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matemate

Wings are soft as hell.

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I'm happy with the bottom six we have. Sure I'd absolutely love to have a Guy who placed like aaron downey and went to hit everyone that was near him, but if our guys play like they do in the playoffs when Darsyuk and Zetterberg and Helm and Clearly are really throwing their checks....that's even better than just one Guy who is a real crash and Banger. Would I love to have a Dallas Drake 2.0 of course, but we have a strong 3rd and 4th lines

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I think LGW is the only forum in hockey that will whine about the team being soft after a 4 game win streak.

Sure, snarl would be nice to have, but going on a rant while the team is playing great hockey?

Rick D and GoWings1905 like this

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I think LGW is the only forum in hockey that will whine about the team being soft after a 4 game win streak.

Sure, snarl would be nice to have, but going on a rant while the team is playing great hockey?

I don't agree with the OP's assertion that the Wings are soft as hell, but I really don't understand this point, which has become a frequently stated opinion as of late. Are we only allowed to talk about potential changes to the team after they lose? I'm not saying that to be a smartass, I just really don't follow the thinking. When things are going well, how many times can we post "woohoo!" and "Go Wings!"

In another thread, Crymson attacks another member because after a loss that person allegedly makes several posts criticizing the team, but after a win is nowhere to be found. So it's this no-win situation where if you only post after a loss you're a whining fan who does nothing but complain when the team loses, yet if you talk about changes to the team during a win streak, then you're still a spoiled fan because you can't enjoy the team winning.

This isn't directed so much at you, but mainly I'm tired of the thinking here that we should do nothing but say positive things about the team (except of course for Hudler and Ericsson who are apparently exempt from that rule) as if that's the only way to support them and be a true fan. I do support the team. I also want to discuss hockey in a hockey forum. Sometimes that means talking about larger issues with the team, or even just wild ass speculation. The season is long, even if they're on a win streak, that doesn't mean there aren't things to talk about that will have implications down the road this season and in the playoffs. As I've said before, a lot of the criticism here is done with an eye towards the postseason and getting past San Jose, so it's not even about the current win streak.

For those who don't like threads criticizing the team and think they are ill timed, it's very simple to avoid and not post in the thread. It'd be great to have more posts here that actually talk about the Wings and hockey in general, instead of all the ones that only judge how other people post here, including this one.

*getting off my soapbox*

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If they do get a guy like that for the playoff stretch, you'd have to think Emmerton would be the odd man out roster-wise. However, it seems to be running against Holland's line of thinking to pick up a player of that ilk so much that he can't possibly be thinking of getting one.

I'm hoping they call up Callahan for a few games this year because that just might end up providing the kind of spark you need some nights.

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Well there were both huge in a stanley cup win last year, one scored more goals than anyone on our team and the other is a top 3 defenseman in the NHL.

So yeah they could destroy most of the wings in hockey, than beat them up

I don't disagree that Lucic was beneficial to the Bruins in the Playoffs last year but it is a extremely misleading to say that Lucic "scored more goals that anyone on our team" in the Playoffs last year. While technically true Lucic scored 5 goals in 25 games which is .20 goals/game. Z on the other hand scored 3 goals in 7 games which is .43 goals/game. At that pace Z would have scored 10.75 goals in 25 games and more than doubling Lucic's goals. In fact Z, Dats, Eaves, Homer, Helm, and Mule all had better goals/game than Lucic. Additionally, Bert, Cleary, and Flip were all right behind Lucic at .18 goals/game. When you play well over twice as many games as the players that you are comparing it not that relent how many goals were scored but rather how many goals were scored relative to the number of games that each player played. In fact, Lucic was tied with 3 other players for 5th-8th on his team in goals/game. It took Lucic 447 minutes and 32 seconds to score 5 goals throughout the playoffs whereas Z got 3 goals in 153 minutes and 56 seconds. Lucic also scored more goals that Bobby Ryan or Patrick Sharp, more than double Ryan Getzlaf, 5 times more than Dustin Brown, Patrick Kane, or Johnathan Towes. Like I said I don't disagree that Lucic is beneficial to his team but I find your comparison of his goals scored to the Red Wings goals scored to have no real relation.

mjlegend and 55fan like this

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I think LGW is the only forum in hockey that will whine about the team being soft after a 4 game win streak.

Sure, snarl would be nice to have, but going on a rant while the team is playing great hockey?

