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sjr2012

Things you would like to see for 2015-16 Season

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Not that the wings would do it, but how does trading a couple strong offensive prospects and our 1st rounder this year to phoenix for their 1st round pick (3rd overall). I feel like hanifin could be the strong complementary defenseman for Kronwall and could become our #1 dman soon enough.

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I would suggest Zetterberg >>> Tatar/Nyquist.

Thornton > Zetterberg at the pivot.

Vermette >>> Sheahan/Helm at the pivot.

Green >> Ericsson.

Of course you'd suggest that, it was your idea.

I would counter-suggest that both Tatar and Nyquist are better goal scorers at this point than Zetterberg. While Hank is certainly the better player overall, I don't think he'd really be any more effective.

Thornton = Zetterberg. He hasn't really been better for about 5 or 6 years. Doesn't have the injury concerns, so maybe he'll age better, but maybe not. He hasn't so far.

Vermette = Sheahan/Helm. He used to be better, but not so much over the last 5 years or so. Even playing more minutes and with generally better linemates, he's barely outproduced Helm's pts/g and goals/g. Sheahan's numbers are even closer, though he's also had some good linemates and decent PP time. Sheahan's also 23 and should be expected to get better, while Vermette is 32 and should be expected to get worse.

Green is certainly better than Ericsson offensively, probably enough so that it would be a de facto defensive improvement as well. But you're also making a big commitment to an injury prone 30 year old. Maybe not any worse that what we already have committed to Ericsson, but it could be if his injury woes get worse.

Bottom line, I guess I would say it'd be a marginal improvement, but still doesn't put us over the hump. Pretty much all the improvement comes from Green, which would be a much simpler and more realistic move by itself. (Though if it were more than a 1 year deal, I'd hope to move Ericsson or at least Kindl out so there still a spot for a kid the following year.) You also have two goalies with little experience. I wouldn't be too worried about it, but it is a risk. And Jurco and Pulkkinen (who's out of options btw) need to be in the lineup or traded. Wasting them in the pressbox doesn't do anyone any good.

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I think finding a way to get Phaneuf here would be a great start. Up front I honestly believe the team just needs growth from within and address needs come trade deadline. Obviously if the right fit is there to get bigger up front in the summer, then go for it. But I do think trimming some of the fat and getting #3 here would be a big win for the summer. If we landed Phaneuf at the deadline I strongly believe the team would still be playing hockey right now.

Kronwall-Ericsson

Phaneuf-Dekeyser

A much better and deeper than what we've had. And with Kronwall not getting any younger, this definitely helps to bridge the gap between he and the youth.

Edit: We also absolutely need to keep Babs around.

Edited by marcaractac

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Not that the wings would do it, but how does trading a couple strong offensive prospects and our 1st rounder this year to phoenix for their 1st round pick (3rd overall). I feel like hanifin could be the strong complementary defenseman for Kronwall and could become our #1 dman soon enough.

Strome or Hanifin would be better than anything we could offer. I don't think even Mantha + Larkin + our 1st would get us that pick.

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Another year and another early exit from the playoffs. As I started to think about it, I did expect this to be the case. Which of course raised more questions. In the end the best way I can describe the team is stale. It really is time for a major shake up, but I doubt it happens. Ok maybe it happens with the head coach. Babs has had plenty of time to decide if he wants to be here and sign a new contract. That hasn't happened, so I think he is gone. Yes he is a great coach, but maybe it is time. Maybe he goes somewhere else or just retires for a couple of years. Either way I think he is gone. Good luck Micheal and thanks for the good times!

But the changing of the guard on the bench is only part of the big picture. This team is stuck. We are not terrible nor great. Just average and in the middle somewhere. Yes we made the playoffs. That means we are in the top 53% of the league. But we are not a top team anymore, nor have we been for several years. 3 of the last 4 years getting dumped in the 1st round. Great teams do more.

