11/27 Thanksshivving GDT - Maple Leafs @ Red Wings - 7:00 PM ET

[Dabura 12,232]

3 minutes ago, Euro_Twins said:

Trade larkin. Start over. 

Nah. He just needs help. Quinton Byfield is likely a franchise centerman and there's a pretty decent chance that he doesn't even go 1st overall (unless, perhaps, we pick 1st overall) -- so that would be a nice addition. And Seider's definitely going to be a Wing next season.

Things will get better eventually. But this is going to be a very painful season.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

Trade Larkin, see if I give it a s***, I'm crazy, I'll support anything at this point

[Spongewingredpants 75]

So, No Mantha, no goal scoring by anybody

[Akakabuto 1,842]

Just fix the defense pls. Better defense=better offense. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

22 minutes ago, Akakabuto said:

Just fix the defense pls. Better defense=better offense. 

I don't think there will be much of a change in the near future, aside from DeKeyser hopefully getting healthy soon. Next season, all of Green, Daley, Ericsson, McIlrath, Biega will likely be out, and Seider will be in. That alone should (in theory) be a pretty significant upgrade.

I could see something like this next season...

DeKeyser - Hronek
Nemeth - Seider
Cholowski - Bowey

That's not a terrible defense (on paper), and I could still see Yzerman acquiring a defenseman via trade before next season as well, or perhaps another stop-gap UFA...

I know some think next season will be just as bad or worse than this season, but I do believe this is rock bottom. I'm not saying we'll be a playoff team as early as next season, but I do think we'll be much improved...

[marcaractac 3,963]

I'd honestly like to see a lot less Bowey next season. 

[Akakabuto 1,842]

53 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I don't think there will be much of a change in the near future, aside from DeKeyser hopefully getting healthy soon. Next season, all of Green, Daley, Ericsson, McIlrath, Biega will likely be out, and Seider will be in. That alone should (in theory) be a pretty significant upgrade.

I could see something like this next season...

DeKeyser - Hronek
Nemeth - Seider
Cholowski - Bowey

That's not a terrible defense (on paper), and I could still see Yzerman acquiring a defenseman via trade before next season as well, or perhaps another stop-gap UFA...

I know some think next season will be just as bad or worse than this season, but I do believe this is rock bottom. I'm not saying we'll be a playoff team as early as next season, but I do think we'll be much improved...

Yeah we need to add to that group. Hopefully by trade. The UFA class 2020 doesn’t offer much. 

[gcom007 1,465]

10 hours ago, mackel said:

Hurt...

Feelings are injured, bro.

I still can’t say f*** that game enough. It made me get so drunk, even though that was already the plan. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

7 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

I'd honestly like to see a lot less Bowey next season. 

I wouldn't give up on Bowey yet. He's big, skates well, has a decent shot, and can make plays in the offensive zone. 8 points in 21 games for a defenseman that is getting bottom pair minutes and no power-play time is pretty solid production.

I don't think he's terrible defensively either. 1-on-1 he's pretty solid. His positioning could use some work. He also coughs up the puck pretty easily when pressured. He's good for one awful turnover pretty much every game. If he can clean that up, and work on his positioning in the defensive zone, I think he can be a more than competent 3rd pairing defenseman.

[The 91 of Ryans 3,019]

1 hour ago, krsmith17 said:

I don't think there will be much of a change in the near future, aside from DeKeyser hopefully getting healthy soon. Next season, all of Green, Daley, Ericsson, McIlrath, Biega will likely be out, and Seider will be in. That alone should (in theory) be a pretty significant upgrade.

I could see something like this next season...

DeKeyser - Hronek
Nemeth - Seider
Cholowski - Bowey

That's not a terrible defense (on paper), and I could still see Yzerman acquiring a defenseman via trade before next season as well, or perhaps another stop-gap UFA...

I know some think next season will be just as bad or worse than this season, but I do believe this is rock bottom. I'm not saying we'll be a playoff team as early as next season, but I do think we'll be much improved...

Next TWO seasons actually. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

5 minutes ago, Akakabuto said:

Yeah we need to add to that group. Hopefully by trade. The UFA class 2020 doesn’t offer much. 

We need to add to that group before we become a legit contender. I'd be okay with rolling with that next season though. But yeah, I can definitely see a trade at some point as well.

2 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Next TWO seasons actually. 

So you don't think this team will make any improvement until 2022-23?

[The 91 of Ryans 3,019]

1 minute ago, krsmith17 said:

We need to add to that group before we become a legit contender. I'd be okay with rolling with that next season though. But yeah, I can definitely see a trade at some point as well.

So you don't think this team will make any improvement until 2022-23?

Unless this team has a near-perfect offseason (Laffy + Nielsen/Abby trade + trade for top four D) I don't see any team in the NHL being as bad as Detroit next year. Maybe the Wild or Kings. 

[marcaractac 3,963]

Next season will be more like last season was. Competitive, but still losing a lot, albeit close games. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

1 minute ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Unless this team has a near-perfect offseason (Laffy + Nielsen/Abby trade + trade for top four D) I don't see any team in the NHL being as bad as Detroit next year. Maybe the Wild or Kings. 

I agree that we need to get rid of Nielsen, but I don't think us improving depends on that. Improvement will come from within, and addition by subtraction on the back end. Yeah, I'm counting on drafting an immediate impact player in next year's draft (Lafreniere / Byfield). I'm also counting on Seider being a significant upgrade over any of our current defensemen, with the exception of Hronek (maybe DeKeyser). I also think one, maybe two of Rasmussen, Veleno, Zadina, Svechnikov will make the team, and be a significant upgrade over some of our current bottom six forwards. And finally, I think we can reasonably expect some trades made to upgrade this team.