That's because some fans have foresight. Regular season wins only get you into the playoffs. If you have a team that A. get's banged around twice as much as other teams in the regular season, that doesn't bode well come playoff time; and B. If you have a team that can't dish it out as good as it gets in the playoffs, advantage opponent. The last Detroit team that had any real grit was, well, the championship team. Any coincidence? Sure, Downey only played around 40 regular season games or so, but he was an effective deterrent in those games. And sure, the only key piece from the championship team that is not here now is Dallas Drake, but Dallas Drake should of won the Conn Smythe for what he gave Detroit in those playoffs. If Abdelkader wasn't such a complete and utter puss, he could maybe fill that role, but he is. And if Bertuzzi would stop playing no-touch hockey, he could also be a more effective player, but he won't. All that being said, outside of the Bruins game I don't think Detroit's lack of physicality has been as glaring as it has in past seasons. But that will change come playoff time.

This team would benefit greatly from looking into acquiring a Dallas Drake-like player by the deadline. Chris Neil, maybe? David Clarkson?

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would love to see boris valabik here. lots of potential, huge, and can scrap. plus he'll be able to give me free tickets to every game lol.

linky

^ hes a wings fan too. look at that 02 cup gear! his in the back with the white shirt

Edited by Din758

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I dislike how it always seems the Wings have to be criticized for something around here. But despite the OP's obnoxious tone, there is a reasonable point. A fourth line of Miller-Emmerton-Holmstrom makes me gag. I don't think that the answer has to be players known for toughness, but some sort of theme/identity for the line would be nice. For example, a line like Mursak - Helm - Abdelkader would be great despite not having huge, bruising checkers or a legitimate fighter (ignoring the fact that one of Helm or Abdelkader will be playing a bigger role than fourth-line duty).

Edited by Zetts

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I don't disagree that Lucic was beneficial to the Bruins in the Playoffs last year but it is a extremely misleading to say that Lucic "scored more goals that anyone on our team" in the Playoffs last year. While technically true Lucic scored 5 goals in 25 games which is .20 goals/game. Z on the other hand scored 3 goals in 7 games which is .43 goals/game. At that pace Z would have scored 10.75 goals in 25 games and more than doubling Lucic's goals. In fact Z, Dats, Eaves, Homer, Helm, and Mule all had better goals/game than Lucic. Additionally, Bert, Cleary, and Flip were all right behind Lucic at .18 goals/game. When you play well over twice as many games as the players that you are comparing it not that relent how many goals were scored but rather how many goals were scored relative to the number of games that each player played. In fact, Lucic was tied with 3 other players for 5th-8th on his team in goals/game. It took Lucic 447 minutes and 32 seconds to score 5 goals throughout the playoffs whereas Z got 3 goals in 153 minutes and 56 seconds. Lucic also scored more goals that Bobby Ryan or Patrick Sharp, more than double Ryan Getzlaf, 5 times more than Dustin Brown, Patrick Kane, or Johnathan Towes. Like I said I don't disagree that Lucic is beneficial to his team but I find your comparison of his goals scored to the Red Wings goals scored to have no real relation.

I was just talking regular season, didnt even look into playoffs, obviously he would have mroe goals in the playoffs because his team won the cup

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I don't agree with the OP's assertion that the Wings are soft as hell, but I really don't understand this point, which has become a frequently stated opinion as of late. Are we only allowed to talk about potential changes to the team after they lose? I'm not saying that to be a smartass, I just really don't follow the thinking. When things are going well, how many times can we post "woohoo!" and "Go Wings!"

In another thread, Crymson attacks another member because after a loss that person allegedly makes several posts criticizing the team, but after a win is nowhere to be found. So it's this no-win situation where if you only post after a loss you're a whining fan who does nothing but complain when the team loses, yet if you talk about changes to the team during a win streak, then you're still a spoiled fan because you can't enjoy the team winning.

This isn't directed so much at you, but mainly I'm tired of the thinking here that we should do nothing but say positive things about the team (except of course for Hudler and Ericsson who are apparently exempt from that rule) as if that's the only way to support them and be a true fan. I do support the team. I also want to discuss hockey in a hockey forum. Sometimes that means talking about larger issues with the team, or even just wild ass speculation. The season is long, even if they're on a win streak, that doesn't mean there aren't things to talk about that will have implications down the road this season and in the playoffs. As I've said before, a lot of the criticism here is done with an eye towards the postseason and getting past San Jose, so it's not even about the current win streak.

For those who don't like threads criticizing the team and think they are ill timed, it's very simple to avoid and not post in the thread. It'd be great to have more posts here that actually talk about the Wings and hockey in general, instead of all the ones that only judge how other people post here, including this one.

*getting off my soapbox*

The key word is "rant".

We can absolutely talk about how to make the team better(this team needs to get better to contend for a championship), but it just seems like someone getting worked up based on a preference of style and not really on a big weakness the team has. It also doesn't help when some posters get so worked up about physicality they state that Dallas freaking Drake deserved the Conn Smythe for the 2008 playoffs.

