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Zetterberg: + Owns Crosby; - Can grow a much sweeter beard than me Datsyuk: + James Brown ringtone; - No dangle dangle for another month Lidstrom: + He has four sons; - Does perfection have a flaw? Cleary: + Relentless worker; - Bad at avoiding teammates' slapshots Franzen: + April through June; - Game 5 giveaway in the 2008 Final Bertuzzi: + Doesn't need to floss; - Blind passes in the neutral zone Rafalski: + Team USA; - His turnovers wake my neighbors Filppula: + He has potential; - We've heard that for three years Kronwall: + Marty Havlat; - Apparently Teemu Selanne Holmstrom: + Unreal hand-eye coordination; - The English language Eaves: + The goal smile; - I'm not raining on his parade Stuart: + So incredibly reliable; - Not so good Game 7 in the 2009 Final Hudler: + The past two games; - The season started in October Helm: + Speed; - Cement hands Ericsson: + 2009 playoffs; - Everything since Abdelkader: + Willing to fight; - Probably shouldn't be Modano: + Willa Ford; - March is a long way off Salei: + Not a whole lot; - Not a whole lot Miller: + Great on the PK; - He's not Ryan Draper: + The Grind Line; - That was a decade ago

when i google image larry murphy i get this...

eaves good everyone else suck

Drape is motivated. He's had a lot of downtime. And he's ending his career. AND, he's the kinda dude that just gives a s***, how his team does. Draper is a class act. Goals by him are always just bonuses. Dude is older, slower, crappier than ever, but he exemplifies a work ethic, that is not paralleled. Even in 2010, 2011, Draper still has a job to do. It's not goal scoring. It's not winning a cup. IMO, Draper is a professor, when it comes to 3rd and 4th line play. He's a champion of those lines. I think he's just trying to show the young guys, how the f*** to do it

You fear for every game

Thought everyone might enjoy this. Larry Murphy - Whoo, the Fries!.mp3

Murph keeps it gangsta!

Headline: Winter Classic Rained Out. God Tired of Crosby.

Who do you like? On this roster, post two comments about every single player. Post more than one if you like. Positive, Negative. Praise, or demons in the closet. Whatever it be. Zetterberg Datsyuk Lidstrom Cleary Franzen Bertuzzi Rafalski Filppula Kronwall Holmstrom Eaves Stuart Hudler Helm Ericsson Abdelkader Modano Salei Miller Draper Normally I would start a thread like this by posting my own opinions, but honestly I'm so high that correctly spelling all their names was complex. I will respond later. Basically........two comments about each player. Preferable, one positive, one negative, but for freedom of speech reasons, two negatives, and two positives is also acceptable. I guess run on sentences could be allowed, as well

I'm sure all three of them have very astute observations.

Puss, Drapes scores when he gets hit in the face with the puck. Or was it Franzen?

There are 35 goalies in the Hall. 16 of them are pre-Original 6 goalies. That leaves 19 goalies over a span of about 55 years. Osgood is one of the five best goalies of his era; two are already in, another just became eligible, and the last is still playing. There are other goaltenders who were very good who can make arguments for the Hall who have not been inducted, such as Tom Barrasso, Andy Moog, and John Vanbiesbrouck, but Osgood has a higher claim to the Hall than any of them.

