Franzen on IR

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Not bored. Our record this season was a lot worse when Franzen wasn't playing. And when was the last time a RW of his caliber had his career ended early due to injury? Fischer?

The guy pretty much got us a cup in 2008, and almost another one in 2009

What was their record with Franzen vs. without?

Obviously directed at me.

My opinion on Franzen, though unpopular, is well documented in this thread and throughout the Franzen arguments on this forum.

If he's done I think 93 should be off limits for at least a while, and I thought the same with number 2 at the time.

In this thread alone you've said Franzen is done forever, then later said anyone who thought he was done was 100% jumping to conclusions. So your thoughts on Franzen can be difficult to track.

[number9 3,297]

What was the record with Franzen vs. without?

In this thread alone you've said Franzen is done forever, then later said anyone who thought he was done was 100% jumping to conclusions. So your thoughts on Franzen can be difficult to track.

17-16 with

27-22 without

My bad on forgetting the games he missed in October and our last hurrah right after he went down. The skid began 8-12 games after we lost him. Obviously his loss is not the sole reason for the skid, but his pts, streaky or not, probably could have won us a few extra games during a stretch when no one else could get it done.

I jumped to a conclusion without thinking and then realized the error I committed. But what does my take on his injury have to do with liking him as a player? I've made it pretty clear for a few years now that I'm one of Franzen's staunchest supporters. I thought you'd know since you've scrubbed some of my posts about him.

And now you've successfully steered the conversation away from my original posts about him being a good RW in his time (as many have stated) and 93 possibly being off limits, which you called baiting. Congrats

Edited April 16, 2015 by number9

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

17-16 with

27-22 without

My bad on forgetting the games he missed in October and our last hurrah right after he went down. The skid began 8-12 games after we lost him. Obviously his loss is not the sole reason for the skid, but his pts, streaky or not, probably could have won us a few extra games during a stretch when no one else could get it done.

I jumped to a conclusion without thinking and then realized the error I committed. But what does my take on his injury have to do with liking him as a player?

And now you've successfully steered the conversation away from my original posts about him being a good RW in his time (as many have stated) and 93 possibly being off limits, which you called baiting. Congrats

Your original posts claimed that once Franzen got injured everything fell apart. I didn't steer the conversation anywhere.

As you've now shown, their winning percentage is actually better without him. You're usually pretty sharp on those kinds of details. Innocent mistake I guess.

[number9 3,297]

Your original posts claimed that once Franzen got injured everything fell apart. I didn't steer the conversation anywhere.

As you've now shown, their winning percentage is actually better without him. You're usually pretty sharp on those kinds of details. Innocent mistake I guess.

Yup, and I owned up to that mistake immediately and corrected myself.

Yet instead of simply correcting me, you accused me of baiting and then commented on my opinion of Franzen.

If you want to talk Franzen, shoot. If you want to talk about the nature of my posts, take it to pm. Don't accuse me of trolling and then feign ignorance about my stance on Franzen.

Edited April 16, 2015 by number9

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Yup, and I owned up to that mistake immediately and corrected myself.

Yet instead of simply correcting me, you accused me of baiting and then commented on my opinion of Franzen.

If you want to talk Franzen, shoot. If you want to talk about the nature of my posts, take it to pm. Don't accuse me of trolling and then feign ignorance about my stance on Franzen.

No feigning ignorance here. It just seemed unlike you to make such a mistake regarding Franzen's contributions as you're one of the more knowledgable members here regarding hockey.

My comment about you saying Franzen was done, then contradicting yourself on the next page was merely to elaborate on why your thoughts on Franzen may not be as clear as you think.

If you'd like to discuss further you're more than welcome to PM myself or any of the other mods. Because I agree, we should get back on topic.

[themcityblues 249]

Franzen sucked for a long time, but right before he got injured, he was actually pretty valuable. 'Tis a shame.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Please folks, let's get back on topic.

I wouldn't want to have to suspend anyone for something as silly as not following a simple instruction.

[number9 3,297]

Franzens injury sucks. I'm sure he wishes he could think hockey, but his brain just keeps scrubbing all of his thoughts. I guess concussed brains have to do it in order to protect themselves. Oh well. Best of luck going forward Johan Franzen.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Can Mlive not afford a decent microphone?

