No Scoring and No Fighting

[GMRwings1983 8,803]

No this thread is not about the Wings.

So the league leader in points this year was Jamie Benn, with a whopping 87 points. Ovechkin led the league in goals with 53. Only two other players even hit 40 goals! Only 15 players hit 30 goals.

I know this is the era of butterfly, oversized pad goaltending, but this can't be what Bettman and company want to see. You'd think all the top players in the league spent the season overseas when you look at these stats atop the leaderboards.

Oh and only 16 players hit 100+ PIM, with only 4 of those players hitting 150+ PIM. I can't imagine that happening any other time in a full season in the modern era.

To sum up, this "new NHL" has no scoring and no fighting. I guess if you're a fan of big goalies swallowing up pucks, you'll love today's game.

Oh I almost forgot. There's parity, so that makes everything more fun to watch, despite the fact that nobody scores, hits or fights. Parity is what really counts here folks.

Edited April 13, 2015 by GMRwings1983

[Hack & Whack Rule! 160]

A few more years and it'll be figure skating with sticks.

[GMRwings1983 8,803]

A few more years and it'll be figure skating with sticks.

Aren't we already there?

And I hope the league doesn't think that the way to solve this is by increasing powerplays. That seemed to be their "genius" idea for how to raise goals after the lockout.

Edited April 13, 2015 by GMRwings1983

[8 Legged RedWing 367]

I can't even remember seeing many big hits this year. For or against the Wings. I can literally recall maybe only two or three for the Wings this whole season. Granted I know the Wings aren't the team to watch for hits but still.

[GMRwings1983 8,803]

I can't even remember seeing many big hits this year. For or against the Wings. I can literally recall maybe only two or three for the Wings this whole season. Granted I know the Wings aren't the team to watch for hits but still.

Good point. I couldn't even find hitting stats on the league's site, but big hits didn't seem too common either.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

I can't even remember seeing many big hits this year. For or against the Wings. I can literally recall maybe only two or three for the Wings this whole season. Granted I know the Wings aren't the team to watch for hits but still.

There were big hits this year, they just tend not to happen with the Wings. The Wings don't really hit, so even when their opponent plays a physical game, it's not that physical relatively speaking.

[GMRwings1983 8,803]

There were big hits this year, they just tend not to happen with the Wings. The Wings don't really hit, so even when their opponent plays a physical game, it's not that physical relatively speaking.

They must have all been legal if only 4 players hit 150+ PIM.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

They must have all been legal if only 4 players hit 150+ PIM.

Even the ones that weren't, the refs have to actually call a penalty and even then what counts against PIMS, 10 minutes? I'm guessing the lack of fighting is why PIMs are down.

But there's teams that hit. Seemed like Byfuglien was wrecking someone every other game. And watching games not involving the Wings there were guys throwing their weight around. Wings just don't play that style.

[Wings_Toledo 233]

Honestly I don't think we've ever seen an era of the NHL where there were so many great goaltenders in the league at the same time. Save % has gone up every year since the first lockout and there were fewer penalties called this season than any in recent history. At least, if this source is correct: http://www.hockey-reference.com/leagues/stats.html#stats::11

[GMRwings1983 8,803]

Honestly I don't think we've ever seen an era of the NHL where there were so many great goaltenders in the league at the same time. Save % has gone up every year since the first lockout and there were fewer penalties called this season than any in recent history. At least, if this source is correct: http://www.hockey-reference.com/leagues/stats.html#stats::11

Yeah, I'm thinking even smaller goalie equipment may not make the game more exciting. Don't forget the defensive systems have gotten a lot better than they used to be. But even so, you always see vintage tapes of players scoring from slapshots on the rush with no screen in front of the goalie. That never seems to work anymore. Now everyone's screaming for a goalie to be pulled if he gives up a shot like that.

The goalies are just trained too well nowadays. They have made the league less exciting . The rule changes and eradication of fighting has helped also.

As I said, one has to embrace big goalies that can swallow pucks to enjoy today's game. I for one don't, which is the biggest reason I follow the league casually now and not religiously like I used to.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

Give it a few more years and this game will be like soccer on ice, figure skating with sticks and gear and players will be asked to play in a synchronized way ...instead of acting like men they will be forced to run to Quintal and asking him for help.

I don't care about the scoring part don't think it's that important but you are - as always - damn right in all other points.

Edited April 13, 2015 by frankgrimes

[KATIEBARTHEDOOR24 426]

No more Kronwall. This team is small and weak. I hope they go all the way... but good luck with that.

As for the league... yes it is soccer on ice.

[GMRwings1983 8,803]

Give it a few more years and this game will be like soccer on ice, figure skating with sticks and gear and players will be asked to play in a synchronized way ...instead of acting like men they will be forced to run to Quintal and asking him for help.

I don't care about the scoring part don't think it's that important but you are - as always - damn right in all other points.

Why do you always have to bash soccer? It's a different sport and the best sport in the world. I used to feel that way about hockey, but well.............I've already said why that changed in this thread.

