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Will young talent ever speak out against Wings philosophy?


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#1 Red Wings Addict

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 10:58 PM

Will we ever see the day where a young talent simply snaps and goes outright publicly HAM against the Wings development philosophy?

 

The stereotype is that hockey players are so down to earth and humble but you always got your handful of individuals who have a little bit of a screw loose. 

 

One of these days I wonder if a young but established NHL player will ever just lose his mind and any sense of class and publicly rants to the media, "Yeah, I'm glad I didn't get drafted by Detroit.  I played one year in juniors after I got drafted, two years in the AHL; for all my years scored in the top 20 in my respective leagues, worked on my overall game, went to training camp and earned a full-time roster spot.  More or less, that's how it should be.  I didn't have management that played favorites.  I didn't have management that tried to reduce my salary negotiating power by trapping me in the minors so I couldn't earn a bigger and more fair contract for my abilities with NHL experience and a decent opportunity to prove myself.  I didn't have to deal with that BS and I'm thankful to the X organization for not tossing out some bullcrap about being overripe.  You ever tried eating an overripe fruit?  It's disgusting."

 

Would that person be 100% right?  Hell no.  But I wouldn't be surprised if perhaps one of these days during perhaps a rivalry playoff series that a player on the opposing team tries to stir the pot that way. 



#2 thegerkin

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 11:21 PM

If any player in our system publicly bitched about the team or where they are in the farm system, they are going to get the Ian White treatment. Plus, it's hockey. If an established NHL'er is bitching, then you ignore them. There won't be a negative effect to the organization if Jack Jackson Jacksonite Esq. rips into the organization.

 

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#3 Jedi

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 11:26 PM

Not if that young talent wants to land a roster spot on this team...


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#4 cnot19

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 12:19 AM

This is why I hate people praising the "red wings" way. Get fired up,get pissed off. Play hard and physical. Maybe maybe just hurt someone that's how everyone else plays. To the prospects get fired the hell up and grab something, do something about it
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#5 Bring Back The Bruise Bros

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 12:47 AM

Not if they wanna get called up before they turn 30.







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#6 DeGraa55

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 03:48 AM

Tatar pretty much did. He said of he wasn't on the roster this year he was gone.

#7 frankgrimes

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 04:50 AM

I think Tatar and Nyquist might reach a pint where they are fed up with getting scratched or sent down in favor of vets. Letting players develop sand over ripen in the AHL. That's the point at which I would hope for Kenny to move up and let another GM take over. but if they ever do their future in this organization would be sealed and like others mentioned, every player would get the White treatment.

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#8 evilzyme

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 08:21 AM

Wiz spoke against Detroit when he hit free agency. Basically stating that Detroit low-balls everyone and he would never sign with them. Then he signed with CBJ. Tatar spoke up against it stating that he wasn't going to go back to the AHL; he would rather go to the KHL. I'm sure numerous prospects have had words, or their agents speaking for them but it doesn't need to be public. Leagues, celebrities, athletes, businesses all put on a dog and pony show. It's how you look to the rest of the world. That's why we get so fascinated when we actually get a behind the scene look to see how things actually operate. I'm sure 24/7 will most likely feature some segments/episodes that will change your opinion of a few of our players.


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#9 hillbillywingsfan

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 08:30 AM

I am sort of torn here. We could be a team like the Oil and be on a 7 season playoff drought trying by trying to play all of our young kids or we can be like the wings and be on a 22 season playoff streak doing what we do. Don't get me wrong I would love to see some of our young players over the likes of Sammy and Cleary but with the success the wings have had with the way they have done things I don't see that changing any time soon. The young players still talk highly about the wings and how they are ran so I think its more us fans that have a problem with it then any of the players.


