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shocky2002

For the Kenny apologists, what Holland move would change your stance o

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But even Larkin played 1 year in Michigan before he came here. I wonder when the last time we actually had a 1st round pick play the first year? Martin Lapointe? Keith Primeau?

Haven't checked it up but I think Lapointe was the last 1st rounder that played right away. I could be wrong but think not.

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Holland trading the 16th pick and the Defense man that they desperately need were traded for one single year of relief of Dats contract should wake the rest of them up. The Jets got a great defense man with our 16th pick. Holland is the worst part of the Detroit organization, has delayed their rebuild and continues to do so.

Arizona jets?

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I said he MAY be NHL ready. And no, probably not in Detroit, because they like their prospects to get moldy before they play in the NHL, with some exceptions. On a team like Arizona, he will probably play this season.

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Never know. He did fall hard in the rankings before the draft. He was pegged to go 2nd overall at one point. We'll see I guess. I still think Holland could have drafted better with the first than he did either way.

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If we didn't trade Datsyuk's caphit, we probably wouldn't have Nielson or Vanek. I would be interested to see what the criticism level would be like around here in that case. No one will know for a while what we missed out on with Chychrun, so I think speculating can only go so far.

I think it's interesting to compare this trade to the 2013 draft trade where we similarly moved down in the 1st round.

2013: down 2 spots (18:Mirco Mueller - 20: Anthony Mantha) + we received a 2nd rounder (58th: Bertuzzi)

2016: down 4 spots (16:Jakob Chychrun-20: Dennis Cholowski) + we received a 2nd rounder (53rd: Hronek) + we got rid of Pav's caphit + took we took on Vitale's caphit)

If you take out the part about the 2 contracts switching hands, the 2 trades look very similar if you look at pick numbers. We gave up a higher 1st round pick in 2016, but we received a higher 2nd so that compensates a bit. Haven't seen any complaints about the 2013 trade and we didn't even get rid of a big contract as part of it.

But, obviously, the difference is that we ended up with the higher ranked player (Mantha ranked 15, mueller ranked 16th in the consensus top 30) (Chychrun ranked 12, Cholowski was honourable mention - just outside the top 30).

As a sidenote, I don't think we can guess that we would have picked Chychrun. Both Chychrun and Fabbro were ranked higher than 16th and Stanley was taken 18th, so there were D choices and our choices often deviate from the rankings (cholo, bertuzzi are examples).

Holland trading the 16th pick and the Defense man that they desperately need were traded for one single year of relief of Dats contract should wake the rest of them up. The Jets got a great defense man with our 16th pick. Holland is the worst part of the Detroit organization, has delayed their rebuild and continues to do so.

We made the trade to Arizona not the Jets - Or maybe you're referring to them as the relocated Jets? Also, the trade was 16th+Dats for 20th+53rd+Vitale. To simplify it to Dats for Chychrun is very misleading.

Edited by PavelValerievichDatsyuk

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If Holland didn't make that trade and we were still stuck with Datsyuk's contract, with little to no activity on July 1st, it would be the exact same people b****ing and moaning. Just imagine how much backlash there would be if Stamkos did hit free agency and he went to Buffalo because we didn't have the cap space to sign him.

I don't think there's any question that today Chychrun is more skilled and more developed than Cholowski. My first reaction when we were trading the pick was "pissed" too, but after hearing what the trade entailed, I was stoked. It was a great trade, and you make it every time in that situation. Who knows how it will look in 5-10 years, but hindsight is 20/20...

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Same people bothered by the trade would have called for Holland's head because we would be stuck with $7.5 million cap hit and no Vanek or Nielsen.

It's hard to support anti-Holland crew when they blame him for everything from contracts to Global Warming.

Datsyuk wanted to leave? Must be Hollands fault.

Edited by kickazz

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Same people bothered by the trade would have called for Holland's head because we would be stuck with $7.5 million cap hit and no Vanek or Nielsen.

It's hard to support anti-Holland crew when they blame him for everything from contracts to Global Warming.

Datsyuk wanted to leave? Must be Hollands fault.

THANKS HOLLAND

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Same people bothered by the trade would have called for Holland's head because we would be stuck with $7.5 million cap hit and no Vanek or Nielsen.

It's hard to support anti-Holland crew when they blame him for everything from contracts to Global Warming.

Datsyuk wanted to leave? Must be Hollands fault.

Holland isn't responsible for Global Warming. That's Al Gore's fault.

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Same people bothered by the trade would have called for Holland's head because we would be stuck with $7.5 million cap hit and no Vanek or Nielsen.

It's hard to support anti-Holland crew when they blame him for everything from contracts to Global Warming.

Datsyuk wanted to leave? Must be Hollands fault.

I mean, he's not trying to stop global warming is he?

But seriously there was a $2,000,000 bonus if datsyuk played out the last season of his contract. You gotta think he knew something.

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Never know. He did fall hard in the rankings before the draft. He was pegged to go 2nd overall at one point. We'll see I guess. I still think Holland could have drafted better with the first than he did either way.

What exactly do you know about drafting again?

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This forum makes me giggle sometimes and cry others.

Let me get this straight if I can pull this out of my... um memory banks...

When the Wings hit on a draft pick it is to the scouts credit.

When the Wings miss on a draft pick, Holland picked the wrong guy.

Lids leaves and the Wings have no replacement (for one of, if not the, best d-man ever, because those grow on trees) it is Hollands fault for not being prepared.

Holland is prepared for Dats leaving, finds a sucker another team to take his contract, and the only thing given up is the 16th pick, and it is an epic fail????

Did I miss anything?

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... And we didn't even really trade Datsyuk's contract for the 16th overall pick... The way I see it, we traded down from 16 because we weren't that high on Chychrun (for whatever reason?), and the guy we were high on (Cholowski) was likely going to be available a few picks later anyway, so we traded back, still got our guy at 20, and picked up a 2nd round pick (Hronek) as well... We basically just traded Datsyuk's contract ($7.5M cap hit without having to pay any salary) for Joe Vitale (LTIR no cap hit having to pay $1.3M salary). Good trade for both teams, and about all it should have cost for a cash strapped team like Arizona...

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How long does the team remain irrelevant before Holland is moved. I realize compared to most Detroit teams the Wings are a special but the goodwill most of you extend to him is ridiculous.

The franchise has been in the same position for years...a glut of low to mid range forwards, young hyped defenseman that never seem to break the lineup and a defense that is never fixed.

Holland focuses on the Miller, Helms and Cleary's of the world and promises the trade that never comes. St. James or whatever her name is will parrot Holland's position all off season but in the end

all trade partners will just be asking too much...wait another year...youth....it won't change until he's replaced.

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Yeah looks pretty convincing. He must have had his suspicions and tried to keep with bonuses. At the same time though, it's not a surprising management decision since Datsyuk was leaning towards going back home around the 2012 lockout.

I was actually really surprised he signed a 3 year extension in 2013. When he came out in 2013 and said his dream was to finish his career in Russia, I was assuming it would he at the age of 36 not 38 lol.

Edited by kickazz

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Holland's needs to make the Fowler (or Trouba) deal. That's what will save him this summer after being snubbed (again) by the best available UFA.

He's got to shed one of our nhl defensemen, a couple d kids 3 nhl forwards.

If not, the offseason will be a fail in retrospect.

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