You should care about the scoring part as well. Only fifteen players scoring 30 or more goals is pitiful.

[wings4thecup06 504]

Why do you always have to bash soccer? It's a different sport and the best sport in the world. I used to feel that way about hockey, but well.............I've already said why that changed in this thread.

You should care about the scoring part as well. Only fifteen players scoring 30 or more goals is pitiful.

Personally I can't stand 'soccer', being from England and all, but that's another story.

But I agree with you GMR, it's a shame what has become of today's game. I think the lack of scoring isn't just due to great goaltending and coaching, but it's also the gap between the best players and the worst has now closed. No longer do you see 4th lines sent out there with guys who couldn't skate. What once before was a mismatch of top line vs 4th line, it's now becoming more even than ever. Speed is in a way, killing the most talented hockey players out there.

And boy do I miss a good physical game.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

Why do you always have to bash soccer? It's a different sport and the best sport in the world. I used to feel that way about hockey, but well.............I've already said why that changed in this thread.

You should care about the scoring part as well. Only fifteen players scoring 30 or more goals is pitiful.

The best sport in the world is hockey (but with the way things are going it needs a 180° return to what it once was).

As far as scoring goes yeah it's part of the game but I can appreciate hard hits, nice fights more because scoring will always be there some years higher some years lower but so what.

[GMRwings1983 8,803]

Personally I can't stand 'soccer', being from England and all, but that's another story.

But I agree with you GMR, it's a shame what has become of today's game. I think the lack of scoring isn't just due to great goaltending and coaching, but it's also the gap between the best players and the worst has now closed. No longer do you see 4th lines sent out there with guys who couldn't skate. What once before was a mismatch of top line vs 4th line, it's now becoming more even than ever. Speed is in a way, killing the most talented hockey players out there.

And boy do I miss a good physical game.

That's an interesting take on it. But how many times did Gretzky, Lemieux or Bossy hit the ice against the other team's goon line? I can't imagine coaches were that stupid back then not to adjust.

[Barrie 900]

After Probert's death, and hearing/reading about all the physical pain McCarty is in right now, I don't miss the fighting at all.

When it comes to scoring, things work in cycles. Baseball scoring is down too. Also, remember defense wins Championships. High scoring teams don't usually go to far in the playoffs.

[hillbillywingsfan 794]

No more Kronwall. This team is small and weak. I hope they go all the way... but good luck with that.

As for the league... yes it is soccer on ice.

After getting our asses handed to us in Chicago in the playoffs when they started pushing us around and we just sat their like a bunch of pansies I'm not sure how anyone can say we don't' need some toughness on the team.

[GMRwings1983 8,803]

After Probert's death, and hearing/reading about all the physical pain McCarty is in right now, I don't miss the fighting at all.

When it comes to scoring, things work in cycles. Baseball scoring is down too. Also, remember defense wins Championships. High scoring teams don't usually go to far in the playoffs.

The league is becoming les and less exciting. I wouldn't call this a cycle anymore.

[Aznknight 139]

Sure I'll take that concussion or broken bone or some other lifelong debilitating injury so Joe blow can be extremely happy...for 5 seconds.

Speed and defense wins games. If you want to watch goons, watch wrestling.

[number9 3,297]

The whole enforcer protecting the team era was in response to the lawlessness on the ice. The rules didn't protect players, so the players did. Now the league has rules to curb this lawlessness, which makes the role of the enforcer semi-obsolete.

The enforcer era is not coming back. It's going to move farther and father from that despite whatever protests you (and including myself) have. The sooner one accepts this, the sooner one can move past it.

Hockey isn't becoming soccer. Hockey is becoming hockey. Fighting is part of hockey's history, but at the end of the day it's a side-show within the sport. Trust me, that pains me to admit.

If you want to watch good fights, do what I do and follow the UFC. Hockey and fighting are going to split. Maybe not tomorrow, maybe not in 10 years from now, but we all know it's going to happen eventually. Enjoy it while we have it. The game is evolving, and it's going to leave us 80's and 90's fans in the dust if we don't evolve with it.

[mvanpop 98]

One reason for less goals is that goalies are given the blue paint and with better and more strict reviews many goals are taken back. We should make the nets 50% bigger and see what happens .

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

No this thread is not about the Wings.

So the league leader in points this year was Jamie Benn, with a whopping 87 points. Ovechkin led the league in goals with 53. Only two other players even hit 40 goals! Only 15 players hit 30 goals.

I know this is the era of butterfly, oversized pad goaltending, but this can't be what Bettman and company want to see. You'd think all the top players in the league spent the season overseas when you look at these stats atop the leaderboards.

Oh and only 16 players hit 100+ PIM, with only 4 of those players hitting 150+ PIM. I can't imagine that happening any other time in a full season in the modern era.

To sum up, this "new NHL" has no scoring and no fighting. I guess if you're a fan of big goalies swallowing up pucks, you'll love today's game.

