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Has the Detroit diamond lost it's shine?


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#1 FireCaptain

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:13 PM

I read a couple of articles today that reference the Wings' inability to land Suter or Parise. I'm beginning to think long gone are the days of the hometown discount and the 'head to Detroit and you've got a shot at a championship' mentality. With the parity that currently exists, any team has a shot at winning.

Yes, there's a tradition of success. Yes, there's 4 Cups in the last 15 years. However, there's just as many first/second round exits and early playoff exits. Other than consistently making the playoffs - what sets Detroit apart as a choice for someone's career? Nothing tangible.

Sure, there are the intangibles - the history, Original Six, 11 Cups, Gordie Howe, etc.. but those have very little to do a person's day-to-day working life or home life.

I was just pondering all this.. what say you?

Ryan Suter turned down Hockeytown for a bunch of lakes.

He turned down the Red Wings

. Worse of all, he turned down Mike Ilitch and $90 million.


And few can turn down Mr. Ilitch. Pudge Rodriguez couldn’t do it. Neither could Prince Fielder or Chris Chelios and countless other players that I can’t remember right now.

http://www.freep.com...ise-free-agency

Submitted for your approval: Four years ago a general manager of an NHL hockey team stops at a gas station and is interrupted by a phone call informing him that one of the top players in the league is willing to sign a one-year deal with his team. The general manager cannot believe his good fortune.



Fast forward four years later, the same general manger is in an airplane flying to Wisconsin with the hope of convincing a top player to sign a multiyear, mega-million-dollar deal with his team.

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#2 hillbillywingsfan

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:18 PM

You are talking about 2 players that took well over what they are worth. 98mil for 13 yrs??? If thats what it took would you of really wanted us to do that and handcuff our team for the future??
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#3 Wings10

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:25 PM

They also made the Finals 3 yrs ago and were 1 game away from another Cup..Sorry but just because 2 over rated and now over paid players decided to join a crappy team In Minni does not mean the Red Wings are all of a sudden a 2nd tier franchise.

#4 Salviaman

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:30 PM

Suter and Parise wanted to be BFF in Minnesota. There was nothing Illitch and Holland could have done. They tried but we got denied.
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#5 Dominator2005

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:37 PM

Schultz...

Holland is 0/3 so far this summer...
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#6 stillwater

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:39 PM

No.

#7 matt198913

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:39 PM

Are you referring to the same player that signed with the Wings right after they won the cup
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#8 hillbillywingsfan

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:41 PM

Schultz...

Holland is 0/3 so far this summer...

Not sure how It's his fault. They got 98mil 13 yrs....would you of really wanted to spend that much? really....
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#9 Dominator2005

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:45 PM

Between you and me +/- $8M for 13 years... does it really make a difference (when you already have $90M) ?!
"Some guys dream about scoring goals, or making big saves... I swear to God I dream about kicking ass in a hockey fight - no other way to say it than I love to do it, its who I am"... Brian McGrattan

#10 Seraph

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:50 PM

Are you a fan of the Red Wings or are you only a fan of winning? Every franchise faces challenges. Half the fun is seeing how those challenges are overcome.

Are we as prepared for a cup run as we were five years ago? Are we the number one cup contender? No. Things change, players come and go.

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#11 hillbillywingsfan

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:53 PM

Even if the Red Wings had matched Minnesota's offers to both, it probably wouldn't have mattered.


“You read today where they’re happy to be going as a pair and they’re both going home,'' Holland said. “Those are some of the things we couldn’t compete against because we’re not (their) home.''


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#12 Dabura

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 03:57 PM

We kicked the tires. I like our team. Our power play is our enforcer.

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#13 The Axe

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 04:25 PM

Dominator2005, youre the only one who realizes that Holland lost a race. If hes willing to offer 180 mil to 2 guys, why not go the extra mile and offer 8 mil a season to land em both. In 7 years, cap will be 80-90 million and the extra mil a season will be so meaningless. We lost 2 great players and our gm stinks. Those are the facts.

