Be honest..

[chaps80 1,591]

40 minutes ago, shocky2002 said:

 

I bet you think steroids= get big. Lol. 

No, they equal "muscles" full of water and a shriveled sack. 

[shocky2002 36]

38 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

No, they equal "muscles" full of water and a shriveled sack. 

injury healing is the #1 objective

 

[LeftWinger 5,129]

I guess it's speculation since I don't know fact, but saying Todd wasn't on them is like saying Pudge wasn't either...somehow they both got emmensely smaller and worse after an incident and (in pudges case) rule changes. They both were half the athletes they used to be. Of course, they weren't the only ones in their respective sports, so it's not like they were bad people, they were doing what they were allowed to. 

[DickieDunn 2,571]

Pudge was no question. Bert changed after he ended a guy's career, no reason to think he was juicing. Chelios on the other hand, you'd have a hard time convincing me he wasn't on something.

[kliq 3,763]

Bertuzzi was a power forward that had a crap load of injuries.I think a combination of the Moore incident, injuries, and getting older led to his decline. Physically, Mentally, and production wise.

I would not argue for anyone in baseball, I think most of the players in the 90's were on something. 

[kliq 3,763]

7 hours ago, F.Michael said:

There's this international competition that takes place every few years...Lots of media, and hype...The NHL has been a part of it since 1998...It's called the Olympics...Maybe you've heard of it?

Ignore the troll, he's trying to get a reaction out of people. In addition to that, the NHL does drug test each player twice a year.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

Ignore the troll, he's trying to get a reaction out of people. In addition to that, the NHL does drug test each player twice a year.

we both have a different approach on how to fix this team but I fully agree with you it's really too bad that the ignore option doesn't work with tapatalk on Android and BlackBerry.

[kliq 3,763]

6 hours ago, frankgrimes said:

 

we both have a different approach on how to fix this team but I fully agree with you it's really too bad that the ignore option doesn't work with tapatalk on Android and BlackBerry.

Completely agree. There is a way to debate your point, as at the end of the day this is a discussion board where we all share our opinions, but some people are just trolling and trying to piss people off.

[blgillett 48]

Neither one no way I want to not make play off for 8 years I hate to miss one it got to be some where in the middle a couple years to miss playoffs we can handle as long as it gives us a shot at the cup. The wings in the past has been able to rebuild on the run but that's with great coaching I'm not sure we in that position right now Blashhill a good coach just not great at least yet

[greenrebellion 415]

Might honestly be time for a GM change.  I've been a Holland supporter but this team needs a fresh start from top to bottom and it starts with putting everyone on this roster on the trade block.  Given Holland's track record in the trade department (or lack thereof), we really need to move in a different direction.  

I don't blame Holland for the Wings lack of success this season, its merely a function of being at the top for so long.  But at this point, I'd say the odds of making the playoffs this season are near zero and I'd hate to have us stand pat and hang on to all of our players in the off chance that some miracle happens.

[kliq 3,763]

18 minutes ago, greenrebellion said:

Might honestly be time for a GM change.  I've been a Holland supporter but this team needs a fresh start from top to bottom and it starts with putting everyone on this roster on the trade block.  Given Holland's track record in the trade department (or lack thereof), we really need to move in a different direction.  

I don't blame Holland for the Wings lack of success this season, its merely a function of being at the top for so long.  But at this point, I'd say the odds of making the playoffs this season are near zero and I'd hate to have us stand pat and hang on to all of our players in the off chance that some miracle happens.

I'm not by any means going to argue that our team is great, but how do you come up with this when we are 2 points out?

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

Guys, anything can happen in the playoffs...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

This team has ZERO top end talent. You look around the league and even most basement teams have 1 elite player. We have none. A team comprised of 2/3rd line forwards. 2/3rd pairing Dmen. And average goaltening. We are loaded to the brim with mediocrity 

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

2 minutes ago, F.Michael said:

Exactly...Which is why I think this will be the 1st of 3 - maybe 4 seasons in a row of not making the playoffs.

