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yztheman

Holland interview with Mickey comment about a trade

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You would be wrong. 2007-8 was one long bitchfest, mainly about how the team was too soft to compete in the playoffs. When people weren't bitching about the lack of fighters, there were endless threads about our sucktacular goaltending as Hasek and Osgood fanboys took turns in deriding the other goaltender as an over the hill fruitcake, or as never good enough in the first place. The month of February saw us decimated by injuries, with a 1st pairing of Lilja-Lebda. Nevertheless, the associated slump in results was proof positive for all the Chicken Lickens that the team was not good enough to win the cup. Trade deadline day was an orgy of Holland hate. The announcement of the Stuart trade, coming after the deadline had passed, meant that the outright fury was only quelled down to a sullen, grudging "OK , I guess that'll do", but prior to that not even the Cleary re-signing generated so much HOLLAND YOU SUCK!!!! Being 3-0 up against the Stars and them coming back to 3-2 was further proof positive that this team wasn't good enough to win the cup. Not to mention, we had Eva Unit Zero and his always entertaining mental gymnastics bemoaning the under utilisation of Jiri Hudler, and how Hudler was a better player than Messier etc etc, if only we used Hudler more..... Finally, we had Mindfly. If you weren't here for it, it would be hard for you to understand just how overwhelmingly negative he was. Every loss, every goal against, every shot against, every icing, every lost faceoff was evidence of what a truly terrible team we had, how Holland should be fired, and the whole team traded for prospects and picks. After every loss he would pop up, preaching his gospel of doom and gloom. Thankfully we won a lot that year. I think us winning game 6 in Pittsburgh was probably the worst night of his life. Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk

So basically, not much has changed around these parts ;)

The days of arguing with Eva... oh, how I miss them. I was a rookie back then.

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You would be wrong. 2007-8 was one long bitchfest, mainly about how the team was too soft to compete in the playoffs. When people weren't bitching about the lack of fighters, there were endless threads about our sucktacular goaltending as Hasek and Osgood fanboys took turns in deriding the other goaltender as an over the hill fruitcake, or as never good enough in the first place. The month of February saw us decimated by injuries, with a 1st pairing of Lilja-Lebda. Nevertheless, the associated slump in results was proof positive for all the Chicken Lickens that the team was not good enough to win the cup. Trade deadline day was an orgy of Holland hate. The announcement of the Stuart trade, coming after the deadline had passed, meant that the outright fury was only quelled down to a sullen, grudging "OK , I guess that'll do", but prior to that not even the Cleary re-signing generated so much HOLLAND YOU SUCK!!!! Being 3-0 up against the Stars and them coming back to 3-2 was further proof positive that this team wasn't good enough to win the cup. Not to mention, we had Eva Unit Zero and his always entertaining mental gymnastics bemoaning the under utilisation of Jiri Hudler, and how Hudler was a better player than Messier etc etc, if only we used Hudler more..... Finally, we had Mindfly. If you weren't here for it, it would be hard for you to understand just how overwhelmingly negative he was. Every loss, every goal against, every shot against, every icing, every lost faceoff was evidence of what a truly terrible team we had, how Holland should be fired, and the whole team traded for prospects and picks. After every loss he would pop up, preaching his gospel of doom and gloom. Thankfully we won a lot that year. I think us winning game 6 in Pittsburgh was probably the worst night of his life. Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk

I'm not buying it. The team won the President's trophy, pretty solidly coasted through the playoffs (after netting Hasek out of the next), and was never in any real trouble at any point in the season.

There's also a little bit of a logical fallacy involved in generalizing from two extreme points of view. Basically you're saying Holland was criticized heavily in 2008, but your proof is 1) People were ok with the Stuart trade after temporarily being worried, and B) Two dummies with dummy points of view.

I'm not convinced.