On subject: I do think the Wings are going to need to get meaner and bigger now that the disparity in talent between now and 2008 is getting bigger each year. We may not need to become a team that is feared physically, but we do need to become one that can contend physically in the coming years.

Edited by Doc Holliday
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The key word is "rant".

We can absolutely talk about how to make the team better(this team needs to get better to contend for a championship), but it just seems like someone getting worked up based on a preference of style and not really on a big weakness the team has. It also doesn't help when some posters get so worked up about physicality they state that Dallas freaking Drake deserved the Conn Smythe for the 2008 playoffs.

On subject: I do think the Wings are going to need to get meaner and bigger now that the disparity in talent between now and 2008 is getting bigger each year. We may not need to become a team that is feared physically, but we do need to become one that can contend physically in the coming years.

Absolutely agree. Right now they're in this middle ground where they're not quite skilled as they were to outmaneuver physical teams regularly, but they're also not quite physical enough to hold their own.

The thread title is a wee bit melodramatic, but I think there's a valid discussion to be had about making better use of the Wings 4th line.

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I was just talking regular season, didnt even look into playoffs, obviously he would have mroe goals in the playoffs because his team won the cup

My mistake I apologize, I thought the first part of your post, "Well there were both huge in a stanley cup win last year" was in reference to Lucic in the playoffs. You are correct he scored more goals than any Wing during the regular season.

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Absolutely agree. Right now they're in this middle ground where they're not quite skilled as they were to outmaneuver physical teams regularly, but they're also not quite physical enough to hold their own.

The thread title is a wee bit melodramatic, but I think there's a valid discussion to be had about making better use of the Wings 4th line.

I think the Wings are in kind of a hard spot right now with the 4th line though. Holmstrom is mostly effective on the PP and there is uncertainty how to best utilize or utilize him at all during non PP time. I think he kind of throws a kink in the lineup because where exactly do you put him.

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I don't totally disagree, but boy those big tough Bruins sure put the Wings in their place last week.

I would rather have Ericsson for 15 years than Mike Komisarek, also.

Yeah - regular season means so much...

Had we faced them last spring - we would've had a repeat of 1995...Some here tend to forget how throughout the playoffs the game tends to favor teams that can not only score goals, but can physically dominate you as well.

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They sure do.

And you can also count this year's Pens.

Lots of tough teams win the Cup nowadays.

are you suggesting that this years pengwhines are going to win the Cup?

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Who do this year's Pens have?

Engelland, Asham, and Macintyre. All of whom could likely walk into our forward gate and fight their way through the Wings bench and walk out the defense gate relativley unscathed.

Bertuzzi can fight but hes not the 27 year old 250lb monster he used to be in Vancouver - plus hed had a few concussions ... I dont want to see Bert fighting tough guys. Abdelkader is a decent also. I agree with TS in saying that grabbing someone who can play the game and eat up minutes but is ready/willing/capable to throw down to defend teammates or spark the bench when needed.

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Yeah - regular season means so much...

Had we faced them last spring - we would've had a repeat of 1995...Some here tend to forget how throughout the playoffs the game tends to favor teams that can not only score goals, but can physically dominate you as well.

Geez, talk about being melodramatic.

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No - just bloody honest.

No, that's being melodramatic.

The Wings weren't a world beater by any means, but they could have put up a fight against any team in the league last post-season. They went 7 games against a team that has had their number, and swept a team they struggled with the previous year.

Hell, the tiny Canadiens went 7 against Boston and almost pulled off a series win. Boston would have most certainly beat Detroit last year, but Detroit could have won one or two games.

For the record, I think San Jose would have had the best chance to beat Boston.

Edited by Doc Holliday
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downy fabric softeners make towels soft as hell.

So you're saying we need Jiri Fischer to wash the jerseys for the team? I agree!!!! He'd probably use sandpaper and glass to clean those suckers!!!

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No, that's being melodramatic.

The Wings weren't a world beater by any means, but they could have put up a fight against any team in the league last post-season. They went 7 games against a team that has had their number, and swept a team they struggled with the previous year.

Hell, the tiny Canadiens went 7 against Boston and almost pulled off a series win. Boston would have most certainly beat Detroit last year, but Detroit could have won one or two games.

For the record, I think San Jose would have had the best chance to beat Boston.

No Doc - it's called an honest opinion of where our beloved Detroit Red Wings have a weakness.

Edited by F.Michael

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No Doc - it's called an honest opinion of where our beloved Detroit Red Wings have a weakness.

You aren't talking about a weakness. You are talking about a Bruins team sweeping Detroit in a seven game series, something that hasn't happened since 2003.

That is a really bold assertion about a team that hasn't beaten Detroit since 09. And beat every single team they played this month EXCEPT for Detroit.

Edited by Doc Holliday
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