Oh I almost forgot. There's parity, so that makes everything more fun to watch, despite the fact that nobody scores, hits or fights. Parity is what really counts here folks.

There's a flaw in your reasoning. Just because there's less 30 and 40 goal scorers doesn't necessarily mean there's less scoring. To me, it means the defensive side of the has improved so that teams have learned to neutralize stars so that they can't rack up the goals.

You'd have to look total league-wide goals scored to see if scoring is up or down. I found this chart for average goals per game:

http://www.hockey-reference.com/leagues/stats.html

It actually shows that scoring has been pretty steady. Especially for the past 5 years. This current period is actually up from 97-03. 05-09 was a bit higher. After 1996 is the point where scoring dropped off significantly. Since then, it's been down, up then settled between the two levels. It doesn't fit so well into your "league is becoming less and less exciting" argument.

Edited April 14, 2015 by PavelValerievichDatsyuk

[frankgrimes 1,836]

It's not just about the enforcers per se it's about the whole package. Hits are way down, hipchecks ? Almost gone and even if people are doing them perfectly they'll get a hearing or suspended I mean WTF this is a league that has seen guys like Stevens lay out guys left and right and the fans got pumped up cheered , fans from the opposing team had real enemies to hate and also guys that would take care of business ON the ice i.e the crowd was entertained.

Kronwall has gone from one of my favorite Wings to someone I wouldn't care if we trade him (mind everyone I really like the guy) but the guy used to bring an element that made other teams aware when he was one the ice and provided fans - of an otherwise boring and softish team - with enjoyment.

Without hits, fighting what's left to cheer for ? Yes goals and nice saves ok...sounds very entertaining compard to the whole package of fights, hits, goals, saves, line brawls and seeing a bunch of HHOF lines play on ONE team and showing off their chemistry and skills.. This is league is going in the wrong direction and yet the GM meetings aren't fighting against that trend.

There is nothing barbaric about enforcers taking care of business if rats are taking advantage of star or smaller players. If Benn is tough enough to punch Z four times in the head he is also tough enough to answer to McGrattan, Colton Orr instead of a suit who has his office based in New York (i.e. Quintal).

I really hope the ratings continue to go down till the owners decide it's time to clean house and bring back hockey to it's roots.

Another point is this: Sadly the league is more concerned about NON fans than the fans that are actually going to the games and following the game already, I Mean seriously ? If people think the game is too violent and to hard to take part in guess what find another sport and hopefully be happy with it.

Edited April 14, 2015 by frankgrimes

[kliq 3,763]

It's not just about the enforcers per se it's about the whole package. Hits are way down, hipchecks ? Almost gone and even if people are doing them perfectly they'll get a hearing or suspended I mean WTF this is a league that has seen guys like Stevens lay out guys left and right and the fans got pumped up cheered , fans from the opposing team had real enemies to hate and also guys that would take care of business ON the ice i.e the crowd was entertained. Kronwall has gone from one of my favorite Wings to someone I wouldn't care if we trade him (mind everyone I really like the guy) but the guy used to bring an element that made other teams aware when he was one the ice and provided fans - of an otherwise boring and softish team - with enjoyment. Without hits, fighting what's left to cheer for ? Yes goals and nice saves ok...sounds very entertaining compard to the whole package of fights, hits, goals, saves, line brawls and seeing a bunch of HHOF lines play on ONE team and showing off their chemistry and skills.. This is league is going in the wrong direction and yet the GM meetings aren't fighting against that trend. There is nothing barbaric about enforcers taking care of business if rats are taking advantage of star or smaller players. If Benn is tough enough to punch Z four times in the head he is also tough enough to answer to McGrattan, Colton Orr instead of a suit who has his office based in New York (i.e. Quintal). I really hope the ratings continue to go down till the owners decide it's time to clean house and bring back hockey to it's roots. Another point is this: Sadly the league is more concerned about NON fans than the fans that are actually going to the games and following the game already, I Mean seriously ? If people think the game is too violent and to hard to take part in guess what find another sport and hopefully be happy with it.

But Frank, its not just fans or non fans that are moving it in this direction and thinking the game is too violent, its former players and former fighters.

Just from doing a quick Google search the lawsuit launched this past February came up. http://www.thehockeynews.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Adams-v-NHL-COMPLAINT-as-filed-02-09-15-2.pdf

Here is a list of players suing the NHL (in this lawsuit):

Greg Adams; Rick Be

rry; Richard Brodeur;

Shawn Chambers; To

dd Elik; Robert

Goring; Mark Hardy;

Michael Hartman;

Todd Harvey; Tony Horacek; Garry

Howatt; Dave Hutchinson; Jean Francois

Jomphe; Edward Kennedy; Mike Lalor;

Darren Langdon; Emmanuel Legace; Jamie

Lundmark; Sergio Mo

messo; Jeff Parker;

Stephen Patrick; Cr

aig Redmond; Terry

Ruskowski; Brian Savage; Jeffrey

Shevalier; Turner

Stevenson; German

Titov; Todd Warriner; Vernon Westfall