The team is just boring to watch lately. I am not saying the players are not working hard, they are. But there isn't an outward show of emotion most of the time. Some may remember the TV commercial that the Wings used to show about hosting other teams. They were putting up curtians, playing easy lsitening music and burning candles. Well i think the team took that to heart. We are a very nice group of guys that no one fears playing. The other teams know they are not going to get hit, beat up, and it will be a nice time playing the wings, win or lose.

Back in the 1990's when Bill Cowher was the coach of the Steelers, there was a stat that I loved. The winning % of teams the week after they played the Steelers was about 25%. Teams were so tired, sore, beat up, after playing them, that they always lost. That is what i miss from the Red Wings. We used to be that way when we won Cups. Playing us was a tough game and everyone knew it. Now, not so much.

Now looking forward. yes it would be great if some changes were made. but I don't expect many/any from outside of the organization. i would bet that 20 of the 23 on the opening roster are already with the team. Cleary will finally be gone, hopefully franzen is as well, some more youth will be brought up, and maybe 1-2 outsiders brought in. If ever there was a chance of maiing a trade or 2, this is the year. many teams are already tight to the cap and good high end players with big contracts will have to be moved. The UFA class is weak-which is the new normal. Let's hope and pray kenny makes a statement move this year. Not holding my breath however.....

When I look at the team we need 2 big wingers, and a good RHed Dman. As of today I see the following:

tatar-Datsyuk- open spot

Nyquist-Z-Abby

Jurco-Sheahan-Pulk

open spot-Glendening-Miller

Anderson and maybe Callahan

dekeyser-open spot

Kronwall-ericsson

Smith-marchenko

Lashoff

Howard

Mrazek

Now fill in the other 3 spots and we are set for the year. The Griffins could have a heck of a lineup if we get Larkin signed this summer, which there have been a rumor or 2 posted could happen.

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When you look at it we weren't supposed to make the playoffs according to some.

I think Tatar and Nyquist need to show some consistency and be the goal scorers we know they can be.

I think we need a dependable power forward, Abby isn't enough. I like Cole and I think he could have made a huge difference in the series if not for his injury, but that's just our luck anymore.

Like it or not Z is not the player he used to be and Datsyuk, while still amazing is depleting. We simply CANNOT make the same mistake that we made when Lidstrom retired and not fill the voids those two will leave behind. And Tatar and Goose are no Pav and Z.

Yes we need a legit top pairing d-man, but that's like asking for the impossible as a Wings fan. Our defense isn't that bad, we were the *only* team to shut out Tampa, and yes Mrazek is primarily responsible for that but we have to give the defense a little credit as well.

I don't think that we're stale, I think we're a team in transition and a few more tweaks and we're very much cup capable.

My 2 pennies.

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Couldn't this go in the "Things you'd like to see thread..."? Trying to follow two threads on the same topic is so confusing.

My thoughts exactly, merged them together.

Let's keep like topics consolidated in the same thread, regardless if the offseason is generally a slower time of year for the forums here.

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When I look at the team we need 2 big wingers, and a good RHed Dman. As of today I see the following:

tatar-Datsyuk- open spot

Nyquist-Z-Abby

Jurco-Sheahan-Pulk

open spot-Glendening-Miller

Anderson and maybe Callahan

dekeyser-open spot

Kronwall-ericsson

Smith-marchenko

Lashoff

Howard

Mrazek

Now fill in the other 3 spots and we are set for the year. The Griffins could have a heck of a lineup if we get Larkin signed this summer, which there have been a rumor or 2 posted could happen.

You forgot Helm. He showed himself to be pretty important this year.

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You forgot Helm. He showed himself to be pretty important this year.

No I didn't. To get players of value you have to give up something. He is a UFA after next season and is going to be in the 3.5 million range. Checkers-which he is are not worth that type of money. I would rather move him, Q, and Kindl than any of our prospects. Of course some will have to go if we are going to get some big fish.

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You guys are right. Just play all of our young kids from the Griffins. They will probably carry us to the promised land. Oh wait, haven't we been doing that? Hasn't it not been working?

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You guys are right. Just play all of our young kids from the Griffins. They will probably carry us to the promised land. Oh wait, haven't we been doing that? Hasn't it not been working?