#14 Crymson

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 04:32 PM

I don't think that Detroit's standing or lack thereof as a perennial contender, nor that of any other team, mattered to Parise and Suter. They chose to go to a non-contender.

Dominator2005, youre the only one who realizes that Holland lost a race. If hes willing to offer 180 mil to 2 guys, why not go the extra mile and offer 8 mil a season to land em both. In 7 years, cap will be 80-90 million and the extra mil a season will be so meaningless. We lost 2 great players and our gm stinks. Those are the facts.


Your prediction for the cap is immensely speculative, and probably wrong. I find it likely that the league will push for a halt on increases in the salary cap, as it is presently out of control. League owners no doubt do not enjoy paying out massively inflated contracts due to the cap being so high.

#15 Zetts

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 04:35 PM

Dominator2005, youre the only one who realizes that Holland lost a race. If hes willing to offer 180 mil to 2 guys, why not go the extra mile and offer 8 mil a season to land em both. In 7 years, cap will be 80-90 million and the extra mil a season will be so meaningless. We lost 2 great players and our gm stinks. Those are the facts.

Has it occured to you that maybe Ilitch wasn't ok with that amount of money? Holland doesn't get to unilaterally make these decisions. 90M was them upping their offer, which Ilitch might not have been crazy about to begin with. I know that we just assume that Ilitch's wealth is unlimited, but maybe things aren't going quite as well these days? Just a thought.

Man people are fast to throw Kenny under the bus.

Edited by Zetts, 04 July 2012 - 04:36 PM.


#16 marcaractac

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 04:40 PM

Dominator2005, youre the only one who realizes that Holland lost a race. If hes willing to offer 180 mil to 2 guys, why not go the extra mile and offer 8 mil a season to land em both. In 7 years, cap will be 80-90 million and the extra mil a season will be so meaningless. We lost 2 great players and our gm stinks. Those are the facts.



How do you even know how much they offered Parise? IT's pretty clear that offer was less than what was offered to Suter because he was our bigger need.

So our GM stinks because PArise and Suter wanted to go play BFF on a s***ty team? Please. Suter was all but signed with the Wings until Parise talked him out of it. Holland wasn't gonna criiple the team in the future cap-wise to bring in above average players. If you wanna go all out with money, you wait for Weber, not Suter.

#17 The Axe

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 04:41 PM

It doesnt matter why. Facts are: 1) we dont have either Lidstrom, Shultz, parise or suter, and 2) we have bertuzzi, sammuelson, gustavson, and tootoo. That is crappy general management by definition.

#18 Crymson

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 04:43 PM

It doesnt matter why. Facts are: 1) we dont have either Lidstrom, Shultz, parise or suter, and 2) we have bertuzzi, sammuelson, gustavson, and tootoo. That is crappy general management by definition.


Something tells me that signing Lidstrom this season was not an option. I don't think that you can reasonably lay that one at Holland's feet. Suter and Parise chose to go a non-contender. Schultz was not willing to consider non-Canadian teams.

Edited by Crymson, 04 July 2012 - 04:43 PM.


#19 marcaractac

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 04:45 PM

It doesnt matter why. Facts are: 1) we dont have either Lidstrom, Shultz, parise or suter, and 2) we have bertuzzi, sammuelson, gustavson, and tootoo. That is crappy general management by definition.


1 and 2 are not any fault of Holland. #3 gives the team a little depth up front so we can make trades. Would you like some cheese with your whine?

#20 Hairy Lime

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Posted 04 July 2012 - 04:45 PM

I can't say how much blame, if any, Holland deserves in the case of Parise and Suter, but I do think he has let this team age badly. I always seem like I'm the only one who doesn't like his "over ripe" theory when it comes to prospects. Just because a prospect who sat in GR or over seas a little longer eventually turns into a success, doesn't mean they wouldn't of advanced quicker if they had been thrown right into the mix. I would of loved to have seen more of Tatar last season, and Smith in the playoffs. And don't even get me started on his anti-enforcer stance.





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