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nyqvististhefuture

Trade deadline fast approaching - who should we target?

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I like helm - but playing devil's advocate - a 2C plays harder and more minutes than a 3/4C so I would prefer my better players to be in the top 6 rather than have a strong bottom 6 and weak top 6. You can find bottom 6 guys with value around the league - a guy like eaves can pass though waivers.

I agree, but what happens when Kesler is Weiss 2.0? I know we'd all rather have Fil in hindsight right now

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I agree, but what happens when Kesler is Weiss 2.0? I know we'd all rather have Fil in hindsight right now

I wouldn't want fil , I think if he was here it be the same old bs with him .... We'll never know but I just think he was destined to forever be an under achiever here for whatever reason .... Just sucks we got weiss but at least we got to see loads of the kids here (nyquist Tatar sheahan jurco) play great ... Just imagine them I. 2-3yrs

That's why I always said every year we should be bringing up a kid or 2 to filter them In a few at a time and let them learn instead of bringing up a bunch at a time .... Imagine how good nyquist and Tatar would be now if they had a full season already ? ..... Boy went off topic there abit lol

Does anyone know if Weiss has a full no trade?

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From the beginning on keepin filp @number9.... I forgot who said it was cuz of shortened season subban won Norris and kesler won selke, I only seen 3rd period but subban had like 3 turnovers two of which went for 2 on 1s budaj is standing upside down and brown still can't break through this season

Edited by brooklynsour

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I wouldn't want fil , I think if he was here it be the same old bs with him .... We'll never know but I just think he was destined to forever be an under achiever here for whatever reason .... Just sucks we got weiss but at least we got to see loads of the kids here (nyquist Tatar sheahan jurco) play great ... Just imagine them I. 2-3yrs

That's why I always said every year we should be bringing up a kid or 2 to filter them In a few at a time and let them learn instead of bringing up a bunch at a time .... Imagine how good nyquist and Tatar would be now if they had a full season already ? ..... Boy went off topic there abit lol

Does anyone know if Weiss has a full no trade?

That's a fair POV I just think at the end of the day trading Helm is beyond unwing like.

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Knowing Holland he might trade a prospect or draft pick but no way is he trading a roster player.

Agreed. He's going to build his depth not subtract or maintain it. Ideally you have to think he wants to move lower end picks and prospects like Jensen, Paterson, 2nd round picks, etc.

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That's a fair POV I just think at the end of the day trading Helm is beyond unwing like.

Agreed ...all this helm trade talk is crazy I can see him here for along time unless he gets crazy with salary demands

Agreed. He's going to build his depth not subtract or maintain it. Ideally you have to think he wants to move lower end picks and prospects like Jensen, Paterson, 2nd round picks, etc.

I think depending on the return athanasiou can be a really nice trade bait with his 45 goals and we can afford to lose him with pulkkinen jarnkrok jurco sheahan mantha in our depth chart

Paterson could also have value .... Like holland said it would have to be a hockey trade were not good enough to risk these guys for ufa's especially with hank and pavelski being a ?

Edited by nyqvististhefuture

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Not sure why so many wouldn't want kesler. I mean he only has more goals than anyone on our roster-injured or healthy. Is every bit as good as Helm defensively. So yes, If I can move helm as part of a package for kesler I would do it. That would be an upgrade of our team. Let's compare the 2 for a second. Helm is 27, doesn't score, makes 2.2 million for 2 more years, plays great D, but because of his style of play-he does get hurt a good amount. In 2009/10 Helm played 75 games. In 10/11 he played 82. Not bad. But since then he has played 68 in 11/12, 1 in 12/13 and this year he has played in 28. At his size can he ever be a guy that is counted on to play more than 70 games per year? Kesler on the other hand turns 30 this summer and is signed for 2 more year at 5 million per. His average season is about 2.5 times as many goals as Helm. Over the past few years he has played: 82, 82, 77, 17, and 62 games. They were both hurt last year for a lot of games.

Now go forward a couple of years. What will it cost to keep these guys? I firmly believe that Helm will be in the 3.5-4 million per range in his next contract. Kesler will be around 6 million. At that point in time, which makes more sense?

Now I have no idea what Holland's thoughts are on all of this. But these are the long term things that have to be thought about. Is a 3C really worth 4 million per? Is that money better spent and produce a better team than a 6 million per year 2C?

The other part of course is, what goes with helm? of the younger guys that have made it up, Tatar is the best more IMHO. yes he scores goals. Should be good for 20-25 every year. But that is all he does. he is poor defensively, not very big or physical even though he plays with an edge, and is a LHed RW. I would keep Jurco, Nyquist, and Sheahan all ahead of him. Pulk should be able to come up and provide what tatar does, while being a RHed RW.

So what to offer, ok simple: Helm, Tatar, Kindl, and a 2014 2nd round pick for Kesler. By moving Helm and Kindl we also free up about 4 million in cap space and then add a guy that should score 25-30 goals per year as a 2C.

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Detroit Red Wings Trade Rumors: Dustin Byfuglien [WIIM]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: we should be in on Byfuglien. We need more right-handed players - he's right-handed. We need a top-four offensive defenseman who can be lethal on the PP - that's him. We need a top-six power forward who can park his ass in front of the net - also him. We need to get bigger, tougher, more physical - him. We need a guy who isn't a rental - him again. We need at least one of the Jets' 9,000 players who could potentially do wonders for us - him.

There are some concerns about him, but that's the whole reason why he'd be traded - and possibly for a reasonable price - in the first place. We're not getting Duncan Keith or Alex Ovechkin. And, again, standing pat is not a recipe for significant improvement and winning one more Cup with Datsyuk and Zetterberg. It's praying that some rookies can be the difference between a second-round exit and the Stanley Cup, all while our core gets older every day.