[The 91 of Ryans 3,019]

7 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I agree that we need to get rid of Nielsen, but I don't think us improving depends on that. Improvement will come from within, and addition by subtraction on the back end. Yeah, I'm counting on drafting an immediate impact player in next year's draft (Lafreniere / Byfield). I'm also counting on Seider being a significant upgrade over any of our current defensemen, with the exception of Hronek (maybe DeKeyser). I also think one, maybe two of Rasmussen, Veleno, Zadina, Svechnikov will make the team, and be a significant upgrade over some of our current bottom six forwards. And finally, I think we can reasonably expect some trades made to upgrade this team.

Goaltending = disaster

Defence = disaster

Compete = disaster

Forward depth = disaster

Expecting a couple of rookie forwards and Seider to turn this around in one season? No chance. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

4 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

Next season will be more like last season was. Competitive, but still losing a lot, albeit close games. 

I think we'll finish dead last (by a wide margin) this season with <60 points, and bottom 5-10 next season with >70 points *IF a lot of things within reason go our way this offseason... I think a jump of 10+ points is definitely reasonable expectations from this season to the next.

[krsmith17 7,191]

1 minute ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Goaltending = disaster

This is one area I could definitely see us addressing via free agency this offseason.

2 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Defence = disaster

Healthy DeKeyser (?). Addition by subtraction. Trade (?).

3 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Compete = disaster

I don't necessarily agree with this, but a new coach (?) could change this.

4 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Forward depth = disaster

This could honestly be a strength as early as next season.

We may still lack the elite talent (unless we get a top 2 pick), but depth shouldn't be an issue.

5 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Expecting a couple of rookie forwards and Seider to turn this around in one season? No chance. 

Lafreniere (if we're that lucky) could legitimately have a Matthews level impact on this team in his first season. The Leafs jumped 26! points after the Matthews draft.

[The 91 of Ryans 3,019]

4 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

This is one area I could definitely see us addressing via free agency this offseason.

Healthy DeKeyser (?). Addition by subtraction. Trade (?).

I don't necessarily agree with this, but a new coach (?) could change this.

This could honestly be a strength as early as next season.

We may still lack the elite talent (unless we get a top 2 pick), but depth shouldn't be an issue.

Lafreniere (if we're that lucky) could legitimately have a Matthews level impact on this team in his first season. The Leafs jumped 26! points after the Matthews draft.

Much better chance that this team is still basement. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

3 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Much better chance that this team is still basement. 

With potential of a big overhaul in the roster, I'd say there's a much better chance that we see improvement on the ice and in the standings, than stay exactly the same...

Agree to disagree.

[The 91 of Ryans 3,019]

2 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

With potential of a big overhaul in the roster, I'd say there's a much better chance that we see improvement on the ice and in the standings, than stay exactly the same...

Agree to disagree.

Yeah, sure, this team is might improve by 10 points like you said, but to finish 5 - 10 at least four teams would need to be worse and I just don't see who that would be. Like I said maybe the Wild or Kings. 

[marcaractac 3,963]

28 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I think we'll finish dead last (by a wide margin) this season with <60 points, and bottom 5-10 next season with >70 points *IF a lot of things within reason go our way this offseason... I think a jump of 10+ points is definitely reasonable expectations from this season to the next.

100% this. Sure we could win Lafreniere, and sure he could have a Mathews-level debut season. But more would need to go right to have a jump like the Leafs did that season. We'd need to shed some dead weight, and have Seider, Zadina and at least one of Veleno or Ras become contributing NHLers. Not only did the Leafs get Mathews that year, but Marner and Nylander also came in and tore it up. They also had Reilly show significant improvement. 

The problem is the teams above us are also improving. Therefore we need a substantial jump to flirt with a playoff spot again. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

13 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Yeah, sure, this team is might improve by 10 points like you said, but to finish 5 - 10 at least four teams would need to be worse and I just don't see who that would be. Like I said maybe the Wild or Kings. 

Would you not consider a 10 point jump in the standings significant improvement? I would. Also, like @marcaractac said, next season should be a lot more like last season, than this season, with a lot more closer games, rather than these 5-2, 5-1, 6-0 blowout losses.

[krsmith17 7,191]

13 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

100% this. Sure we could win Lafreniere, and sure he could have a Mathews-level debut season. But more would need to go right to have a jump like the Leafs did that season. We'd need to shed some dead weight, and have Seider, Zadina and at least one of Veleno or Ras become contributing NHLers. Not only did the Leafs get Mathews that year, but Marner and Nylander also came in and tore it up. They also had Reilly show significant improvement. 

The problem is the teams above us are also improving. Therefore we need a substantial jump to flirt with a playoff spot again. 

I think right now we're setup very similarly to the 2015-16 Leafs. Literally everything went right for them that offseason / next season though. I don't expect the same sort of turn around, but I do expect the turnaround to start next season. We're likely another couple years away from the playoffs, and another couple years after that before we're a legit contender...

[The 91 of Ryans 3,019]

27 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Would you not consider a 10 point jump in the standings significant improvement? I would. Also, like @marcaractac said, next season should be a lot more like last season, than this season, with a lot more closer games, rather than these 5-2, 5-1, 6-0 blowout losses.

A 10 point jump.

Right now they have 17 points one third of the way through the season. 10 divided by 3 = 3.3333

I'll round that off for you. This time next year they'd have 4 extra points. 21 points. 

IF they had those 21 points this season they'd be 2nd last, ahead of NJ by one point and NJ would have 4 games in had.

STILL the basement. Like I said. Bottom 5 team next year and probably the following season as well. IMO

 

[marcaractac 3,963]

The big difference next season will be goal differential.