krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 15 minutes ago, BarkBurgerman said: I'm not interested in an elderly Yandle But boy he fits the mold of what a Seider needs in a partner. LH offensive specialist who Seider can cover for. And he's ONLY 34!!! F*** Suter! He's too old... Yandle is who I want now... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marcaractac 3,963 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 2 minutes ago, BarkBurgerman said: See maybe this is where I disagree with some of you on Seider's abilities. Seider scores because his positioning is immaculate in both ends, he can log heavy minutes, and he has the mobility and stamina to keep up with the play. Other than that he doesn't really have an incredibly creative brain or good shot. I expect him to be the secondary assist guy, not the primary assist guy AKA Yandle. I think his points go up with a partner like Yandle, not the other way around. Then in the D zone what Yandle needs is a partner that can cover for him. I think they'd be a good complimentary pair... I'd just like someone a bit younger and in there prime than Yandle personally. I don't disagree. Though I do think his offensive capabilities probably fall somewhere between what you say and most other say. I think he will show a little more offensive flair over the years. He may not have a booming shot, but he has a hell of a wrister from the point. He has also been impressive during his PP time in Sweden. I can easily see him being a 50 point dmen in his prime. Having said that, I simply do not see it being the right move to saddle the kid with a defensive liability right off the bat. Let him have the chance to jump up into the offense every now and again. Not have to hang back because of Yandle. Basically I hope to see SHL Seider instead Mannheim Seider. Obviously I wouldn;t expect him to match those numbers right away in the NHL, but I;d like to see him with a partner that allows him to play that way. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 5 minutes ago, BarkBurgerman said: Reading comprehension I thought you were working on this? Did I say you wanted Yandle? Nope. I said "I" want Yandle... This is what I originally said re: Suter... "All joking aside, I'd love to see Suter paired with Seider for a couple seasons"... This is what you just said re" Yandle... "he fits the mold of what a Seider needs in a partner"... To sum it up, I want good players (short-term), regardless of age. You don't want good players because of their age... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marcaractac 3,963 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 Just now, BarkBurgerman said: I mean I don't want Yandle, I just believe that's the type of Dman he'll flourish with. Ideally you want a Rafalski or a Quinn Hughes to pair with him. I think a steady Brad Stuart or Dekeyser type is redundant for Seider and won't maximize his abilities. Don;t get me wrong, down the road having a high offensive dman with Seider would rule. I see Johansson filling that role some day. And when I say responsible, I do not mean guys like Dekeyser or Stuart. I just mean guys who aren't completely inept in their own end. Like, it would be perfect if Hronek was a lefty. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 12 minutes ago, BarkBurgerman said: And it's only taken you a couple days and 30+ posts to figure out I figured it out early on in this debate. I'm just trying to hit home how absolutely moronic it is (you are)... 14 minutes ago, BarkBurgerman said: I mean I don't want Yandle, I just believe that's the type of Dman he'll flourish with. Ideally you want a Rafalski or a Quinn Hughes to pair with him. I think a steady Brad Stuart or Dekeyser type is redundant for Seider and won't maximize his abilities. I think this player would really help out our rookie defenseman. He's EXACTLY the type of defenseman that could really help him flourish. I don't want him though, because he's "too old". It's a good thing Scotty Bowman had that same mentality when bringing up Lidstrom to play with Brad McCrimmon, and later Larry Murphy... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marcaractac 3,963 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 13 minutes ago, BarkBurgerman said: Agreed, and I would be interested to see if Blash isn't afraid to try one of them on their off hand sometimes. Would not mind that experiment at all. Such a pairing would allow either guy to pinch from time to time, as they are both capable of covering for each other. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 8 minutes ago, BarkBurgerman said: Well there ya go. You proved it. Absolute moron here Are we done here now? Yup. 1 BarkBurgerman reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 1 hour ago, marcaractac said: Yandle being bought out. Please no. Ken Holland doesnt work here anymore. 1 hour ago, BarkBurgerman said: See maybe this is where I disagree with some of you on Seider's abilities. Seider scores because his positioning is immaculate in both ends, he can log heavy minutes, and he has the mobility and stamina to keep up with the play. Other than that he doesn't really have an incredibly creative brain or good shot. I expect him to be the secondary assist guy, not the primary assist guy AKA Yandle. I think his points go up with a partner like Yandle, not the other way around. Then in the D zone what Yandle needs is a partner that can cover for him. I think they'd be a good complimentary pair... I'd just like someone a bit younger and in there prime than Yandle personally. Reading comprehension I thought you were working on this? Don't throw that kind of defensive responsibility on Seider as a rookie. Let him learn the position at the NHL level first, before you really on him to also cover his D partner. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 3 minutes ago, BarkBurgerman said: @Akakabuto posted this in the LGW discord. Holland is secretly a genius: If Keith retires the Oilers actually get a cap credit. Don't ask me to explain cause I don't understand it. Which is exactly why I'm advocating for someone like Oesterle, McCabe, Forbort, Oleksiak over an old ragged Yandle. We don't need washed up vets who can't play defense right now. Suter wouldn't be a defensive liability. Hes just old. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,019 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 Seems like a guy like Hyman comes along every now and then and a bunch of teams tie bags of money to their boners. He's basically this year's David Clarkson or even Abdlekader. 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mackel 764 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 32 minutes ago, krsmith17 said: Yup. Thank God. 1 town123 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 17 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: Seems like a guy like Hyman comes along every now and then and a bunch of teams tie bags of money to their boners. He's basically this year's David Clarkson or even Abdlekader. This exactly. If Hyman leaves Toronto (Matthews / Marner) and doesn't go to Edmonton (McDavid / Draisaitl), he will drop off just as quick as Clarkson / Abdelkader. Coincidentally, the same age Abdelkader was when he fell off, after having back-to-back 40+ point seasons with Datsyuk / Zetterberg... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,019 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 1 minute ago, krsmith17 said: This exactly. If Hyman leaves Toronto (Matthews / Marner) and doesn't go to Edmonton (McDavid / Draisaitl), he will drop off just as quick as Clarkson / Abdelkader. Coincidentally, the same age Abdelkader was when he fell off, after having back-to-back 40+ point seasons with Datsyuk / Zetterberg... I mean you obviously need Hyman types to win. Good GMs (BriseBois) get their Coleman's and Goodrow's through gutsy trades. Lazy GMs overpay for guys like Hyman. Watch Yzerman sign him now........ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 9 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: I mean you obviously need Hyman types to win. Good GMs (BriseBois) get their Coleman's and Goodrow's through gutsy trades. Lazy GMs overpay for guys like Hyman. Watch Yzerman sign him now........ Sure. You do need those types of players to win, but you can get them much cheaper than the reported $5M Hyman is asking for... I think the Leafs could let Hyman walk, and sign an Erne type player for under $2M, play him in the Hyman role with Matthews and Marner, and he would produce similarly to Hyman. There may be a bit of a dropoff in production, but I doubt there'd be much. Certainly not $2-3M worth... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,019 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 (edited) 1 minute ago, krsmith17 said: Sure. You do need those types of players to win, but you can get them much cheaper than the reported $5M Hyman is asking for... I think the Leafs could let Hyman walk, and sign an Erne type player for under $2M, play him in the Hyman role with Matthews and Marner, and he would produce similarly to Hyman. There may be a bit of a dropoff in production, but I doubt there'd be much. Certainly not $2-3M worth... Erne to TO for Nylander confirmed........ Also what you said is basically what I said. Good GMs find Hyman types without overpaying for them during UFA. But if you want a Ramussen type, you best pony up a top 10 pick........ Edited July 15, 2021 by The 91 of Ryans Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 39 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: Seems like a guy like Hyman comes along every now and then and a bunch of teams tie bags of money to their boners. He's basically this year's David Clarkson or even Abdlekader. Yeah. He would be a decent add as a 2nd line winger. Being a RH shot would be advantageous too. But I wouldnt sign him to a long term deal with the salary hes looking for. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,019 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 1 minute ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said: Yeah. He would be a decent add as a 2nd line winger. Being a RH shot would be advantageous too. But I wouldnt sign him to a long term deal with the salary hes looking for. Yzerman could sign Hyman if he wanted to and it would basically have zero impact in the Wings long term cap situation. I just can't see why he would. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 1 hour ago, BarkBurgerman said: Agreed, and I would be interested to see if Blash isn't afraid to try one of them on their off hand sometimes. You cant do this. It would cause a temporal paradox. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 3 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: Yzerman could sign Hyman if he wanted to and it would basically have zero impact in the Wings long term cap situation. I just can't see why he would. Not knowing the potential development time of Raymond, Berggren, and a possible forward at 6, Hymen would be a good short term add, especially since the team is short on RH forwards. But if signed to more than a 2 year deal, there would be a logjam of top 6 wingers. Pretty sure Hyman wants something long term, and more money than any of the kids would cost. So no. Cap hit/salary wouldn't be an issue. The roster spot would. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 11 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: Erne to TO for Nylander confirmed........ Yes. 12 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: But if you want a Ramussen type, you best pony up a top 10 pick........ No. 7 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: Yzerman could sign Hyman if he wanted to and it would basically have zero impact in the Wings long term cap situation. I just can't see why he would. Except it would if he wants a long-term (7 year) contract, which he absolutely would, coming off a career year, as a 29 year old (last chance to really cash in), going to a rebuilding team... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,019 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 2 minutes ago, krsmith17 said: Yes. No. Except it would if he wants a long-term (7 year) contract, which he absolutely would, coming off a career year, as a 29 year old (last chance to really cash in), going to a rebuilding team... Yzerman could sign Hamilton, Hyman, and Grubauer + extend Bertuzzi and Vrana at 5.5 per and still have 20M left to spend on 7 - 8 plugs. That's how much space he has. It'll be 6 years before Raymond or Seider will be making the big pay. Larkin ain't getting a raise and it remains to be seen if guys like Htonek or Zadina will ever be more than 5M/per players. He shouldn't. and won't. But signing Hyman would be to Detroit's cap what one beer was to Andre the Giant. I'm trying to put Yzerman's nearly 50M in cap space into contect here. 2 BarkBurgerman and Rick D reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,019 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 Gazillion tons of cap space 12 draft picks A glut of UFA options A dozen teams in cap hell A handful of teams looking to trade really good players 1 Rick D reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 29 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: Yzerman could sign Hamilton, Hyman, and Grubauer + extend Bertuzzi and Vrana at 5.5 per and still have 20M left to spend on 7 - 8 plugs. That's how much space he has. It'll be 6 years before Raymond or Seider will be making the big pay. Larkin ain't getting a raise and it remains to be seen if guys like Htonek or Zadina will ever be more than 5M/per players. He shouldn't. and won't. But signing Hyman would be to Detroit's cap what one beer was to Andre the Giant. I'm trying to put Yzerman's nearly 50M in cap space into contect here. I'm well aware of the Red Wings mountain of cap space. That doesn't mean we should waste it. And signing Hyman to a $5M, 7 year contract would be wasting it in my opinion. That's a contract that will not age well. Do we really want to be entering our playoff / Cup window, needing to shed another bad contract? I have absolutely zero interest in Hyman (or any of the other guys you mentioned), unless any of them are willing to come here on the cheap (and preferably short-term)... Hyman (and none of the other guys you mentioned) are going to do that with a rebuilding team... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,019 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 1 minute ago, krsmith17 said: I'm well aware of the Red Wings mountain of cap space. That doesn't mean we should waste it. And signing Hyman to a $5M, 7 year contract would be wasting it in my opinion. That's a contract that will not age well. Do we really want to be entering our playoff / Cup window, needing to shed another bad contract? I have absolutely zero interest in Hyman (or any of the other guys you mentioned), unless any of them are willing to come here on the cheap (and preferably short-term)... Hyman (and none of the other guys you mentioned) are going to do that with a rebuilding team... *sigh* I'm with you man. I was merely trying to illustrate how insanely ridiculous it is to have 50M in cap space......Ydawg could sign Hyman just to troll Holland or Armstrong if he wanted. 1 Rick D reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted July 15, 2021 Just now, The 91 of Ryans said: *sigh* I'm with you man. I was merely trying to illustrate how insanely ridiculous it is to have 50M in cap space......Ydawg could sign Hyman just to troll Holland or Armstrong if he wanted. It is a ridiculous amount of cap space, and I hope Yzerman puts it to good use. A lot of teams will be handcuffed with the flat cap and expansion draft. Take full advantage. Take on some bad contracts, trade for players that teams don't want to lose for nothing to Seattle, sign short-term, low salary contracts that can be flipped in the next two years. Basically just continue what Yzerman has been doing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