Zetterberg - Slowed down a bit, but I still like his clutchiness in the playoffs Datsyuk - *spotlight from the heavens comes on, choir of angels sings* Lidstrom - Sucks. Psh, come on, like I'm going to trash talk Lids Cleary - I'm going to nickname him Murphy. Just when things are going awesome, disaster strikes. Franzen - Can he have one of his insane streaks pretty soon? I guess I should specify insane scoring streaks, 'cause honestly, he looks like one of those quiet guys who is secretly about 2 seconds away from snapping but you just can't tell. Bertuzzi - Bertuzzi, on the other hand, we know is about 2 seconds away from snapping. Speaking of snapping, right now he needs to snap out of those bad habits from last season that I thought he was over. Rafalski - I like him, but maybe not for $6 mil. Better than most of our D, anyway Filppula - Arrrrgh!!! Him and Helm drive me nuts. I know they have it in them, but it just won't happen for them! Kronwall - I like his glasses. I can't make a fair judgment on him right now because I'm still too jazzed about his rad goal the other night. Holmstrom - Chip (see Modano for further information). Don't know how anybody takes that much abuse. He's my hero because he's a slow skater (I, too, am rather slow), but still gits 'er done. Eaves - Again, wrong time to ask....no way am I going to say anything negative right after his hat trick. Unlike Kronwall, however, there's nothing really lurking at the back of my mind that I would say under normal circumstances. Stuart - Stuie's my whipping boy. Sorry Stuie. Needs to be better around the net, I think (our net, I mean). Hudler - My god he's short! Seriously, I never really realized just how much under I saw them play the Ducks on the 3rd. Don't know if his goals are just luck or improvement, but I think he's standing up for himself more and doesn't get pushed down as easily. Helm - I love this guy. I just wish he could shoot the puck at the net. He does all this crazy dangle stuff on the PK, but all that disappears when he actually has to take a shot at the net. Ericsson - Whipping boy no. 2, but he seems to fade into the background more than Stuart. Seems like he either has a good night or an awful night. Abdelkader - Love the physicality (and he's a good hitter, too, harrr). Like everybody's said, I think he has it in him to score more (I won't make a joke with that one...you're welcome). Modano - Dale (see Holmstrom for further info). Hope he's ready to go in March...I'm worried that he'll go back to looking lost when he comes back. Really wished this would've worked out better Salei - Not bad. Takes a lot of penalties, but on the other hand, it's nice to have someone on the team who plays physical. Miller - Good PK, but everything else, meh. He doesn't really do anything to make me mad, unlike certain people on our D, but he's just kind of there. Draper - Right now, I think he's providing some important stability for a team that's kind of wonky because of injuries. He just has that confidence that says, "Don't worry, I've done this sh!t before," which makes everybody else able to just get to work. Osgood - Hard to judge from the amount of games he's played this year, but I'm glad he's around to mentor Howie. Couldn't ask for a nicer, funnier, and above all experienced guy to help you down the right path. Howard - Nicest guy ever (I met him in July). Rather easy on the eyes, too. Anyway, if this is a sophomore slump, it's not too horribly bad. He could definitely step it up a little, especially when we're struggling offensively, but I'm not in panic mode yet. I think he will improve. Edit: grammar, forgot the Modano part of Chip & Dale, and needed to add the goalies. Oops.

When a goaltender stops goals but the team loses, the goaltender gets traded even though the problem with the team is scoring. Either the goalie wins Vezinas, retires in obscurity, or they look for a team that can play in front of them. Since good teams usually already have at least average goaltending and the coaches aren't jizzing about stats every day, I can see how, for some fans, the HoF is their last, best chance to get their favorite player, "the respect he deserves!" Osgood has a better SO/game average in the playoffs than Roy, Belfour or Dryden. He's the equal of Hasek and Joseph and in the same neighborhood as Jaques Plante by those numbers. You're basically saying Detroit could have hired a mop and broomstick to do the job because the team had a NYR-size salary. When a goaltender is runner-up for the Hart Trophy to Wayne Gretzky, considering that it would pass over Messier, Kurri and whoever else was also on the ice that season, doesn't it give you some perspective about what the team valued vs what your stat sheet tells you? Have you honestly watched the games Fuhr played when he wasn't in St. Louis? Osgood has been couched as inferior to goaltenders with higher salaries and better SV% his whole career. The HoF can sit on its collective thumb and spin if they can't admit Osgood is among the best in history. I know there are questions about #14, #91, #16 ever having jerseys hung from the rafters simply because of the circumstance of careers, but I know 2 out of 3 have a lock on the HoF. I think #30 should hang from the rafters and I don't have the least hesitation putting that out there. If Osgood is reaching retirement age and wins a Stanley Cup backing up Howard, it will be nothing new as far as ammunition for critics to claim he's not the best.