I know right! Tatar, Nyquist, Sheahan, Jurco, Ferraro, Glendening, and Dekeyser all failed to win us the Cup in their second professional season. What a bunch of losers! Time to tear down and rebuild, because this strategy is obviously flawed.

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I know right! Tatar, Nyquist, Sheahan, Jurco, Ferraro, Glendening, and Dekeyser all failed to win us the Cup in their second professional season. What a bunch of losers! Time to tear down and rebuild, because this strategy is obviously flawed.

And when those kids that come from that rebuild fail to win a cup in their first two seasons? Blow it up and do it again. :lol:

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I'd like to see a substantial upgrade in defense (who wouldn't?). We can't have anymore of this, "Well this guy isn't as bad as this guy, so we'll put him in." At the risk of sounding like a politician, we need to put the D back in Detroit. When we at least made it to the conference finals three years in a row, we had fast two way forwards, cheap goaltending (Osgood and Hasek each made around a mil) and a strong defense. Some teams rely on their stars or goalies, the Wings have always relied defense. I think Holland's job should be reallocating the money we're spending. Weiss and Howard are making too much. Weiss is obvious. As for Howard, I'm not picking on him because of how he played in the second half this year, I'm picking on him because he's not $4 million better than Mrazek. We had $10 in cap space riding in the pine in the playoffs and that doesn't include Franzen who's making another $4 mil. We should be using that money to build up our defense. Phaneuf and Green would do well in Detroit. Green is exactly the kind of defenseman Babcock wants. He would fit in here similar to how Rafalski did. Phaneuf is a big guy that would log a ton of minutes, block shots, and has a big shot from the point. I'm not saying he can replace Lidstrom, but he can do a lot of the things Lidstrom did for our team that has been missing for the past few years.

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I'd like to see a substantial upgrade in defense (who wouldn't?). We can't have anymore of this, "Well this guy isn't as bad as this guy, so we'll put him in." At the risk of sounding like a politician, we need to put the D back in Detroit. When we at least made it to the conference finals three years in a row, we had fast two way forwards, cheap goaltending (Osgood and Hasek each made around a mil) and a strong defense. Some teams rely on their stars or goalies, the Wings have always relied defense. I think Holland's job should be reallocating the money we're spending. Weiss and Howard are making too much. Weiss is obvious. As for Howard, I'm not picking on him because of how he played in the second half this year, I'm picking on him because he's not $4 million better than Mrazek. We had $10 in cap space riding in the pine in the playoffs and that doesn't include Franzen who's making another $4 mil. We should be using that money to build up our defense. Phaneuf and Green would do well in Detroit. Green is exactly the kind of defenseman Babcock wants. He would fit in here similar to how Rafalski did. Phaneuf is a big guy that would log a ton of minutes, block shots, and has a big shot from the point. I'm not saying he can replace Lidstrom, but he can do a lot of the things Lidstrom did for our team that has been missing for the past few years.

I agree. Getting dion and green would make this team miles better

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I'd like to see a substantial upgrade in defense (who wouldn't?). We can't have anymore of this, "Well this guy isn't as bad as this guy, so we'll put him in." At the risk of sounding like a politician, we need to put the D back in Detroit. When we at least made it to the conference finals three years in a row, we had fast two way forwards, cheap goaltending (Osgood and Hasek each made around a mil) and a strong defense. Some teams rely on their stars or goalies, the Wings have always relied defense. I think Holland's job should be reallocating the money we're spending. Weiss and Howard are making too much. Weiss is obvious. As for Howard, I'm not picking on him because of how he played in the second half this year, I'm picking on him because he's not $4 million better than Mrazek. We had $10 in cap space riding in the pine in the playoffs and that doesn't include Franzen who's making another $4 mil. We should be using that money to build up our defense. Phaneuf and Green would do well in Detroit. Green is exactly the kind of defenseman Babcock wants. He would fit in here similar to how Rafalski did. Phaneuf is a big guy that would log a ton of minutes, block shots, and has a big shot from the point. I'm not saying he can replace Lidstrom, but he can do a lot of the things Lidstrom did for our team that has been missing for the past few years.