 

 

Its not fun to watch, but it may get us to the playoffs still. i guess thats the fear for some ppl whod rather draft high. 

I just wanna watch good hockey, but at this point ill take any hockey my b**** wife lets me see

[chaps80 1,591]

25 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Guys, anything can happen in the playoffs...

I have a feeling your being sarcastic, but since the loss in the Finals in 2009, all that's happened is first and second round losses.

2009-Lost in Finals 4-3 to Pittsburgh after going up 2-0

2010-Lost Round 2 to San Jose 4-1

2011-Lost in Round 2 to San Jose 4-3 after going up 3-1

2012-Lost in Round 1 to Nashville 4-1

2013-Lost in Round 2 to Chicago 4-3 after going up 3-1 

2014-Lost in Round 1 to Boston 4-1

2015-Lost in Round 1 to Tampa 4-3

2016-Lost in Round 1 to Tampa 4-1

Sad.

[Buppy 1,720]

1 minute ago, chaps80 said:

...

2011-Lost in Round 2 to San Jose 4-3 after going up 3-1

...

We were down 0-3 in that series.

And yeah, sarcastic.

Also, half the league hasn't been past the 2nd round either. Some haven't been past the first, or even to the first.

[greenrebellion 415]

On 12/12/2016 at 6:29 PM, kliq said:

I'm not by any means going to argue that our team is great, but how do you come up with this when we are 2 points out?

By watching the games?  I've watched the Wings for 25 years and I've watched every game this season.  They overperformed their actual performance early in the season and they aren't nearly as good as their record reflects.  I don't care how many points out of the playoffs they are right now, this team will not make it.  

[kliq 3,763]

2 hours ago, greenrebellion said:

By watching the games?  I've watched the Wings for 25 years and I've watched every game this season.  They overperformed their actual performance early in the season and they aren't nearly as good as their record reflects.  I don't care how many points out of the playoffs they are right now, this team will not make it.  

Sorry but I don't buy it. I cannot agree with the notion that the Wings have a 0% chance of making the playoffs when they are only 2 points out.

You want to make the debate "Will the Wings make the playoffs or not", different story. But when the debate is do they have a 0% shot, I'm sorry but that's just hyperbole. I'm not trying to sit here and say that they are playing great or even good, I just came from the game tonight and that was one of the worst games I ever went to, but to act like you 100% know the future is just wrong. In the grand scheme of things, alot of things can happen between now and playoff time. Do I think they will make the playoffs if nothing changes...no. Do I think something will change...yes. The question is does whatever change they make cause an impact.

Edited December 14, 2016 by kliq

[kliq 3,763]

On 12/12/2016 at 6:40 PM, F.Michael said:

To me - 2 pts out seems alot considering how this team has performed thus far this season.

I honestly feel some changes are needed.

I actually look at that the other way. We are only 2 points out with as bad as we have been playing at times, if we get our s*** together, you would think we would rise in the standings, not drop.

I do agree that some changes are needed.

[chaps80 1,591]

On December 12, 2016 at 7:40 PM, Buppy said:

We were down 0-3 in that series.

And yeah, sarcastic.

Also, half the league hasn't been past the 2nd round either. Some haven't been past the first, or even to the first.

Ahh yeah, screwed that one up.

Whatever the rest of the league does doesn't really matter. This team has been going nowhere by striving to make the playoffs and bowing out first round in four of the five past seasons, and in three of those four in 5 games, instead of letting The Streak go and commit to a rebuild. This rebuild on the fly has done nothing. It's had the opposite effect of it's intention. This team is in bad shape.

[kliq 3,763]

11 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

Ahh yeah, screwed that one up.

Whatever the rest of the league does doesn't really matter. This team has been going nowhere by striving to make the playoffs and bowing out first round in four of the five past seasons, and in three of those four in 5 games, instead of letting The Streak go and commit to a rebuild. This rebuild on the fly has done nothing. It's had the opposite effect of it's intention. This team is in bad shape.

This team needs to get better, but the whole "we can't get out of the first round argument" is looking at it the wrong way. We are not a team that is great in the regular season that struggles in the playoffs, we are a team that needs to improve overall and for that to happen our young players need to get to the next level.