Edited by kipwinger

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Not to mention, we had Eva Unit Zero and his always entertaining mental gymnastics bemoaning the under utilisation of Jiri Hudler, and how Hudler was a better player than Messier etc etc, if only we used Hudler more.....

lol classic

I'm not buying it. The team won the President's trophy, pretty solidly coasted through the playoffs (after netting Hasek out of the next), and was never in any real trouble at any point in the season.

There's also a little bit of a logical fallacy involved in generalizing from two extreme points of view. Basically you're saying Holland was criticized heavily in 2008, but your proof is 1) People were ok with the Stuart trade after temporarily being worried, and B) Two dummies with dummy points of view.

I'm not convinced.

Its LGW. We always find things to ***** about and logic doesn't matter.

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lol classic

Its LGW. We always find things to ***** about and logic doesn't matter.

I'll take you guys' word for it. I'm just skeptical because I've never seen any fan, anywhere, ever, who wasn't a raging dick about their team when said team has the best record in the league. Walk into any bar next Sunday, and the cockiest, most arrogant, most obnoxious a-hole in the place will be the one with the best team in the league. As much as I'd like to think we're different I don't believe we are. Maybe. But it's hard to believe.

I just assumed all this "Pavel Datsyuk is magic" and "Mike Babcock is a the world's best coach", etc. started in 2008. The fact that it all came along since then is actually kinda funny. And sad.

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I'll take you guys' word for it. I'm just skeptical because I've never seen any fan, anywhere, ever, who wasn't a raging dick about their team when said team has the best record in the league. Walk into any bar next Sunday, and the cockiest, most arrogant, most obnoxious a-hole in the place will be the one with the best team in the league. As much as I'd like to think we're different I don't believe we are. Maybe. But it's hard to believe.

I just assumed all this "Pavel Datsyuk is magic" and "Mike Babcock is a the world's best coach", etc. started in 2008. The fact that it all came along since then is actually kinda funny. And sad.

No, Mindfly really was that bad. Seriously.

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You would be wrong. 2007-8 was one long bitchfest, mainly about how the team was too soft to compete in the playoffs. When people weren't bitching about the lack of fighters, there were endless threads about our sucktacular goaltending as Hasek and Osgood fanboys took turns in deriding the other goaltender as an over the hill fruitcake, or as never good enough in the first place.The month of February saw us decimated by injuries, with a 1st pairing of Lilja-Lebda. Nevertheless, the associated slump in results was proof positive for all the Chicken Lickens that the team was not good enough to win the cup.Trade deadline day was an orgy of Holland hate. The announcement of the Stuart trade, coming after the deadline had passed, meant that the outright fury was only quelled down to a sullen, grudging "OK , I guess that'll do", but prior to that not even the Cleary re-signing generated so much HOLLAND YOU SUCK!!!!Being 3-0 up against the Stars and them coming back to 3-2 was further proof positive that this team wasn't good enough to win the cup.Not to mention, we had Eva Unit Zero and his always entertaining mental gymnastics bemoaning the under utilisation of Jiri Hudler, and how Hudler was a better player than Messier etc etc, if only we used Hudler more.....Finally, we had Mindfly. If you weren't here for it, it would be hard for you to understand just how overwhelmingly negative he was. Every loss, every goal against, every shot against, every icing, every lost faceoff was evidence of what a truly terrible team we had, how Holland should be fired, and the whole team traded for prospects and picks. After every loss he would pop up, preaching his gospel of doom and gloom. Thankfully we won a lot that year. I think us winning game 6 in Pittsburgh was probably the worst night of his life.Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk

:lol:

I lurked back then, and would always stop by after a loss to hear what Mindfly had to say for a laugh.