The lines I had slated, if I recall correctly, were: Bertuzzi/Zetterberg/Cleary Holmstrom/Datsyuk/Eaves Franzen/Filppula/Hudler Abdelkader/Helm/Miller I said overall player. I was referring to those players playing on fourth lines, not with regard to the "fourth line" style of play. Arguing that Asham is a better overall player than Eaves is like saying Manny Legace is on track for the Vezina. Eaves is a developed player who has all of the skills to play on the second line. He has been putting them to use this season. Just because he's not on the second line due to the Wings' excessive depth does not mean he is not second-line capable.

I don't know if I hinted this well in my first post, but I kind of think the HOF is becoming a joke. Currently, the HOF is filled with names that even knowledgable hockey fans don't know. (I don't care if you're the best fan in the world, unless you're rainman, you will not remember everyone). As it continues to expand, and allow players, for odds and ends reasons, it will become just more and more obscure, and meaningless. To me, Hall of Famers are the guys you randomly look up youtube videos of when you're hammered. I'm sure half the people who read this thread have at one point youtubed a Gretzky video, and sure as s*** an Yzerman video. When you search "Datsyuk" on Youtube, and it says he has 400,000,000 hits, to me that should tell you something.

when i heard that last night i IMMEDIATELY thought of this:

I thought I deleted this picture of myself long ago. Whoops.

MORE FREE CURLIES IN BENTONVILLE, ARK TODAY!!!! THANKS EAVES!

When saying I dropped the ball, you should not say: "If he starts scoring like he has been" When he has only been doing it two games. I don't really care that I dropped the ball in your opinion. I still stick with my opinion. You might base your opinion on his last two games. I try to look at the season. A s*** ton of players have scored 2 games in a row, only to go on to be minor league players the next year. I am not a Hudler hater. I honestly think the man has skills. I'm just saying, 2 good games so far in an 82 game season....is not really awe inspiring. Hell, Draper can pull that off. Hell........Miller pulled it off. A goalie could pull off points in two consecutive games, in theory. I never shut my eyes on Hudler. I'm just saying.....he broke out two games....now he's got 40 more to prove. I am not really anti hudler. I am not really Pro Hudler. My stance is more like, "lets ******* see" Oh and when I'm wrong, I got no problem admitting it. I'm wrong more than I'd care to admit, honestly. This thread isn't even about Hudler. I digress.

I always get uncomfortable when the case for a player getting into the HHoF ultimately boils down to picking the absolute weakest inductions and then arguing said player is better than them. Wins should not be the only measure of a great goalie. The bar for goalies is much higher than it is for forwards, so Osgood is going to have a considerable wait on his hands, and there are currently a fair amount of goalies waiting in line before him. I think he will eventually get in, but I am more in favor of the committee tightening their selections versus loosening them.

Realize I am not saying that Lids wont win the Norris. The topic is suppose to be a discussion of how Lids is having a record low plus minus year and how someone like letang is at a plus 19. I don’t care how he got it he is a plus 19. Green got votes to win a Norris. Was his plus minus a plus 39 because of his defensive play? It was not and he still got Norris votes. Did I ever say Letangs plus minus was because he was good at defense? and my past posts have mainly been how Crosby is better than Ovechkin yet none of you exept mindfly agree. Clearly Crosby is better than Ovi.

Damn you, I was just coming into this thread to make the same joke. I was going to say that I read the thread title in Seinfeld's voice.

he's miles ahead of rafalski in that department

I didn't see anyone assigning any major value to the stat in this thread. Just people saying that it looks odd. Pump the brakes, jeez.