Video clip of Franzen talking about his concussion symptoms. When one reporter asks if it's scary since it was his third or fourth concussion, Franzen responds "I've had a few more than that."

Has he really? If he's really up to 6 or 7 concussions, it's definitely time to call it a career.

http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/2015/04/latest_concussion_makes_red_wi.html

[gcom007 1,465]

Can Mlive not afford a decent microphone?

Video clip of Franzen talking about his concussion symptoms. When one reporter asks if it's scary since it was his third or fourth concussion, Franzen responds "I've had a few more than that."

Has he really? If he's really up to 6 or 7 concussions, it's definitely time to call it a career.

http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/2015/04/latest_concussion_makes_red_wi.html

Rough. And from what I remember from earlier in the thread, it was suggested that this was his 10th concussion. No matter what anyone thinks of him as a player, it's impossible not to feel for him as a person. I, luckily, can't even imagine how hard this must be on him. Given how bad this one seems to have been and how many he's had, you really wonder if it wouldn't be best for him to hang them up. I'd honestly be fine with him coming back, and generally have had no agenda against him, but I wouldn't blame him at all for riding off into a Pronger-esque retirement. There are things more important than hockey. If one could guarantee that he'd never get another concussion, it'd be one thing, but that's simply not possible, and there are bigger things in life than hockey.

Edited April 16, 2015 by gcom007

[kliq 3,755]

Rough. And from what I remember from earlier in the thread, it was suggested that this was his 10th concussion. No matter what anyone thinks of him as a player, it's impossible not to feel for him as a person. I, luckily, can't even imagine how hard this must be on him. Given how bad this one seems to have been and how many he's had, you really wonder if it wouldn't be best for him to hang them up. I'd honestly be fine with him coming back, and generally have had no agenda against him, but I wouldn't blame him at all for riding off into a Pronger-esque retirement. There are things more important than hockey. If one could guarantee that he'd never get another concussion, it'd be one thing, but that's simply not possible, and there are bigger things in life than hockey.

Also, with every concussion you get you become more prone to getting more concussions. If he does come back, I'd say its almost a sure thing that at some point it would happen again.

Given what has happened to him, it just pisses me off more that Gary Roberts took that cowardly cheap shot back at him back in the finals. Not saying that caused all this, but it definitely added to it.

To help prevent these kinds of things from happening in the future, the NHL needs to take a zero tolerance policy on cheap shots to the head. Fighting is one thing, and while I think that should stop as well for the health of the players, at least in a fight you have 2 guys engaging. No player deserves to get a random punch to the temple or jaw.

For those who don't remember:

[Jersey Wing 1,521]

Here's the link to a story today on Deadspin that talks about a lot of what is being said, not being able to play with his kids, having to take a nap each afternoon or he has a debilitating headache the rest of the day...

http://deadspin.com/johan-franzens-brain-is-not-healthy-1698244079

[MTU_Huskies963 398]

The league talks so much BS when it comes to concussions. If they really cared about head injuries they would suspend players when they remove a players helmet and slam their head into the boards. Or hey how about when a player gets suckered punch and has to sit because of it. The league also does nothing to protect these players coming back from concussions. How many times was Franzen's head targeted when he returned from previous concussions. Some of them were just blatant cheap shots, like the first example. I mean come on a guy has concussion history, an opponent removes his helmet on purpose, and rams him into the boards. Stuff like that should be a heavy suspension.

Edited April 16, 2015 by MTU_Huskies963

[Jesusberg 1,256]

The league talks so much BS when it comes to concussions. If they really cared about head injuries they would suspend players when they remove a players helmet and slam their head into the boards. Or hey how about when a player gets suckered punch and has to sit because of it. The league also does nothing to protect these players coming back from concussions. How many times was Franzen's head targeted when he returned from previous concussions. Some of them were just blatant cheap shots, like the first example. I mean come on a guy has concussion history, an opponent removes his helmet on purpose, and rams him into the boards. Stuff like that should be a heavy suspension.

Wouldn't that be a little counterproductive?

[GoWings! 179]

I'm not big on Franzen floating and not going all out but I really can't blame him if he has it this bad. I wish him the best regardless. He was the man in 08, 09. Won't forget that and his beast mode to help us get the Cup.