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You would be wrong. 2007-8 was one long bitchfest, mainly about how the team was too soft to compete in the playoffs. When people weren't bitching about the lack of fighters, there were endless threads about our sucktacular goaltending as Hasek and Osgood fanboys took turns in deriding the other goaltender as an over the hill fruitcake, or as never good enough in the first place. The month of February saw us decimated by injuries, with a 1st pairing of Lilja-Lebda. Nevertheless, the associated slump in results was proof positive for all the Chicken Lickens that the team was not good enough to win the cup. Trade deadline day was an orgy of Holland hate. The announcement of the Stuart trade, coming after the deadline had passed, meant that the outright fury was only quelled down to a sullen, grudging "OK , I guess that'll do", but prior to that not even the Cleary re-signing generated so much HOLLAND YOU SUCK!!!! Being 3-0 up against the Stars and them coming back to 3-2 was further proof positive that this team wasn't good enough to win the cup. Not to mention, we had Eva Unit Zero and his always entertaining mental gymnastics bemoaning the under utilisation of Jiri Hudler, and how Hudler was a better player than Messier etc etc, if only we used Hudler more..... Finally, we had Mindfly. If you weren't here for it, it would be hard for you to understand just how overwhelmingly negative he was. Every loss, every goal against, every shot against, every icing, every lost faceoff was evidence of what a truly terrible team we had, how Holland should be fired, and the whole team traded for prospects and picks. After every loss he would pop up, preaching his gospel of doom and gloom. Thankfully we won a lot that year. I think us winning game 6 in Pittsburgh was probably the worst night of his life. Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk

Great memories lol

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I'll take you guys' word for it. I'm just skeptical because I've never seen any fan, anywhere, ever, who wasn't a raging dick about their team when said team has the best record in the league. Walk into any bar next Sunday, and the cockiest, most arrogant, most obnoxious a-hole in the place will be the one with the best team in the league. As much as I'd like to think we're different I don't believe we are. Maybe. But it's hard to believe.

I just assumed all this "Pavel Datsyuk is magic" and "Mike Babcock is a the world's best coach", etc. started in 2008. The fact that it all came along since then is actually kinda funny. And sad.

A lot of us were definitely thinking those things during 2008 and before, and also being raging dicks about it to our friends in different states, but there's always people who freak out at the smallest things, ie goalie controversy, wings aren't tough enough to last four rounds in the playoffs, too many soft, skilled Euros, the refs and Bettman will do whatever it takes to keep the Wings from winning, Holland didn't make a big move at the deadline and the Pens/Chicago and yadda yadda got whoever which puts them over the top, the Wings are too old, blah blah blah blah. Those voices were and probably still are the minority, but they're also definitely the loudest.

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A lot of us were definitely thinking those things during 2008 and before, and also being raging dicks about it to our friends in different states, but there's always people who freak out at the smallest things, ie goalie controversy, wings aren't tough enough to last four rounds in the playoffs, too many soft, skilled Euros, the refs and Bettman will do whatever it takes to keep the Wings from winning, Holland didn't make a big move at the deadline and the Pens/Chicago and yadda yadda got whoever which puts them over the top, the Wings are too old, blah blah blah blah. Those voices were and probably still are the minority, but they're also definitely the loudest.

Well it's a good thing we don't have anyone like that now.

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You would be wrong. 2007-8 was one long bitchfest, mainly about how the team was too soft to compete in the playoffs. When people weren't bitching about the lack of fighters, there were endless threads about our sucktacular goaltending as Hasek and Osgood fanboys took turns in deriding the other goaltender as an over the hill fruitcake, or as never good enough in the first place. The month of February saw us decimated by injuries, with a 1st pairing of Lilja-Lebda. Nevertheless, the associated slump in results was proof positive for all the Chicken Lickens that the team was not good enough to win the cup. Trade deadline day was an orgy of Holland hate. The announcement of the Stuart trade, coming after the deadline had passed, meant that the outright fury was only quelled down to a sullen, grudging "OK , I guess that'll do", but prior to that not even the Cleary re-signing generated so much HOLLAND YOU SUCK!!!! Being 3-0 up against the Stars and them coming back to 3-2 was further proof positive that this team wasn't good enough to win the cup. Not to mention, we had Eva Unit Zero and his always entertaining mental gymnastics bemoaning the under utilisation of Jiri Hudler, and how Hudler was a better player than Messier etc etc, if only we used Hudler more..... Finally, we had Mindfly. If you weren't here for it, it would be hard for you to understand just how overwhelmingly negative he was. Every loss, every goal against, every shot against, every icing, every lost faceoff was evidence of what a truly terrible team we had, how Holland should be fired, and the whole team traded for prospects and picks. After every loss he would pop up, preaching his gospel of doom and gloom. Thankfully we won a lot that year. I think us winning game 6 in Pittsburgh was probably the worst night of his life. Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk

But Hasek did prove himself to be an over the hill fruitcake by the end of it, though one who went out in truly classy fashion given the demotion. That was the best year for goalie arguments. I ended so many arguments defending Osgood that year and the next with "get back to me in June" and man, that really worked out well for me down the stretch.

But man, Mindfly, man...I forgot about that guy, but as soon as I read the name, it was like a dark cloud crept up over my head.

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So basically, not much has changed around these parts ;)

The days of arguing with Eva... oh, how I miss them. I was a rookie back then.

I miss Eva, and his arguments that Kronwall was better than Housley based upon the number of 17th place Norris votes that he received or somesuch :D. Every now and then he would pull out a brilliantly sane and lucid argument though. He had Aspergers, so I was willing to cut him a lot of slack.

Mindfly I don't miss at all.

Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk

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Haven't been here long enough, so I don't know anything about these guys but personally I never get too attached to arguments on a forum. I don't care if others think that I'm a debbie downer or whatever, I always try to keep a realistic approach, if others prefer to take the more optimistic thing that's fine also.

I mean after all, the forum would be pretty boring and low activity if everyone agreed with everyone right ? I've been on such a forum for 1 month (mods kicked everyone, who didn't share their view of not only hockey but also other non hockey stuff) and the funniest part was those so called "mods" where all from hockey-teams which existed for less than 9 years ! so basically plastic clubs.

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I miss Eva, and his arguments that Kronwall was better than Housley based upon the number of 17th place Norris votes that he received or somesuch :D. Every now and then he would pull out a brilliantly sane and lucid argument though. He had Aspergers, so I was willing to cut him a lot of slack. Mindfly I don't miss at all. Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk

Wasn't Eva the Hudler lover? maybe you'll find him/her on the Flames board.

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Haven't been here long enough, so I don't know anything about these guys but personally I never get too attached to arguments on a forum. I don't care if others think that I'm a debbie downer or whatever, I always try to keep a realistic approach, if others prefer to take the more optimistic thing that's fine also.

I mean after all, the forum would be pretty boring and low activity if everyone agreed with everyone right ? I've been on such a forum for 1 month (mods kicked everyone, who didn't share their view of not only hockey but also other non hockey stuff) and the funniest part was those so called "mods" where all from hockey-teams which existed for less than 9 years ! so basically plastic clubs.

Your approach is the realistic one, others are just optimists. Rightttttt

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Eva was a legend. I miss his super serious font, especially in the context of super serious font telling me Hudler can put up 70 points playing with Datsyuk. It brought even more seriousness to his serious statistical analyses.

Edited by Echolalia

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Eva was a legend. I miss his super serious font, especially in the context of super serious font telling me Hudler can put up 70 points playing with Datsyuk. It brought even more seriousness to his serious statistical analyses.

I'm just happy to not have the constant temptation to play classic Nintendo and Mario Bros...

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Eva was a legend. I miss his super serious font, especially in the context of super serious font telling me Hudler can put up 70 points playing with Datsyuk. It brought even more seriousness to his serious statistical analyses.

Aha I forgot about his font.

You know who I miss a ton? Crymson. I think he disappeared when this last bunch of knuckle heads rolled in. That guy was my daily Xanax bar. Come back Crym!

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I've been thinking for a while, because of the cap, Holland is going to have to trade Kindl and Jurco. Nyquist and Smith are RFA's after this season. Base on what Tatar and DeKeyser got, we need $5 Million cap space to sign them.

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Aha I forgot about his font.

