rick zombo 3,739 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 (edited) Agreed on all counts. Hopefully the Wings know exactly where Weiss is health wise before deciding what to do with Legwand. If he's going to be on LTIR all next season I wouldn't mind a 1 year deal on Legwand. Or Statsny. edit: on (what would most definitely have to be) a mult-year deal. Then deal with the Weiss situation if/when he's ever healthy again. Edited April 29, 2014 by rick zombo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rick zombo 3,739 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 Hossa was offered the deal first, he rejected his, Franzen was offered a similar (but less financially lucrative) deal and accepted immediately. Is Hossa the better player? Clearly yes, but he was option #1 and he wanted to see if he could get more money. Franzen was the back-up option. This. This. This. This. This. A tousand times over. I'm actually blown away that this never gets talked about more. 3 marcaractac, FlashyG and wingedominance13 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wings87 1,290 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 Maybe Holland's sick of losing all his personel to other teams? As happy as I am for Nill, MacLean, McLellan, etc for thier new opportunities over the last few years, other teams' scavenging of the Detroit organization is getting old and frustrating, in a hurry. Whatever the reason, I still don't think its right to block someone from bettering their position. 1 roboturner reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frankgrimes 1,836 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 u o That Babcock quote is exactly what I've been fearing for a long time. The guy - and who can blame him - may not want to go through some tough rebuilding years or just hope to make the playoffs. Maybe it's coincidence but him not being dedicated to talk extension this summer and other teams not getting permission to talk to Blashill doesn't exactly point a contract extension for the best coach in hockey but man I wouldn't wanzt to face a Babock coached team, he may go away from the game for 1 - 2 years and then decide to come back as for Mule well it's going to be the last opportunity anyways that combined with the Weiss deal could really hurt this franchise for a long time. With the way Franzen is going through the motions I really don't see him playing out his contract and then the recapture will kick in so this is a gamble I would not be willing to take. Yeah buying out Tootoo who has one year remaining on his contract and provides at least some sort of protection for the GR is a great move. In Mantha's case all I can hope for is that they don't rush him let him pay his dues in the AHL, bulk up even more and come up when he is fully ready not before it. 1 rick zombo reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,963 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 I don't care if we lose Babcock or not, and I also wouldn't want to resign Legwand for $5M, but there is no way he will be our #4 center anyhow. Whatever, I just think since we gave up a ton (in comparison to others on Trade Day) that Legwand should at least be in the immediate future plans for a couple of seasons...but again, not at $5M. I do not like that they say that hey are going to build the D from within...I do like our kids, but I just think we need a vet or two to bridge the gap while the kids gain experience. BUT, I do feel that Marchenko, Sproul and Ouellet are going good solid players and am excited to see their progress. If they aren't going to bolster their D with better NHL players, then they damn well better convince Howard to waive his NTC because he proved this season that he cannot make the save when needed and needs a BETTER defense in front of him, not a greener one... Damn Holland, you are going to have $20M available and you want to fill you roster full of rookies? Why save the cap Kenny, so you can acquire that player at the deadline? Give us all a break! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rking72 13 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 I wouldn't be surprised if the Hawks buy out Hossa this off season...that would be kind of funny 1 LeftWinger reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Euro_Twins 4,476 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 Whatever the reason, I still don't think its right to block someone from bettering their position. Why? He signed a contract, he has stated he wants to stay the year in grand rapids. If I had an employee sign a contract possibly with a no compete clause or something of the like, and it was my say if he is allowed to negotiate elsewhere, and he/she was a valuable employee, I definitely would say no too. If he is unhappy he can tell Holland he would like to leave, but he is still under contract and until that contract is done he shouldn't be talking to other employers. Same goes with players. They can't discuss new contracts with other teams till the old one ends. 2 Internet.Unknown and Hockeymom1960 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wings87 1,290 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 Why? He signed a contract, he has stated he wants to stay the year in grand rapids. If I had an employee sign a contract possibly with a no compete clause or something of the like, and it was my say if he is allowed to negotiate elsewhere, and he/she was a valuable employee, I definitely would say no too. If he is unhappy he can tell Holland he would like to leave, but he is still under contract and until that contract is done he shouldn't be talking to other employers. Same goes with players. They can't discuss new contracts with other teams till the old one ends. While I get what your saying, its also a wildly accepted practice to allow coaches/assistants, to interview for positions in other organizations that are better then their current one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wings7 62 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 Well if your not gonna buy out franzen why on earth wouldn't you buy out tootoo. I'd say Hollands an idiot if he doesn't buy out tootoo. WUT? You don't buy out Tootoo because he costs nothing and is potentially tradable.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