Some of what you are saying is true. hasek was not cheap however. he has well paid at the market rate and so is Howard. As for Weiss many of us knew it was a bad idea at the time. But and here is the kicker, nothing can be done about it now. he is signed, has no movement clauses and will be here unless we take on another bad contract. You mention "putting the D back into Detroit" then talk about adding Green!?!? he doesn't play D, never has. he is Paul Coffey 2.0 but more injury prone.

We need to take advantage of our prospect pool and cap space to rob so9me of the teams that are already cap tight/over the cap and need to make space. IE Chicago, Philly, Boston, LA, NYR etc.... Most of those teams need to move salaries to be able to field a team next year.

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Some of what you are saying is true. hasek was not cheap however. he has well paid at the market rate and so is Howard. As for Weiss many of us knew it was a bad idea at the time. But and here is the kicker, nothing can be done about it now. he is signed, has no movement clauses and will be here unless we take on another bad contract. You mention "putting the D back into Detroit" then talk about adding Green!?!? he doesn't play D, never has. he is Paul Coffey 2.0 but more injury prone.

Hasek made $750,000 in 06-07 and $2 mil the next year. The kind of production we got out of him in the 07 season and playoffs and the 08 season, he was below market value. With the cap going up, I'm hoping someone will need him to hit the cap floor. Green isn't a defensive defenseman, however, he'll fill that Rafalski role for us and he'll do a lot of things that we require our defensemen to do like possess the puck, be a threat to skate with it, have a big shot from the blue line, make good passes out of our zone.

I think our forwards are set. Maybe an add here or there, but I see a lot of promise out of our younger guys. I don't feel the same way about our defense. Smith and Kindl aren't filling me with any confidence and Quincey should be a 5th or 6th d-man. If we had more young guys like DeKeyser, I'd say just stick with the youth movement, but a player or players will need to be brought it to patch up the holes on the defense or we'll never make it past the second round.

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I want Seabrook.

He wont be cheap, and I expect Chicago to do whatever they can to keep him...

These are times where I wish capgeek was still up, but as their roster stands right now in the playoffs, I believe they're over the cap by a real good amount. How on earth are they going to afford Seabrook??

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I want Seabrook.

He wont be cheap, and I expect Chicago to do whatever they can to keep him...

Chicago Boston, Philly and others are already at the cap or over it, and need to add multiple players to even have a team. This is where Kenny needs to make a steal of a deal. No it isn't going to be cheap but it can be done. The BH have several good D prospects and this might allow them to make the salary dump they need to make.

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Hasek made $750,000 in 06-07 and $2 mil the next year. The kind of production we got out of him in the 07 season and playoffs and the 08 season, he was below market value. With the cap going up, I'm hoping someone will need him to hit the cap floor. Green isn't a defensive defenseman, however, he'll fill that Rafalski role for us and he'll do a lot of things that we require our defensemen to do like possess the puck, be a threat to skate with it, have a big shot from the blue line, make good passes out of our zone.

I think our forwards are set. Maybe an add here or there, but I see a lot of promise out of our younger guys. I don't feel the same way about our defense. Smith and Kindl aren't filling me with any confidence and Quincey should be a 5th or 6th d-man. If we had more young guys like DeKeyser, I'd say just stick with the youth movement, but a player or players will need to be brought it to patch up the holes on the defense or we'll never make it past the second round.

That is when he was in his 40's. When we traded for him he was making 6 million per year. After he retired we sign Cujo to a 3 year/24 million contract. fact is we paid a lot of money for goalies. It was never on the cheap. There has always been this false belief that from 95-2009 we had sub par goalies that didn't matter becasue of the team in front of them. Not true at all. Vernon, Cujo, and Hasek were some of the biggest stars in the league as goalies. Ozzie may end up in the HOF. That is not a shabby group at all.

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We are going to have one maybe 2 D up from GR next season. I do see a big change in the D corps for 2015/16 and I wouldn't rule out seeing some unforseen changes happening either. The D does need a shake up if we are going to be serious contenders next year.

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