[kickazz 5,459]

Here's the link to a story today on Deadspin that talks about a lot of what is being said, not being able to play with his kids, having to take a nap each afternoon or he has a debilitating headache the rest of the day...

http://deadspin.com/johan-franzens-brain-is-not-healthy-1698244079

Apparently people didn't understand when I said that additive concussions isn't good for your health. These are typical symptoms he's showing. Any TBI isn't good for you and to have it 6+ times is a text book prediction that you wont make it far if you keep pushing yourself. What worries me more is his prognonsis in 10-20 years. Just because he stopped playing hockey doesn't mean the damage done wont be detrimental in the future. I'm hoping it works out for him and his family. He's a good guy that just had some bad luck. Edited April 16, 2015 by kickazz

[kliq 3,755]

The guy needs to retire. Not because it helps us with the cap, not because he isnt the same player, not because he floats around. He needs to retire because enjoying the next 60 years of his life is more important then a game.

I wish him the best, nobody deserves this. Just sucks.

[Jesusberg 1,256]

The guy needs to retire. Not because it helps us with the cap, not because he isnt the same player, not because he floats around. He needs to retire because enjoying the next 60 years of his life is more important then a game.

I wish him the best, nobody deserves this. Just sucks.

This is pretty much as spot-on as it gets with this situation.

[amato 3,210]

"@AnsarKhanMLive: Franzen also skating with team but admitted two days ago it's the longest of long shots that he's back this year."

I'm sure it's minimal but it's probably a positive sign, at least for his future health, that he can at least skate a little..

[kipwinger 8,524]

What the heck happened here? Pm anyone?

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

What the heck happened here? Pm anyone?

I thought what you posted warranted it's own thread, so I split those posts out into their own thread here:

http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/topic/77429-carcillo-speaks-out-on-montadors-death-and-mental-health-issues/

[amato 3,210]

Franzen:

“I feel a lot better. I was in a really dark place maybe not the first month because you think it’s going to get better. But then when it doesn’t get better, you start wondering.”

“Certainly the message the last month was he wanted to play,” said Red Wings’ GM Ken Holland. “He told us a couple weeks ago he felt great and was on the right path. If we advanced in the playoffs he was hoping he’d be available. Then he had a bit of a setback.

“People with concussions it’s hard to know, but the hope is over the summer he gets 100 percent healthy.”

As for his future in the game, both Franzen and Holland are unsure if the Wings’ forward will play again.

“I don’t think anybody knows,” Holland said. “When you’re dealing with people that have concussions and he’s (had) a bit of a history. That’s a decision that’ll be determined between Mule and Dr. (Jeffrey) Kutcher.”

Added Franzen: “I have no clue, but I’m just happy I’m feeling better. Hopefully, it’s going to progress a little bit every week and I will be fine.”

Poor guy, glad to hear he's doing better.

The article also mentions that he'll likely stay on LTIR if he decides to stop playing.

As mentioned before, I hope he hangs them up just for his long term health and his children's sake

http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2015/05/07/wings-franzen-has-no-clue-if-hell-return-to-playing/

[Richdg 267]

This is something that the various PA's need to address. Come up with a mandatory max number a player can have before being forced to retire. Sometimes with the money involved players have to be protected from themselves.

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

This is something that the various PA's need to address. Come up with a mandatory max number a player can have before being forced to retire. Sometimes with the money involved players have to be protected from themselves.

Not sure that would be a good idea. Players that didn't want to retire would just lie about having concussions. Also, it would be to hard to come up with a number since concussions have different levels of severity and are hard to measure. I also think they should have control of when they want to stop. They have doctor's advising them on their health.

Some kind of concussion relief fund would be good, though. For Franzen's case, he would still get paid, right, if he went on LTIR.

[Richdg 267]

Not sure that would be a good idea. Players that didn't want to retire would just lie about having concussions. Also, it would be to hard to come up with a number since concussions have different levels of severity and are hard to measure. I also think they should have control of when they want to stop. They have doctor's advising them on their health.

Some kind of concussion relief fund would be good, though. For Franzen's case, he would still get paid, right, if he went on LTIR.

Big can of worms yes..... Then don't sue......