You know who I miss a ton? Crymson. I think he disappeared when this last bunch of knuckle heads rolled in. That guy was my daily Xanax bar. Come back Crym!

He'll be back by next week at the latest, he cant stay away.

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I've been thinking for a while, because of the cap, Holland is going to have to trade Kindl and Jurco. Nyquist and Smith are RFA's after this season. Base on what Tatar and DeKeyser got, we need $5 Million cap space to sign them.

We all said the same thing last season and the season before "logjam! They have to trade!" Never happened. Not getting my hopes up.

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I've been thinking for a while, because of the cap, Holland is going to have to trade Kindl and Jurco. Nyquist and Smith are RFA's after this season. Base on what Tatar and DeKeyser got, we need $5 Million cap space to sign them.

Trading Jurco makes no sense based on salary and even less sense based on potential.

Lot’s of deadweight can be cut to make room for Nyquist and Smith.

In fact, since we’re talking trades, there’s as good a chance as any that Smith would get dealt before Jurco.

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I've been thinking for a while, because of the cap, Holland is going to have to trade Kindl and Jurco. Nyquist and Smith are RFA's after this season. Base on what Tatar and DeKeyser got, we need $5 Million cap space to sign them.

When it comes to Jurco, not playing him in the NHL this year could be a strategy so when his RFA status comes up he gets paid Nyquist money (950,000) opposed to Tatar money (2,750,000). I hope not, but its not impossible.

Next year Cleary and Gustavsson come off the books and they can easily dump off Anderson or Lashoff, or trade Kindl which I think they will do at some point.

Then when you take into consideration the cap going up, they should be okay. Though I credit your line of thinking, this is exactly why I am happy Holland didnt sign any mediocre free agents to big money. Too many people fail to look forward at the big picture, and rather look at the here and now.

Secondly, to those saying Holland has a bad track record when it comes to trades, here is a link to every trade he has ever made. I don't see a single BAD trade in the last 10 years. Pretty much every pick/prospect he has traded away in the last 10 years has done nothing.

http://www.nhltradetracker.com/user/trade_list_by_team/Detroit_Red_Wings/1

Edited by kliq

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Aha I forgot about his font.

You know who I miss a ton? Crymson. I think he disappeared when this last bunch of knuckle heads rolled in. That guy was my daily Xanax bar. Come back Crym!

He still posts on HFboards, but he's changed. Whereas he was Hollands biggest defender, he is now Hollands biggest critic. He's like a jilted lover - all the energy and aggression he poured into defending Holland is now directed at attacking Holland.

Wasn't Eva the Hudler lover? maybe you'll find him/her on the Flames board.

Yes he was. He also had a completely irrational hatred of Mark Messier that I never managed to get to the bottom of.

Haven't been here long enough, so I don't know anything about these guys but personally I never get too attached to arguments on a forum. I don't care if others think that I'm a debbie downer or whatever, I always try to keep a realistic approach, if others prefer to take the more optimistic thing that's fine also.

I mean after all, the forum would be pretty boring and low activity if everyone agreed with everyone right ? I've been on such a forum for 1 month (mods kicked everyone, who didn't share their view of not only hockey but also other non hockey stuff) and the funniest part was those so called "mods" where all from hockey-teams which existed for less than 9 years ! so basically plastic clubs.

You'd have loved it Grimey, endless threads on why the Wings aren't tough enough and need more fighters. Huge, long, threads with the same posters going round and round arguing the same points with all posters identified as pro or anti-fighting (except we were never anti fighting, we were anti-goons who contribute nothing else, but that was always ignored). Cheerleader in chief for the pro-fighting camp was the delightfully named E.S.A.D. who regarded himself as a balanced and tolerant poster, and would always preface his attacks on the anti-fighters with something like "I know you guys can't help it, you're all euro pinko commie homo veggies, and its not your fault that you lack the intelligence to appreciate my argument, I really do understand that" and thought that made him a fair guy who saw both sides of the argument :D Anyone who disagreed with him had clearly never worn skates or been to a game ;)

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