rule?  I've never seen one since they put the rule in after the 05' lockout, but it's pretty ridiculous watching goalies try to dodge it with nobody around).

 

You can see arguments for this one.  It could be a safety thing for hands and wrists (much like the no kicking rule in the goal crease).  But it's probably more to avoid faceoffs becoming a rugby match where you have centers that aren't even trying to win a draw with skill. 

 

I don't mind the defensive zone delay of game penalty, only because it stops players from routinely shooting it over the glass if they can't clear the puck


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#15 PumpIron

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 04:36 PM

This rule would of made draper retire sooner, At least they waited til he was gone.



#16 hooon

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 05:34 PM

Stupid rule, and Datsyuk never actually touched it, so it was a terrible call too, especially when the center ice ref was the one to call it. Considering it led directly to the other team scoring in a close game just puts more salt in the wound. 


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#17 Barrie

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 05:35 PM

I'm still steamed about that call last night against Datsyuk that cost us the game against LA.  Its a call that's rarely made and to make it in a close game to put a team down two men is a complete joke.  The linesman need to drop the puck and not try to be the star of the show.  Don Cherry was complaining about it earlier this season and he's right, that call should never be made.

 

That's one of my complaints about NHL officials. They have way to much effect in momentum swings in games based on their calls. And it doesn't help that most of their calls are based on the score. They almost have as much effect on the momentum of the game as the players do, sometimes more.


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#18 eva unit zero

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 10:27 PM

It looked pretty clear on the replay that he swiped it back with his glove (still holding his stick).

 

I guess I'm more upset about no call on either Stoll pounding Cleary's head into the boards, or Penner's takeout hit on Smith. Those no-calls are what decided the game, if anything.


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#19 wings_fanatic

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 07:48 PM

This is just a dumb rule and is another reason why the modern game of hockey pails in comparison to hockey back in the day, just 10 years ago for example. There is no reason for this rule other than to try to let the officials control more of the game.



#20 Bully76

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 08:02 PM

It looked pretty clear on the replay that he swiped it back with his glove (still holding his stick).

 

I guess I'm more upset about no call on either Stoll pounding Cleary's head into the boards, or Penner's takeout hit on Smith. Those no-calls are what decided the game, if anything.

Agreed. Especially Penner's hit. What the hell was that and where was the ref looking?


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