This is nothing against you chaps, this is something that is said all the time. The reason why we struggle to get out of the first round is because since Lidstrom left we are ALWAYS the lower seed playing a contender. We shouldn't beat TB or Boston in the first round. The fact that we took TB to gm.7 a couple years ago just shows you how well coached this team was. For us to do anything right now we need all of our players to be playing their best hockey which is not even close to happening. 

[romagoth 47]

What this team really needs is a culture change. Everything with the Wings has become about the process, doing things the right way, a 200 foot game, and of course the playoff streak.

I don't see a hunger from this team to want to win or even compete sometimes. It appears that Blashill has lost the team, and with the absurd moves made by Holland since Lids retired...we need a change from the top down.

[DickieDunn 2,571]

I'm so tired of the "we're only two points out" argument.  That's artificially jamming teams together thanks to the parity point.  Buffalo and Toronto are dead last, only 6 points from 3rd in the division, 2 points behind Detroit both with 2 games in hand on Detroit.  The Wings are 4 points out of 3rd place in the division after tonight.  They're closer to the bottom than the playoffs.

Go ahead and keep wearing those rose colored glasses and tell yourselves that everything is going to be OK.  Just don't be shocked when they miss the playoffs, sign Vanek and Sheahan to extensions, and keep Holland and Trashill for another year because "they only missed the playoffs by a few points," just like almost every other team that missed them.

 

I'd be ok with the Wings not being a great team if they looked like they had a coherent plan to get back to being contenders sometime in the near future.  They don't.  "Sign vets and hope for the best" is a loser strategy that will keep them in that "playoff contenders" category for the foreseeable future.  Just like the Lions were when Ford Sr. was alive and running the team.

[kliq 3,763]

47 minutes ago, DickieDunn said:

I'm so tired of the "we're only two points out" argument.  That's artificially jamming teams together thanks to the parity point.  Buffalo and Toronto are dead last, only 6 points from 3rd in the division, 2 points behind Detroit both with 2 games in hand on Detroit.  The Wings are 4 points out of 3rd place in the division after tonight.  They're closer to the bottom than the playoffs.

Go ahead and keep wearing those rose colored glasses and tell yourselves that everything is going to be OK.  Just don't be shocked when they miss the playoffs, sign Vanek and Sheahan to extensions, and keep Holland and Trashill for another year because "they only missed the playoffs by a few points," just like almost every other team that missed them.

 

I'd be ok with the Wings not being a great team if they looked like they had a coherent plan to get back to being contenders sometime in the near future.  They don't.  "Sign vets and hope for the best" is a loser strategy that will keep them in that "playoff contenders" category for the foreseeable future.  Just like the Lions were when Ford Sr. was alive and running the team.

lol, who Dickie? I brought up that we were two points out in response to someone saying that we had a 0% chance of making the playoffs, but who is posting about us being 2 points out in the context of trying to create the narrative that we are a great team right now?

Wearing rose colored glasses is one extreme, and wearing s*** stained glasses is the other extreme. Like always, the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

[greenrebellion 415]

7 hours ago, kliq said:

Sorry but I don't buy it. I cannot agree with the notion that the Wings have a 0% chance of making the playoffs when they are only 2 points out.

You want to make the debate "Will the Wings make the playoffs or not", different story. But when the debate is do they have a 0% shot, I'm sorry but that's just hyperbole. I'm not trying to sit here and say that they are playing great or even good, I just came from the game tonight and that was one of the worst games I ever went to, but to act like you 100% know the future is just wrong. In the grand scheme of things, alot of things can happen between now and playoff time. Do I think they will make the playoffs if nothing changes...no. Do I think something will change...yes. The question is does whatever change they make cause an impact.

It is this kind of thinking that will keep Holland's hands tied as the deadline approaches. Focus more on the teams play rather than the artificially compressed standings and you will realize just how bad this team is. Howard isn't going to maintain a 1.5 gaa all season and when he regresses to the mean, look out below.