On that note: I'm very happy that we're in on Erhoff.

Kesler's price is about what I'd expected. That's Helm/Sheahan, Sproul/Ouellet, and a 1st. If any one of Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Weiss were healthy, I'd say it's absolutely, positively not happening. But, fact is, we could really use a top-six center. (And if we get healthy down the middle, Kesler's able and willing to play RW.)

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Tonight we're gonna be without Datsyuk, Zetterberg, and Weiss. Against a team that's hot on our heels. At some point, this all-our-key-forwards-are-injured s*** is going to cost us a postseason berth, if it hasn't already. If we can move Helm, Sproul/Ouellet, and a 1st for Kesler, that's worth serious consideration.

I'm sorry, but the state of our team is ticking me off, as is the notion that if we just keep waiting for the absolute perfect trade to come along - say, Cleary for Chara - we'll be doing the best we can do. Or if we just keep waiting for the perfect UFA - say, Vanek at $5M over three years. Because it goes without saying that we'd be the only ones in on that, right? Welcome to Motown, Thomas!

We need to add a high-end piece! If it can be done without losing one of our untouchables, it should be done! And even some of our untouchables shouldn't be wholly untouchable.

Ehrhoff, Kesler, Byfuglien, someone good. Do it. Just do it.

(I kinda feel like Dunbar in Catch-22 when he finally snaps. THERE'S NO ONE IN THERE!)

Edited by Dabura

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Other people see big offensive numbers and think he's a good defenseman. He's over matched in his own end in the AHL, he'd be a huge liability in the NHL.

I've heard a year ago how Tatar gets pushed easily,Jurco's one way player and Sheahan would be the 4th liner at best.

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Dickie, not that I'm especially keen on Almqvist, but you're basically just saying what everyone says about smallish offensive defensemen. And yet, there are guys who were hit with the same criticisms earlier in their careers who've gone on to become good defensemen at the NHL level.

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I certainly don't believe any trade would help us if dats injury is more serious than stated

Why not? If Dats's injury is more serious than stated (and we all know it is), that means we could be fighting tooth & nail for a playoff spot without our two best players. I've already pointed it out twice in like the past eight minutes, but it can't be overstated: Joakim Andersson is our first-line center. With Weiss not even ready to play in a game yet, we have to consider trading for a top-six centerman.

Edited by Dabura

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Joakim Andersson is our first-line center! Kyle Quincey is a key part of our blue line! When is Brett Lebda due back???

Quincey goes through brutal stretches, but I still wouldn't put him in the same ranks as Lebda. Andersson as our first line center though. Wow injuries have decimated this team.

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I guess what I'm saying is, this news about Weiss and Datsyuk takes us from "If we make a trade, great. If we don't, we're still fine" territory and places us in "s***. We might actually have to make a big trade" territory. A Ryan Kesler might now be something of a necessity.

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Well you basically make my point the odds of us winning in the playoffs with Hank coming off back surgery and dats knee, who knows what'll be of it, hopefully it can heal with rest. Are slim... I don't think and not saying we should throw the season, I'm saying trading away some our prospects for a 2nd line center/wing (i.e kesler) would be a waste for the future, they wouldnt be able to carry our team to the playoffs with all the lack of chemistry and so little time (I think like 20 games)

I don't see what ya see in kesler

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Quincey goes through brutal stretches, but I still wouldn't put him in the same ranks as Lebda.

You're right. We won a Cup with Lebda. What has Quincey done for us lately?

(I kid. Quincey has grown on me. But try saying, "We can win a Cup with Kyle Quincey playing huge minutes" with a straight face.)

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Well you basically make my point the odds of us winning in the playoffs with Hank coming off back surgery and dats knee, who knows what'll be of it, hopefully it can heal with rest. Are slim... I don't think and not saying we should throw the season, I'm saying trading away some our prospects for a 2nd line center/wing (i.e kesler) would be a waste for the future, they wouldnt be able to carry our team to the playoffs with all the lack of chemistry and so little time (I think like 20 games)

I don't see what ya see in kesler

I'm not big on Kesler. But we're talking about maybe a first-round pick, a prospect, and a 3C for a very good 2C who could hold his own as a 1C or be one of our better RWers. Given our situation, I think that makes a lot of sense. The argument could be made that even with a fully healthy lineup we should be thinking about adding a top-six centerman sometime soon. Datsyuk and Zetterberg are getting old and breaking down. It's sad but it's true. Weiss is a huge question mark, short-term and long-term. Helm, Sheahan, Andersson, Glendening are bottom-sixers. Franzen doesn't like playing center. Jarnkrok is the only Griffin who projects as a top-six center in the NHL, and he's still got a long way to go.

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I guess that's a good point too, I suppose it would really depend on what we ship out... I don't know enough about kesler to say anything about his character but I seen some comments on his divaness, we certainly don't need any cancer in the locker room

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The thing with Kesler is, does he even waive for the Wings ? Yeah, he is a Michigan boy but other than that the Wings situation is not that much different from the one he currently is in. The guy wants to win a cup neither Detroit nor Vancouver are going to be cup contenders in this or next year. Another thing to consider is again the asking price, with Pittsburgh offering Pouiliot, Bennet, Sutter + 1 let them get him and mortage their future...

Jurco, Helm, Kindl + first won't get the job done and Tatar, Nyquist, Sheahan and Dekeyser should be non starters, period.

Heck even Holmgren was rumored to be shocked by the asking price one of Couture, B. Schenn, Laughton + 1 so go along Shero add another piece for your insane top 6 instead of fixing your D :D

As for Vanek if the Wings want him, make him an offer come July 1 the guy has said over and over again, he will test free agency.

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