number9 3,297 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 WUT? You don't buy out Tootoo because he costs nothing and is potentially tradable.... 1,900,000 is far from nothing in the NHL and he's not trade-able. If he was it would have happened already. He can barely crack the Griffins right now. Wouldn't be surprised if his NHL career is done. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marcaractac 3,963 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 WUT? You don't buy out Tootoo because he costs nothing and is potentially tradable.... If he was able to be traded he would have been already. 29 other teams even passed on him for nothing when he had to clear waivers. 1 Internet.Unknown reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wings7 62 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 (edited) 1,900,000 is far from nothing in the NHL and he's not trade-able. If he was it would have happened already. He can barely crack the Griffins right now. Wouldn't be surprised if his NHL career is done. Does it count against the cap if he's in the AHL playing? If he was able to be traded he would have been already. 29 other teams even passed on him for nothing when he had to clear waivers. Also, I still think it has to be Franzen or Howard bought out. But what do I know about buy-outs. Also, I've noticed you just follow me around on here and comment on everything I comment on in a negative/disagreeing way. That's fun for you isn't it? Did you go to any games last year? Any playoff games? Edited April 29, 2014 by wings7 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marcaractac 3,963 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 Does it count against the cap if he's in the AHL playing? Also, I still think it has to be Franzen or Howard bought out. But what do I know about buy-outs. Franzen isn't getting bought out, and Howard's contract was signed after the lockout so the compliance buyout cannot be used on him. If the buyout is used, it will be on Tootoo. It is bad business to pay someone almost 2 million to play in the AHL. Franzen will play, and as frustrating as his cold spells can be, he will put up his usual numbers. As long as he can be reliable backchecking when he is in a scoring funk, his cap hit is not hurting the team. Howard will rebound. It is not uncommon for a goalie to struggle in the first year of signing a big contract. It happens all the time. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ShanahanMan 473 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 (edited) Really sounds like next year will be Babs' last year and they're getting ready to transition him out with Blashill. Edited April 29, 2014 by ShanahanMan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joshy207 156 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 Whatever the reason, I still don't think its right to block someone from bettering their position. His contract says otherwise. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frankgrimes 1,836 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 While I get what your saying, its also a wildly accepted practice to allow coaches/assistants, to interview for positions in other organizations that are better then their current one. Basically yes but Blashill said he wants to coach another season in the AHL and the FO is happy with him. Conversations would then be like this: other GM: Hello Mr. Holland can I please get your permission to talk to your AHL coach ? Holland: Sure thing, number... other GM: Hello Mr. Blashill you've done a great job in the AHL and paid your dues would you like to come up and sign with us ? Blashill: Sorry, I like my job here and don't feel I'm ready. other GM: but b....but This way there is no grey area, Blashill can focus on his AHL job and other teams know he doesn't want to leave, so no reason for granting them permission. In the last years Detroit has been one of the teams, which always allowed others to talk to their FO stuff (McLellan, Yzerman, Nill, MacLean..). So it's not like the Wings are against it, Holland just sees no reason and it seems like Blashill wants to stay where he is so a no brainer. 1 Rivalred reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joshy207 156 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 I don't care if we lose Babcock or not, and I also wouldn't want to resign Legwand for $5M, but there is no way he will be our #4 center anyhow. Whatever, I just think since we gave up a ton (in comparison to others on Trade Day) that Legwand should at least be in the immediate future plans for a couple of seasons...but again, not at $5M. I do not like that they say that hey are going to build the D from within...I do like our kids, but I just think we need a vet or two to bridge the gap while the kids gain experience. BUT, I do feel that Marchenko, Sproul and Ouellet are going good solid players and am excited to see their progress. If they aren't going to bolster their D with better NHL players, then they damn well better convince Howard to waive his NTC because he proved this season that he cannot make the save when needed and needs a BETTER defense in front of him, not a greener one... Damn Holland, you are going to have $20M available and you want to fill you roster full of rookies? Why save the cap Kenny, so you can acquire that player at the deadline? Give us all a break! I think the Wings might have been a little disappointed overall in Legwand... he had some really good games when he first got here and showed some flashes after that, but for the most part, he played his way down to 4th-line wing. I can't see the Wings being excited to bring him back (even after what they gave up to get him) and I can't see him rushing to sign here and play 4th-line minutes again (even though he's a local and had wanted to be here). Had he produced more, I wouldn't have been surprised to hear that the Wings wanted him back... And I agree with you on the D, they really do need a vet for a year or two, someone solid and responsible. I do want to see Sproul, Marchenko, Ouellet, and maybe the other guys, but don't want to have to rely on them just yet. It seems like the organization is talking out of both sides of its mouth... they are going to build from within (so, YOUTH) but they expect to be much better and make a deep run in the playoffs next year. Are they "blaming" the 93-point, 8th place finish and the 5-game first-round elimination on injuries? They were a factor, yes, but this is also a team in decline. Its key players are old, half of its support players were replaced during the season, and it has no budding superstars on the immediate horizon. Yet Holland wants to keep the band together. He won't trade anyone away because he never does, it sounds like he's not going to pursue any free agents of consequence (they might throw off his 2006-based team salary structure)... does he really think everything is just roses? 1 LeftWinger reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Richdg 267 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 Guys it is April 29. Have the RW's even finished there post season reviews yet? Just a hint, don't ever put to much weight in what any GM or coach says publicly this soon after a season. It means nothing. Lets see where things are at say July 15. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FlashyG 1,799 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 It seems like the organization is talking out of both sides of its mouth... they are going to build from within (so, YOUTH) but they expect to be much better and make a deep run in the playoffs next year. Are they "blaming" the 93-point, 8th place finish and the 5-game first-round elimination on injuries? They were a factor, yes, but this is also a team in decline. Its key players are old, half of its support players were replaced during the season, and it has no budding superstars on the immediate horizon. Yet Holland wants to keep the band together. He won't trade anyone away because he never does, it sounds like he's not going to pursue any free agents of consequence (they might throw off his 2006-based team salary structure)... does he really think everything is just roses? The Wings are unquestionably a better team going into next season than they were going into this season and injuries were by far the biggest factor in how this season played out. Out the door are, Cleary, Samuelsson, Bertuzzi, Eaves, Tootoo, Quincey, and from the sound of things Kindl and Andersson aren't far behind Replaced by Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan, Glendening, Jurco, Ouellet, likely either Callahan or Ferraro also upfront and possibly Almquist on D. What free agents of consequence are available? Who exactly are you looking to get rid of? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
derblaueClaus 1,668 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 (edited) "People wan't answers today. I don't have answers today." - Ken Holland Watch it here : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9gq_ESOjzk#t=1110 So I'd take any quotes postet here with a grain of salt. He did say them but Kenny doesn't sound as if he already made up his mind about his moves in the offseason. How could he, our season is just over since a few days. Edited April 29, 2014 by derblaueClaus 1 frankgrimes reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hey man nice shot! 144 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 The Wings are unquestionably a better team going into next season than they were going into this season and injuries were by far the biggest factor in how this season played out. Out the door are, Cleary, Samuelsson, Bertuzzi, Eaves, Tootoo, Quincey, and from the sound of things Kindl and Andersson aren't far behind Replaced by Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan, Glendening, Jurco, Ouellet, likely either Callahan or Ferraro also upfront and possibly Almquist on D. What free agents of consequence are available? Who exactly are you looking to get rid of? We think the wings are gonna look weird, i wonder what blash is thinking of his gr roster next season:) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frankgrimes 1,836 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 (edited) Watch it here : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9gq_ESOjzk#t=1110 So I'd take any quotes postet here with a grain of salt. He did say them but Kenny doesn't sound as if he already made up his mind about his moves in the offseason. How could he, our season is just over since a few days. Seriously this is one - if not the best - end of season interview I've listened from him in a loooong time. Holland wanting to watch even more from Boston is a great thing, a lot of teams can learn a lot from that almost perfect team. You can tell he is pissed but Holland really makes a lot of good points when it comes down to the development of our young guys fans and the media would absolutely label Mrazek a bust if he craps the bed for 10 games..Let the kids develop in the AHL and bring them up, when Blashill and Babcock are saying they are ready. That was my biggest complaint with the Cleary signing the guy blocked a spot for Nyquist. The best example to me is Jake Gardiner, some Leaffans had NORRIS! threads about this kid two years ago and now they want to trade him, no need to put young 20 year olds - non exceptional players - through this kind of crap. I also appreciate his honesty about Weiss, the guy has to hit the gym like crazy maybe even 5 - 6 times a week just to make up for that 18 months span and personally I really don't know what to expect from this guy anymore, so hopefully our FO will keep in touch with him over the summer. It's true the Wings are starting to draft bigger and I absolutely love it but some bigger bodies are needed right now and they are available for cheap, tough fourth line guys are making around 750 - 1.000 k that's nothing compared to average NHL salaries. Don't know but after listening to Babcock, Zetterberg and now even Holland I really believe them getting antsy could lead to a better future. Edited April 29, 2014 by frankgrimes 2 derblaueClaus and Nightfall reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dragonballgtz 273 Report post Posted April 29, 2014 (edited) Watch it here : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9gq_ESOjzk#t=1110 So I'd take any quotes postet here with a grain of salt. He did say them but Kenny doesn't sound as if he already made up his mind about his moves in the offseason. How could he, our season is just over since a few days. LOL!! He went from calm and cool in the beginning to irritated at that part. Funny it came about when he was discussing the trade for Legwand. I understand the wanting multiple 20G scorers, which it more depth. However, the 20G scorers cannot be a bunch of floaters when they are not scoring. Which is the issue with Mule. Holland seem like he doesn't know when to bring up kids at the right time. He wants them in the minors as long as possible but some kids clearly don't belong. EDIT: After watching Babs video, I wonder if the culture of working out hard in the offseason is dying a little in the Wings locker room. Edited April 29, 2014 by dragonballgtz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,963 Report post Posted April 30, 2014 I wouldn't be surprised if the Hawks buy out Hossa this off season...that would be kind of funny this would be awesome! Especially if Holland was able to scoop him back up! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WingsallTheway 383 Report post Posted April 30, 2014 Ken Holland quote August 31st 2014: Ultimately, we kicked some tires but the price was too steep to bring in a free agent RH defenceman. We feel the return of a more experienced Quincey and Kindl solidifies our backend. The return of a healthy pav and Z gives us all we need and franzen tells me he has been resurged. I traded tatar and 2 conditional 1st round picks for the rights to Chris Chelios, but ultimately I did not kick the tires hard enough and we won't be adding his veteran leadership this season. 1 datsyukian_13 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites