2020 Draft Thread

[F.Michael 4,590]

1 hour ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Reading through Wyshynski's twitter...

it seems to be Gregs contention that the Red Wings most definitely actively tanked since day 1 of Yzerman's tenure, and that Wings fans are too proud of their glorious dynasty to admit it.

I do have a problem with this.

Rewind to summer 2019. Do any of you recall? Things were pretty positive. Yzerman had taken control, Zadina was in the pipe, Seider was looking like a monster pickup, we were coming off a very strong end of the season where the Bert-Larkin-Mantha line was really clicking and taking over games. If I recall correctly the collective zeitgeist seemed to be: Don't spend money, let the kids develop into larger roles, and we'll see what happens. Things couldn't possible get any worse from here and our young core is only going to get better. And there was even talk of maybe this team could squeak into a wildcard spot if everything went right.

Obviously that didnt happen, but here's the timeline:

1. Yzerman makes a bed for Fil and Nemeth
2. Jimmy poops in the bed
3. The team poops in the bed
4. Yzerman makes a buncha minor trades to try to get the poop out of the bed
5. It's too late the poop has stained the bed
6. Yzerman trades some of the poop away for Gagner and draft picks <--- It is my contention that this is where active tanking began

It was always the collective opinion that we shouldnt spend money and should instead let the team grow organically while we wait to shed bad contracts. Adding Fil and Nemeth wasn't tanking, but right in line with that thinking. Then Yzerman actually adds Fabbri and other pieces to mitigate the team falling apart (not exactly what someone who's actively tanking would do)

So what's really going on with our good friend Gregory and his clever quips? He's envious. He's always been envious. His precious Niedermayer was out-shined by Nick Lidstrom. His precious 90s dynasty was out-shined by one in Detroit. His precious Rafalski abandoned him to extend said dynasty in Detroit. And now years later he has two 1st overall picks under his belt and he's still no better than Detroit. Hischier and Hughes - despite their draft pedigree - just aren't that good, and now it's the old Detroit Red Wings turn to take a 1st overall. And he has to sit there and watch the league bend over sideways to give Detroit Alexis Lafreniere - the player that Greg should have got with his 1st overall picks but didn't. It must be tearing him up inside. Flashbacks of his precious Lemieux being dummied by that neanderthal Darren McCarty ring through his mind while he yells at his TV screen "ELIAS IS JUST AS GOOD AS ZETTERBERG". He's not Greg. Another 20 years of Red Wings supremacy is about to begin and he's screaming helplessly into the void. But there's no PK Subban or Taylor Hall in this world that will hear his cries and save his precious Devils from the mediocrity that awaits them.

IMHO?

'Wysh' has always been, and will always be a c**t.

Just some try-hard 'reporter' as Kip, and 91 of Ryans have pointed out - Wysh tries to appeal to the masses via hip language, and whatever the else he can pull outta his a$$.

If his teeth were on fire - I wouldn't bother walking across the street to pi$$ on his face.

Edited May 6, 2020 by F.Michael

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

2016/17 Wings - Finished 25th - drafted 9th (-3 spots)
2016/17 Devils - Finished 27th - drafted 1st (+3 spots)
2017/18 Wings - Finished 27th - drafted 6th (-1 spot)
2017/18 Devils - Finished 15th - drafted 17th (+/- 0)
2018/19 Wings - Finished 28th - drafted 6th (-2 spots)
2018/19 Devils - Finished 29th - drafted 1st (+2 spots)

Over the last 3 drafts the Wings are -6 in first round draft position, and the Devils are +5 with two first overalls.

But yes Greg, we are the new Edmonton, not the Devils with their multiple 1st overalls on a failing roster and trading of Taylor Hall. Totally.

[LeftWinger 4,936]

I am officially going to say, IF/WHEN this draft lottery NEW rules go into effect, and we get a 57% chance at #1, and no lower than 2, Uncle Gary is officially my Uncle Gary! I still won't forgive him for 2009 (rescinding the 1 game suspension to Malkin which would've  most likely given us a 3-0 series lead) but like most of our strange uncles, I can move forward with him!

In the #2 scenario, I certainly hope Yzerman drafts Byfield.  But if he is in love with Rossi, Stutzle or Drysdale, I hope he trades down to #3 or #4.

I ran the simulator about 50 times, and Ottawa only leaped over us 4 times! With that idiot talking crap all the time (Wyshynski) I would love for NJ to get the #1 only to give it right to us! 

 

Edited May 6, 2020 by LeftWinger

[mackel 675]

5 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

2016/17 Wings - Finished 25th - drafted 9th (-3 spots)
2016/17 Devils - Finished 27th - drafted 1st (+3 spots)
2017/18 Wings - Finished 27th - drafted 6th (-1 spot)
2017/18 Devils - Finished 15th - drafted 17th (+/- 0)
2018/19 Wings - Finished 28th - drafted 6th (-2 spots)
2018/19 Devils - Finished 29th - drafted 1st (+2 spots)

Over the last 3 drafts the Wings are -6 in first round draft position, and the Devils are +5 with two first overalls.

But yes Greg, we are the new Edmonton, not the Devils with their multiple 1st overalls on a failing roster and trading of Taylor Hall. Totally.

Do you think this guy is resorting to "hot-takes" for a few clicks?  He seems pretty vanilla/pathetic otherwise.

[TLGTrico 616]

I don't care what the league does with the draft, as long as the Wings' odds at first overall don't drop below 18.5%

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

47 minutes ago, mackel said:

Do you think this guy is resorting to "hot-takes" for a few clicks?  He seems pretty vanilla/pathetic otherwise.

Probably. I feel like his persona and "takes" have become way worse and more click-baity since he joined ESPN. But it's fitting for him. All the good writers went to the Athletic and he got stuck with the organization that most of the hockey community literally laughs at.

Marek vs. Wyshynski was a good podcast before Spittin' Chiclets came in and absolutely slayed the hockey podcast market. But looking back it was mostly:

*Mildly interesting take from Jeff Marek*
followed by:
"hehe I'm so excited for the new Star Wars/Marvel movie! hehe my dog sneakers is a little flufferino" *more effeminate giggling from Greg*

Then Marek literally abandoned goofy Greg and that show to join Elliotte Friedman on the 31 Thoughts podcast (smart move Jeff). So Greggy scrambled and got Dave Lozo to start a new show with him called Puck Soup. But it sucked and I stopped tuning in shortly after. I dunno how it is now, I think Lozo left the show too.

He's an overrated blogger in the tail end of his career. He got into sports blogging early with Yahoo which enabled him to punch far above his own weight class. Now guys with actual insider knowledge and humor above surface level pop culture references have caught up and he's fukt. I imagine he'll get more edgy and click-baity as time goes on.

Edited May 6, 2020 by ChristopherReevesLegs

[LeftWinger 4,936]

so it seems the NHL is re-thinking the process of the lottery because some executives say Detroit and Ottawa got too much privilege.  Honestly, unless you wait until the playoffs are established, there is no other way of doing it. Columbus is 2 points out of a playoff spot, are you going to award them a lottery pick, possibly #1, then they could make the playoffs and go deep? If you don't finish the season and get the total amount of points, how fair is it to still have Detroit (and others) still drop up to 3 spots? How fair is it that New Jersey just might win a 3rd top pick in the last 4 years? How fair is it that Chicago may get it after just being 4 years out from winning their 3rd Cup in 6 years? Pittsburgh is only 5 points ahead of Columbus, so if they happened to falter and miss, and they get the 1st overall (their traded pick is protected) how fair is that? They are 2 years out of winning back to back Cups. The whole lottery is flawed there is no way an 80-90 point team (which Columbus may have after the season) should be getting a 1st overall pick while teams in the bottom 5 get screwed.

https://twitter.com/TSN1200/status/1258133902763442179?s=20

Edited May 7, 2020 by LeftWinger

[F.Michael 4,590]

17 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

so it seems the NHL is re-thinking the process of the lottery because some executives say Detroit and Ottawa got too much privilege.  Honestly, unless you wait until the playoffs are established, there is no other way of doing it. Columbus is 2 points out of a playoff spot, are you going to award them a lottery pick, possibly #1, then they could make the playoffs and go deep? If you don't finish the season and get the total amount of points, how fair is it to still have Detroit (and others) still drop up to 3 spots? How fair is it that New Jersey just might win a 3rd top pick in the last 4 years? How fair is it that Chicago may get it after just being 4 years out from winning their 3rd Cup in 6 years? Pittsburgh is only 5 points ahead of Columbus, so if they happened to falter and miss, and they get the 1st overall (their traded pick is protected) how fair is that? They are 2 years out of winning back to back Cups. The whole lottery is flawed there is no way an 80-90 point team (which Columbus may have after the season) should be getting a 1st overall pick while teams in the bottom 5 get screwed.

https://twitter.com/TSN1200/status/1258133902763442179?s=20

As much as I wanted it (and Bettman/Daly can push it thru) - I always felt it was unlikely to happen since the 'bosses' aka the BoG would pi$$ & moan relentlessly.

 

[Dabura 12,206]

On 5/3/2020 at 5:02 PM, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Call me crazy, but I actually think she looked hotter in the recent reboot.

She is aging very well.

On 5/3/2020 at 5:02 PM, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Also, the league has been Toronto-centric forever and the Leafs still cant win a Cup in over 50 years. They can shut up.

Word.

[MileHighWingsGuy 178]

Every day that passes moves us closer to the realization the league must implement a draft sequence in a timely manner. If the draft happens sometime in June as eluded to that puts the pressure on deciding the order and getting on with planning for the big event. If the league moves to the old format we draft first or second, any idea when that lottery would take place? I see each day passing as giving us better odds to land the first overall selection. Surprised there isn't greater conversation on this as I'm geeked for it!!

[ely s 457]

if it really comes down to that https://www.mlive.com/redwings/2020/05/nhl-reportedly-shifts-focus-to-24-team-playoff-not-season-completion.html

then I think they might change the proposed draft format into something like the 7 non playoff teams get a shot at number one and the playoff teams have to be sorted on winning% during the regular season or something like that, I can´t see the league giving Detroit a 57% of landing 1oa

[Akakabuto 1,745]

2 hours ago, ely s said:

if it really comes down to that https://www.mlive.com/redwings/2020/05/nhl-reportedly-shifts-focus-to-24-team-playoff-not-season-completion.html

then I think they might change the proposed draft format into something like the 7 non playoff teams get a shot at number one and the playoff teams have to be sorted on winning% during the regular season or something like that, I can´t see the league giving Detroit a 57% of landing 1oa

This really sucks. The 57% at 1OA wasnt even the best thing about the new proposed draft. It was that DET couldn't drop below nr 2 giving us either Lafreniere or first pick at Byfeld/Rossi/Stützle/Drysdale.. We couldnt lose in that situation.

[F.Michael 4,590]

2 hours ago, ely s said:

if it really comes down to that https://www.mlive.com/redwings/2020/05/nhl-reportedly-shifts-focus-to-24-team-playoff-not-season-completion.html

then I think they might change the proposed draft format into something like the 7 non playoff teams get a shot at number one and the playoff teams have to be sorted on winning% during the regular season or something like that, I can´t see the league giving Detroit a 57% of landing 1oa

Yeah - giving us nothing worse than 2nd overall was unlikely to happen.

Those 7 clubs will likely be in a revised draft lottery, and the % of winning, or staying in the top 2, or 3 - who knows?

[AtlantaHotWings 974]

6 hours ago, ely s said:

if it really comes down to that https://www.mlive.com/redwings/2020/05/nhl-reportedly-shifts-focus-to-24-team-playoff-not-season-completion.html

then I think they might change the proposed draft format into something like the 7 non playoff teams get a shot at number one and the playoff teams have to be sorted on winning% during the regular season or something like that, I can´t see the league giving Detroit a 57% of landing 1oa

So do our odds get better in a 1 of  7 vs 1 out of 16 ? 

 If they revise it to 7 teams then maybe the drop is a max 2 vs 3? As long as we dont drop beyond 4 as that is equal to the regular draft. 

[mackel 675]

This is an interesting read...

https://thehockeywriters.com/2020-nhl-do-not-draft-list/?utm_sq=gekbr8rsi7&fbclid=IwAR0TbXvChoikkreX-dQabHFoY_Zgw8bEssuiY8qrUuVujVciB9l2-tcGX-I

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

1 hour ago, mackel said:

This is an interesting read...

https://thehockeywriters.com/2020-nhl-do-not-draft-list/?utm_sq=gekbr8rsi7&fbclid=IwAR0TbXvChoikkreX-dQabHFoY_Zgw8bEssuiY8qrUuVujVciB9l2-tcGX-I

I'm looking through this guys work briefly. He also said Travis Dermott was the steal of the 2015 draft. So I mean he probably doesn't know s***.

[Dabura 12,206]

On 5/8/2020 at 1:34 AM, MileHighWingsGuy said:

Every day that passes moves us closer to the realization the league must implement a draft sequence in a timely manner. If the draft happens sometime in June as eluded to that puts the pressure on deciding the order and getting on with planning for the big event. If the league moves to the old format we draft first or second, any idea when that lottery would take place? I see each day passing as giving us better odds to land the first overall selection. Surprised there isn't greater conversation on this as I'm geeked for it!!

For whatever reason, Bill Daly said there's no urgency.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Edited May 9, 2020 by Dabura

[Dabura 12,206]

On 5/7/2020 at 11:36 AM, F.Michael said:

As much as I wanted it (and Bettman/Daly can push it thru) - I always felt it was unlikely to happen since the 'bosses' aka the BoG would pi$$ & moan relentlessly.

Yeah. It was too good to be true, I guess. It's kind of surreal that it was a thing at all. Like I said, I genuinely wouldn't be surprised to learn it was a calculated, boldfaced attempt to take a little short-term hit in the draft integrity department in the hope of shaving a few years off the Wings' rebuild.

On the other hand, maybe this is just the standard "ask for more than you actually want and 'concede' to walk back your ask to what you (secretly) really wanted all along" play. I dunno.

[13dangledangle 957]

7 hours ago, Dabura said:

Yeah. It was too good to be true, I guess. It's kind of surreal that it was a thing at all. Like I said, I genuinely wouldn't be surprised to learn it was a calculated, boldfaced attempt to take a little short-term hit in the draft integrity department in the hope of shaving a few years off the Wings' rebuild.

On the other hand, maybe this is just the standard "ask for more than you actually want and 'concede' to walk back your ask to what you (secretly) really wanted all along" play. I dunno.

 

Thats what Im thinking.  Though I was stoked when I first read it, obviously every other team not in equation was going to scream bloody murder at it.  The lottery just hasnt gone our way at all in recent years so I certainly wasnt going to complain.  Hopefully they announce a solution soon

[TLGTrico 616]

I don't see the problem with only the bottom 5 teams having at shot at first overall.  First overall has always gone to a bottom 5 team anyway.

[Dabura 12,206]

7 hours ago, TLGTrico said:

I don't see the problem with only the bottom 5 teams having at shot at first overall.  First overall has always gone to a bottom 5 team anyway.

Easy for Wings fans to say, I suppose. If I'm a fan of the Sabres or Devils or Habs, I want my team in that 1st overall mix. As a Wings fan, I'm fine with telling those teams to get f***ed. We had the worst season in recent memory; give us our damn handout. But I think those teams are absolutely right to want no part of the five-team plan.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

7 hours ago, Dabura said:

Easy for Wings fans to say, I suppose. If I'm a fan of the Sabres or Devils or Habs, I want my team in that 1st overall mix. As a Wings fan, I'm fine with telling those teams to get f***ed. We had the worst season in recent memory; give us our damn handout. But I think those teams are absolutely right to want no part of the five-team plan.

I understand those teams POV. But I have no real morals or ethics beyond "Make Red Wings good NOW". Give me my unfair Lafreniere. I will only stroke harder if someone whines about us each time he scores.

[LeftWinger 4,936]

It wouldn't be the first time the NHL tilted the balls towards a specific team!  Does anyone think it was just a coincidence that in 2005 Mario Lemieux was threatening to re-locate the Penguins, just so happened to be letting a young man stay at his home, then proceeds to win the lottery enabling him to draft said young man, Sidney Crosby?  That stunk of a fix, and so who freaking cares if Detroit and or Ottawa, arguable the two worst teams in the league the last 3-5 years get a little help in their rebuild? 

Besides, when Detroit gets 2 compliance buyouts and gets rid of Abby's and Nielsen's contract's, and add to that the availability of Z's LTIR, Yzerman could very well throw the wallet at Hall, Krug and Holtby. Even if the cap fell a bit, he'll have about $50M in space (after Abby, Nielsen and Z) to get all three, PLUS re-sign the important RFA's to nice deals for both sides!  Are the NHL Execs gonna ***** about Yzerman spending up to his cap and becoming 1000% better that way? Honestly, if we don't get Lafreniere, I really don't think we need another center.  We have Larkin, Veleno and Rasmussen to be our top 3 C's, I guess we could draft one and make someone a winger, but I'd like to see our D bolstered.  Which is why most of us were hoping that we went D instead of Holland drafting Zadina. But even now, if Yzerman drafted Drysdale, put him in the mix with Hronek, Seider and the possibility of Krug or similar?  I think the other NHL teams just better watch out for Detroit no matter what happens this draft. Sooner than they think Detroit will be knocking on Lord Stanley's door and 30 other GM's will be shaking their heads wondering how it happened so fast, when they all conspired to keep Detroit from drafting a franchise LW back in 2020.

It's funny how things work out in the draft, back in 1983, Detroit wanted LaFontaine SOOOOO bad, they were begging The Isles not to take him, so they "settled" for their next choice and we all know how that worked out. If we don't get Lafreniere, so be it, there is a great chance someone like Stutzle, Rossi or Drysdale just may end up being the better pick when it's all over 20 years from now.  I'm just tired of Detroit getting worked over in the draft lottery. It's already bad enough that in a normal lottery our chances of falling to 4 are higher than retaining the #1 and that makes zero sense.

Edited May 10, 2020 by LeftWinger

[Dabura 12,206]

Sup Lefty. Imma do a deep dive on your post -- not because I'm trying to pick on you, but because the boards are absolutely dead and we need some good discussion.

On 5/10/2020 at 12:13 PM, LeftWinger said:

It wouldn't be the first time the NHL tilted the balls towards a specific team!  Does anyone think it was just a coincidence that in 2005 Mario Lemieux was threatening to re-locate the Penguins, just so happened to be letting a young man stay at his home, then proceeds to win the lottery enabling him to draft said young man, Sidney Crosby?  That stunk of a fix, and so who freaking cares if Detroit and or Ottawa, arguable the two worst teams in the league the last 3-5 years get a little help in their rebuild?

I think what makes this situation unique is that the hypothetical scenario that would help the Wings was being proposed. It's not like the system is already in place and "Well, whatever happens, happens. [wink wink]" The feelers were put out and there was a ton of pushback.

Like I said, I don't really care what other organizations think; I want what's best for the Wings, other teams be damned. But, realistically, the five-team lottery was never going to be a thing. 

On 5/10/2020 at 12:13 PM, LeftWinger said:

Besides, when Detroit gets 2 compliance buyouts and gets rid of Abby's and Nielsen's contract's, and add to that the availability of Z's LTIR, Yzerman could very well throw the wallet at Hall, Krug and Holtby. Even if the cap fell a bit, he'll have about $50M in space (after Abby, Nielsen and Z) to get all three, PLUS re-sign the important RFA's to nice deals for both sides!  Are the NHL Execs gonna ***** about Yzerman spending up to his cap and becoming 1000% better that way?

That's an interesting angle. Personally, I don't think other organizations would be all that butthurt over compliance buyouts giving us even more cap flexibility than we were already set to have. If every organization gets a compliance buyout or two, that's pretty fair to everyone, right? It helps everyone. Maybe it helps some organizations more than it helps others, but it wouldn't seem like the fix is in. The five-team lotto plan? That straight-up punches a whole lot of organizations in the gut. No upside for them.

On 5/10/2020 at 12:13 PM, LeftWinger said:

Honestly, if we don't get Lafreniere, I really don't think we need another center.  We have Larkin, Veleno and Rasmussen to be our top 3 C's, I guess we could draft one and make someone a winger, but I'd like to see our D bolstered.  Which is why most of us were hoping that we went D instead of Holland drafting Zadina. But even now, if Yzerman drafted Drysdale, put him in the mix with Hronek, Seider and the possibility of Krug or similar?  I think the other NHL teams just better watch out for Detroit no matter what happens this draft. Sooner than they think Detroit will be knocking on Lord Stanley's door and 30 other GM's will be shaking their heads wondering how it happened so fast, when they all conspired to keep Detroit from drafting a franchise LW back in 2020.

I think we need meaningful and immediate help at center; I'm not sure Rasmussen is going to be a solid full-time top-nine centerman and Veleno is probably still at least a couple of years away from being a guy we can really lean on. Whether that means draft or trade or UFA, I dunno. But I do think Yzerman needs to be looking.

At the same time, I agree with you about the D situation: It's brutal, *BUT*...if you add Drysdale and an above-average veteran UFA or two, all of a sudden we've got a future foundation of Hronek, Seider, Drysdale, [UFA(s)], maybe Tuomisto. Granted, of the kids in that group, Hronek is the only one with any NHL experience. So, even if all those other kids are destined for greatness, it's probably going to be 3+ years before it all comes together on the back end.

But I do love how this 2020 draft class is deep enough that we could miss out on the "top-tier" guys and still come away with a cornerstone-type defense prospect who would largely put the "OK, but what are the Wings going to do about their defense?" question to bed, at least for a little while.

Even with all the attention and praise he's been getting, I feel like the average hockey fan is kinda sleeping on Drysdale. He has the skating and offense and creativity of guys like Hughes and Makar *PLUS* a pretty robust two-way game. He projects as a legit high-scoring, minute-munching, all-situations, top-pairing workhorse. That's what I love about a hypothetical core of Hronek, Seider, Drysdale: It'd be three well-rounded all-situations guys, any one of whom you could hard-match against the other team's top forward.

I'd be ok with Yzerman taking Drysdale 2nd overall. I'm not necessarily saying Yzerman *should*. What I'm saying is, basically, no matter who we get, it's going to be a huge boost for our rebuild. We have needs at every position and we're going to come away from this draft with one of the skating positions "solved."

On 5/10/2020 at 12:13 PM, LeftWinger said:

It's funny how things work out in the draft, back in 1983, Detroit wanted LaFontaine SOOOOO bad, they were begging The Isles not to take him, so they "settled" for their next choice and we all know how that worked out. If we don't get Lafreniere, so be it, there is a great chance someone like Stutzle, Rossi or Drysdale just may end up being the better pick when it's all over 20 years from now.  I'm just tired of Detroit getting worked over in the draft lottery. It's already bad enough that in a normal lottery our chances of falling to 4 are higher than retaining the #1 and that makes zero sense.

Word.

[LeftWinger 4,936]

3 hours ago, Dabura said:

That's an interesting angle. Personally, I don't think other organizations would be all that butthurt over compliance buyouts giving us even more cap flexibility than we were already set to have. If every organization gets a compliance buyout or two, that's pretty fair to everyone, right? It helps everyone. Maybe it helps some organizations more than it helps others, but it wouldn't seem like the fix is in. The five-team lotto plan? That straight-up punches a whole lot of organizations in the gut. No upside for them.

now with the rumor of a 24 team playoff, that leaves 7 teams in the draft lottery.  Only two more, I am sure there will still be rule changes about how many spots you can drop or jump.  With only 7 teams, how fair is it that you still may be able to drop 3 spots? I like our odds, but it still gives perennial tankers like New Jersey and Buffalo a shot at #1 yet AGAIN! They should make sure that a team cannot move up more than 4. That means NJ and Buffalo won't get a shot at #1, but NJ could get #2, and Buffalo could get #3, which should be ok with them. Teams cannot drop more than 2 would be a good thing as well. that way Detroit and Ottawa won't be getting screwed. Even if NJ jumped to 2 and we fell to 3, I think all parties should be ok with that.