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#10 evilzyme

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 08:36 AM

I am sort of torn here. We could be a team like the Oil and be on a 7 season playoff drought trying by trying to play all of our young kids or we can be like the wings and be on a 22 season playoff streak doing what we do. Don't get me wrong I would love to see some of our young players over the likes of Sammy and Cleary but with the success the wings have had with the way they have done things I don't see that changing any time soon. The young players still talk highly about the wings and how they are ran so I think its more us fans that have a problem with it then any of the players.

 

I agree with you that you can be a team like the Oilers and not have enough veteran leadership to lead the way. There are also numerous other problems with the Edmonton franchise, though. The biggest key to the Wings philosophy was that having a handful of veterans on your roster would not only allow for them to teach current youngsters how to play the right way, but to also delay and allow for the prospects to develop properly in the A/College/Juniors. Numerous franchises were rushing their prospects straight to their big show rosters because they needed the help asap. It puts insane amounts of pressure on the prospects and can hinder the development depending on the personality and work ethic. What really irks me right now is that Nyquist and Tatar can't develop in the AHL anymore. They're too good for the league. They need to be playing stiffer competition so they can learn how to execute at the NHL level. 


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#11 Dabura

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 09:11 AM

I am sort of torn here. We could be a team like the Oil and be on a 7 season playoff drought trying by trying to play all of our young kids or we can be like the wings and be on a 22 season playoff streak doing what we do.

 

Is there no in between?

 

Does giving a couple young guns more ice time necessarily mean the end of our playoff streak?


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#12 The Greek

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 09:14 AM

 
Is there no in between?
 
Does giving a couple young guns more ice time necessarily mean the end of our playoff streak?

Clearly not, when you consider last season. If anything, the young guys were vital to us making the playoffs.

Edited by The Greek, 08 October 2013 - 09:14 AM.


#13 hillbillywingsfan

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 10:01 AM

 

Is there no in between?

 

Does giving a couple young guns more ice time necessarily mean the end of our playoff streak?

Isn't that what we are doing now?

 

I'm not sure I understand what you are wanting from them. We only have 2 players that legitimately could be replaced by younger players and it make a difference...Cleary and Sammy. Who else do you want to see a young player take a spot from? 


Edited by hillbillywingsfan, 08 October 2013 - 10:56 AM.

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#14 F.Michael

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 10:24 AM

This is why I hate people praising the "red wings" way. Get fired up,get pissed off. Play hard and physical. Maybe maybe just hurt someone that's how everyone else plays. To the prospects get fired the hell up and grab something, do something about it

Agreed.

 

Maybe it's just me - I dunno.....If I were a 'prospect' in the Wings system - I'd seriously consider taking a run at a guy like Bertuzzi/Sammy/Cleary at summer/fall camp.....If anything - you'll get noticed, and maybe you'll get lucky, and knock one of the 3 mentioned outta the line up for a bit, and create an opportunity for yourself.



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#15 amato

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 10:34 AM

Will we ever see the day where a young talent simply snaps and goes outright publicly HAM against the Wings development philosophy?

 

The stereotype is that hockey players are so down to earth and humble but you always got your handful of individuals who have a little bit of a screw loose. 

 

 

the vast majority of them end up between the pipes (and also not in the winged wheel)  :P


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#16 bakerbert

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 10:40 AM

Isn't that what we are doing now?

 

I agree, right now we have Danny D and Tatar in then line up and Nyquist will be up as soon as a spot opens.

At the end of this year there are a bunch of contracts ending. (Sammy, Bert, Alferdsson, Cleary, Eaves).  

That opens up spots to be earned, adds the much needed cap space. These guys will get there spots. 

 

Why mess with the formula that made Detroit the most successful franchise in all of sports. 


Edited by bakerbert, 08 October 2013 - 11:54 AM.

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#17 kipwinger

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 11:26 AM

Agreed.

 

Maybe it's just me - I dunno.....If I were a 'prospect' in the Wings system - I'd seriously consider taking a run at a guy like Bertuzzi/Sammy/Cleary at summer/fall camp.....If anything - you'll get noticed, and maybe you'll get lucky, and knock one of the 3 mentioned outta the line up for a bit, and create an opportunity for yourself.

 

Are you advocating hurting your own teammate in practice to get ahead?  How very "Black Swan" of you.  I'd hate to be your coworker, god knows what you'd do for a better parking spot. 


GMRwings:  "Well, in other civilized countries, 16 years old isn't considered underage.  For instance, I believe the age of consent is 16 in Canada.  There's some US states where it's 16 as well.  

 

Get off the high horse.  Not like she was 10."

 

"Some girls are 17 even though they look 25."

 

 


#18 Richdg

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 11:40 AM

 

Are you advocating hurting your own teammate in practice to get ahead?  How very "Black Swan" of you.  I'd hate to be your coworker, god knows what you'd do for a better parking spot. 

Yes. That is what young players are supposed to do: earn a roster spot/playing time. Which as of today nyquist and Tatar haven't. maybe it is do to blind loyalty or maybe it is because they are not as good as the vets some fans want them to replace.

Yes waiting for your chance is hard to do. Then do something about it. As Ric Flair used to say "To be the man, you have to beat the man". There is a lot of trueth in that statement.


 

Isn't that what we are doing now?

I agree, right now we have Danny D and Tatar in then line up and Nyquist will be up as soon as a spot opens.

At the end of this year there are a bunch of contracts ending. (Sammy, Bert, Alferdsson, Cleary, Eaves).  

That opens up spots to be earned, adds the much needed cap space. These guys will get there spots. 

 

Why mess with the formula that made Detroit the most successful franchise in all of sports. 

 

What made the RW the most successful isn't overriping players in the minors. It was a great draft-1983, several big time trades, multiple UFA signings, and scouting Europe before everyone else did. All the while being backed by the best owner in sports. The overriping of young talent is a by product of having a deep and talented team. Not the cause of having a deep and talented team.



#19 kipwinger

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 11:41 AM

Yes. That is what young players are supposed to do: earn a roster spot/playing time. Which as of today nyquist and Tatar haven't. maybe it is do to blind loyalty or maybe it is because they are not as good as the vets some fans want them to replace.

Yes waiting for your chance is hard to do. Then do something about it. As Ric Flair used to say "To be the man, you have to beat the man". There is a lot of trueth in that statement.

 

Jesus, you're ok with it too.  Listen I'm all for young guys outplaying older ones, happens all the time.  He suggested that they should "take runs" at veteran players and injure them during practice in order to make an opportunity for themselves.  That isn't outplaying anyone.  That's borderline psychotic.  It's not at all different than what Tonya Harding did to Nancy Kerrigan.  It's f*cking nuts!  These guys are your teammates, your buddies, not your f*cking Game of Thrones rival. 


GMRwings:  "Well, in other civilized countries, 16 years old isn't considered underage.  For instance, I believe the age of consent is 16 in Canada.  There's some US states where it's 16 as well.  

 

Get off the high horse.  Not like she was 10."

 

"Some girls are 17 even though they look 25."

 

 


#20 Richdg

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 11:46 AM

 

Jesus, you're ok with it too.  Listen I'm all for young guys outplaying older ones, happens all the time.  He suggested that they should "take runs" at veteran players and injure them during practice in order to make an opportunity for themselves.  That isn't outplaying anyone.  That's borderline psychotic.  It's not at all different than what Tonya Harding did to Nancy Kerrigan.  It's f*cking nuts!  These guys are your teammates, your buddies, not your f*cking Game of Thrones rival. 

Like when little Bert put Jensen on the LTIR? Everyone on the forum was for it. Trying to make an impression and a name for himself. Go back a few years. probert, kocur, grimson all practiced fighting. Tommy hearns used to box Mccarty lapointe etc..... There are tryout videos online of McKee fighting others in the USHL tryout camp. Every player has to play their game to earn a spot. You do what you have too to make it. 







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